[NSRCA-discussion] Collision Avoidance Breaks

Mon Jul 27 20:32:51 AKDT 2009

did that buzzard survive......

________________________________
From: Verne Koester <verne at twmi.rr.com>
To: General pattern discussion <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
Sent: Monday, July 27, 2009 10:29:30 PM
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Collision Avoidance Breaks

I understand completely. If you count the turkey buzzard I hit
on the 4th flight on a new plane a few years back, I’ve had nine
mid-airs through the years. Funny thing though, I never worry about a mid-air
at the Nats and always worry about it at a local contest. Contests are the only
time I’ll even fly with another plane in the air and that’s only if it’s an
actual scored round. A few mid-airs will do that to ya.

Verne

From:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
[mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Vicente
"Vince" Bortone
Sent: Monday, July 27, 2009 5:33 PM
To: General pattern discussion
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Collision Avoidance Breaks

Hi Verne,

You are
correct.  I had a collision two years ago at the Nats.  I was allowed
to fly my backup plane at the end of the round to get me time to be
ready.  The main problem for the pilot after this event is that we pay
more attention to the other plane.  It is very hard to get it out of your
mind after having this situation.  It is practically impossible to avoid
collisions by calling the avoidance.  

Vicente
"Vince" Bortone

----- Original Message -----
From: "Verne Koester" <verne at twmi.rr.com>
To: jpavlick at idseng.com, "General pattern discussion"
<nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
Sent: Monday, July 27, 2009 4:05:39 PM GMT -06:00 US/Canada Central
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Collision Avoidance Breaks
From the AMA Rulebook:

10.3: In the case of a collision during a
Pattern flight, the contestants must immediately recover their aircraft. They
may resume their flights with the same aircraft if the aircraft are judged to
be airworthy or with a backup or repaired aircraft. They will begin with the
maneuver that was in progress or with the next scheduled maneuver if the
collision occurred between maneuvers. The previously defined starting times
will apply for a resumed flight and the contestant will be allowed no more than
two (2) passes in front of the judges for the purpose of trimming the plane.
Scores of the previous maneuvers will be added to the scores of subsequent
maneuvers in the resumed flight. The flight must be completed by the end of the
round being flown, or within a time frame designated by the CD.

Hope this helps
though it’s little comfort when put to use,
Verne Koester

From:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
[mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of John
Pavlick
Sent: Monday, July 27, 2009 2:45 PM
To: General pattern discussion
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Collision Avoidance Breaks

Bill,
That's correct. This is Pattern, not IMAC. In order to score maximum points for a maneuver you CANNOT make any attempt to avoid a midair even if you're absolutely sure that one is about to happen. VBG

Should a midair occur however, you will unfortunately zero all remaining maneuvers, as well as the landing. Depending upon whether or not you completed the maneuver during which the midair occurred, you may also lose points. For example if you complete only 2 of the required 4 points of a 4-point roll and then midair, you will zero the 4-point roll. :(

My advice to you: if you can foresee a midair, by all means avoid it, land the plane and go buy some lottery tickets. Then you won't have to worry about it happening again. LOL

John Pavlick

--- On Mon, 7/27/09, Archie Stafford <astafford at swtexas.net> wrote:

>>  From: Archie Stafford <astafford at swtexas.net>
>>  Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Collision Avoidance Breaks
>>  To: "'General pattern discussion'"
>  <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
>>  Date: Monday, July 27, 2009, 2:06 PM
>This is not a rule in pattern.  There is virtually no
>  way to be certain of
>>  an oncoming mid-air.  If you are flying your plane then you really
>  aren't
>>  going to be able to see the other plane either.  I've seen some that
>  looked
>>  very close, that probably really weren't and mid-air's that happened when
>>  they didn't look that close.  
>
>>  In IMAC where they have the rule you can call avoidance, I have twice seen
>>  people call avoidance thinking they are going to have a mid air and actually
>>  turn directly into the path of the other plane.  Had they just stayed on
>>  their line they would've been fine.  I think you are much better off,
>  just
>>  flying and maintaining your line and if a mid air happens, it happens
>>  unfortunately, but the odds of turning away in time to avoid one is
>>  virtually impossible.
>
>>  Mid-airs will happen as long as there are 2 planes in the air.  Trying
>  avoid
>>  them usually causes more problems than it solves.
>
>>  Arch
>
>>  -----Original Message-----
>>  From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
>>  [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of
>  Bill's Email
>>  Sent: Monday, July 27, 2009 12:58 PM
>>  To: General pattern discussion
>>  Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Collision Avoidance Breaks
>
>>  I've looked over the rule book but I cannot find where this topic is 
>>  mentioned.
>
>>  Is it the case that if a pilot who maneuvers to avoid a collision is 
>>  downgraded for doing so?
>
>>  We can displace a figure to avoid the sun without penalty but you cannot 
>>  avoid a mid-air without penalty?
>
>
>
>
>
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