[NSRCA-discussion] Collision Avoidance Breaks

Mon Jul 27 13:32:43 AKDT 2009

Hi Verne, 

You are correct.  I had a collision two years ago at the Nats .  I was allowed to fly my backup plane at the end of the round to get me time to be ready.  The main problem for the pilot after this event is that we pay more attention to the other plane.  It is very hard to get it out of your mind after having this situation.  It is practically impossible to avoid collisions by calling the avoidance.  

Vicente "Vince" Bortone 

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Verne Koester " < verne @ twmi . rr .com> 
To: jpavlick @ idseng .com, "General pattern discussion" < nsrca -discussion at lists. nsrca .org> 
Sent: Monday, July 27, 2009 4:05:39 PM GMT -06:00 US/Canada Central 
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Collision Avoidance Breaks 

>From the AMA Rulebook: 

10.3: In the case of a collision during a Pattern flight, the contestants must immediately recover their aircraft. They may resume their flights with the same aircraft if the aircraft are judged to be airworthy or with a backup or repaired aircraft. They will begin with the maneuver that was in progress or with the next scheduled maneuver if the collision occurred between maneuvers. The previously defined starting times will apply for a resumed flight and the contestant will be allowed no more than two (2) passes in front of the judges for the purpose of trimming the plane. Scores of the previous maneuvers will be added to the scores of subsequent maneuvers in the resumed flight. The flight must be completed by the end of the round being flown, or within a time frame designated by the CD. 

Hope this helps though it’s little comfort when put to use, 

Verne Koester 

From: nsrca -discussion-bounces at lists. nsrca .org [mailto: nsrca -discussion-bounces at lists. nsrca .org] On Behalf Of John Pavlick 
Sent: Monday, July 27, 2009 2:45 PM 
To: General pattern discussion 
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Collision Avoidance Breaks 

Bill, 

That's correct. This is Pattern, not IMAC. In order to score maximum points for a maneuver you CANNOT make any attempt to avoid a midair even if you're absolutely sure that one is about to happen. VBG 

Should a midair occur however, you will unfortunately zero all remaining maneuvers, as well as the landing. Depending upon whether or not you completed the maneuver during which the midair occurred, you may also lose points. For example if you complete only 2 of the required 4 points of a 4-point roll and then midair, you will zero the 4-point roll. :( 

My advice to you: if you can foresee a midair, by all means avoid it, land the plane and go buy some lottery tickets. Then you won't have to worry about it happening again. LOL 

John Pavlick 

--- On Mon, 7/27/09, Archie Stafford <astafford at swtexas.net> wrote: 

From: Archie Stafford <astafford at swtexas.net> 
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Collision Avoidance Breaks 
To: "'General pattern discussion'" < nsrca -discussion at lists. nsrca .org> 
Date: Monday, July 27, 2009, 2:06 PM 

This is not a rule in pattern.  There is virtually no way to be certain of 
an oncoming mid-air.  If you are flying your plane then you really aren't 
going to be able to see the other plane either.  I've seen some that looked 
very close, that probably really weren't and mid-air's that happened when 
they didn't look that close.  

In IMAC where they have the rule you can call avoidance, I have twice seen 
people call avoidance thinking they are going to have a mid air and actually 
turn directly into the path of the other plane.  Had they just stayed on 
their line they would've been fine.  I think you are much better off, just 
flying and maintaining your line and if a mid air happens, it happens 
unfortunately, but the odds of turning away in time to avoid one is 
virtually impossible. 

Mid-airs will happen as long as there are 2 planes in the air.  Trying avoid 
them usually causes more problems than it solves. 

Arch 

-----Original Message----- 
From: nsrca -discussion-bounces at lists. nsrca .org 
[mailto: nsrca -discussion-bounces at lists. nsrca .org ] On Behalf Of Bill's Email 
Sent: Monday, July 27, 2009 12:58 PM 
To: General pattern discussion 
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Collision Avoidance Breaks 

I've looked over the rule book but I cannot find where this topic is 
mentioned. 

Is it the case that if a pilot who maneuvers to avoid a collision is 
downgraded for doing so? 

We can displace a figure to avoid the sun without penalty but you cannot 
avoid a mid-air without penalty? 

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