[NSRCA-discussion] Length of 2011 Masters Sequence

Tue May 5 15:38:17 AKDT 2009

Judged takeoffs and landings don't take any longer if the pilot eliminates
the unnecessary procedure turn and flies a simple 180 or two 90's after
takeoff and prior to landing. Of course we could always fly smaller
geometry, closer in and / or faster.
Jim Hiller

-----Original Message-----
From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
[mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org]On Behalf Of John Fuqua
Sent: Tuesday, May 05, 2009 3:29 PM
To: mups1953 at yahoo.com; 'General pattern discussion'
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Length of 2011 Masters Sequence

I have suggested in D3 that we spilt masters into 2 groups seeded by the
results of the last year's contests/standings.  You provide for moving the
top flyer(s) in the second group up the next year and the last flyer(s) in
the first group down the next year.  You now have 2 judging groups for
masters with a mechanism to ensure movement between.

As to length of schedule.  Eliminate Take off and landing scoring like FAI
and you immediately save time, eliminate non-aerobatic maneuvers, shorten
the sequence and make it easier for the judges to complete the score sheet.

John

-----Original Message-----
From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
[mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of mike mueller
Sent: Tuesday, May 05, 2009 11:24 AM
To: General pattern discussion; Atwood, Mark
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Length of 2011 Masters Sequence

Mark we have plans for splitting Masters into 2 groups around here. Anything
else is a disaster. Mike

--- On Tue, 5/5/09, Atwood, Mark <atwoodm at paragon-inc.com> wrote:

> From: Atwood, Mark <atwoodm at paragon-inc.com>
> Subject: RE: [NSRCA-discussion] Length of 2011 Masters Sequence
> To: "General pattern discussion" <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>,
"mups1953 at yahoo.com" <mups1953 at yahoo.com>
> Date: Tuesday, May 5, 2009, 10:57 AM
> Hear Hear!!
>
> I love flying long sequences...hate judging them.  There
> needs to be a balance.  Not just for the sake of the judges,
> but also to accommodate the length of the contest.
>
> At a big D4/D5 contest we'll usually have 5-6 FAI
> pilots and 15 or 16 masters pilots.  Currently the masters
> pattern is a MINIMUM of 10 minutes per pilot (maybe not in
> the air, but you have to really have people on their toes to
> even get 6 flights in an hour).  With 16 masters pilots,
> that's 2 hours and 40 minutes of flying per round if
> you're humpin'.   Six rounds means 16 hours of
> flying for JUST masters guys.  Assuming you have 2 lines,
> that means one of those lines is dedicated to Masters for
> the entire contest AND assume you have 16 hours to fly.
>
> We never have 16 hours to fly.  Rarely can we get people to
> stay until 6pm on Sunday (9am - 6pm with a lunch break both
> days) and most fields have the sun in the box either in the
> morning or afternoon which shortens the flying day even
> more.
>
> Now add to those woes that you only have 5-6 FAI guys
> judging.  You need 32 man hours of judging, so even if you
> mix in a group of Advanced flyers it's a loooong time in
> the chair.
>
> Bottom line, regardless of whether it's P-09 (probably
> not a good choice at this point) or a home brewed
> pattern...it needs to follow the FAI trend of getting a
> little shorter.
>
> My .02
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
> [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf
> Of Archie Stafford
> Sent: Tuesday, May 05, 2009 11:38 AM
> To: mups1953 at yahoo.com; 'General pattern
> discussion'
> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Length of 2011 Masters
> Sequence
>
> Verne,
>
> This started when I suggested to the sequence committee
> that we need to
> shorten the masters pattern.  Flying it is fine, but I
> think we need to take
> into account the guys who have to sit and judge it.  I
> heard several guys in
> FAI judging this weekend about how long a sequence it is.
> Which wouldn't be
> near as bad except for the fact Masters is usually the
> largest class at most
> contests.  I think we need to consider the length of time
> in the judges
> chair for those that have to judge it as well.
>
> Arch
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
> [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf
> Of mike mueller
> Sent: Tuesday, May 05, 2009 10:31 AM
> To: General pattern discussion
> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Length of 2011 Masters
> Sequence
>
>
>  The current pattern puts E. guys at a bit of a
> disadvantage. It pushes my
> setup a little further than I prefer. It is a great pattern
> and I compliment
> the designers for having a nice flow. Mike
>
>
> --- On Tue, 5/5/09, verne at twmi.rr.com
> <verne at twmi.rr.com> wrote:
>
> > From: verne at twmi.rr.com <verne at twmi.rr.com>
> > Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Length of 2011 Masters
> Sequence
> > To: "General pattern discussion"
> <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
> > Date: Tuesday, May 5, 2009, 10:24 AM
> > If it sounded as though I were complaining that the
> current
> > Masters schedule takes too long, I wasn't. Just
> > commenting that it takes a lot longer than the
> previous one.
> > For me, eight minutes from takeoff to landing approach
> (my
> > timer is started on takeoff and is almost always
> beeping
> > during my landing). I fly at what I would call a
> medium
> > speed most of the time.
> >
> > I'm also against flying the FAI-P schedule.
> I'd
> > rather fly a home-grown variant that we create
> ourselves.
> >
> > Verne Koester
> >
> >
> > ---- Stuart Chale <schale at optonline.net> wrote:
> > > _______________________________________________
> > > NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> > > NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> > >
> >
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
> > _______________________________________________
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> >
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>
>
>
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