<html><body bgcolor="#FFFFFF"><div>You could probably do it in a single day. I might get my field (OCMA in Irvine) for a small, one day event. I'm going to inquire at the next board meeting (I'm the Pres). It's not a great spot for big contests but it is a great place to fly. </div><div><br></div><div>I had been thinking about something like this. An FAI-only "shootout". </div><div><br></div><div>If enough guys were interested then I can see about a two day. Keeping it under 25 would be best for my field.</div><div><br></div><div>Steve <br><br>Sent from my iPhone</div><div><br>On Mar 7, 2010, at 4:04 PM, Chris Fitzsimmons <<a href="mailto:homeremodeling2003@yahoo.com">homeremodeling2003@yahoo.com</a>> wrote:<br><br></div><div></div><blockquote type="cite"><div><div>Jim</div><div><br></div><div>I really like this idea! The only issue I see is who's field would be willing to shut down for a weekend for 10 or 12 guys.<br><br>Sent from my iPhone</div><div><br>On Mar 7, 2010, at 1:54 PM, James Oddino <<a href="mailto:joddino@socal.rr.com"><a href="mailto:joddino@socal.rr.com">joddino@socal.rr.com</a></a>> wrote:<br><br></div><div></div><blockquote type="cite"><div>I've stayed out of this conversation and it is probably too late to offer an idea now, but I remember going to a contest in Germany back in 1970. It was a district type contest but open to all and as it turned out the guy that won wasn't from that district so the guy in second was the district champ. But here was the format. FAI only. One plane in the air at a time. One set of judges as I recall. Twelve pilots. Two or three rounds just like the FAI rules called for at the time. All in one day. We could do what we
wanted but the concept of an FAI only contest could attract some attention.<div><br></div><div>If we held a few FAI only contests I suspect many of the Masters guys would participate and find out it is a lot of fun. Just a thought.</div><div><br></div><div>Jim</div><div><br></div><div><br><div><div>On Mar 7, 2010, at 12:52 PM, steve hannah wrote:</div><br class="Apple-interchange-newline"><blockquote type="cite">"<font><font color="#000000" face="Arial" size="2">I think Jon C is working on a proposed 'template' for this year. "<br><br>Good. That is the only way we can move on with something. We need a proposal to vote for or against. The current email debate has fallen into the infinite do-loop syndrome. The only way to formally act on this is for a proposal to be put forward. So, I'll wait to see what that is. <br>
<br>By the way, you guys missed a fun time in Yuma. Friday, practice day, was beautiful. Saturday morning was fantastic with calm air, then we were treated to very windy conditions late Saturday. We got in 4 rounds on Sat and rained out this morning. Even though it was shortened by two rounds today, I had fun. You got a little of everything. No air, high wind, right to left, and left to right. Plus, we really enjoyed the Mexican food at Mi Ranchito on 4th st. I'll go back to that place for sure.<br>
<br>Now I'll be waiting for Jon's proposal. <br><br>Steve<br></font></font><br><div class="gmail_quote">On Sat, Mar 6, 2010 at 11:13 AM, <span dir="ltr"><<a href="mailto:AtwoodDon@aol.com"></a><a href="mailto:AtwoodDon@aol.com"><a href="mailto:AtwoodDon@aol.com">AtwoodDon@aol.com</a></a>></span> wrote:<br>
<blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="border-left: 1px solid rgb(204, 204, 204); margin: 0pt 0pt 0pt 0.8ex; padding-left: 1ex;">
<div style="font-family: Arial; color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-size: 10pt;"><font color="#000000" face="Arial" size="2">
<div>OK, after thinking about this for a while, here is my opinion, for whatever
that is worth. We are wrestling with a near term request and a longer term
approach. Following is my opinion and does not represent anyone else, so
if you as a FAI flyer agree or don't agree, let Jon and the rest of the FAI
flyers know what you think or want.</div>
<div> </div>
<div>This 'discussion' started as a question framed around whether we should
allow some provision to fly F at the Arvin contest in May to provide a way for
people that wanted to go to the Nats an opportunity to fly F competitively prior
to the Nats. And for a few, the opportunity to fly F just because they wanted
to. So far, so good. I do not have any problem supporting our D7 members
that want to compete in the Nats. I can live with some level of compromise
to support that. Good for you. Go D7!!! </div>
<div> </div>
<div>At this point some of us headed for the popcorn and microwave assuming this
was going to get</div>
<div>interesting. And it has.....<br> <br>A few ideas were batted
around about how to accommodate those wanting to practice F in a competitive
setting with little or no impact to those that don't really want to fly F.
Basically, we were looking for a middle ground to keep everyone happy.
Predictably, the discussion quickly became more about why that won't work for a
myriad of reasons and we should make a District wide decision to change the way
we run the FAI class. Now, remember the original request was to provide an
avenue for 'F' exposure prior to the Nats.</div>
<div> </div>
<div>I have flown in the FAI/F3A class for many years under the format we
settled into for local contests. I worked my way up thru all the available AMA
classes over the years and ended up in 'FAI'. I have flown most of my FAI
contests in D7 and have not attended the Nats for many years. Personally, I
don't have much interest in flying F. When I say I 'fly FAI' it is just a
designation for the class I competed in using the same rules for everybody
everybody else in that contest. I am by no means a world class flyer and
if I am not qualified to call myself a FAI flyer because I don't fly F, I don't
have an problem with that, it is just a name. </div>
<div> </div>
<div>D7 has been in a mode of flying 'P only' for many years as have most
districts. We made the FAI class fit into the AMA formats, not the other
way around. Some strongly feel we are following the 'intent' of the FAI rules,
some don't. So, if we change the approach, where do we draw the line?
We 'kinda' follow the rules? We 'mostly' follow the rules? We
'fully' follow the rules? </div>
<div> </div>
<div>The only black and white answer is 'fully' follow the rules, right
now. However, I don't believe it is the best near term answer for
D7. There are too many ramifications to that decision that will not be
positive for D7. I would suggest the approach could be to find a way to
'migrate' to that decision if the majority of FAI flyers think it is the right
direction. </div>
<div> </div>
<div>That migration could be a step this year, 2 steps next year, and full blown
local FAI 3 years from now, or some other agreed on timetable. For those
CDs that want to provide some F rounds this year, they could announce it
<u>well</u> in advance, and hopefully follow a format that is predictable for
this year, then current FAI contestants could decide if they want to participate
or not. No announcement of F with reasonable leadtime defaults to 'P
only'. The CD will have to determine if his offering will be positive or
negative to the turnout, etc. Toward the end of this year, maybe at the District
Championships, the FAI flyers could get together and hash out the format for
next year. Maybe we switch to full FAI rules at that time. </div>
<div> </div>
<div>Remember, there are 2 things going on in this discussion. First, a
request to see if we can help our FAI guys that want to go to the Nats? My
vote is yes, let's find a way to help them without disrupting our D7
world. Second, does D7 need to address our FAI format approach to be
more in line with the other Districts? My vote is yes, let's make plans to
migrate there and get this behind us peacefully with as little negative impact
as possible this year. At that point, we can recognize FAI as the
'international' class it is intended to be, support our top pilots in their
inter-regional, national and international efforts. Meanwhile we can all
plan how we want to deal with that change on a personal basis.</div>
<div> </div>
<div>I think Jon C is working on a proposed 'template' for this year. If
we can all find some way to make it work for this year, we have almost a year to
map out a more concrete plan for next year. We may have individually sacrifice
something this year in fairness, equal exposure, etc, but I think we will live
thru it. After all, the individual CDs are still going to be the final
vote. You have to choose whether you can live with the format. Those that fly F
may have an advantage, those that fly P may have an advantage, or maybe no one
has an advantage, who knows. F may not be offered at many contests,
but for those contests where it is, let's all just make it work.</div>
<div> </div>
<div>On a more personal note, I am going to start a campaign that gives me a 10%
advantage over Chip on all maneuvers, no matter what they are, no matter what
sequence. I would appreciate your vote for my proposal
Unfortunately, I will still get my head handed to me......</div>
<div> </div>
<div>Don Atwood</div>
<div> </div>
<div> </div>
<div> </div>
<div> </div>
<div> </div>
<div><div><div></div><div class="h5">
<div>In a message dated 3/5/2010 4:06:08 P.M. Pacific Standard Time,
<a href="mailto:joncarter60@comcast.net" target="_blank"></a><a href="mailto:joncarter60@comcast.net"><a href="mailto:joncarter60@comcast.net">joncarter60@comcast.net</a></a> writes:</div>
</div></div><blockquote style="border-left: 2px solid blue; padding-left: 5px; margin-left: 5px;"><font style="background-color: transparent;" color="#000000" face="Arial" size="2"><div><div></div><div class="h5">
<div><p class="MsoNormal"><font color="navy" face="Arial" size="2"><span style="font-family: Arial; color: navy; font-size: 10pt;">Well, we have
certainly kicked off an interesting discussion!! </span></font></p><div><font color="navy" face="Arial" size="2"><span style="font-family: Arial; color: navy; font-size: 10pt;"> </span></font><br class="webkit-block-placeholder"></div><p class="MsoNormal"><font color="navy" face="Arial" size="2"><span style="font-family: Arial; color: navy; font-size: 10pt;">I would like to get a
broader range of opinions so I could use some help from some of you! Here is a
list of everyone who flew FAI at a D7 contest in
2009.</span></font></p><div><font color="navy" face="Arial" size="2"><span style="font-family: Arial; color: navy; font-size: 10pt;"> </span></font><br class="webkit-block-placeholder"></div>
<table style="width: 88pt; border-collapse: collapse;" width="117" border="0" cellpadding="0" cellspacing="0">
<tbody>
<tr style="min-height: 13.15pt;" height="18">
<td style="border: 1pt solid windowtext; padding: 0in 5.4pt; width: 88pt; min-height: 13.15pt;" width="117" height="18" nowrap="" valign="bottom"><p style="text-align: center;" class="MsoNormal" align="center"><b><font color="navy" face="Arial" size="1"><span style="font-family: Arial; color: navy; font-size: 8.5pt; font-weight: bold;">FAI</span></font></b></p>
</td></tr>
<tr style="min-height: 13.15pt;" height="18">
<td style="border-style: none solid solid; border-color: -moz-use-text-color windowtext windowtext; border-width: medium 1pt 1pt; padding: 0in 5.4pt; width: 88pt; min-height: 13.15pt;" width="117" height="18" nowrap="" valign="bottom"><p class="MsoNormal"><font face="Arial" size="1"><span style="font-family: Arial; font-size: 8.5pt;">Don Atwood
**</span></font></p></td></tr>
<tr style="min-height: 13.15pt;" height="18">
<td style="border-style: none solid solid; border-color: -moz-use-text-color windowtext windowtext; border-width: medium 1pt 1pt; padding: 0in 5.4pt; width: 88pt; min-height: 13.15pt;" width="117" height="18" nowrap="" valign="bottom"><p class="MsoNormal"><font face="Arial" size="1"><span style="font-family: Arial; font-size: 8.5pt;">Greg Frohreich
****</span></font></p></td></tr>
<tr style="min-height: 13.15pt;" height="18">
<td style="border-style: none solid solid; border-color: -moz-use-text-color windowtext windowtext; border-width: medium 1pt 1pt; padding: 0in 5.4pt; width: 88pt; min-height: 13.15pt;" width="117" height="18" nowrap="" valign="bottom"><p class="MsoNormal"><font face="Arial" size="1"><span style="font-family: Arial; font-size: 8.5pt;">Jim Kimbro
**</span></font></p></td></tr>
<tr style="min-height: 13.15pt;" height="18">
<td style="border-style: none solid solid; border-color: -moz-use-text-color windowtext windowtext; border-width: medium 1pt 1pt; padding: 0in 5.4pt; width: 88pt; min-height: 13.15pt;" width="117" height="18" nowrap="" valign="bottom"><p class="MsoNormal"><font face="Arial" size="1"><span style="font-family: Arial; font-size: 8.5pt;">Bill
Sheets</span></font></p></td></tr>
<tr style="min-height: 13.15pt;" height="18">
<td style="border-style: none solid solid; border-color: -moz-use-text-color windowtext windowtext; border-width: medium 1pt 1pt; padding: 0in 5.4pt; width: 88pt; min-height: 13.15pt;" width="117" height="18" nowrap="" valign="bottom"><p class="MsoNormal"><font face="Arial" size="1"><span style="font-family: Arial; font-size: 8.5pt;">Chip Hyde
**</span></font></p></td></tr>
<tr style="min-height: 13.15pt;" height="18">
<td style="border-style: none solid solid; border-color: -moz-use-text-color windowtext windowtext; border-width: medium 1pt 1pt; padding: 0in 5.4pt; width: 88pt; min-height: 13.15pt;" width="117" height="18" nowrap="" valign="bottom"><p class="MsoNormal"><font face="Arial" size="1"><span style="font-family: Arial; font-size: 8.5pt;">Tom Messer
**</span></font></p></td></tr>
<tr style="min-height: 13.15pt;" height="18">
<td style="border-style: none solid solid; border-color: -moz-use-text-color windowtext windowtext; border-width: medium 1pt 1pt; padding: 0in 5.4pt; width: 88pt; min-height: 13.15pt;" width="117" height="18" nowrap="" valign="bottom"><p class="MsoNormal"><font face="Arial" size="1"><span style="font-family: Arial; font-size: 8.5pt;">Bill
Wallace</span></font></p></td></tr>
<tr style="min-height: 13.15pt;" height="18">
<td style="border-style: none solid solid; border-color: -moz-use-text-color windowtext windowtext; border-width: medium 1pt 1pt; padding: 0in 5.4pt; width: 88pt; min-height: 13.15pt;" width="117" height="18" nowrap="" valign="bottom"><p class="MsoNormal"><font face="Arial" size="1"><span style="font-family: Arial; font-size: 8.5pt;">Troy
Newman</span></font></p></td></tr>
<tr style="min-height: 13.15pt;" height="18">
<td style="border-style: none solid solid; border-color: -moz-use-text-color windowtext windowtext; border-width: medium 1pt 1pt; padding: 0in 5.4pt; width: 88pt; min-height: 13.15pt;" width="117" height="18" nowrap="" valign="bottom"><p class="MsoNormal"><font face="Arial" size="1"><span style="font-family: Arial; font-size: 8.5pt;">Steve Hannah
**</span></font></p></td></tr>
<tr style="min-height: 13.15pt;" height="18">
<td style="border-style: none solid solid; border-color: -moz-use-text-color windowtext windowtext; border-width: medium 1pt 1pt; padding: 0in 5.4pt; width: 88pt; min-height: 13.15pt;" width="117" height="18" nowrap="" valign="bottom"><p class="MsoNormal"><font face="Arial" size="1"><span style="font-family: Arial; font-size: 8.5pt;">Matt Kimbro
**</span></font></p></td></tr>
<tr style="min-height: 13.15pt;" height="18">
<td style="border-style: none solid solid; border-color: -moz-use-text-color windowtext windowtext; border-width: medium 1pt 1pt; padding: 0in 5.4pt; width: 88pt; min-height: 13.15pt;" width="117" height="18" nowrap="" valign="bottom"><p class="MsoNormal"></p></td></tr></tbody></table></div></div></div></font></blockquote></div></font></div></blockquote></div></blockquote></div></div></div></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><div><span>_______________________________________________</span><br><span>NSRCA-dist7 mailing list</span><br><span><a href="mailto:NSRCA-dist7@lists.nsrca.org"><a href="mailto:NSRCA-dist7@lists.nsrca.org">NSRCA-dist7@lists.nsrca.org</a></a></span><br><span><a href="http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-dist7"><a href="http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-dist7">http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-dist7</a></a></span><br></div></blockquote><br>
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