[NSRCA-dist7] FAI: F sequence at local contests
Steve Hannah
shannah1806 at gmail.com
Sun Mar 7 15:31:31 AKST 2010
You could probably do it in a single day. I might get my field (OCMA
in Irvine) for a small, one day event. I'm going to inquire at the
next board meeting (I'm the Pres). It's not a great spot for big
contests but it is a great place to fly.
I had been thinking about something like this. An FAI-only "shootout".
If enough guys were interested then I can see about a two day. Keeping
it under 25 would be best for my field.
Steve
Sent from my iPhone
On Mar 7, 2010, at 4:04 PM, Chris Fitzsimmons <homeremodeling2003 at yahoo.com
> wrote:
> Jim
>
> I really like this idea! The only issue I see is who's field would
> be willing to shut down for a weekend for 10 or 12 guys.
>
> Sent from my iPhone
>
> On Mar 7, 2010, at 1:54 PM, James Oddino <joddino at socal.rr.com> wrote:
>
>> I've stayed out of this conversation and it is probably too late to
>> offer an idea now, but I remember going to a contest in Germany
>> back in 1970. It was a district type contest but open to all and
>> as it turned out the guy that won wasn't from that district so the
>> guy in second was the district champ. But here was the format.
>> FAI only. One plane in the air at a time. One set of judges as I
>> recall. Twelve pilots. Two or three rounds just like the FAI rules
>> called for at the time. All in one day. We could do what we
>> wanted but the concept of an FAI only contest could attract some
>> attention.
>>
>> If we held a few FAI only contests I suspect many of the Masters
>> guys would participate and find out it is a lot of fun. Just a
>> thought.
>>
>> Jim
>>
>>
>> On Mar 7, 2010, at 12:52 PM, steve hannah wrote:
>>
>>> "I think Jon C is working on a proposed 'template' for this year. "
>>>
>>> Good. That is the only way we can move on with something. We
>>> need a proposal to vote for or against. The current email debate
>>> has fallen into the infinite do-loop syndrome. The only way to
>>> formally act on this is for a proposal to be put forward. So,
>>> I'll wait to see what that is.
>>>
>>> By the way, you guys missed a fun time in Yuma. Friday, practice
>>> day, was beautiful. Saturday morning was fantastic with calm air,
>>> then we were treated to very windy conditions late Saturday. We
>>> got in 4 rounds on Sat and rained out this morning. Even though
>>> it was shortened by two rounds today, I had fun. You got a
>>> little of everything. No air, high wind, right to left, and left
>>> to right. Plus, we really enjoyed the Mexican food at Mi Ranchito
>>> on 4th st. I'll go back to that place for sure.
>>>
>>> Now I'll be waiting for Jon's proposal.
>>>
>>> Steve
>>>
>>> On Sat, Mar 6, 2010 at 11:13 AM, <AtwoodDon at aol.com> wrote:
>>> OK, after thinking about this for a while, here is my opinion, for
>>> whatever that is worth. We are wrestling with a near term request
>>> and a longer term approach. Following is my opinion and does not
>>> represent anyone else, so if you as a FAI flyer agree or don't
>>> agree, let Jon and the rest of the FAI flyers know what you think
>>> or want.
>>>
>>> This 'discussion' started as a question framed around whether we
>>> should allow some provision to fly F at the Arvin contest in May
>>> to provide a way for people that wanted to go to the Nats an
>>> opportunity to fly F competitively prior to the Nats. And for a
>>> few, the opportunity to fly F just because they wanted to. So far,
>>> so good. I do not have any problem supporting our D7 members that
>>> want to compete in the Nats. I can live with some level of
>>> compromise to support that. Good for you. Go D7!!!
>>>
>>> At this point some of us headed for the popcorn and microwave
>>> assuming this was going to get
>>> interesting. And it has.....
>>>
>>> A few ideas were batted around about how to accommodate those
>>> wanting to practice F in a competitive setting with little or no
>>> impact to those that don't really want to fly F. Basically, we
>>> were looking for a middle ground to keep everyone happy.
>>> Predictably, the discussion quickly became more about why that
>>> won't work for a myriad of reasons and we should make a District
>>> wide decision to change the way we run the FAI class. Now,
>>> remember the original request was to provide an avenue for 'F'
>>> exposure prior to the Nats.
>>>
>>> I have flown in the FAI/F3A class for many years under the format
>>> we settled into for local contests. I worked my way up thru all
>>> the available AMA classes over the years and ended up in 'FAI'. I
>>> have flown most of my FAI contests in D7 and have not attended the
>>> Nats for many years. Personally, I don't have much interest in
>>> flying F. When I say I 'fly FAI' it is just a designation for the
>>> class I competed in using the same rules for everybody everybody
>>> else in that contest. I am by no means a world class flyer and if
>>> I am not qualified to call myself a FAI flyer because I don't fly
>>> F, I don't have an problem with that, it is just a name.
>>>
>>> D7 has been in a mode of flying 'P only' for many years as have
>>> most districts. We made the FAI class fit into the AMA formats,
>>> not the other way around. Some strongly feel we are following the
>>> 'intent' of the FAI rules, some don't. So, if we change the
>>> approach, where do we draw the line? We 'kinda' follow the rules?
>>> We 'mostly' follow the rules? We 'fully' follow the rules?
>>>
>>> The only black and white answer is 'fully' follow the rules, right
>>> now. However, I don't believe it is the best near term answer for
>>> D7. There are too many ramifications to that decision that will
>>> not be positive for D7. I would suggest the approach could be to
>>> find a way to 'migrate' to that decision if the majority of FAI
>>> flyers think it is the right direction.
>>>
>>> That migration could be a step this year, 2 steps next year, and
>>> full blown local FAI 3 years from now, or some other agreed on
>>> timetable. For those CDs that want to provide some F rounds this
>>> year, they could announce it well in advance, and hopefully follow
>>> a format that is predictable for this year, then current FAI
>>> contestants could decide if they want to participate or not. No
>>> announcement of F with reasonable leadtime defaults to 'P only'.
>>> The CD will have to determine if his offering will be positive or
>>> negative to the turnout, etc. Toward the end of this year, maybe
>>> at the District Championships, the FAI flyers could get together
>>> and hash out the format for next year. Maybe we switch to full
>>> FAI rules at that time.
>>>
>>> Remember, there are 2 things going on in this discussion. First,
>>> a request to see if we can help our FAI guys that want to go to
>>> the Nats? My vote is yes, let's find a way to help them without
>>> disrupting our D7 world. Second, does D7 need to address our FAI
>>> format approach to be more in line with the other Districts? My
>>> vote is yes, let's make plans to migrate there and get this behind
>>> us peacefully with as little negative impact as possible this
>>> year. At that point, we can recognize FAI as the 'international'
>>> class it is intended to be, support our top pilots in their inter-
>>> regional, national and international efforts. Meanwhile we can all
>>> plan how we want to deal with that change on a personal basis.
>>>
>>> I think Jon C is working on a proposed 'template' for this year.
>>> If we can all find some way to make it work for this year, we have
>>> almost a year to map out a more concrete plan for next year. We
>>> may have individually sacrifice something this year in fairness,
>>> equal exposure, etc, but I think we will live thru it. After all,
>>> the individual CDs are still going to be the final vote. You have
>>> to choose whether you can live with the format. Those that fly F
>>> may have an advantage, those that fly P may have an advantage, or
>>> maybe no one has an advantage, who knows. F may not be offered
>>> at many contests, but for those contests where it is, let's all
>>> just make it work.
>>>
>>> On a more personal note, I am going to start a campaign that gives
>>> me a 10% advantage over Chip on all maneuvers, no matter what they
>>> are, no matter what sequence. I would appreciate your vote for my
>>> proposal Unfortunately, I will still get my head handed to
>>> me......
>>>
>>> Don Atwood
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> In a message dated 3/5/2010 4:06:08 P.M. Pacific Standard Time, joncarter60 at comcast.net
>>> writes:
>>> Well, we have certainly kicked off an interesting discussion!!
>>>
>>>
>>> I would like to get a broader range of opinions so I could use
>>> some help from some of you! Here is a list of everyone who flew
>>> FAI at a D7 contest in 2009.
>>>
>>>
>>> FAI
>>>
>>> Don Atwood **
>>>
>>> Greg Frohreich ****
>>>
>>> Jim Kimbro **
>>>
>>> Bill Sheets
>>>
>>> Chip Hyde **
>>>
>>> Tom Messer **
>>>
>>> Bill Wallace
>>>
>>> Troy Newman
>>>
>>> Steve Hannah **
>>>
>>> Matt Kimbro **
>>>
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