[NSRCA-discussion] More flexibility in class selection?

Ken Thompson mrandmrst at comcast.net
Wed Aug 15 16:48:39 AKDT 2007


Thank you Gene...with special attention to the highlighted line in 8.2.5...

That's all I was trying to say, it's not an AMA class...




  ----- Original Message ----- 
  From: Gene Maurice 
  To: 'NSRCA Mailing List' 
  Sent: Wednesday, August 15, 2007 7:35 PM
  Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] More flexibility in class selection?


  For those that haven't read it, please read the rulebook.

   

  The applicable sections are:

   

  7. Pattern event classes. The Pattern event shall

  be divided into five (5) classes. The first four (4)

  shall (in order of increasing difficulty) be

  referred to as Sportsman, Intermediate,

  Advanced, and Masters. The fifth class shall be

  referred to as the FAI class. The Sportsman class

  is supplemental (see Supplemental and

  Provisional Rules, page 2). Competitors must be

  advised prior to the start of the contest of any

  planned deviations from standard AMA rules

  pertaining to the events they have entered.

   

  8.2. A contestant will be mandatorily

  advanced through the classes as follows: A flier

  must move out of the Sportsman class at the end

  of that calendar year if he places first, second, or

  third, and above at least four (4) other fliers

  (having recorded an official flight) in any

  sanctioned Pattern class contest. For

  Intermediate and Advanced fliers, advancement

  takes place through the accumulation of points.

  In these classes, contestants receive points

  according to their finishing place in every contest

  they compete in. For fliers finishing third or

  below in a given contest, they will receive points

  equal to the number of official (having recorded

  an official flight) fliers they beat. The second

  place winner will receive points equal to twice

  the number of official fliers he beats, and the

  first place winner will receive points equal to

  three times the number of official fliers he beats.

  The points each contestant receives go into his

  cumulative record.

   

   

  8.2.5. There is no mandatory

  advancement into FAI from the Masters class.

  Contestants may enter their current AMA class

  OR  the FAI class at any contest but not both.

   

  8.3. Each Pattern contestant is

  responsible for maintaining an accurate record of

  his own classification points. Handy wallet size

  Classification Advancement Record forms are

  available upon request from AMA HQ; please

  include a preaddressed and stamped return

  envelope. CDs of meets having RC Pattern

  events are also provided with a small supply of

  such forms.

   

   

  Gene Maurice

  gene.mauirce at sgmservice.com

  Plano, Texas

  AMA 3408 NSRCA 877


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  From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of John Gayer
  Sent: Wednesday, August 15, 2007 7:13 PM
  To: NSRCA Mailing List
  Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] More flexibility in class selection?

   

  That must mean the progression rules are in effect for all AMA classes, right? Including 406?

  Tim Taylor wrote: 

  FAI is class 406, an AMA Class, Just checked the rule book.

   

   http://www.modelaircraft.org/events/rulebooks/RC%20Aerobatics.pdf

  Fred Huber <fhhuber at clearwire.net> wrote:

    In that case... there's no support for offering FAI class at an AMA sanctioned event.  

     

    Its not an AMA class.  Have a seperate contest.

     

    That worm turns 2 ways.

      ----- Original Message ----- 

      From: Ken Thompson 

      To: NSRCA Mailing List 

      Sent: Wednesday, August 15, 2007 4:57 PM

      Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] More flexibility in class selection?

       

      The bottom line is this...the AMA has 4 classes, the top level being Masters.  FAI is an international F3A class, not a AMA class..."in my opinion" there can never be a mandatory progression from an AMA SIG class to an international class.

       

      As for your question, my logic should, and does, apply to every class controlled by the AMA...which is what I'm talking about.

       

      Ken

        ----- Original Message ----- 

        From: John Gayer 

        To: NSRCA Mailing List 

        Sent: Wednesday, August 15, 2007 4:38 PM

        Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] More flexibility in class selection?

         

        Why does this apply to every class except Masters?? 
        Aren't there better flyers available to learn from in FAI?  :)
        John

        Ken Thompson wrote: 

Now THAT'S what I'm talkin' about!!!    You will only get better if you do one of two things,    1.  Fly against people that are better than you, obviously paying attention   to their flights.    2.  Have a pilot that is better than you willing to coach you.    I've been blessed with having both...any contest I go to in D6 will have   pilots that are better  than I am, and I have Archie as a coach to help me through the little   things.    BTW:  I fully expect to be flying Masters in 6 or 7 years.  That will put me   at 54 or 55 years old when I make the move.    Personally I have no desire to go to contests and come in 1st or 2nd on a   regular basis, AND stay in that  class...it simply won't make me a better pilot.  My goal is to get better   every year, with hard work and patience,  it will happen.    Ken      ----- Original Message -----   From: <rcpattern at stx.rr.com>  To: "NSRCA Mailing List" <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>  Sent: Wednesday, August 15, 2007 3:55 PM  Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] More flexibility in class selection?        I take exception to this.  FAI and Masters are not related.  I have  been flying masters several years, finishing as high as second this  year at the NATS.  Yes, I'm coming back next year in Masters.  I have  a goal of winning the nats before I move up.  I can be realistic...at  some point with enough practice I might be able to crack the finals in  FAI at the NATS, but I'm smart enough to know that realistically  winning FAI isnt going to happen.  I would also argue that the guys  that have been flying masters for years, just raise the bar.  I know  in different areas I've flown around the country, these are the guys  that make guys fly better.  Show up in District 6 sometime, and fly  Masters...you'll definitely get better.  6 of the top 10 at the NATS  were D6.  The means, guy that finished in the top 10 at the NATS in  what is probably top to bottom the most competitive class have trouble  getting wood at a local contest.  I can promise you though, the guys  that fly here have greatly  improved their flying than they would have in other parts of the  country.  Glen has set the bar here for a while, and I know the other  guys are pushing to catch him, and if you look now at local contest  scores, it is getting closer.  At any given time down here in D6, I'd  say 6 or 7 guys can take a round in masters.  Now that makes it fun. I  know when I was flying in D4 last year.  Every contest I went to, was  Verne K, and Steve Miller....I knew I'd better put up great flights  every flight and this makes you a better pilot.  I think you should  try moving up...take a year of the low 900's, and then see where you  are the following year.  I bet you start moving up and before you know  it you would be right there in the mix.  This is a competitive  activity and the only way you improve is flying against people who are  better than you.    Arch      ----- Original Message -----  From: John Gayer <jgghome at comcast.net>  Date: Wednesday, August 15, 2007 3:41 pm  Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] More flexibility in class selection?  To: NSRCA Mailing List <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>        Ron,  I take exception to those rules. There should be only one  destination  class. Why shouldn't there be a mandatory move from Masters to  F3A? They  are just two patterns with a natural progression as there is  between  Advanced and Masters.  Parking and sandbagging is a mental state, not a rules violation.  john    Ron Van Putte wrote:          The Master class is the top AMA class and there is no mandatory          move        from the Master class to F3A, so how can there be "parkers" or  "sandbaggers"?    Ron Van Putte    On Aug 15, 2007, at 2:10 PM, John Gayer wrote:            how about changing the AMA advancemant rule and keep it very            simple?>> Your first contest of the year will determine your class  for the        year. You may go up one class at any time during the year but            may not        go back down during the year. At the start of the next year you            may        drop back one class at your option, stay where you are or go up            a class.        This is simple enough that your fellow competitiors will know            if you        are following the rules. It will also be up to your fellow  competitiors to insure that you are not sandbagging.  I also feel strongly that sandbagging in Masters should not be  allowed. If you disregard Sportsman, then half of the classes            allow        parking. Obviously, F3A has to be a parking lot but I see no            reason        to allow this behavior in Masters. As a competant advanced            pilot of        somewhat advanced years, I have very little interest in moving            to        Masters in order to spend the rest of my pattern years trying            to        break 900 against the parkers.  I fail to see the logic in having two destination classes.            Shouldn't        we all aspire to progress to FAI? The current Masters schedule            is        designed as a stepping stone to Masters. Let's use it that way.    John Gayer  NSRCA 632      BUDDYonRC at aol.com wrote:              There was a proposal on the last rules cycle that would allow              a        person to move up and test his ability then move back if he              had not        attained the skills required for the higher class.  I              personally        think it is a good idea and I also see no need for the point              system        like someone said if someone abuses the privilege we can              solicit        Earl and four other guys his size to take him behind the barn              and        splain to him why he will be moving up. I believe peer              pressure is        all the control we need.  I think this is worth a try.  For those who have the ability and desire to achieve a spot at              the        top I don't see that we have a problem.  Buddy        ---------------------------------------------------------------              ---------        Get a sneak peek of the all-new AOL.com                <http://discover.aol.com/memed/aolcom30tour/?        ncid=AOLAOF00020000000982>.>>>      ----------------------------------------------------------------              --------        _______________________________________________  NSRCA-discussion mailing list  NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org  http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion                _______________________________________________  NSRCA-discussion mailing list  NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org  <mailto:NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>  http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion            ------------------------------------------------------------------          ------        _______________________________________________  NSRCA-discussion mailing list  NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org  http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion            _______________________________________________  NSRCA-discussion mailing list  NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org  http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion         _______________________________________________  NSRCA-discussion mailing list  NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org  http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion        
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