World Judge selection process

Mon Dec 13 07:54:06 AKST 2004

First off Eric... One TINY little clarification.  The judge evaluation
system that was developed by RVP, Matt Kebabjian, with input from several
others is NOT based on TBL at all.  BTW, TBL does NOT rank judges... TBL
ranks pilots - there isn't a TBL judge ranking system.  Period.  If you have
a problem with TBL then you obviously don't understand it, nor do you
understand the calculations involved.  Instead of the "bull in a china shop"
comment - how about "open mouth - insert foot"?

Charlie:  I have no idea why you think I had anything to do with the judge
ranking system... I do support it as it gives us a quantifiable way to
measure judges instead of the "good old boy" way it has been done in the
past.  Don Ramsey is more than qualified to represent the US at the WC next
year, as are several other people that were on that list (including Bob
Noll, Mike Dumpy (sic), Earl Haury, etc.).

-----Original Message-----
From: discussion-request at nsrca.org [mailto:discussion-request at nsrca.org] On
Behalf Of Grow Pattern
Sent: Monday, December 13, 2004 7:31 AM
To: discussion at nsrca.org
Subject: World Judge selection process 

Charlie,
              I had and have absolutely NOTHING to do with this judging
evaluation system. You were probably misinformed so please allow me to
correct/update the information.

FYI - I nominated Bob Noll to the AMA when Dave Brown asked the NSRCA for
its recommendation. It felt like a good choice. I selected him and two
others after asking for nominations from the NSRCA District-VP's and the
rest of the NSRCA board. He was chosen for his work as a judge, the work
done running many judging schools, great services to the NSRCA and
especially the AMA after running three USA Nationals etc.

At the time I was overruled by Dave Brown who chose Mike Dumpy, (for similar
reasons). Subsequently, Dave chose Bob after Mike had represented the USA on
two occasions. (Very well I might add).

The ranking system was put together by RVP and associates to prove to Dave
who he should submit to the FAI for WC judge consideration. I am guessing
that lobbying took place to remove Bob Noll and insert the top TBL rated USA
judge.

I have several issues with the TBL type of judges ranking.

1. The biggest is that it is too easy for a judge to do well by scoring in a
popular way or an "average" way. The guy who knows enough about judging to
give the correct low score will often be on the "out".

2. Also they included judging performances from Master's Nat's. There is big
difference scoring FAI and Masters. Not least of which is the 1/2 point vs. 
the whole point system.

3. They used the performance in 8 contests (As far as I know). Scoring rules
and maneuver standards change. To get eight Nationals/team trials you have
to go back a few years. I have always believed that only the last few years
of FAI judging should be used because they are the most relevant to
performance.

4. It does not take into account the intangibles such as, Statesmanship,
ambassadorial qualities and contribution that will be needed in a WC
environment.

One further point. I also think that Don Ramsey is a great guy and should
not get any flack for being selected. He was the guy I went to and asked to
form the current rules/judging committee. He has helped clarify many rules
for us and dealt with many tough issues in a calm and professional manner.

I have always been an opponent of the ranking system. The problem is that
when you speak out against something that people are "married" to,
especially when they are the creators of the system, you will, and I have,
draw a lot of abuse. I fully expect my note to be cropped, chopped, torn
apart, dissected and corrected. I might even get another "Bull in a china
shop" comment reward. Of course I might just look like that to some,
especially when I am in their face and won't back down when I see something
going on that I believe is wrong!

I credit you for speaking out Charlie, but I just had to set the record
straight when you used my name.

Regards,

Eric Henderson.

----- Original Message -----
From: "Rock, Charles" <crock at kclife.com>
To: <discussion at nsrca.org>
Sent: Monday, December 13, 2004 9:10 AM
Subject: RE: [SUSPECT-HEADER] - Re: Adjustable stab weight - Character set
not allowed (n/a)

> Well here is another example of the results of the fox designing the 
> chicken coop! Don Ramsey knew exactly what he had to do to become the 
> top ranked judge as did Ron V., Derek K., and Eric H., need I tell you 
> who all were involved making the judges ranking system?? THIS PISSES 
> ME OFF...The "Haves" get all the beanies, and we pay their way too, 
> most likely..Another NSRCA moment!! Charlie

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