[NSRCA-discussion] More flexibility in class selection?
Rex LESHER
trexlesh at msn.com
Wed Aug 15 20:16:17 AKDT 2007
You hit it right on the nail head Chris!!! I remember my first Masters event....
It was like entering a NASCAR race with an old Volkswagen Beetle! I found
out I was pretty unprepared... and it wasn't the sequence, it was the level
of competition. It really doesn't matter what the difference in the level of
difficulty is in the sequences in relation of Advanced to Masters. The Level
of competition in Masters is fierce. That's part of what makes people think they
aren't ready to move up to the next class. In reality, as you advance to the
next higher sequence, the competition raises exponentially...
It's pretty hard to gain the experience and ability to compete at that level
without jumping in and eating humble pie for a while... Sure, there's a
young superstar that is a natural and beats most everyone, but that only
happens once in a while and they usually just go right on to FAI to play
with the big boys. Or, they discover girls, LOL.
My point to all this is simple... And I'm not pointing any fingers or relating
this to any one person. Don't think for one minute that you have
it all figured out until you actually step up to the plate. So what if Masters
is a destination class. I'm glad it is! It actually gives the up and coming
flyers from the lower classes a target to prepare for. Could you imagine
flying for 5 or 6 years thinking, "I want to get good enough to compete
against that guy".... only to get there and see "that guy" flying a couple
sequences higher than you. Your goal just became unobtainable... There
has to be a top as well as a bottom to all competitions. The competition in
Masters is enough that you would never get tired of flying there unless you
are getting maximum scores and have won it all...
Then you get the opportunity to jump in the shark tank with all the FAI
guys during feeding time. More humble pie!
Reguardless of what you think, there has to be a goal associated with
playing with these toys as we are... And, that's an individual thing!
The rules governing our fine pastime weren't written on a whim. They were
written and proposed by people that had or have a lot of experience in this
consortium... Are they perfect? probably not in some areas... but the intent
is there. By the way, anything not covered in AMA rules is deferred to FAI
rules.... So, when you get done reading all the AMA competition rules, get
the FAI rules and read them... I guarantee you'll be informed!
Rex
Team VISA
----- Original Message -----
From: chris moon<mailto:cjm767driver at hotmail.com>
To: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org<mailto:nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
Sent: Wednesday, August 15, 2007 7:41 PM
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] More flexibility in class selection?
Guys, the short answer is that Masters is an AMA class and FAI is not.
Don't believe me? Submit a rules change for FAI to the AMA and see what
they say....don't submit to us, that's not our event. Need more proof?
Why do some maneuvers get judged differently in Masters and FAI (ex:
take off/ landing)? Why? because they are governed by different
entities and are different events. If someone wants to fly Masters
forever, so be it. It IS a destination class. One does not have to move
out of Masters...EVER. Does is make it tough for the guys moving into
Masters? You bet. I moved up to Masters this year and found myself
flying against guys who have been in Masters over a decade. Guess
what? I have learned more this year flying against that level of
competition than ever before. If some wants to collect trophies in
Masters, that is their prerogative.
Chris
Fred Huber wrote:
>Well...
>
>He is the one who proclaimed that he was going to stay in the class until
>he won a particular event... which how many people have EVER won? Out of
>how many who have competed?
>
>Sorry... the world does not owe anyone any particular trophy.
>
>You say he's second best... maybe thats the best he ever gets.
>
>Every other competitor who goes to the NATS and flys in Masters wants to be
>the best too. Most will NEVER make it.
>
>Most would be damn glad to be called second best in this sport...
>
>Reality is not politically correct.
>
>This is not the special olympics where everyone gets the same trophy:
>"Participant"
>
>----- Original Message ----- From: "Matthew Frederick"
><mjfrederick at cox.net<mailto:mjfrederick at cox.net>>
>To: "NSRCA Mailing List" <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org<mailto:nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>>
>Sent: Wednesday, August 15, 2007 8:17 PM
>Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] More flexibility in class selection?
>
>
>
>>Fred,
>>The person who made the comment about not moving up until winning the Nats
>>was Arch Stafford. He's a very nice guy, and according to the Nats finish
>>this year, he's probably the second-best Masters pilot in the nation. He
>>wants to be the best before he moves up to F3A, it's a personal goal he
>>has
>>set and well within the bounds of the rules. Having met Arch, and knowing
>>what a decent guy he is, I frankly take offense at you blatantly calling
>>him
>>out as a sandbagger. I don't know one person who flys Masters in D6 who
>>would call him that, and those are the people he competes with on a
>>regular
>>basis... There is currently no relevant points accumulation in Masters
>>other
>>than for district championships as it is the highest level of AMA Pattern.
>>I
>>completely agree with the point someone else made that stated we should
>>not
>>force someone to a level of competition that is out of the control of the
>>AMA Competition Regs. If I were ever in a situation that forced me to move
>>into F3A competition, I'd probably stop flying pattern. Full turnaround
>>patterns was a hard enough pill to swallow. F3A has too many maneuvers
>>that,
>>while very beautiful when performed well, I don't personally consider to
>>be
>>precision aerobatics. Snaps and spins are enough of a stretch.
>>
>>Matt
>>
>>----- Original Message ----- From: "Fred Huber" <fhhuber at clearwire.net<mailto:fhhuber at clearwire.net>>
>>To: "NSRCA Mailing List" <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org<mailto:nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>>
>>Sent: Wednesday, August 15, 2007 6:56 PM
>>Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] More flexibility in class selection?
>>
>>
>>
>>>No sour grapes here about not being able to win... I don't ever expect
>>>to
>>>accumulate the points needed to force advancement from Sportsman. The
>>>hand-eye coordination just isn't there.
>>>
>>>The only way I'll take 3rd place in Sportsman is if there's only 2 others
>>>flying. I'm just in Pattern for the flight discipline... and to be
>>>around
>>>people who can help me quit breaking airplanes.
>>>
>>>I will probably move to Intermediate next year.. becaue I have learned
>>>almost as much as I can from the Sportman sequence.... I'll place DEAD
>>>LAST
>>>FOREVER. I'll fly at the NATS in about 3 or 4 years too.
>>>
>>>I do see the hypocracy of people complaining about not being competitive
>>>if
>>>they move up... and sitting firmly in the lower class for years so they
>>>can
>>>always win...
>>>
>>>"I won't move up until I WIN the NATS" is why they came up with the point
>>>system to force people to move up... sandbagger. (not even bothering to
>>>look up who made the referenced post...)
>>>
>>>The only way I'll take 3rd place in Sportsman is if there's only 2 others
>>>flying.
>>>
>>>I take offense at rules that are unfair.
>>>
>>>I take offense at people who revise the rules to suit thier personal
>>>agendas.
>>>
>>>----- Original Message ----- From: <seefo at san.rr.com<mailto:seefo at san.rr.com>>
>>>To: "NSRCA Mailing List" <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org<mailto:nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>>
>>>Sent: Wednesday, August 15, 2007 5:40 PM
>>>Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] More flexibility in class selection?
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>>I know Glen.
>>>>
>>>>My question was more rhetorical than anything else, and I really just
>>>>put it out there to try to clarify the issue. There seems to be a
>>>>division amongst people who want Masters to be that stepping stone
>>>>class verses those who want Masters to be a destination all by itself
>>>>(which it currently is).
>>>>
>>>>I do think the idea of a progression rule whereby a pilot who does not
>>>>meet a given criteria has the option of moving down. I personally like
>>>>the 'qualification' bar idea. For example, a pilot moves up to Masters
>>>>from Advanced. In their 1st contest, if they are unable to achieve an
>>>>AVERAGE normalized score of at least 800, they are given the option of
>>>>moving back to Advanced. The 800 number is arbitrary and used for
>>>>example only.
>>>>
>>>>I guess my biggest problem with these threads, is they give me a big
>>>>sense of sour grapes from people as I read them talk continually about
>>>>not being able to win. Last I checked this was competition, and if you
>>>>want to win, you perfect your own flying until you can do it better
>>>>than everyone else. You don't tell the guy beating you to go play
>>>>somewhere else so you can feel good about yourself.
>>>>
>>>>Of course I could be completely wrong. It wouldn't be the 1st time.
>>>>(just ask my wife)
>>>>
>>>>-Doug
>>>>
>>>>----- Original Message -----
>>>>From: Glen Watson <gwatson11 at houston.rr.com<mailto:gwatson11 at houston.rr.com>>
>>>>Date: Wednesday, August 15, 2007 3:24 pm
>>>>Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] More flexibility in class selection?
>>>>To: 'NSRCA Mailing List' <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org<mailto:nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>There is no mandatory advancement from Masters...
>>>>>
>>>>>The following was copied from the current AMA rulebook...
>>>>>
>>>>>8.2.5. There is no mandatory advancement into FAI from the Masters
>>>>>class.Contestants may enter their current AMA class or the FAI
>>>>>class at any
>>>>>contest but not both.
>>>>>
>>>>>~Glen
>>>>>
>>>>>-----Original Message-----
>>>>>From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org<mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org>
>>>>>[mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of
>>>>>seefo at san.rr.com
>>>>>Sent: Wednesday, August 15, 2007 4:51 PM
>>>>>To: NSRCA Mailing List
>>>>>Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] More flexibility in class selection?
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>It seems to me the real question that must be answered (yet again)
>>>>>
>>>>is:
>>>>
>>>>>Is Masters a destination class or not?
>>>>>
>>>>>-Doug
>>>>>_______________________________________________
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>>>>>
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>>>>>
>>>>>
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>>>>
>>>>
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