[NSRCA-discussion] Rainout Contests...
mike mueller
mups1953 at yahoo.com
Mon Jun 12 15:50:09 AKDT 2006
Mark, thanks for clarifying what I was actually attempting to say. After I made my comments yesterday I went flying. Somehow Frankie had heard that I was a little po'd. I told him that my anger was in no way directed at either him or Tommy. It's just a general comment on what I have observed. Oh ya your right about the peer pressure influencing many, Mike Mueller
"Atwood, Mark" <atwoodm at paragon-inc.com> wrote: v\:* {behavior:url(#default#VML);} o\:* {behavior:url(#default#VML);} w\:* {behavior:url(#default#VML);} .shape {behavior:url(#default#VML);} st1\:*{behavior:url(#default#ieooui) } Larry, I think the issue is less about Muncie than the general topic. Muncie at 8am appeared to be a complete washout. It was WAY more obvious than usual
Forecast was for up to an inch of rain over the next 12 hours and probably more on Sunday. Calling it was horribly unfortunate as we had such a big crowd from so many areas, but probably the right thing given the information available.
I think Mike’s point has more to due with less obvious situations, and the general “let’s get home early” attitude that’s become the norm. Forget weather
we get the same issue at the district championship regarding flying a 6th round. With 40+ contestants, and 2 flight lines, with an average of 9 minutes per pilot, it takes 3 hours per round. With GREAT weather
that’s 9 hours of flying both days with no breaks. We get the sun in the box at 4:30 – 5pm
so even with a militaristic 8:30am start, and rigid attention to flight lines (Everyone does a great job at this I must add) we’re pressed to finish anything more than 3 rounds on Saturday
We could also fly 3 rounds on Sunday
but we’d likely not finish until 4pm or so. That seems to be unacceptable to most anymore. I realize that many come from a great distance for this event (we like to think it’s all about the steak roast and night fly! J ), but there are some who are scratching for that last round in hopes
of pulling out a win, and maybe a district championship.
I know I’ve left before some contests have ended because of other commitments. That’s my choice, and if I have to sacrifice a round
then that’s my choice. Bob Kane often chooses to sacrifice the first round of Sunday flying to attend church
I guess my point is maybe Mike’s right
and we have to weight the “Contest” as a whole more heavily
and do our very best to complete them. The pilot “vote” has value, but let’s face it
there’s a lot of peer pressure from those who’s current standings won’t change, or maybe even those that will, but who are in the better position at present
to call it a day.
Let’s face it
MOST of the time, we’re able to finish up 6 rounds by 2pm or so
.so it’s not a big deal most contests. On the few that do run long
maybe we need to suck it up for the exception and lose a little sleep.
-Mark
---------------------------------
From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Lisa & Larry
Sent: Sunday, June 11, 2006 10:32 PM
To: 'NSRCA Mailing List'
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Congratulations D5,proud holders of the Ryder trophy for 2006
My initial take is that I agree with Verne if a mistake was made, we own it. I was there when the vote was made. If someone had thoughts to continue the contest it could have been brought up. Many people were there earlier and had left the field for one reason or another (not necessarily to go home, but to kill time).
Looking back, I think that there is room for improvement. Perhaps the best thing to do was for the CD’s to be at the field at the correct time for starting the contest no matter what the conditions are, and not let anyone leave for any reason if there is a cancellation concern. This way they can work to keep all pilots in the area so a debate can be heard. A decision could then be made to allow folks to check out of there hotel room and meet back at the field to see if any flying could be done. This would allow everyone the flexibility to check back in a hotel if we hold the contest without the risk of any unnecessary loss of money by not checking out.
“People needing to leave early on Sunday”, is not a good argument to cancel a contest if the rain is bad on Saturday
If you can get a contest in regardless of the time on Sunday’s end, provided the majority of folks want it, then that is what should be done. My point is that everybody knows their own situation. For those who took the time and made the commitment to stick it out, they deserve to have a full contest benefit even if it’s a couple of rounds to make a contest.
I’m on the fence with regards to the Muncie cancellation. I would have been ok with either call. If a cancellation is immanent, the sooner it’s called the better. It’s always easier to second guess the decision after the fact knowing how it turned out. I wonder how many people would be ticked if the Muncie contest wasn’t cancelled and we couldn’t get any rounds in due to rain on Sunday also? Lisa and I stayed in the area. There wouldn’t have been enough time to get a complete round in on Saturday for all classes. I don’t know about Sunday.
Larry
---------------------------------
From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Verne Koester
Sent: Sunday, June 11, 2006 7:55 PM
To: NSRCA Mailing List
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Congratulations D5,proud holders of the Ryder trophy for 2006
For the record, Tom and Frank polled those who were there before they called it. If it was a mistake, everyone standing there owns it, including me.
Verne
----- Original Message -----
From: DoWayne Gould
To: 'NSRCA Mailing List'
Sent: Sunday, June 11, 2006 6:50 PM
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Congratulations D5,proud holders of the Ryder trophy for 2006
As a CD that may have to make this call in the future I am watching this thread closely. I make it to all the contests that I can afford the time and money to attend. I was at Muncie when the rain started at around 2:30am. It was still raining steady at 10am with no clearing in sight. I would not want to stand around all day in the rain for the outside chance that the weather would clear long enough to get a round or two in. The forecast for Sunday was for a better chance of rain. I think Tom and Frank did the right thing calling the contest and let everyone salvage there weekend.
As for staying late on Sunday to finish or start a contest, I work third shift and have to be at work at midnight Sunday. That means if I get started to a contest at 7am and awards are given around 7pm and I have a 2 to 3 hour drive, it doesn’t leave much family and rest time before work. Taking Monday’s off for may be OK for some but others like me get paid for being there, if I don’t work I lose a days pay. No pay equals upset family and no hobby funds.
Dowayne
---------------------------------
From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of george w. kennie
Sent: Sunday, June 11, 2006 12:53 PM
To: NSRCA Mailing List
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Congratulations D5,proud holders of the Ryder trophy for 2006
I have to somewhat concur. The most enjoyable contest that I ever competed in was a seven rounder. We flew 3 rounds on Sunday and I was in favor of one more, but got out voted (won the last two rounds and was just getting hot).
----- Original Message -----
From: mike mueller
To: NSRCA Mailing List
Sent: Sunday, June 11, 2006 12:28 PM
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Congratulations D5,proud holders of the Ryder trophy for 2006
Del, I see your point. Maybe what we need to do in the future is consider taking Mondays off instead of Fridays. That way we don't have this situation on Mondays.
Look I expect that things will remain the same. I'm not proposing that we fly late on Sundays I'd just like the option to fly a little later than normal if mother nature is making things difficult. I'd like it if we would stop being in such a rush to go home.
I fly in 6 to 8 contests a year. I spend the rest of the year preparing for these. Its a big commitment to prepare to compete. I think we may have too many who don't care about the competition and fail to respect the wishes of those who do. Maybe we should just change contests to informal get togethers. Have dinner, BS, complain and fly if you feel like it. I'd have far less grief that way.
--Mike
"Del K. Rykert" <drykert2 at rochester.rr.com> wrote:
Thanks for setting me straight.. Well my view is I need to leave by certain departure time to get kids and planes to bed so I can get at least 6.5 hours sleep at minimum.. I always need an 90 minute to get ready and eat before leaving house for Mondays work. That doesn't not include the 50 minute to hour commute. So when you do that math means for me I have to depart no later than 4pm Sunday for contest long drive away.
Del
----- Original Message -----
From: mike mueller
To: NSRCA Mailing List
Sent: Sunday, June 11, 2006 11:32 AM
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Congratulations D5,proud holders of the Ryder trophy for 2006
Thanks Del I understand it but in the case of rain shouldn't we have a different mentallity? Also thanks for the sympathy but the crashes were Marty Kings and on Friday Larry Auer lost his expensive Pinnacle.
"Del K. Rykert" <drykert2 at rochester.rr.com> wrote:
Hi Mike..
My heart goes out to you on your terrible loss of a prize plane.
I wanted to share my view on the wrapping up early on Sunday at contests. When people with families travel a distance, 4-6 hours to a contest and leave at a late hour to be getting up at 5am for work and school for children next day makes for reason not to attend that contest in future. I know if a contest did that repeatedly I would stop attending it.
I had to be clearheaded and awake when I reported on Monday. Peoples lives were in the balance. Another view on it..
Del
nsrca - 473
----- Original Message -----
From: mike mueller
To: NSRCA Mailing List
Sent: Sunday, June 11, 2006 10:23 AM
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Congratulations D5,proud holders of the Ryder trophy for 2006
Do you realize that this makes 3 straight days that we've had total washouts at the shootout? This is because we didn't fly last year on Sunday.
I think that we call contests way too early. It's a shame that we didn't at least attempt to wait till the afternoon and get in 2 flights. I've been told that someone actually stayed and flew in the afternoon. We had people that drove some long distances that dissevered a better attempt.
I don't get why so many are in such a rush to go home. When did it become a rule that we have to be done very early on Sundays also. I remember Rough River in 1987 waiting out the rains on a Sunday and having the award ceromony in the dusk. Bottom line is we got in a contest. This go home early stuff is bad.
What's to say that we couldn't have flown 2 rounds today?
Is it getting to the point where if the weather forcasts show the slightest possability of rain that we should just stay home?
I love coming to contests and seeing all my friends but to be honest its the flying that I'm there for.
---Mike
Bob Kane <getterflash at yahoo.com> wrote:
Well, the D4-D5 shootout was a washout. Rained all day
today in Muncie with a high probability of the same
tomorrow. In a joint decision between D4 and D5, it
was decided to award the Ryder trophy to D5 due to
their tremendeous effort in recruiting pilots to
represent their district this year. They outnumbered
us handily, and would have probably prevailed had we
had the opportunity to fly. Congratulations and good
work!
I might add that dinner last night on the patio at the
Texas Roadhouse was another one to remember, great
friends and great food.
The gauntlet has been thrown, it is on D4 to get the
pilots to Muncie next summer to win back the trophy.
Bob Kane
getterflash at yahoo.com
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