[NSRCA-discussion] Nats Final Scores

Dave Lockhart davel322 at comcast.net
Mon Jul 23 17:10:32 AKDT 2007 

I agree there is not any commentary in the current FAI book about a noise
exemption for electrics.  And while I don't have the old or new book in
front of me at the moment, I believe in the not too distant past, there was
a noise exemption for electrics in the "general" section of the FAI book
(which contains rules/guidance/structure applicable to all FAI events).
However, when the general section and an event specific section conflicted,
my understanding is that priority is given to the event specific section.

 

I agree with Mark's comments about noise - on our pattern models, tipspeed
is usually the largest culprit, and prop noise can certainly be amplified by
minimal prop clearance.  In my situation, I did make some mods prior the
NATs to the Prestige with the Neu motor to knock the db down from 95 to
93db, and the A60 in the other Prestige was typically low 90s (variable
depending on temp of lipos which affects prop RPM).  The setups that I am
running are atypical for electric - 18" props at relatively high RPM.  The
18x13PN on the Neu was probably @ 7700 when it flunked noise, and the same
18x13PN was probably @ 7500 on the A60 when it registered 94 db (opposed to
low 90s at home).  I suspect the "added" noise of the Neu motor is in part
from the added RPM - the 6.7:1 planetary gears on the Neu are seeing ~52,000
RPM from the motor, whereas the typical 13/14XL Hacker setup is only seeing
~42,000 RPM from the motor shaft.  More stuff to play with and figure out!!!


Dave

 

 

  _____  

From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
[mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Mark Atwood
Sent: Monday, July 23, 2007 1:23 PM
To: NSRCA Mailing List
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Nats Final Scores

 

I'm sure there WAS an exemption...it was somewhere in the general guidelines
though, NOT specific to pattern.  It simply said that Electric models didn't
have to be checked for noise.  But we looked through the entire rulebook
almost cover to cover and it's not there.  I'm guessing it was removed from
the general area and nobody paid any attention.

If someone has an old rule book and can find the section, and compare it to
the new one, it would be interesting to see.  Rather moot now though.

It certainly makes sense that electrics should have to comply though, and
I'm sure Dave L. had intended too, and was surprised that he wasn't.    One
of the issues seems to be ground clearance.  The large props are so close to
the pavement that it seems to almost amplify the sound.  Raising the
airplane up even an inch or two seems to have an effect on the Db meter.
Never thought that longer landing gear would be a component of noise
reduction.

-M


On 7/23/07 12:30 PM, "John Ferrell" <johnferrell at earthlink.net> wrote:

I must have missed a rule change. FAI has been providing an exemption for
electrics and noise checks in the past.

John Ferrell    W8CCW
"Life is easier if you learn to plow 
       around the stumps"
http://DixieNC.US


----- Original Message ----- 
 
From:  Gray E  Fowler  <mailto:gfowler at raytheon.com>
<mailto:gfowler at raytheon.com>  
 
To: NSRCA Mailing List  <mailto:nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
<mailto:nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>  
 
Sent: Monday, July 23, 2007 11:37 AM
 
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Nats  Final Scores
 


Mike 

Were sound problems big props or gearboxes making  noise? 



Gray  Fowler
Senior Principal Chemical Engineer
Radomes and Specialty  Apetures
Technical Staff Composites Engineering
Raytheon  


   
 "Michael Wickizer"  <mwickizer at msn.com>  
Sent by: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org  07/23/2007 10:17 AM     

 Please respond  to
NSRCA Mailing List <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org> 


     

 To 

nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org   

 cc 

  

 Subject 

Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Nats Final  Scores
  
  



Thanks Don,

I found it interesting that the only sound check  problems were with the 
electrics.  I guess the electric guys kinda  took it for granted, as I did, 
had me wondering for  awhile.


>From: tocdon at netscape.net
>Reply-To: NSRCA  Mailing List <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
>To:  nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
>Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Nats  Final Scores
>Date: Sun, 22 Jul 2007 23:04:19  -0400
>
>
>Mike.? My congrats to Brett on his phenomenal  finish.
>
>
>
>I was running 20% nitro along with the  restrictor from Central Hobbies on 
>the 170  DZ.
>
>
>
>All the  best,
>
>
>
>Don  Szczur
>
>
>-----Original Message-----
>From: Michael  Wickizer <mwickizer at msn.com>
>To:  nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
>Sent: Sun, 22 Jul 2007 9:39  pm
>Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Nats Final  Scores
>
>
>
>
>I believe it was Cool Power 30%  heli fuel pretty much across the board.
>
>
> >From: Bob  Kane <getterflash at yahoo.com>
> >Reply-To: NSRCA Mailing List  <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
> >To: NSRCA Mailing List  <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
> >Subject: Re:  [NSRCA-discussion] Nats Final Scores
> >Date: Sun, 22 Jul 2007  18:05:38 -0700 (PDT)
> >
> >Anybody know what fuel the DZ  guys are using?
> >
> >Bob Kane
>  >getterflash at yahoo.com
> >
> >----- Original Message  ----
> >From: Ken Thompson <mrandmrst at comcast.net>
>  >To: NSRCA Mailing List <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
>  >Sent: Sunday, July 22, 2007 8:59:51 PM
> >Subject: Re:  [NSRCA-discussion] Nats Final Scores
> >
> >Thanks for this  list Dave,
> >Pretty impressive showing for electrics, though I'll  probably go with
the
> >YS
> >for my Black Magic next  year.
> >----- Original Message -----
> >From: "Dave  Lockhart" <davel322 at comcast.net>
> >To: "'NSRCA Mailing List'"  <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
> >Sent: Sunday, July 22,  2007 7:56 PM
> >Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Nats Final  Scores
> >
> >
> > > For FAI -
> >  >
> > > JAS - Hacker C50, TP
> > > QQ -  YS170
> > > Andrew - Hacker C50, TP
> > > Sean -  YS170
> > > Chip - Hacker C50, TP
> > > Brett - Hacker  C50, Evo
> > > Don - YS170
> > > Dave - Hacker A60,  TP
> > >
> > > Dave
> > >
> >  >
> > >
> > > -----Original Message-----
>  > > From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
> > >  [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org]
<mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org%5d>  On Behalf Of James
>  > > Oddino
> > > Sent: Sunday, July 22, 2007 8:50 PM
>  > > To: NSRCA Mailing List
> > > Subject: Re:  [NSRCA-discussion] Nats Final Scores
> > >
> > >  Chris, how many of the finalists in FAI and Masters were flying
> >  > electric?
> > >
> > >
> > >
>  > > On Jul 22, 2007, at 6:39 AM, chris moon wrote:
> >  >
> > >> Full standings for Advanced and  Intermediate
> > >>
> > >> Advanced:
>  > >>
> > >> 1 ERIK J NEWSHOLME 3986.3315 STONE  MOUNTAIN GA
> > >> 2 RYAN M SMITH 3960.842 BROWNS SUMMIT  NC
> > >> 3 CHARLES A HOCHHALTER 3943.2206 SAN ANTONIO  TX
> > >> 4 ANTHONY B PAGE 3927.7466 NICHOLS SC
> >  >> 5 JON A LOWE 3829.4998 MADISON AL
> > >> 6 ROBERT B  GREEN 6810.7499 OMAHA NE
> > >> 7 EUGENE VILLA 3762.3207 SKOKIE  IL
> > >> 8 DENNIS BODARY 3725.752 TRENTON MI
> >  >> 9 WILLIAM J SHEFFIELD 3717.2661 SPRING TX
> > >> 10  LUIS A RODRIGUEZ 3692.1843 THE WOODLANDS TX
> > >> 11 DAVID  JOHNSTONE 3679.7326 EDGEWOOD KY
> > >> 12 BILL R MITCHELL  3655.8635 LEXINGTON NC
> > >> 13 FRANK DEL GIUDICE 363.9105  HOFFMAN ESTATES IL
> > >> 14 JOSEPH E ZEIGENFUS 3606.1274 EGG  HARBOR TOWNSHIP NJ
> > >> 15 CARLOS M BARRERA 3493.3373 CONROE  TX
> > >> 16 JARVIS R JOHNSON 3117.3074 CHINO CA
> >  >>
> > >> Intermediate:
> > >>
>  > >> 1 MARCIO A JORGE O 3980.7941 ATLANTA GA
> > >> 2  RUOHAN (JACK) LI S 3947.2841 DUNLAP IL
> > >> 3 GARY R COURTNEY  O 3946.3255 HUNTSVILLE AL
> > >> 4 BRANDON C LANDRY J 3894.2959  BATON ROUGE LA
> > >> 5 RICHARD A ROSINSKI II O 3881.1865  RALEIGH NC
> > >> 6 EDWIN M MANSON J 3777.0279 MCLEAN  VA
> > >> 7 MATTHEW C LIPRIE S 3767.6467 LAKE CHARLES  LA
> > >> 8 JOHN KONNEKER O 3765.2024 MOUNT PLEASANT IA
>  > >> 9 JON R MARTIN O 3756.0163 RAYNE LA
> > >> 10  AUSTIN WINGO S 3667.335 BIRMINGHAM AL
> > >> 11 LARRY L  KAUFFMAN O 3633.7106 MANASSAS VA
> > >> 12 ROYCE W DORSETT O  3564.2409 WELCOME NC
> > >> 13 TIM R TIPTON O 3544.1965 BROKEN  ARROW OK
> > >> 14 BRUCE M GINN O 3536.6891 NORTH EAST  MD
> > >> 15 MICHAEL GREEAR O 3455.4515 LITTLEROCK CA
>  > >> 16 DYLAN FORNEY O 3414.4633 MURCHISON TX
> > >>  17 DEAN FUNK O 3348.4203 AUSTELL GA
> > >>
> >  >>
> > >>
> > >>
> > >> Tim  Taylor wrote:
> > >>> Well we know all about FAI and  Masters, but wasn't there a couple
> > >>> other
>  > >>> classes flying? What about them? Don't they rate some air  time as
> > >>> well?
> > >>>
> >  >>>  
>---------------------------------------------------------------------
>  > >>> ---
> > >>> Moody friends. Drama queens.  Your life? Nope! - their life, your
> > >>> story.
>  > >>> Play Sims Stories at Yahoo! Games.
> > >>>   <http://us.rd.yahoo.com/evt=48224/*http:/sims.yahoo.com/>
<http://us.rd.yahoo.com/evt=48224/*http://sims.yahoo.com/>
> >  >>>  
>---------------------------------------------------------------------
>  > >>> ---
> > >>>
> > >>>  _______________________________________________
> > >>>  NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> > >>>  NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> > >>>  http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
> >  >>
> > >>  _________________________________________________________________
> >  >> http://newlivehotmail.com
> > >>
> > >>  _______________________________________________
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> > >>  NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> > >>  http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
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