[NSRCA-discussion] Article (series) suggestion for K-factor

Wed Jan 2 17:31:24 AKST 2013

Jim H, John G, Peter V - Thanks!

I will certainly pass on the feedback to FM - I can assure the editor Frank
Fanelli is very receptive to feedback.  I've actually previously asked about
the possibility of an electronic compilation of sorts (disc, downloadable
file, etc) as a sale item as I think it could stand on its own.  I will
follow up.

A bit more (quite possibly a shameless plug) -
Mar - Nov 2011 I wrote a 9 part series "Project Foamy" about how to build a
world class foamy suitable for the highest levels of ETOC / F3P competition.
"Project Pattern Redux" is a series I started in Mar 2012 and is ongoing.
Mar/Apr were actually historical in nature detailing the evolution of
pattern from the early 1980s (when the original Project Pattern was authored
by Dean Pappas and Bob Hunt) to the present day, and in May 2012 I started
the construction of a Europa Pro LT, which is quite representative of the
modern day composite "ARF" pattern plane.  The most recent issue was
December, and reviewed mounting options and construction of the firewall(s).
The series will continue until every detail up to the test flight is
described...I honestly don't know how many more columns that will take. 

http://www.flying-models.com/
For those not familiar with Flying Models, I think it'd be accurate to say
it is the last magazine that focuses on the building / modeling aspects of
the hobby for all disciplines - RC, CL, FF.  The myriad of quicky reviews of
the latest/greatest products are not found in Flying Models.

Regards,

Dave

-----Original Message-----
From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
[mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Peter Vogel
Sent: Wednesday, January 02, 2013 7:05 PM
To: General pattern discussion
Cc: General pattern discussion
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Article (series) suggestion for K-factor

The beauty of the internet is that if I know an article series exists I can
buy back issues to read on my iPad (Dave, you can tell Flying Models that
they gained a digital subscriber who just bought almost a year's worth of
back issues because of you :-)

Peter+

Sent from my iPad

On Jan 2, 2013, at 3:22 PM, John Gayer <jgghome at comcast.net> wrote:

> Peter,
> 
> I suggest since you are in the area you help apply some pressure on 
> Don Atwood and Bruce Thompson to update their book on "Building a Pattern
Plane". :-) Anything I can do to help, let me know directly by phone or
email. That goes for both your build and the application of pressure.
> 
> Seriously, we are always looking for information that we can add to the
website and such an article  would be an excellent addition. Most of the
time build threads are more useful to experienced modelers looking for new
approaches to problems they have already resolved. This is opposed to
someone looking for a ground up build with full explanations of the solution
used and alternatives available. Of course we would love to have articles on
the NSRCA website for specific aircraft as well.
> DaveL,
> Is it possible to include some of the many building articles you have
published? Including your latest which is great BTW. I don't know how that
works out with Flying Models but we would certainly give credit. It seems a
shame that articles such as yours are published once and then disappear.
> 
> John
> 
> Many of the questions you have relate are specific to the model you have
sitting on your bench.
> On 1/2/2013 11:56 AM, Peter Vogel wrote:
>> Whoops!  Meant to send from gmail!
>> 
>> Peter+
>> 
>> 
>> Begin forwarded message:
>> 
>>> So, I received my first composite plane for Christmas (A beautiful
x-treme Composites Griffin) and, like Don Rumsfeld a lot of unknown unknowns
are becoming known unknowns :-). Ordinarily I turn to articles on the web,
build threads, etc. to learn what I need to learn, but I am shocked by the
dearth of information on basic composite assembly information out there!
I'm fortunate to have the brilliant and talented Jon Carter and Dale
Olstinski nearby with Jon Bruml, Chris Fitzsimmons, Frank Capone and Don
Atwood not that much farther away, but I doubt everyone is that lucky!
>>> 
>>> There's a good, but still detail-lacking (because he refers often to
instructions on the specific plane) and somewhat dated article by Earl Haury
off Don Ramsey's pattern page, but that, and some of the other building
techniques there and on the Central Hobbies site are the best resources I've
found, which is sad!
>>> 
>>> There is real room out there for a soup-to-nuts tutorial on building out
a composite ARF, like a very detailed build thread that lets you into the
builder's head:  WHY did you do what you did, what would you do differently
if the motor were mounted the other way (if you use a nose-ring mount in
your build, what would you do for a firewall mounted motor?  I think it's
safe to say most newbies will be coming in with electrics) and so forth.
>>> 
>>> I'd call myself an intermediate balsa builder, having built several 
>>> 40 size planes from Balsa kits about 20 years ago, and I've assembled
we'll over 50 balsa ARF's in the past 4 years, but as I say, this is my
first composite build. Also, as a matter of critique of the Griffin, at the
price point ($1500) it's reasonable to expect that this would be a first
composite for a lot of folks, that it comes with NO assembly manual is a bit
of a shock.
>>> 
>>> Examples of areas where this newbie has had several 'hmm' moments 
>>> (some of which Dale and Jon talked me through at the field the other 
>>> day, some of which are new since)
>>> 
>>> I've got an advance and the F3AU mount for it, but the 'ears' of the
nose ring (and the mounting holes) extend slightly beyond the edges of the
front of the plane's existing nose ring, I know I need to put a ply spacer
in back and the ears will fit within the composite shell at that point, but
wouldn't we want the mounting screws for the nosering to go through all
three layers of nosering structure to hold the whole sandwich together?
Should I drill new mounting holes in the ring to allow that and shave a gram
or two of weight by cutting the ears off the F3AU nose ring mount?
>>> 
>>> Should I reinforce the installation of the Aeroply spacer with
fiberglass?  How is that done?
>>> 
>>> What's the best procedure for ensuring that the spinner is centered in
the nose when everything is mounted?
>>> 
>>> what's the best way to mount the stab incidence adjusters in the stab
and then line up the holes to access the set screws?
>>> 
>>> How do you determine where to put the pull-pull cable exits?  How do you
decide whether to cross the cables or not?
>>> 
>>> The recommendation of BVM aeropoxy/hydrosol epoxy instead of typical
5/30/60 minute epoxy off the hobby shop shelf.
>>> 
>>> Control rod selection, sizing and sourcing. 4-40/2-56/3mm/2.5mm/2mm
what's the right size for what?  What parts are compatible with what (I.e.
clevises for BB control horns of various sizes (this is really something
F3AU & Central Hobbies sites could do better with) 4-40 titanium turnbuckle
rods are relatively easy to find, but where does one find metric sized or
2-56?  Why or why not titanium rod ends with Carbon rods?
>>> 
>>> Just a few examples to get the writer juices flowing in an expert
builder -- if an expert builder near Santa Clara wants a composite newbie
ghost writer/photographer (I've written several technical books and done
some photography that has made it into textbooks) I'm game!
>>> 
>>> Peter+
>>> 
>>> Sent from my iPhone5
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