[NSRCA-discussion] Let us bicker about who can use the list

Mon May 12 20:22:08 AKDT 2008

I personally know Jim, and have for a number of years.  I point this out, because it may mean I have a bias.

Couple questions I have –

- Is it possible Jim was simply asking a question, and is legitimately puzzled as to why someone why someone who is active on and benefiting from the list would not support the organization that sponsors the list?

- Does Jim have a history of positive contributions to the organization and this list?

I’d like to think that most non-NSRCA members that become involved on this list for any length of time would eventually join NSRCA (as some have done), but it is an open list (and I like it that way), so there is no requirement to do so.

I read Jim’s query as short, direct, and free of sugar coating.  I didn’t find it offensive, but I can see how it could be interpreted that way.  Knowing Jim, I sincerely think he is puzzled as to why someone would not support a group that is providing benefit.  For those that don’t know Jim, and care to know what kind of person he is, I’ve never seen him without a smile on his face, I’ve never seen him fail to help people, and he is definitely passionate about pattern.  For those that think Jim’s post was offensive, perhaps maybe Jim deserves a little benefit of doubt – just my opinion.

Regards,

Dave Lockhart

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From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Pete Cosky
Sent: Monday, May 12, 2008 11:24 PM
To: General pattern discussion
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Let us bicker about who can use the list

Jeremy,

Some of us just have off days and other like to debate ( I personally fall into both categories ) but I think you will find that pattern people are among the most helpful. That has been my experience at any rate with VERY FEW exceptions.

If you need any help with your vacuum setup don't hesitate to contact me directly. I have built a few of them in the past and have not used weights on anything in the last 5 years. 

Pete

----- Original Message ----- 

From: JEREMY CHINN <mailto:lagrue at hotmail.com>  

To: General pattern discussion <mailto:nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>  

Sent: Monday, May 12, 2008 11:12 PM

Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Let us bicker about who can use the list

Jim et al, as a guy who is terribly interested in flying pattern this season and becoming a member of the NSRCA, your idea and attitude initially turns me off to the organization. 

However, I'll temper that idea or feeling with the fact that every good organization will have people who feel the way or act as you have. IE, my hope and belief is that not everyone thinks as you do. 

I've managed to be part of this hobby for over 25 years and always subscribed to the idea that sharing knowledge gets me more in return than I could ever offer and often helps me make great new friends and as an extension of that thought, an organization can benefit in the same way - new members, new enthusiasm are gotten by free sharing of information and ideas.

FWIW, one other thought to consider- there are always many more listening/lurking than speaking/typing. So how many people might you have run off now? Many won't tell you about it, they'll just go. 

Time to get back to my shop and finish tuning up my new vacuum bagging system so I can bag my new pattern plane wings next week. 

Sincerely, a non-NSRCA member who subscribes to and learns from this list. 

Jeremy Chinn

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From: pcosky at comcast.net
To: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
Date: Mon, 12 May 2008 22:37:24 -0400
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Let us bicker about who can use the list

Then make the list members only if you would rather close the gates instead of build bridges. If one wanted to make sure only members were able to glean any knowledge from the NSRCA I guess we shouldn't hand out KFs to people who are not members nor even have a booth at a show like Toledo.

I'm with Dowayne and Ken.

FYI - I subscribed to the list before I became a member and it was the general helpfulness of the general populace on this list that made me decide to join. After all you do not have to be an NSRCA member to fly in a pattern meet. 

Can we now get back to discussing the hobby we all enjoy instead of making this an US and THEM debate?

----- Original Message ----- 

From: Steven <mailto:patternrules at yahoo.com>  Maxwell 

To: General pattern discussion <mailto:nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>  

Sent: Monday, May 12, 2008 9:50 PM

Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Starters for YS in Canada

 I have to disagree I have seen this list been abrused many times by people that have never been NASRCA members. I tyhink it's time someone does watch the list. My hats off to Jim.

DoWayne Gould <iflyrc24 at gmail.com> wrote: 

I have to agree Ken. I donâ€™t understand the strong arm tactics. Is this the way to get new members to join the NSRCA? I donâ€™t think a public brow beating is good for anyone. If it keeps up you can count me out next year at renewal time. I donâ€™t agree with it, I donâ€™t care to have it done to me and I donâ€™t like seeing anyone else getting it!

Dowayne

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From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Ken Thompson
Sent: Monday, May 12, 2008 7:02 PM
To: jaqfly at prodigy.net; General pattern discussion
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Starters for YS in Canada

That's kinda' harsh isn't it Jim?

----- Original Message ----- 

From: Jim Quinn <mailto:jaqfly at prodigy.net>  

To: cchariandy at yahoo.ca ; General pattern discussion <mailto:nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>  

Sent: Monday, May 12, 2008 11:25 AM

Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Starters for YS in Canada

Colin, Why do you keep coming to us (NSRCA) for help but refuse to join our membership? It makes no sense to me.

Jim Quinn

colin chariandy <cchariandy at yahoo.ca> wrote:

Will the KAVAN in 12V gell cell work?

Colin.

--- On Mon, 5/12/08, Mark Atwood <atwoodm at paragon-inc.com> wrote:

From: Mark Atwood <atwoodm at paragon-inc.com>
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Starters for YS in Canada
To: cchariandy at yahoo.ca, "General pattern discussion" <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
Received: Monday, May 12, 2008, 9:50 AM

IÃ¢â‚¬â„¢ve been using the Kavan for years.  No problems.  ItÃ¢â‚¬â„¢s currently starting my 1.60 and 1.70DZÃ¢â‚¬â„¢s    CanÃ¢â‚¬â„¢t comment on the others, as to whether they are better or not, but the Kavan will work just fine.

-Mark

On 5/12/08 9:39 AM, "colin chariandy" <cchariandy at yahoo.ca> wrote:

Hi all  I tried to start my DZ with a regular, non-geared 12V Sullivan starter yesterday...no joy.  I know guys are running geared staters from B&P and PAM, but I can't find starters like those in Canada.  My options at the LHS are KAVAN and Sullivan Dynatron.  The KAVAN is really compact...but can it turn over a 170? And the Dynatron....I guess I can use it in the weight room after flying.  Can you advise which is more commonly used and functions better?  Of course if there are other options the Canadians can chime in.  Thanks much Colin.     

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