[NSRCA-discussion] Electronic versus Paper K-Factor Poll

Sun Jan 25 04:16:00 AKST 2009

I really like Mike's suggestion.  Should we add this one to the poll and start a new one? 

Vicente Bortone 

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "mike mueller " <mups1953 at yahoo.com> 
To: "General pattern discussion" < nsrca -discussion at lists. nsrca .org>, homeremodeling2003 at yahoo.com 
Sent: Sunday, January 25, 2009 6:31:36 AM GMT -06:00 US/Canada Central 
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Electronic versus Paper K-Factor Poll 

 How about this for an idea. Alternate between a print version and an electronic version each month. Kind of a good compromise. If after a period of time one seems better than the other than make the change to that or not. If you kill the print version it would be very hard to get it started back again if it turned out to be a mistake. 
 I do not support the notion that we should have a choice between either an E version or a hard copy. The costs of setup are way too high to justify the small circulation that would result from this change. The press run would have to change to a digital output device such as a color docutech and they are pretty expensive and wouldn't yeild the same high quality magazine that we now have. 
 The K Factor is a very fine piece of literature from the articles to the advertising it serves  an important part representing us and our love for this sport. 
 It's hard to grasp how the K Factor E. or hard copy effects growing the sport and membership numbers. We can only guess what impact an online only format would have. Pattern has to stand on it's own. It will survive and grow because enough people enjoy it. The only real impact we can have on this is to make it look like a worthwhile activity. In the end it's about the planes and competition. It will always have a very narrow appeal but the more barriers we take down the better our chances to grow. Good debate no clear answer but a whole lot of smart people chimming (not me) in and that's a good thing. 
                                                            Mike Mueller 

--- On Sun, 1/25/09, Derek Koopowitz < derekkoopowitz @ gmail .com> wrote: 

From: Derek Koopowitz < derekkoopowitz @ gmail .com> 
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Electronic versus Paper K-Factor Poll 
To: " 'General pattern discussion' " < nsrca -discussion at lists. nsrca .org>, homeremodeling2003 at yahoo.com 
Date: Sunday, January 25, 2009, 12:37 AM 

I think some people are missing the point.  We are not proposing to go with an online only option - people will have a choice.  If you choose paper - then you'll still get paper.  If you want online only then you'll get online only.  It's not an either/or situation.  Our publisher will continue to produce the K-Factor for us... albeit at a potentially different rate if fewer choose paper, but that option still remains. 

From: nsrca -discussion-bounces at lists. nsrca .org [ mailto : nsrca -discussion-bounces at lists. nsrca .org] On Behalf Of Ryan Smith 
Sent: Saturday, January 24, 2009 9:34 PM 
To: homeremodeling2003 at yahoo.com; 'General pattern discussion' 
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Electronic versus Paper K-Factor Poll 

I apologize if it’s already been covered, I read Troy ’s post and skimmed the others to make sure that it didn’t pop out at me. 

Where are we going to get the money for someone to format the electronic K-Factor? Would that even be a concern? I assume that there could be a plug-and-play format to the magazine that maybe Chris or whomever just adds the content in the appropriate areas and bypass a publisher. Does the formatting come from the publisher currently? Isn’t that where most of the cost is? Unless we can internalize the magazine’s production with the transition to online only, we could really save. Would that be feasible? 

I like the paper K-Factor better, as it’s a little more portable say for traveling. I think that it’s a little more “user friendly” in the fact that it’s easier to read, unless of course it’s to be reformatted from the online version we have now. We can still give out printed back issues to anyone at a contest or at a trade show or something to show what the magazine content is, and hopefully generate some interest with new people if the concern is to generate a wider audience. If most of the cost is in the setup, and not the production, why not print a little higher percentage over what we get now, and send the extras to the VP’s,  and AVP’s to distribute at hobby shops or to people at their fields or new Sportsman pilots. 

I don’t see an all-electronic version necessarily a bad thing, I just don’t see it as the holy grail that I perceive some have lauded it to be. 

Kindest Regards, 

Ryan Smith 

From: nsrca -discussion-bounces at lists. nsrca .org [ mailto : nsrca -discussion-bounces at lists. nsrca .org] On Behalf Of krishlan fitzsimmons 
Sent: Saturday, January 24, 2009 11:40 PM 
To: General pattern discussion 
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Electronic versus Paper K-Factor Poll 

While Troy makes some good points, there is alot of research to be done. Troy is incorrect IMO on that we are limited on pages. I haven't ran into this problem in 2 years of editing. We are limited on people submitting info to me. I put everything I can get into the Kfactor. 

As for advertisers staying with us, I'm not so sure they would stay with an online only magazine. Look at Imac.. They have two ad's on theirs and they are bigger than us. 

I don't feel people will join the Nsrca because they like what they read. I think most of us pay because we support pattern. Heck, the only reason I feel I pay my AMA dues are for the magazine. I don't want that online .. 

Sacred cow eh? lol.. 

Troy , yes, this is a business. But we're not selling products here. We are a group of individuals that fly planes. Online is good, yes. I agree. Paper is good too. How much in paper and ink will it take to print out your copy of the Kfactor so you can take it to the bathroom? My ink gets me probably 300 pages tops. At $60 per ink set. 30 pages per Kfactor x 12 months, 360 pages. Probably about $70 worth of ink. Hmmmm. I'll support a dues increase first.. 

I like paper first and online , but I would like to propose that we make our online magazine downloadable for a small fee to non members, and also make all our advertisers ads clickable in the online version. And also offer them a pay per click advertising spot on the website. 

Don't get me wrong folks. I think this discussion is great, as it was at the AMA show a few weeks back. I will be more than happy to support whatever. But it's hard enough to get any articles or pics as it is to make the Kfactor enjoyable. How many articles and pics will you submit when its only online ? I think this will kill the KFactor. 

Chris 

--- On Sat, 1/24/09, Troy Newman <troy at troynewman.net> wrote: 

From: Troy Newman <troy at troynewman.net> 
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Electronic versus Paper K-Factor Poll 
To: "General pattern discussion" < nsrca -discussion at lists. nsrca .org > 
Date: Saturday, January 24, 2009, 6:35 PM 

Hey guys, 

This is a little long. Please read it’s important to the NSRCA. 

I would like to say something regarding the printed KF vs. a online only KF 

Today the KF is costing the organization a ton of money every month. I spoke to Derek about this at the AMA show a few weeks ago. Today the KF is running us about $2100 a month for just round numbers. Most folks don’t know this or understand the huge cost involved every month. We are funding it from dues and NATS money when advertising comes up short. John Konneker is struggling to sell advertising and doing a great job….but we already owe our check to the company store. 

We are bringing in advertising money that is short of that number, Let’s call it 1700 or 1800 a month typical for the last few years. Now I know John K has been working very hard to increase advertising money. The problem is even its breaking even…..is it really worth it to you to have it in your mail box? AT $2100 a month to the group? 

Look at it this way. Re-structure the KF to a new layout. An online magazine. The advertisers are not going to like the idea at first…but here is the what I think would work. 

#1 tell all the advertisers. Today is a new day.  We are going to give you free ads for 2 months at your current ad level. And we are going online only. 

#2 make all KF downloads free to the public. Absolutely free in every respect. But put a counter on the downloads. Get the modeling public looking at what we have to offer. 

#3 at the end of 2 months….take the counter numbers to the advertisers and say look…we were producing 800 copies a month. Now it’s downloaded 2000copies a month. You just doubled your exposure. 

#4 Oh by the way Mr. Advertiser, we understand the economy is tough on you too. Let’s do this. We want you to stay with us advertising and since it’s a web only magazine, we are going to cut your ad rates in ½. You get the same number of pages for the ½ the money…..would you like to double your ad space for the same $$ you were paying? This makes the online only magazine larger…more prestige, more info for the public to see and like. Today we are limited on content…we can only afford so many pages. Online there is no limit essentially. At least not the budgetary limit we currently have. 

Now let’s look at what this will do. John Konneker is selling $2000 a month in ads for just round numbers. It’s close to this from the info I have been told. 

$2000 a month is $24,000 a year. We are using that to pay the US mail, and printer company. That’s 24K a year guys! 

Now let’s go to online and ½ the rates….more circulation as its free to all that want to get it.  We get to take $12,000 a year and put in our pockets to support and grow pattern.  What can you do to grow pattern if you have money in the bank? Can we give more to the USA Team. Can we hold invitational contests like the Tucson shootout and give cash prizes  in all classes or buy products to give away to pilots. Could we completely fund the NATS banquet? 

The advertiser people want more exposure…so we give it away for free after all the more that download it the better it is to sell ads right?   Then we get new members by showing them we are friendly and open folks that want them to come play with us. We get them to join our organization because we support pattern not because we make a magazine.  Telling them to join to get the news letter is like saying we have a club but you gotta pay to play. They will be helping to pay by downloading it. Oh and download often they will.  People want this information…..when they like what they see they will join the organization. If you hold it as a sacred cow then they don’t want to play in that environment. Elitism: remember the stereo type we all know it’s not true or is it….You have to pay to play: is this elite? Just a question there not slamming the argument…just pointing out what we have been doing in the past. I think it’s time for a change. 

Oh and by the way back to John Konnecker’s job on those months when advertising is low meaning not breaking even on the printing costs we currently have…Guess what we are using MEMBERS DUES and NATS funds to pay the printer company and the US mail.  On the new system low month for ads is just that, a low month and it’s still profit mostly profit…Today we go in the hole on the KF and make up the difference. Would it be neat to say well we only made $5K in advertising last year but we put 4K of that in our pockets.  Instead it we brought in 24K in ads, and spent all of it plus another 2-3-4K out of the NSRCA treasury to pay for a printed KF. 

This new idea allows us to have money to advertise ourselves hold events and promote pattern and get new members. The idea of paying to get the KF is not attracting new members….the members we have are footing the bill to pay the printer on those months that the KF advertising comes up short. 

This is common sense guys…run this like a business and it can grow and expand. Live pay check to pay check like we are….. and we are always struggling to stay afloat. 

Is the KF in its current form worth $2100 a month to you? Yes a small setup fee would need to be charged to layout the Online version…so Online doesn’t mean free setup…just free printing and distribution. 

Look Al Gore invented the internet…lets think like business people and use it to spread the word. The US mail is not going to go belly up, the price of stamps will just increase and so will our costs to print and mail each and every member a copy. 

Please keep this information in mind when you vote in the poll 

My two cents on the subject. 

Troy Newman 

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