[NSRCA-discussion] Raffle & Paypal

Derek Koopowitz derekkoopowitz at gmail.com
Sat Jan 5 20:06:58 AKST 2013 

This happened to the NSRCA account several years ago... Paypal's terms of service expressly forbid raffles.


Sent from my iPad

On Jan 6, 2013, at 12:31 PM, "Atwood, Mark" <atwoodm at paragon-inc.com> wrote:

> Hey All,
> 
> Here's the scoop.   The risk we run if we use paypal is that paypal can lock your bank account for up to six months.  The F3J team had this happen and fortunately was able to clear things up prior to their trip or they would have been in serious straights.
> 
> Paypal does have a compliance group that I'm trying to work with to allow non profit organizations to fund raise, but it's a hoop jumping contest and is going to take some time.  We are exploring other avenues as well.  We have a good team so I think we'll get this solved.  If you think you can lend a hand, please contact me offlist as we can use all the help we can.
> 
> Thanks
> Mark Atwood
> Paragon Consulting, Inc.  |  President
> 5885 Landerbrook Drive Suite 130, Cleveland Ohio, 44124
> Phone: 440.684.3101 x102  |  Direct: 440-229-2502
> Fax: 440.684.3102
> mark.atwood at paragon-inc.com<mailto:mark.atwood at paragon-inc.com>  |  www.paragon-inc.com<http://www.paragon-inc.com/>
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> On Jan 5, 2013, at 6:33 PM, Peter Vogel wrote:
> 
> An Austin-based club often does raffles online using Paypal, I'll leave it to y'all to judge the ethics of it, I personally feel that Paypal's rules are overly restrictive based on an interpretation of what the government means by "gambling" when they prohibit online gambling. Here's how it works -- everything on the paypal side is set up as a donation, but there is a side understanding that for donation of $X you will get Y tickets where Y increases faster than X, but not exponentially.  When you make the donation, you get a range of numbers e-mailed to you as a "thank you for your donation", those are the numbers of the tickets that were assigned to you.  Obviously, you need not be present at the drawing to win.  I've not won, but I do know of some people far from Austin who donated online and actually won a big AJ Slick that was then shipped to them at club expense.
> 
> Peter+
> 
> 
> 
> 
> On Sat, Jan 5, 2013 at 2:46 PM, Atwood, Mark <atwoodm at paragon-inc.com<mailto:atwoodm at paragon-inc.com>> wrote:
> We have actually been taking direct cues from the F3J team.  Even the new website follows their URL format (and we're hoping will be the format for all the FAI team.   www.TeamUSAF3A.com<http://www.TeamUSAF3A.com/><http://www.TeamUSAF3A.com<http://www.TeamUSAF3A.com/>>
> 
> Our raffle will be kicking off at the AMA Expo in California this next weekend and will run through the end of the WC's in August with the drawing on Sept 15th.
> 
> Prizes so far...
> 
> 35% Ohio Model Products Extra 300 FULLY built and equiped!  DA100, Airtronics SD10 Radio, etc.
> 
> 2M Osiris - Fully built and equiped (not sure about a radio yet, but working on it.
> 
> 33% Pawnee Arf from Horizon
> 
> 2M Vanquish RTF (has about 40 flights on it) minus Tx.
> 
> And more coming.
> 
> The "Online" part of the raffle is tricky.  There are 50 states each with their own laws regarding online raffles.  Moreover, PayPal prohibits them with their service, so taking payments is more challenging.   We're working on it though.
> 
> If you're out on the west coast and plan to attend the AMA show, PLEASE stop by the NSRCA booth and pick up some tickets as well as a team t-shirt or Polo.
> 
> -M
> Mark Atwood
> Paragon Consulting, Inc.  |  President
> 5885 Landerbrook Drive Suite 130, Cleveland Ohio, 44124
> Phone: 440.684.3101 x102<tel:440.684.3101%20x102>  |  Direct: 440-229-2502<tel:440-229-2502>
> Fax: 440.684.3102<tel:440.684.3102>
> mark.atwood at paragon-inc.com<mailto:mark.atwood at paragon-inc.com><mailto:mark.atwood at paragon-inc.com<mailto:mark.atwood at paragon-inc.com>>  |  www.paragon-inc.com<http://www.paragon-inc.com/><http://www.paragon-inc.com/>
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> On Jan 5, 2013, at 4:50 PM, Joe Lachowski wrote:
> 
> I already forwarded this idea to Mark, but take a look  at how our F3J Team raised its money for the Worlds in South Africa in 2012. They basically had an on-line Mega Raffle. They also had to support a full Junior team, as well.
> 
> ________________________________
> From: rcpilot at wowway.com<mailto:rcpilot at wowway.com><mailto:rcpilot at wowway.com<mailto:rcpilot at wowway.com>>
> To: ldiamond at diamondrc.com<mailto:ldiamond at diamondrc.com><mailto:ldiamond at diamondrc.com<mailto:ldiamond at diamondrc.com>>; nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org<mailto:nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org><mailto:nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org<mailto:nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>>
> Date: Sat, 5 Jan 2013 07:00:20 -0500
> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Team Fund raising Clinics!!!
> 
> I like Larry’s idea but if some riches want to occupy all or most of the trainers time or want more one on one I’m sure Mark and the gang could accommodate such a situation if the team was going to make a reasonable profit.
> 
> 
> 
> From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org<mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org><mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org<mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org>> [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org<mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org>] On Behalf Of Larry Diamond
> Sent: Friday, January 04, 2013 5:53 PM
> To: General pattern discussion
> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Team Fund raising Clinics!!!
> 
> 
> 
> My initial reaction is that $1,000 per pilot will most likely eliminate most of those that really need training and assistance, meaning lower classman. Lower classman are struggling with $$$ already.
> 
> 
> 
> The possible win-win-win is to make it worth the Instructor Time and a value to the trainee time with the additional intent of a tool to help grow pattern.
> 
> 
> 
> Dealing with the math and understanding the one on one time, I would propose this. Similar to full scall flight training:
> 
> 
> 
> Ground School (Class Room) - Minimum 10 people (Trainees can travel to a selected location) - $125 per Pilot
> Flight Training - $25 per flight per person with their caller of choice (Instructor should not be calling)
> 
> 
> 
> Net would be a minum of $1,250, plus Flight training $$$.
> 
> 
> 
> It will require twice as many weekends, but I bet you get more takers and generate more funds for the team.
> 
> 
> 
> Hell, I would even pay this if it was Mark as the trainer. But anybody flying Masters/FAI could be a trainer.
> 
> 
> 
> Have a team pilot attend and sell autographed Team items/pictures and raffle tickets...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> From: "Atwood, Mark" <atwoodm at paragon-inc.com<mailto:atwoodm at paragon-inc.com><mailto:atwoodm at paragon-inc.com<mailto:atwoodm at paragon-inc.com>>>
> To: General pattern discussion <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org<mailto:nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org><mailto:nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org<mailto:nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>>>
> Sent: Friday, January 4, 2013 3:43 PM
> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Team Fund raising Clinics!!!
> 
> Also, would people be willing to travel "Contest distance" to attend?  I.e. reasonable half day drive and plan to stay overnight?
> 
> Jon, I think with Andrew in Utah, a California stop is almost assured.
> 
> 
> Mark Atwood
> Paragon Consulting, Inc.  |  President
> 5885 Landerbrook Drive Suite 130, Cleveland Ohio, 44124
> Phone: 440.684.3101 x102<tel:440.684.3101%20x102>  |  Direct: 440-229-2502<tel:440-229-2502>
> Fax: 440.684.3102<tel:440.684.3102>
> mark.atwood at paragon-inc.com<mailto:mark.atwood at paragon-inc.com><mailto:mark.atwood at paragon-inc.com<mailto:mark.atwood at paragon-inc.com>><mailto:mark.atwood at paragon-inc.com<mailto:mark.atwood at paragon-inc.com><mailto:mark.atwood at paragon-inc.com<mailto:mark.atwood at paragon-inc.com>>>  |  www.paragon-inc.com<http://www.paragon-inc.com/><http://www.paragon-inc.com/>
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> On Jan 4, 2013, at 4:38 PM, Jon Bruml wrote:
> 
> 1k per person sounds dear
> how about 1k for up to 2 or maybe 750 for the two days per person with a
> minimum of 4 people in attendance(to make the visit worthwhile mixing some
> individual as well as group training)
> I would be in if they make a visit to our area
> 
> -----Original Message-----
> From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org<mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org><mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org<mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org>><mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org<mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org><mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org<mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org>>>
> [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org<mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org><mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org<mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org>>] On Behalf Of Atwood, Mark
> Sent: Friday, January 04, 2013 1:21 PM
> To: NSRCA General
> Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Team Fund raising Clinics!!!
> 
> Hey All,
> 
> One of the idea's we (Team USA) have been kicking around as a possible fund
> raiser is to pimp out the team's time and expertise in the form of some
> personal flying clinics.
> 
> The idea would be for one of the team members to spend a FULL weekend with
> no more than 2-4 pilots and provide a lot of specific coaching and help on
> whatever topics they need help with.  We envision spending time on
> 
> Trimming & setup
> CG / Thrust alignment / Incidence
> Throw rates, snap setups, expo, mixing
> Fundamentals
> Positioning
> Wind Corrections
> Rolling / looping / good lines
> 
> Integrated maneuvers
> Overall presentation
> Complex manuevers (Rollers, etc)
> Even 3D stuff if interested.
> 
> The thought would be to cater the days to whatever level the interested
> pilot wants.  Expectation would be to get 8-10 flights per person per day
> (or more).  I.e. A LOT OF FLYING.
> 
> Cost, well, we're going to lob out $1000 per person.  Again, this intended
> to be a fund raiser for the team in addition to providing value to the
> purchaser.
> 
> If there is interest - we need to start lining up interested people and then
> finding suitable locations to meet.  We have team members in FL, VA and UT
> so a lot of the country is covered.  With enough interest we can do this
> almost anywhere.
> 
> Give me an idea of interest level, and if not for $1000... how much would
> you be willing to pay for two full days of coaching from one of these guys.
> Reach out to me on list or off.
> 
> -Mark
> Mark Atwood
> Paragon Consulting, Inc.  |  President
> 5885 Landerbrook Drive Suite 130, Cleveland Ohio, 44124
> Phone: 440.684.3101 x102  |  Direct: 440-229-2502
> Fax: 440.684.3102
> mark.atwood at paragon-inc.com<mailto:mark.atwood at paragon-inc.com><mailto:mark.atwood at paragon-inc.com<mailto:mark.atwood at paragon-inc.com>><mailto:mark.atwood at paragon-inc.com<mailto:mark.atwood at paragon-inc.com><mailto:mark.atwood at paragon-inc.com<mailto:mark.atwood at paragon-inc.com>>>  |
> www.paragon-inc.com<http://www.paragon-inc.com/><http://www.paragon-inc.com/>
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
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> 
> --
> Director, Fixed Wing Flight Training
> Santa Clara County Model Aircraft Skypark
> [http://farm8.staticflickr.com/7163/6513778381_5569cc985d_m.jpg]
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