Pattern Box Rules (discussion)

[Dean Pappas]

Gee Mister, I come from the neolithic era!
Now I see your point! You know, I used to practice the '88 F3A patterns with the 17-1/2 lb, 1/3 scale, TOC Laser, and it was comfortable at 125 meters and 75 MPH. I ain't kidding. 
Of course, if the wind blew, it looked stupid with the horrendous wind correction, but if we legislated that distance, i'd have fun. No, I am not advocating such a change.
Regards,
 

Dean Pappas 
Sr. Design Engineer 
Kodeos Communications 
111 Corporate Blvd. 
South Plainfield, N.J. 07080 
(908) 222-7817 phone 
(908) 222-2392 fax 
d.pappas at kodeos.com 

-----Original Message-----
From: discussion-request at nsrca.org [mailto:discussion-request at nsrca.org]On Behalf Of J.Oddino
Sent: Thursday, March 03, 2005 11:38 PM
To: discussion at nsrca.org
Subject: Re: Pattern Box Rules (discussion)


When I said old days I meant old.  We didn't have no stickin' rocket ships.  Six pound airplanes, Lee Custom 60s, no tuned pipes, no retracts.  We didn't have enough time to fly too far away.  We were lucky to get 11000 rpm with a 11x7.  We could do outside loops under the limbo pole in the center of the runway though.  I'm talking old.
Jim

----- Original Message ----- 
From: J.Oddino <mailto:joddino at socal.rr.com>  
To: discussion at nsrca.org 
Sent: Thursday, March 03, 2005 8:56 AM
Subject: Re: Pattern Box Rules (discussion)

I think Gray has broken the code but doesn't know it.  The reason people fly too far out is so they can stay in the box.  In the old days we'd fly the maneuvers where the judges could see them.  We probably never flew more than 100 meters out or over 150 meters high.  There was a 60 degree "box" (really a triangle) but all maneuvers were center maneuvers and easy to judge as far as positioning.  Turnaround required that the maneuvers be moved out.  It was supposed to reduce the noise footprint but did the opposite. 
The box should be a box and the horizontal distance at 75 degrees ought to be the same as it is at 60.  I haven't gone through the numbers but I'll bet it is easier for all to see the plane at the edges of a rectangular box if it is flown in closer. The objective ought to be to keep the footprint small and to make it easier for the judges and pilots to see the airplane.  That's my take.
JimO
 

----- Original Message ----- 
From: Gray E  <mailto:gfowler at raytheon.com> Fowler 
To: discussion at nsrca.org 
Sent: Thursday, March 03, 2005 6:44 AM
Subject: RE: Pattern Box Rules (discussion)


My vote would be to up the penalty for flying too far out.  Hard to tell if it is 150 or 175, but 200 meters to me is a ZERO...outta the box. But I can only give a serious 2pt downgrade. It bothers me when people fly 200-225 meters out with a downgrade. Problem here of course is the FAI's are about the worse offenders -i.e. can't do a rolling circle within 175 meters-fly it right or get rid of it. Considering that us low class types follow their lead (butt sniffin' in reality) no wonder I see 250 meter patterns. 
The box dimensions are just fine. 

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