[NSRCA-discussion] Rules proposal 11-6 question

[Bob Kane]

I want to know how using rubber helped you roll better . . . .   we are talking airplanes, right?


Bob Kane
getterflash at yahoo.com


--- On Tue, 10/20/09, RON HANSEN <rcpilot at wowway.com> wrote:

> From: RON HANSEN <rcpilot at wowway.com>
> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Rules proposal 11-6 question
> To: jpavlick at idseng.com, "General pattern discussion" <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
> Date: Tuesday, October 20, 2009, 2:37 PM
> #yiv1016192165 p
> {margin:0;}When I suggested
> that intermediate and advanced be more difficult what I was
> suggesting was that we need to build up more
> gradually.  For an example, I believe two horizontal
> rolls done using rudder and elevator is more difficult than
> one slow roll or one 4 pt roll.  I learned to roll
> using rubber and elevator by starting with a 4 pt
> roll.  I've heard others doing the same.  I
> agree that this can be taken to extremes.  For example,
> I've heard folks suggest that intermediate add 3
> rolls.  I believe this will cause pilots to drop the
> rudder and only use elevator which I believe is detrimental
> later on (all rolls should include rudder and
> elevator).  Maybe move the 4 pt roll and the slow roll
> down to intermediate and add some more complicated rolling
> maneuvers such as 2 half rolls reversed inverted to inverted
> or 2 half rolls reversed knife edged to knife
> edge.   These or similar changes would close the
> gap between the various classes.
>  
> 
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "John Pavlick" <jpavlick at idseng.com>
> To: "General pattern discussion"
> <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
> Sent: Tuesday, October 20, 2009 1:59:50 PM GMT -05:00
> US/Canada Eastern
> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Rules proposal 11-6
> question
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Having the turnarounds AND box exits in Sportsman is a
> good thing, I think. As long as the turnarounds are not
> cross-box maneuvers (like a Humpty) then I don't think
> it's asking too much of a Sportsman pilot to try to keep
> things in the box until they get a break (box exit). This is
> very good at preparing them for Intermediate (NO box exits)
> as Pete said, yet it gives them some way to correct their
> lines.What tends to happen to ALL of us is this: One little
> error moves your line. Then another moves your line some
> more. Until you've learned how to correct your lines
> smoothly and / or simply not make those errors in the first
> place (or at least make them to a lesser degree) the errors
> accumulate and without box exits, you only have cross-box
> maneuvers to help you correct them. Sportsman doesn't
> have any cross-box maneuvers so how would they correct their
> line? With box exits of course. 
>  
> As a few people have said - and I say this all the
> time: the sequence you fly contains the maneuvers which you
> are judged on. This doesn't mean that you
> can't fly different maneuvers and / or sequences when
> you practice. Do you guys just go to the field and fly
> your sequence over and over every time? If
> so then I think you're missing out on something
> very important. The difficulty between Masters and Sportsman
> is (and should be) somewhat extreme. Yet there are only 4
> classes that must deal with this range of skills. It's
> nearly impossible to  make each progression seamless.
> You must learn at least some new skills on your
> own. You can't expect that by repeatedly flying
> Advanced, you'll somehow magically be prepared to fly
> Masters when you point out. Trust me, you won't.
> VBG
>  
> John Pavlick
>  
> 
> --- On Tue, 10/20/09, Pete Cosky
> <pcosky at comcast.net> wrote:
> 
> 
> From: Pete Cosky <pcosky at comcast.net>
> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Rules proposal 11-6
> question
> To: "General pattern discussion"
> <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
> Date: Tuesday, October 20, 2009, 1:04 PM
> 
> 
> 
> I partially agree with
> your last post but those building blocks have to come
> from somewhere. From my experience, I moved out of Sportsman
> 4 years ago and then stopped flying to help raise my
> son until this year when I got to fly again in Intermediate.
> My flights were ugly but at least I had an idea of how it
> all had to go together because I learned those building
> blocks in Sportsman. IF what is proposed were to have
> happened in my particular case it would have been quite the
> obstacle to overcome and probably would have taken some of
> the fun out flying pattern for me.
>  
> If a pilot needs work on
> geometry, and I know I sure do, then take the time to
> practice the given maneuver outside the sequence. Go and
> burn a few tanks flying the problem maneuvers and
> nothing else. 
>  
> My opinion is Sportsman is
> fine the way it is and it lays a good foundation for the
> progression in the classes.
>  
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