[NSRCA-discussion] Masters 2007 Figure "M" question -- now judgeing the M

[Glen Watson]

Understood subjectivity will always be part pattern...

Let's see a show of hands of those who would apply a downgrade to an M flown
technically correct according to the AMA judging criteria although the belly
was seen during 1 or both of the stall turns.

Glen

-----Original Message-----
From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
[mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Mark Atwood
Sent: Tuesday, October 17, 2006 2:19 PM
To: NSRCA Mailing List
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Masters 2007 Figure "M" question

I would disagree...it IS defined.  Figure M with 3/4 rolls.  Roll direction
is optional, stall direction is optional.  That's always been the case
unless it's specified otherwise.  There's no "implied" roll direction, just
one that some think looks better.  That will always be the case.

Some people do their four points in different directions so as to show the
canopy first, or last, which ever they feel presents better...Not sure I
personally care, but for those that do...go for it.   I know I'll catch
flack for say this, but this IS a subjective sport.  Presentation DOES
matter... Always will.  It's shouldn't outweigh the objective criteria, but
it's not worthless either.


On 10/17/06 3:11 PM, "jivey61 at bellsouth.net" <jivey61 at bellsouth.net> wrote:

> G
> Yes you agree ..but you also see we have to define it now or everybody
will
> be flying and judging it differently. What a mess that will be.
> 
> Jim Ivey
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "george w. kennie" <geobet at gis.net>
> To: "NSRCA Mailing List" <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
> Sent: Tuesday, October 17, 2006 1:50 PM
> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Masters 2007 Figure "M" question
> 
> 
>> 
>> Jim,
>> It certainly will work this way, but your original method will present
>> better. With the roll direction being pilots option your original
>> ll/rr-rr/ll is a much prettier maneuver. There's something to be said for
>> presenting the canopy to the judges on rolling maneuvers. I apply this
>> technique on all maneuvers with rolling elements unless the specified
>> requirement forces otherwise, like reverse K.E.'s.  IMHO, you had it
right
>> the first time!
>> G.
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> ----- Original Message -----
>> From: <jivey61 at bellsouth.net>
>> To: "NSRCA Mailing List" <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
>> Sent: Tuesday, October 17, 2006 1:17 PM
>> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Masters 2007 Figure "M" question
>> 
>> 
>>> Bob
>>> If I read the Aresti correct the rolls on both vertical lines are the
> same
>>> direction.This makes it lt-lt and lt-lt coming from the left and rt-rt
> and
>>> rt-rt coming from the right.Like Jerry  said look at top of plane one
> time
>>> and bottom of the plane next time.
>>> 
>>> Jim Ivey
>>> ----- Original Message -----
>>> From: "Bob Kane" <getterflash at yahoo.com>
>>> To: "NSRCA Mailing List" <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
>>> Sent: Tuesday, October 17, 2006 1:01 PM
>>> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Masters 2007 Figure "M" question
>>> 
>>> 
>>>> Wow, this is more complicated than I anticipated. Do you have to roll
> the
>>> same way for each stall turn?  Or can you reverse directions to show the
>>> canopy during each stall?
>>>> 
>>>> For example, flying left to right as shown on the aresti, pull 1/4
> loop,
>>> short line, roll 3/4 left (canopy toward flightline), short line, stall
>>> toward the right, short line, roll 3/4 left, short line, push 1/2
> outside
>>> loop, short line, roll 3/4 right (canopy faces flight line), short line,
>>> stall towerd the right, short line, 3/4 roll right, short line, pull 1/4
>>> loop.
>>>> 
>>>> Bob Kane
>>>> getterflash at yahoo.com
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> ----- Original Message ----
>>>> From: "jivey61 at bellsouth.net" <jivey61 at bellsouth.net>
>>>> To: NSRCA Mailing List <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
>>>> Sent: Tuesday, October 17, 2006 12:45:56 PM
>>>> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Masters 2007 Figure "M" question
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> Jerry
>>>> I looked again at the aresti and I think you are right.The aresti shows
>>>> both upline rolls in the same direction.That would let you see the top
>>>> one
>>>> time and bottom the other time.
>>>> My mistake Bob so much for crutches.
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> _______________________________________________
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>>>> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
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>>> 
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>> 
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