[NSRCA-dist1] PatternScoring System

Wed Oct 28 10:25:18 AKDT 2015

Score distribution of 4 contests using the E-Scribe and 4 using paper.
Slightly higher scores overall with E-Scribe, but no difference below 6...I
have to admit, that isn't quite what I expected!

(screen capture below in case it gets clipped)
[image: Inline image 2]

On Wed, Oct 28, 2015 at 11:26 AM, Michael DiGennaro via NSRCA-dist1 <
nsrca-dist1 at lists.nsrca.org> wrote:

> Folks,
>
>  I may be a newbie to Pattern but I have vast experience in complex
> instant scoring systems. In this case there is only a "cool factor" and in
> my opinion no measurable affect on the outcome or attendance of a contest.
>
>  If D1 is to invest hard cash into something perhaps some more actual
> events/contests would be nice. Would our D1 folks benefit more from slick
> scoring or more flying?
>
> On Wed, Oct 28, 2015 at 11:02 AM, JOE LACHOWSKI via NSRCA-dist1 <
> nsrca-dist1 at lists.nsrca.org> wrote:
>
>>
>> Actually, there needs to be more focus on getting people to the contests.
>>
>>
>> Joe Lachowski
>>
>>
>>
>> On Wed, Oct 28, 2015 at 10:57 AM, Ed Alt wrote:
>>
>> Yep!
>>
>> On Oct 28, 2015, at 10:52 AM, JOE LACHOWSKI via NSRCA-dist1 <
>> nsrca-dist1 at lists.nsrca.org> wrote:
>>
>> I never look at scores. It only makes me angry. Only interested in
>> results relative to my fellow competitors. LOL. Focusing on having better
>> qualified and a bigger pool of judges than an automated scoring program is
>> more important. I prefer writing on paper no matter what and will never use
>> an automated system when I judge.
>>
>>
>>
>> Joe Lachowski
>>
>>
>>
>> On Wed, Oct 28, 2015 at 10:43 AM, Scott Smith via NSRCA-dist1 wrote:
>>
>> I think, more than anything, Peter's system provides for better judging.
>> Points are deducted as defects are seen; no more impression judging.  If no
>> defects are seen, it's a 10.  If numerous defects are flown, a 1 or 0 is
>> easily possible.  Where as how many actually write a 1?   It also allows
>> for the judge to never have take their eyes off the airplane to record a
>> score.
>>
>> The logistics of moving scores and eliminating transcription errors is
>> just gravy.
>>
>> On Wed, Oct 28, 2015 at 9:33 AM, John Ford via NSRCA-dist1 <
>> nsrca-dist1 at lists.nsrca.org> wrote:
>>
>>> I think that we need to remember what the core problem is…
>>> The core problem isn't the choice of scoring system, hi-tech, lo-tech,
>>> or anything else.
>>>
>>> The NSRCA's mission is to provide Contests and Contest Experiences to
>>> its members. That means that the local contest is king of everything we do
>>> and has the greatest influence on how our sport evolves and lives. (Sorry,
>>> but the NATS are a statistically trivial part of all NSRCA activity)
>>> From the perspective of a new Sportsman, THE SINGLE BIGGEST DEAL in
>>> his/her mind is seeing their score after the first round of their first
>>> contest…that's it.
>>>
>>> In the Districts (I've seen several, not only D1), we have
>>> volunteers/CD's who run the current "manual" software very very well,
>>> without a hitch, and posting rounds a few minutes after the last pilot
>>> lands. Within the same districts, there are contests where scores are
>>> simply not available at all until Sunday afternoon. We even see contests
>>> where an "on-the-spot" excel spreadsheet gets created on Saturday morning
>>> because of an unresolvable glitch in the software.
>>>
>>> So we have a consistency issue to solve, not necessarily a major
>>> technology obstacle to overcome.
>>>
>>> Probably relatively easy to solve the former, and much more demanding on
>>> someone's time to solve the latter via Peter's system.
>>>
>>> Just my opinion…
>>>
>>> John Ford
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> On Oct 28, 2015, at 9:06 AM, Dana Beaton via NSRCA-dist1 <
>>> nsrca-dist1 at lists.nsrca.org> wrote:
>>>
>>> It’s a system Matt, and someone needs to set-up WiFi at each contest so
>>> that the scores are passed to the computer as the judges record them.
>>> Would require a non-trivial level of knowledge, training and commitment to
>>> implement and maintain in any District; that said, not insurmountable if
>>> that’s what any District wants to do and has volunteers who will see it
>>> through. What is perhaps as interesting is that how our members wish to
>>> score rounds at a contest?  There is a certain simplicity in the way we do
>>> it now, with pencil and paper, that is perhaps not something that all would
>>> like to discard for recording downgrades.  We could say that if it isn’t
>>> broke, don’t fix it; but to be honest that is not entirely the case, that
>>> what we do now is not broke; but Vogel’s solution is only one possible way
>>> to address what sometimes does not work well at our D1 contests. What do
>>> others think?
>>>
>>>
>>> On Oct 28, 2015, at 8:06 AM, rcmaster199 at aol.com wrote:
>>>
>>> I want to qualify my comments. I only have a passing interest in Peter's
>>> scoring system, so take what I'm about to say with a grain of salt. Bottom
>>> line, "I think" that it scores each maneuver directly into a database and
>>> produces immediate results after each pilot has flown. That's really cool!
>>> If I understand it right.
>>>
>>> I think that for D1 it's likely a mater of logistics. How many contests
>>> are there and what is the real workload the system likely to alleviate?
>>> Having the instant response is a nice to have but is it absolutely
>>> necessary? Are the required people who have been doing the job no longer
>>> available? Or is it one big hassle every Saturday morning and that's the
>>> real benefit? But someone still needs to manage something with this
>>> software, don't they?
>>>
>>> Money: Chances are that you the pilots will need to put up the
>>> money. You may ask the NSRCA board for assistance and might get 200$. And
>>> what about new pilots coming into pattern (in D1)? When do they participate
>>> with their wallets?
>>>
>>> Is the app enough technology to help a contest or do you have to have
>>> the full blown system?
>>>
>>> Matt
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> -----Original Message-----
>>> From: Dana Beaton via NSRCA-dist1 <nsrca-dist1 at lists.nsrca.org>
>>> To: Anthony Romano <anthonyr105 at hotmail.com>; CT, DE, ME, MD, MA, NH,
>>> NJ, NY, PA, RI, VT, ME, MD, MA, NH, NJ, NY, PA, RI, VT <
>>> nsrca-dist1 at lists.nsrca.org>
>>> Sent: Wed, Oct 28, 2015 6:27 am
>>> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-dist1] PatternScoring System
>>>
>>> Aside from the obvious question of where would the $2,500 investment
>>> come from, I wish I could say that contest scoring has NOT been an issue in
>>> D1, and that we really don’t need a some solution.  With all due respect to
>>> our clubs, CDs, their assistants and volunteers who have been doing their
>>> very best with what they have to work with; we have had challenges in
>>> recent contests with legacy laptop computers and that remains an issue,
>>> albeit a local one for contests in 2016.  Now I would not go so far as to
>>> say that Vogel's solution is the right fit for D1; but it’s availability
>>> does beg the question if we can do better as a District; and raise the
>>> question if there is an alternative to continuing with the various local
>>> laptops? Perhaps D1 acquiring/updating a laptop or two to support contests
>>> at the District level as an intermediate step?  If we cannot supply/support
>>> a D1 laptop or two, and manage the logistics of who has it, where & when,
>>> then we are not likely to pull off a full conversion to Vogel’s system.
>>>
>>> My observation is that we have enough capable volunteers at each contest
>>> to enter scores, many of whom are now familiar with Master Scoring
>>> software; but we have had an uneven experience with the the laptops
>>> themselves in recent years.  What do others think and is this an issue we
>>> want to address as D1 (or just let it stay local knowing that contests may
>>> not go as smoothly as they could if we had some robust D1 hardware backing
>>> our local efforts)?  Perhaps if we can manage the logistics of shepherding
>>> two D1 scoring computers around in 2016, we might upgrade to Vogel’s system
>>> in the future once additional members have been exposed to it enough to
>>> decide if they want to use it at their local contests (most D1 members do
>>> not travel to the Nats)?
>>>
>>>
>>> On Oct 27, 2015, at 9:00 PM, Anthony Romano via NSRCA-dist1 <
>>> nsrca-dist1 at lists.nsrca.org> wrote:
>>>
>>> Please read the below message from Peter Vogel about the electronic
>>> scoring system he brought to the Canandaigua contest this year. Should D1
>>> invest in one of these systems? Anyone willing to manage this?
>>>
>>> Anthony
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> After 2 very successful trouble-free runs at the SAM contest 2 weeks ago
>>> and the Cajun NATS last week.  Last Monday I finally decided it was time to
>>> submit the app formally to the app store rather than relying on development
>>> loads to individual iPod touches or TestFlight 30-day conk beta loads for
>>> my friends in Australia who have been experimenting with the app.  As more
>>> districts reach out to me with orders for fully configured setups I wanted
>>> to make sure I had a path to get software updates out to devices in a
>>> timely manner.
>>>
>>> So I'm pleased to announce that as of today the PatternScoring app for
>>> iOS is live on the App Store as a free app!
>>>
>>> https://itunes.apple.com/us/app/patternscoring/id1018433564?mt=8
>>>
>>> If you've never used the scribe app before, feel free to download and,
>>> with a good internet connection, use the "demo contest" mode to play with
>>> it.  Naturally the intent is to use it with a game controller, but the
>>> buttons on the screen with the picture of the game controller do work to
>>> give you a flavor for how things work.
>>>
>>> If you are using it on iOS 8, you will notice that the voice is a little
>>> bit fast.  That's because iOS 9 changed the pace of the voice synthesizer
>>> and I submitted the version to work best with the latest iOS (9).
>>>
>>> I've also completed a complete Bill of Materials for the contest scoring
>>> system, including two handy rolling cases with custom-cut foam for
>>> everything needed (except the laptop) to run a contest, I sell these at my
>>> cost of $2500, fully configured to run a contest out of the box (i.e.: I'm
>>> not trying to make money on this).  D8 just bought one, and D7 has bought
>>> two. If any other districts have an interest in getting one or more sets,
>>> please contact me directly and we can make appropriate arrangements.
>>> Please make sure you have one or more people in the district who are
>>> willing and able to take on the running of scoring at a contest using the
>>> system.  I'm making continuous refinements to the system to make it easier
>>> for anyone to run scoring, but it does require a certain level of comfort
>>> and familiarity with technology in general.
>>>
>>> Thanks!
>>> Peter+
>>>
>>> --
>>> Director, Fixed Wing Flight Training
>>> Santa Clara County Model Aircraft Skypark
>>> Associate Vice President, Academy of Model Aeronautics District X
>>> Treasurer, National Society of Radio Control Aerobatics (NSRCA)
>>>
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>
>
> --
> Mike DiGennaro (Mike D.)
>
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