[NSRCA-discussion] Wing Construction

Mark Atwood atwoodm at paragon-inc.com
Thu Nov 8 06:56:13 AKST 2007 

Bingo.  In fact you can use an even more spacious layout, and no real need
to take the time to draw it on the foam.  It¹s a simple process...  Draw all
the places you¹ll be cutting into the wing.  Servo openings (assuming you
put trays in ahead of sheeting), aileron cut outs (NOT the hingeline, but
rather the line you¹ll be cutting to to cap each side), etc.  Then using a
syringe simply lay a very fine bead around the perimeter of the wind (or
stab), on all of the cut lines, and then in a simple 2² square checkerboard
pattern over the rest of the wing.   You will get a VERY solid bond
everywhere you lay a bead, and there is zero issue of it pulling up where
there¹s no glue (anymore than there is if you core it.)   Very strong, very
light.  Same for turtle decks and the like.  No need to seal or prep the
skin either.

-Mark


On 11/8/07 10:42 AM, "Woodward, Jim" <jim.woodward at baesystems.com> wrote:

> Instead of cutting out the ³diamond² shape lightening holes, which can/will
> produce diamond-shaped depressions or low-points in the wing if too much
> vacuum is pulled or too much weight is added during the sheeting cure, you
> could always just draw on an ³X² on the sheeting and lay one the glue in the
> X-pattern.  You get the ³weight² savings from the glue, without the negative
> impact of the honeycoming.
> Thanks,
> Jim W.
>  
> 
>  
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> 
> From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
> [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Suart Chale
> Sent: Thursday, November 08, 2007 10:36 AM
> To: 'NSRCA Mailing List'
> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Wing Construction
>  
> Once you have a diamond shaped template (2) it is actually very quick to cut
> out the foam with a hot wire.  The templates may take a bit of time to make
> however.   With a ³honeycombed wing² using a syringe to apply the glue in the
> center of your foam structure is the way to go.  I think I used a 12 gauge
> agiocath (plastic part of an IV setup).  You can get away with less epoxy and
> it will certainly adhere as it is in beads much thicker than the squeegeed on
> version.  I will agree though that you risk soft spots in the structure that
> may show up or easily be pushed in by heavy hands as there is no foam beneath.
> I have done most of my wings the standard way with a thin layer of epoxy over
> the entire foam surface and have never had that delaminate either so I think
> it is good enough strength wise.  Personally I do not think I would honeycomb
> wings again.  I still have a 60 sized Desire with them (built in ¹91) so they
> do hold up but I do not think it is worth the weight savings.  Coring the
> center may be the better way to fo to remove foam weight.
>  
> Stuart
>  
> 
> 
> From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
> [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Jay Marshall
> Sent: Thursday, November 08, 2007 10:07 AM
> To: 'NSRCA Mailing List'
> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Wing Construction
>  
> Seems like the fastest way would be with a drill press and cutting out circles
> rather than diamonds or square?
>  
> 
> Jay Marshall 
> 
> -----Original Message-----
> From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
> [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Dave Smith
> Sent: Thursday, November 08, 2007 9:57 AM
> To: NSRCA Mailing List
> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Wing Construction
>  
> 
> Karl,et al:   Ukie fliers have been coring wings this way for years.
> 
>  
> 
>  
> 
> Dave
>> 
>> ----- Original Message -----
>> 
>> From: Karl G. Mueller <mailto:kgamueller at rogers.com>
>> 
>> To: NSRCA Mailing List <mailto:nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
>> 
>> Sent: Thursday, November 08, 2007 10:46 AM
>> 
>> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Wing Construction
>> 
>>  
>> 
>> Mark,
>> 
>>  
>> 
>> I have found that it is very hard to get more than 1 oz. out of each
>> 
>> panel on a 2m  pattern wing.
>> 
>> I have seen this method done in Europe a number of years ago.
>> 
>> It is a lot faster, once you have the right setup, than cutting out all
>> 
>> the little squares or diamond shapes.
>> 
>>  
>> 
>> Karl.
>>> 
>>> ----- Original Message -----
>>> 
>>> From: flyintexan <mailto:flyintexan at comcast.net>
>>> 
>>> To: NSRCA Mailing List <mailto:nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
>>> 
>>> Sent: Wednesday, November 07, 2007 10:30 PM
>>> 
>>> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Wing Construction
>>> 
>>>  
>>> 
>>> I second that motion!  This is a great way to take about an ounce of foam
>>> out of each core.
>>> 
>>>  
>>> 
>>> -mark
>>>> 
>>>> ----- Original Message -----
>>>> 
>>>> From: Lance Van Nostrand <mailto:patterndude at tx.rr.com>
>>>> 
>>>> To: NSRCA Mailing List <mailto:nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
>>>> 
>>>> Sent: Wednesday, November 07, 2007 9:21 PM
>>>> 
>>>> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Wing Construction
>>>> 
>>>>  
>>>> 
>>>> Karl,
>>>> 
>>>> My answer might surprise you. When I have need to core my foam cores I core
>>>> them from root to tip so the foam surface is in full contact with the
>>>> skins.  My wings were of interest to several people at the Nats to see how
>>>> this works, but the local guys are used to my weirdness.  This approach
>>>> produces a wing with no soft spots on the surface.
>>>> 
>>>> --Lance
>>>> 
>>>>  
>>>>> 
>>>>> ----- Original Message -----
>>>>> 
>>>>> From: Karl G. Mueller <mailto:kgamueller at rogers.com>
>>>>> 
>>>>> To: NSRCA Mailing List <mailto:nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
>>>>> 
>>>>> Sent: Wednesday, November 07, 2007 7:53 AM
>>>>> 
>>>>> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Wing Construction
>>>>> 
>>>>>  
>>>>> 
>>>>> Lance,
>>>>> 
>>>>>  
>>>>> 
>>>>> Do you apply the glue to the skins or to the foam core in case of a
>>>>> 
>>>>> cored (with cut-outs for weight saving) foam core. I thought that the
>>>>> 
>>>>> amount of glue spread on the skins in the areas that do not make
>>>>> 
>>>>> contact with the foam would be unnecessary weight. It will strengthen
>>>>> 
>>>>> the skin some.
>>>>> 
>>>>>  
>>>>> 
>>>>> Karl G. Mueller
>>>>> kgamueller at rogers.com
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> ----- Original Message -----
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> From: Lance Van Nostrand <mailto:patterndude at tx.rr.com>
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> To: NSRCA Mailing List <mailto:nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> Sent: Tuesday, November 06, 2007 11:13 PM
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Wing Construction
>>>>>> 
>>>>>>  
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> Foam roller, my friend.  a squeegee will force resin into the pores and
>>>>>> away from the joint.  Only a roller applied fast and light can meter the
>>>>>> material properly and keep in on the surface.
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> --Lance
>>>>>> 
>>>>>>  
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> ----- Original Message -----
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> From: Nat Penton <mailto:natpenton at centurytel.net>
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> To: NSRCA Mailing List <mailto:nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> Sent: Tuesday, November 06, 2007 9:32 PM
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Wing Construction
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>  
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> To skin a foam core with contest grade balsa does anyone have a
>>>>>>> preferred way to determine when the amount of epoxy applied is adequate
>>>>>>> - using Easy Lam epoxy. I have been reluctant to use a squeegie, afraid
>>>>>>> of scoring the balsa. Would appreciate any comments.
>>>>>>> Nat
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>>>> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
>>>>>>> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
>>>>>>> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>>> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
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>>>>> 
>>>>> 
>>>>> _______________________________________________
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>>>> 
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