[NSRCA-discussion] New Masters Maneuver

Thu Nov 4 16:27:49 AKDT 2021

I take it as this. The 1st is the loop you must start and end at the same
point making a full 360 equal geometry.  The 4 point roll is done on the
180 deg of the loop the 4 points must be equal segements of the 1/2 loop.
That includes the pause while still haveing to fly the loop. Samething as a
normal 4 point you pause but still have to fly the straight line.

On Thu, Nov 4, 2021, 7:17 PM Stuart Chale via NSRCA-discussion <
nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org> wrote:

> I don’t think you can have hesitations before the rolling elements in
> integrated rolls.  (You do but it is part of the loop)  If we allow a
> hesitation before beginning a roll over the top 180 degrees then that
> hesitation could easily be 15 degrees of the loop on both sides. So the
> start and stop position of the roll would be almost arbitrary as long as it
> is after the prescribed starting point. Can’t effectively judge that.
>
>
>
> As far as positioning of the rolls lets assume equal travel over the loop
> segment for all elements.  90 deg roll, knife edge, 90 deg roll, upright
> flight, 90 degree roll, knife edge, 90 deg roll.
>
> 7 elements in 180 degrees.  Each element covers 25.7 degrees.
>
>
>
> The first roll travels from 90 degrees to 115.7.  The knife edge is from
> 115.7 to 141.4.. Center of the knifedge portion is at  128.55
>
> The next roll is from 141.4 through 167.1.  The upright flight is from
> 167.1 through 192.8
>
> Center of the upright flight is at 180 degrees
>
> The next roll is from 192.8 to 218.5 and the second knife edge segment is
> from
>
> 218.5 through 244.2 and the final roll from 244.2 to 270
>
> (lost a tenth from rounding errors)
>
>
>
> Stuart
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> *rom:* john tarpinian <jtarpinian at yahoo.com>
> *Sent:* Thursday, November 4, 2021 6:51 PM
> *To:* General pattern discussion <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>;
> Stuart Chale <schale1 at outlook.com>
> *Cc:* Don Ramsey <donramsey at gmail.com>
> *Subject:* Re: [NSRCA-discussion] New Masters Maneuver
>
>
>
> My previous interpretation was in fact the way I was doing it.   But after
> further analysis I was doing it wrong.  I see what Stu is saying but here
> is another interpretation.
>
>
>
> 1.   After completing 1/4 loop hesitate briefly and roll to knife edge
> with knife edge portion centered at 10:30.
>
>
>
> 2.   Roll to upright with upright portion centered at 12:00.
>
>
>
> 3.   Roll to knife edge with knife edge centered at 1:30.
>
>
>
> 4.   Complete roll a little before 3:00 just as if it was another point
> centered on 3:00.
>
>
>
> This matches Stu's interpretation at the 10:30, 12:00,  and 1:30 positions
> but differs at the 9:00 and 3:00 positions.   However, the maneuver is now
> completely symmetric.  If you start and end the roll at the begining and
> end of the half loop the begining and last 1/4 rolls will be longer than
> the others.
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> j
>
>
>
> On Thursday, November 4, 2021, 05:39:07 PM EDT, Stuart Chale <
> schale1 at outlook.com> wrote:
>
>
>
>
>
> I have always judged integrated rolls with the start and completion of the
> roll within the designated arc. A half roll over the top 90 starts and
> completes the half roll at the 45 degree points.
>
> The four point would be the same the roll starts at 90. 180 should be the
> mid point of the upright or inverted section and the plane should complete
> the last 90 degree roll at 270 degrees.
>
> Stuart
>
> Sent from my iPhone
>
>
>
> On Nov 4, 2021, at 4:36 PM, john tarpinian via NSRCA-discussion <
> nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org> wrote:
>
> 
>
>
>
> I would say it's not symmetrical in that after the first 1/4 loop there is
> a hesitation but just before reaching the 3:00 position you are rolling.
> My interpretation assuming entering the loop from the right.
>
>
>
> 1. After completing first 1/4 loop, hesitate and perform 1/4 roll coming
> to knife edge at 10:30
>
>
>
> 2. Hesitate and then perform 1/4 roll to coming to upright at 12:00.
>
>
>
> 3.  Hesitate and come to knife edge at 1:30.
>
>
>
> 4.  Hesitate and complete roll at 3:00.
>
>
>
> The NSRCA description makes it sound like you should begin the roll at
> 9:00.  See below.
>
>
>
>  Loop with integrated 4 point roll over the top 180 degrees. (U): From
> upright pull a ¼ inside loop, continue the loop while rolling 90 degrees,
> hesitate the roll while continuing the loop, roll 90° in the same direction
> while continuing loop, hesitate the roll while continuing loop, the center
> of this hesitation should be at top dead center of the loop, roll 90° in
> the same direction while continuing the loop, hesitate the roll while
> continuing the loop, roll 90° in the same direction while continuing the
> loop, completing the roll at 270° of the loop, pull ¼ inside loop to exit
> in level horizontal flight.
>
>
>
>
>
> On Thursday, November 4, 2021, 03:52:13 PM EDT, Don Ramsey via
> NSRCA-discussion <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org> wrote:
>
>
>
>
>
> Food for thought.  In the new Masters sequence, think about the loop with
> a 4 point roll.  Where do the rolls start and where are the key points for
> KE, Up-right, KE, and finish. Is the up-right portion of the roll
> symmetrical around center?
>
>
>
>
>
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