[NSRCA-discussion] MA Pattern column....(re: moving on...)

[vicenterc at comcast.net]

I am sure that you guys put floats on those pattern planes already.  You don't want to miss a single chance to go and practice.

I hope that you and your family are OK after all that rain.

--
Vicente "Vince" Bortone

-------------- Original message -------------- 
From: "White, Chris" <chris at ssd.fsi.com> 

Thanks Dave….glad to see my buddy is taking care of me.:)  Can you swim back and loan me your copy????:)
 
Chris 
From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of k6xyz
Sent: Thursday, June 28, 2007 4:41 PM
To: 'NSRCA Mailing List'
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] MA Pattern column....(re: moving on...)
 
Chris…..I just swam by your house and you can forgedabout that magazine….the mailbox is flooded!
 
Regards

Dave Harmon
NSRCA 586
K6XYZ[at]sbcglobal[dot]net
Sperry, Ok. 
-----Original Message-----
From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of White, Chris
Sent: Thursday, June 28, 2007 4:16 PM
To: NSRCA Mailing List
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] MA Pattern column....(re: moving on...)
 
Thanks Fred….  Mine will probably be in the mailbox todayJ
Chris
 
From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Fred Huber
Sent: Thursday, June 28, 2007 3:19 PM
To: NSRCA Mailing List
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] MA Pattern column....(re: moving on...)
 
Just received my MA yesterday.
 
RC Aerobatics.  Eric Henderson.  pg 104
----- Original Message ----- 
From: White, Chris 
To: NSRCA Mailing List 
Sent: Thursday, June 28, 2007 7:22 AM
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] MA Pattern column....(re: moving on...)
 
Sorry…for some odd reason I haven’t got that issue yet.  Strange because MA never runs late for me. 
Thanks….  
Chris
 
srca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Michael Ramsey
Sent: Wednesday, June 27, 2007 5:01 PM
To: NSRCA Mailing List
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] MA Pattern column....(re: moving on...)
 
Chris:
 
You did check the July 2007 issue for Eric's column right?
 
Michael Ramsey 
Associate Editor, Model Aviation 
5161 East Memorial Drive 
Muncie, Indiana 47302 
765-287-1256 x.223 
 



From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of White, Chris
Sent: Monday, June 25, 2007 9:43 AM
To: NSRCA Mailing List
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] MA Pattern column....(re: moving on...)
I miss Eric’s MA column…. Where’s our pattern exposure in the AMA mag?  We have many good people involved who have helped a lot of us learn and enjoy our hobby.  We can’t afford to build walls between each other. I’m not a current NSRCA member, but only because my life has limited my involvement at the present.  I will participate all I can because I enjoy few things more than flying with other competitors, and admiring their skills whether it be writing, R&D, flying, building, coaching, or just hangar flying. (Pattern flyers are a most helpful group of competitors!)
 
I hope (sooner than later) that feelings will heal, procedures will be corrected if needed, and people will learn from any mistakes they or others may have made. 
 
In the meantime, I would like to thank all the guys who have helped so many of us in columns they write in magazines or this discussion. (risking criticism etc)  I admire all these guys for something they’ve done. Danny Landis, Dave Lockhart, Eric Henderson.  You guys have all made contributions….please continue.  
 
Sincerely, 
Chris White
 



From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Lisa & Larry
Sent: Sunday, June 24, 2007 12:53 PM
To: 'NSRCA Mailing List'
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Going forward.
 
Few things come to mind on this…
 
For Eric…Although I understand what you are stating and realize I don’t have all the facts, I must wonder how this thread has helped grow pattern. Eric, I’m not talking about you even though this is your ID. How many potential pattern guys have now turned away because of this thread? It’s an ugly black eye and I don’t appreciate this forum being used for this purpose. But now the cats out of the bag, let’s deal with it fairly.
 
For the NSRCA Board….I would like to see where this was addressed in the past board meeting minutes. I would like to know where this can be reviewed. If not, I request a copy of the minutes to be mailed to me at my present address. I would like to know what authority a SIG has to sanction a paying AMA member from participating in an AMA national event even as a judge. At what point did the NSRCA Board discuss this with the AMA Competition Board? If not at all it’s nothing less than a lynching and the board members responsible for this should resign immediately. Eric is an AMA member first. The NATS is an AMA event First. I would agree that the CD, with input from the NSRCA Board, could recommend sanctions to the AMA on behalf of a written protest.
 
I would be interested in what Dave Brown and the AMA Competition Board has to say…
 
With this being said, if in fact there is rules clearly stated and the NSRCA had the authority and acted in those rules let me know and I will apologize. I would like to know where it is written.
 
Rules that actually state in the AMA rules book. The pilot or anyone on his behalf can’t confront the judge. This violation is sufficient to result in disqualification of the pilot from this event. See General Competition Rules page 12 of 12 under General, Section 8.
 
In the General Competition Rules it also outlines the rules for Protest, See General Competition Rules page 9 of 12 under Sanctioned Events, Section 18. I will assume that at a Nationals event, the CD followed these rules. They should have been followed to the letter regardless of the NSRCA’s position. The CD is an AMA representative and acts on the AMA’s behalf. No influence by the NSRCA should have impaired the protester’s right or the rights of the person being protested.
 
I would like the NSRCA Board President to respond regarding the AMA Protest Rules and how they were followed to the letter in this case as well as any sanction for an individual confronting a judge regarding a pilots scores.
 
Larry Diamond
AMA 5024
NSRCA 3083
 
 
 
 
 



From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Grow Pattern
Sent: Sunday, June 24, 2007 8:41 AM
To: NSRCA Mailing List
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Going forward.
 
Please understand that I wrote about what had happened to me for a reason greater than personal vindication. There is a fundamental problem with sponsorship, contestant judging, and the management/development of judges.
 
(I can’t address the information given to the Don Lowe Masters or the attempt to remove me from Model Aviation reporting unless I do something and subpoena the records of the NSRCA board, their e-mail their appointee’s mail. To go “legal” on the NSRCA would just be ugly, damaging to all and exhaust what little NSRCA money there is in the bank. That is not my agenda).
 
I can address how I was processed by the NSRCA as regards allegations of biased judging. I can’t do much about what happened to me, but I can do something about the next guy. So can you. (After all, it could be you.)
 
First of all, the NSRCA needs to amend its charter to state that it is a ruling body on judging resources. Then update the bylaws to cover the related process. There is an NSRCA bylaw on how to do this and it involves all of you, the NSRCA membership, voting on a proposed change.
 
Secondly, the AMA has a pretty good disciplinary process that the NSRCA could incorporate to deal with judging infractions. It tells the accused what they have been charged with and allows the accused to present their case. There is even an appeal process if the member does not agree with the decision or the punishment.
 
We all deserve a fair trial and the right to face our accuser(s) or the accusation(s).
 
With the bylaws as they are, I consider the NSRCA board to have acted illegally and to not have given me a chance to challenge their evidence BEFORE they met and passed their sentence. 
 
Most importantly, the NSRCA needs to revamp its judging training. They now need to add performance evaluation to allow us to know how well we are performing as a judge. Maybe we need to be rated as to what we can judge. e.g. which class we can cover etc. We should be tested before--not just accused after!
 
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
 
By NSRCA board voting, I will be eligible to judge pattern in 2009. 
 
Please consider this for a moment.
 
I am sitting in the judge’s chair and I see a zero spin entry, no stall etc. I think for a moment as the rest of the spin is being executed. Hmmm?
 
-What if the other judges all saw that as a valid spin entry? 
-What should I do? If I am out of the norm, I will be in trouble again, 
-They will be watching. 
-It would take only one pilot to complain and I would be toast….
-A small trickle of sweat runs down my back. 
-The clock is ticking.
-Oh no! My confidence as a judge is shot. 
-I freeze.
-I chicken out and give a 6.
 
Well, I need not worry because they will never pick me to judge again. But they will pick YOU!
 
-----------------------------------
My thanks for the off-list encouragement. I will keep your identity confidential. I understand that you cannot post on the discussion-list. I know that it is intimidating when this could affect your results down the line. It is supposed to be a discussion-list about everything that affects pattern. That is, unless your president tell you to not do so!
 
I really thank the two NSRCA board members who had the courage to let me know that the NSRCA board was trying to have me removed from writing the column and that they are currently planning to take me off the list. 
 
I am sorry I blitzed the discussion-list with long notes but, you guys know me--I write and this is what happens when I do J
 
Got to get back to the real world again.
 
Good luck everybody and best regards,
 
Eric--Exiting the box!
 
 
 



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Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] MA Pattern column....(re: moving on...)
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