Suggestions for Sport Pattern 40 - 60 size plane

George Kennie geobet at gis.net
Wed Oct 20 08:42:08 AKDT 2004 

In my original Jav I had a 2-stroke, but ultimately changed it to an O.S. 70 4-Stroke. Due to the fact that the 70 doesn't have that
humongous muffler the weight differential is a non-issue.Somewhere in the 20 oz. area, the whole package comes in almost dead-on 6
pounds and will give you OOS vertical. As I mentioned before, it will snap on the upline and continue to the top of the line with full
rudder applied.
G.

Paul Horan wrote:

> George,
>     Your description of the Javalin has me interested and I think I may very well buy one.
>     My main problem is that I should have said a throw away plane rather than knock around.  The Twist definitely qualifies as as
> throw away, maybe too much so.  I expect I will tire of it quickly.  BUT it would be OK for fun flies.  Actually I would prefer
> something that locks on a little better but still in the throw away class of toy airplane.  Any ideas ?  Besides fun flies I would
> use it when I am too busy instructing or helping others to mess with a actual pattern plane, this way I don't totally forget what
> those sticks do.
>     My pattern plane now is a Meridian with a YS 91 AC.  It flies well but is too heavy, landing are warp 7 or better, if I do slow
> it down and there is a cross wind it gets nasty.  Speed it up a LITTLE with the cross wind and it is off the end of the runway.  It
> is a lead sled.  The weight is also a problem on the half square half roll in Intermediate.  The answer is not more power but
> another plane.  It was OK for Sportsman but will not cut it for Intermediate.
>     This thread stresses serious practice, I expect the Javalin II or Excelleron 90 would satisfy serious practice and also be
> satisfactory for contests, they may be better than the Meridian.
>     One question of the Javalin, many of todays planes are set up for a 4 cycle.  When a 2 cycle is mounted they become tail heavy.
> Did you have this type of problem ?
>
>  Thanks,
> Paul
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "George Kennie" <geobet at gis.net>
> To: <discussion at nsrca.org>
> Sent: Wednesday, October 20, 2004 10:42 AM
> Subject: Re: Suggestions for Sport Pattern 40 - 60 size plane
>
> > Paul,
> > I think what may possibly happen with that approach is that you may acquire the Twist and then say, "Hmmm, this is not doing
> > exactly
> > what I want, I think I'll try that Javelin afterall".  Save yourself the cost of buying something that initially sounds less
> > expensive,
> > but in the end will set you back 100 bucks. The popularity of the Twist was phenominal when first introduced, but the thrill is
> > now
> > wearing thin in my neck of the woods.I don't see anybody crashing a Twist and then going out and buying a replacement Twist, they
> > seem
> > to be speculating about the virtues of the Funtana or the XX-50 or whatever the current craze is at the local field. The quest for
> > that
> > elusive perfect sport offering is a never ending search. I'm not saying that the Javelin is the perfect plane either, but when I
> > crash
> > number 2, I can guarantee there will be a number 3. It's that good IMHO.
> > Oh, it doesn't require much down stick inverted and as I stated in one of my earlier posts, the C.G. markings are located right on
> > the
> > surface of the wing covering and are right on the money. Any airplane that I build, I draw out a scale planform of the wing and do
> > my
> > own calculations of where I want the C.G. to be. Never trust that the manufacturer has indicated the proper location. I built a
> > Saphir a
> > few years back and placed all of the components in the exact locations called out on the plans and when I checked the C.G. it came
> > out
> > exactly where the plan indicated it should be, however when I took it to the field to fly and tried to pull out of the first
> > humpty my
> > heart jumped to my throat as the pullout was inches from the ground. Needlessly to say I immediately landed and went home and drew
> > out
> > the wing and determined that the C.G. indicated on the plan was a full 2 inches ahead of where it should have been. Now if someone
> > was
> > to relate this experience to me I would have a hard time believing that any production unit could be that far off, but I moved all
> > the
> > servos back about 6 inches and the pack about 14 and the beast was tamed. I still have it BTW and it still flies nicely.
> > No reason why you couldn't bolt on the wing of the Jav and chuck it in the back of the van, just take it off periodically and
> > check that
> > all internals are holding up as prescribed.
> > I'd like to know how you finally decide on this and wish you the best in your decision and I promise not to say "I told you so".
> > Georgie
> >
> >
> > Paul Horan wrote:
> >
> >> George,
> >>     The Javalin II does sound interesting.
> >>     I checked on the RCU review and it shows a one piece wing - nice.  The construction looks pretty simple and straight forward.
> >> I
> >> am still considering getting a 3D as a knockaround, the H9 Twist sound good.  But, the Javalin II sounds good too.  I'm having
> >> trouble making up my mind.  In favor of the Twist is I can toss it in the back of the van with the wing on - no setup just fly.
> >> If
> >> it goes in - no heartache there.  It also works well for fun flys.
> >>     I am currently flying a Meridian and have just gotten booted up from Sportsman to Intermediate.  I expect to be a cellar
> >> dweller
> >> for quite a while BUT do not want a plane that has so many quirks that I learn bad habits while practicing Intermediate.  By bad
> >> habits I mean fighting a plane that does no groove (lock in on pitch and roll).  I've been there and done that - its not practice
> >> just massive frustration and learning bad habits.
> >>     Back to the Javalin, how durable is it ? How much push is necessary for inverted, this is usually a matter of preference
> >> depending on how far the CG is moved back.  What CG are you flying at ?  Any other info ?
> >> Thanks,
> >> Paul
> >> ----- Original Message -----
> >> From: "George Kennie" <geobet at gis.net>
> >> To: <discussion at nsrca.org>
> >> Sent: Tuesday, October 19, 2004 4:32 PM
> >> Subject: Re: Suggestions for Sport Pattern 40 - 60 size plane
> >>
> >> > There's no way that you would ever confuse the Javelin with a 3D airplane,
> >> > although you can get it to snap very nicely on low rates for things like the
> >> > avalanches and 45 downline snaps and FAI humpties thus eliminating the need for
> >> > switching. Nice package. Go to Cermark's site Ed. Tell 'em you want it for $ a
> >> > buck and a half and they'll probably go for it. That's what I paid back in the
> >> > spring. It's probably the quickest build out there and the results are as good
> >> > as or better than anything in the class.
> >> > A friend of mine, who is relatively new to pattern, bought one on my
> >> > recommendation and immediately stripped it because he was not thrilled with the
> >> > colors and recovered it in blue and yellow and I was convinced that he had
> >> > probably wrecked it, but he recently let me try it and it was immediate comfort
> >> > on his sticks. It flew every bit as nicely as mine( and I wrestled with the
> >> > thought that it might be even better).I'm a little frustrated with the fact that
> >> > I can't get guys to try this thing. Guys want to buy a knock-around beast that
> >> > they have to fight through every maneuver instead of something that flies with
> >> > the precision of a much larger bird and on top of that they end up paying just
> >> > as much or more.............Jeeeeesshh!
> >> > I feel like  "WHAT'S THE MATTER WITH THESE GUYS ?", .....If you get one and you
> >> > don't like it, take it to an auction and sell it for almost as much as you paid
> >> > for it! You ain't gonna do that with a 3D plane. Those auction people love
> >> > pattern planes.
> >> >  O.K., O.K. .......I'm done.
> >> > G.
> >> >
> >> > Wade Akle wrote:
> >> >
> >> >> I looked at the Javelin 2 at NESail.com . Is this the same one? it looks
> >> >> more like 3D rather than a pattern?
> >> >> Wade
> >> >>
> >> >> ----- Original Message -----
> >> >> From: "Paul Horan" <phoran at vvm.com>
> >> >> To: <discussion at nsrca.org>
> >> >> Sent: Monday, October 18, 2004 9:13 PM
> >> >> Subject: Re: Suggestions for Sport Pattern 40 - 60 size plane
> >> >>
> >> >> > Hi,
> >> >> >   Thanks for the info.
> >> >> >   So far the candidates for knock around sport pattern are:
> >> >> > * Venus,  possibly some QC problems but most have worked well and fly
> >> >> > well.
> >> >> > * Javalin II, sounds good but who carries it and how much.
> >> >> > * Excelleron 50 & 90, also sounds good but a bit on the expensive side for
> >> >> > a knock around.
> >> >> > * Swallow, Yes Chuck you kicked my butt with this.  I'm not sure it fits
> >> >> > as a sport knock around.
> >> >> > * Wideboby 40, I'm not sure about this.  Haven't seen one yet.  Does it
> >> >> > fit as a knock around plane.
> >> >> >
> >> >> >   What I am looking for is something that is
> >> >> > *relatively inexpensive (< 200),
> >> >> > *takes a 40 - 60 2 stroke,
> >> >> > *is pretty sturdy (or replacement parts are available),
> >> >> > *flys well enough that casual Intermediate pattern practice will not teach
> >> >> > me bad habits or cause me to spend most of my attention on fighting the
> >> >> > plane rather than working the manuevers.
> >> >> > * Is an easy to build arf - the easier the better.  This is a knock around
> >> >> > plane and
> >> >> > expendable.
> >> >> >
> >> >> >  Anyone have any coments on a 46 powered 3d plane that fits this
> >> >> > description ?
> >> >> >   The Venus sounds interesting.  The only downside is the pitch hunting
> >> >> > and it may
> >> >> > be  a bit more serious than a knock around plane.
> >> >> >
> >> >> > Thanks
> >> >> > Paul
> >> >> > KC5NF
> >> >> > AMA 57131
> >> >> > NSRCA 3606
> >> >> > =====================================
> >> >> > # To be removed from this list, go to http://www.nsrca.org/discussionA.htm
> >> >> > and follow the instructions.
> >> >> >
> >> >>
> >> >> =====================================
> >> >> # To be removed from this list, go to http://www.nsrca.org/discussionA.htm
> >> >> and follow the instructions.
> >> >
> >> >
> >> >
> >> >
> >> > =====================================
> >> > # To be removed from this list, go to http://www.nsrca.org/discussionA.htm
> >> > and follow the instructions.
> >> >
> >>
> >> =====================================
> >> # To be removed from this list, go to http://www.nsrca.org/discussionA.htm
> >> and follow the instructions.
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > =====================================
> > # To be removed from this list, go to http://www.nsrca.org/discussionA.htm
> > and follow the instructions.
> >
>
> =====================================
> # To be removed from this list, go to http://www.nsrca.org/discussionA.htm
> and follow the instructions.




=====================================
# To be removed from this list, go to http://www.nsrca.org/discussionA.htm
and follow the instructions.

More information about the NSRCA-discussion mailing list