[NSRCA-discussion] Full flying Wing/Aileron

Tue Sep 5 10:31:38 AKDT 2006

A guy in north east flew a .60 size pattern bird with full flying wings,
and the usual retracts and pipe typical of the time.

It did fine, but showed no apparent advantage.  Didn't see a snap
attempted.  

Ron Lockhart

-------------- Original message -------------- 
From: "JShulman" <jshulman at cfl.rr.com> 

If I remember correctly, I think everything was a full flying surface on it. I think Chip said is was smooth but wouldn't spin/snap.

Regards,
Jason
www.jasonshulman.com
www.shulmanaviation.com
www.composite-arf.com 
-----Original Message-----
From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org]On Behalf Of Terry Brox
Sent: Tuesday, September 05, 2006 1:42 PM
To: NSRCA Mailing List
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Aero design question

Didnt Merle Hyde build a Dash 5 with complete wings movement for ailerons?
----- Original Message ----- 
From: george w. kennie 
To: NSRCA Mailing List 
Sent: Tuesday, September 05, 2006 12:16 PM
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Aero design question

I swear I've bought some ARF's that had helical ailerons. Trust me, It's not all that it's cracked up to be! (or maybe that was a mis-statement).
G.

----- Original Message ----- 
From: John Pavlick 
To: NSRCA Mailing List 
Sent: Monday, September 04, 2006 11:20 PM
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Aero design question

Yeah, or do the "flexiron" thing. You can make all kinds of cool shapes with 3 servos. The flexible aileron will interpolate the rest of the curve (somewhat). Think about it. Hey, maybe we should actually try this. 

John Pavlick
http://www.idseng.com

-----Original Message-----
From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org]On Behalf Of Rcmaster199 at aol.com
Sent: Monday, September 04, 2006 11:04 PM
To: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Aero design question

Now John may be on to something here....3 servos driving each aileron on a pattern plane. HMMMMM!!!

If helical is what you want, cut the aileron 3 ways, proportional areas in each segment of course and drive it with Johns 3 preprogrammed servos. And you can use the smallest, fastest servos around so your response will be outasight. That's the ticket laddie, Ahuh....

VBG

I think I'll open another bottle of Rafanelli '02, and continue toasting :)

Matt

In a message dated 9/4/2006 10:50:47 PM Eastern Standard Time, jpavlick at idseng.com writes:
Now that sounds like the way to go! Except I think you actually need 3 servos to do it right. I'm setting up the mix on my 12z now...

John Pavlick
http://www.idseng.com/

-----Original Message-----
From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org]On Behalf Of george w. kennie
Sent: Monday, September 04, 2006 9:55 PM
To: NSRCA Mailing List
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Aero design question

For cryin' out loud, if your going to go to all that trouble, use two servos per panel at the opposing extremes of each flexible aileron driving in opposite directions. Now that's HELICAL !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!  What the  heck have you guys been smokin' ??????????????  And I thought I was extreme. Are we in the "Twilight Zone" here?  BGw?
G.

----- Original Message ----- 
From: Lance Van Nostrand 
To: NSRCA Mailing List 
Sent: Monday, September 04, 2006 9:05 PM
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Aero design question

Helical pitch ailerons!  Nat, this is brilliant.  Instead of making stiff ailerons, make them to flex.  glue the tip to the wing tip and drive the root end.  Ailerons would work just like a 74x6 propeller.

--Lance

----- Original Message ----- 
From: Nat Penton 
To: NSRCA Mailing List 
Sent: Sunday, September 03, 2006 9:31 PM
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Aero design question

Hey Tom
I'm not providing solutions - just putt'in more wood on the fire. In steady state roll the least drag position of the ailerons would be constant AOA root to tip. This would call for the percentage of chord to progress linearly so that it would be double at the tip vs the mid span position - no different than helical pitch. A ( severe ?) negative would occur, though, when the ailerons are initiated, potentially causing a tip stall.

Martin Simmons provides a curve showing Cl vs % of chord for the aileron. Going over 20% doesen't get you much for the dollar - just much more servo wear and tear ( especially with the 160 <G> ).

IMO it is not worth the extra work to stop the ailerons short of the tip.                            Nat

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