Charging concerns/questions with NMP Lithium Ion batteries

[Ed Miller]

5 cell 1100mah NimH, they are 2/3AA cells. With a long ( 7" ) heavy duty Futaba lead and shrink wrap you are looking at 3.4 ounces. They are available in a flat pack or two over three hump shaped pack from Batteries of America/E.H.Yost Co. at http://www.batteriesamerica.com/
Ed M.

  ----- Original Message ----- 
  From: Chris Moon 
  To: discussion at nsrca.org 
  Sent: Friday, May 07, 2004 9:57 PM
  Subject: Re: Charging concerns/questions with NMP Lithium Ion batteries


  Ed: I am running a 1450 nimh 5 cell pack at 5oz.  I did some rough calculations from my practice flights and figure an average flight with 10min in the air plus start / taxi times the battery uses 200 mah per flight. I am using 2- 8411's  2-9411's and a 331 servo.  So the 1450mah is more than plenty and a 1050mah would work too and save a  little weight.
  Chris

  Ed Deaver wrote:

    OK, Ive had Duralite and subsequently Powerflites for about 5 years now.  Because of the fire hazard, everyone is recommending going back to reg batteries or NMhd(which my charges probably won't support)

    So for 3 digital, 1 4721 and a mini throttle servo, how many mah should I look at buying in old style batteries?  I would only go with 5 cell pack.

    Thanx

    ed

    Keith Black <tkeithb at comcast.net> wrote:
      Thanks for your reply Jim. 

      I do like design of the NMP charger and the way it shows how much current is being feed to the battery. This is clearly an excellent design feature. 

      What I gather from your response is it is "possible" for a cell to be charged beyond the safe limit if another cell is either out of balance or defective. Also, I understand your point that one may be able to spot a bad cell after becoming familiar with the charger. 

      As it relates to the cells being unbalanced, will lithium batteries equalized each other via a "trickle" as is the case with NiCad batteries?

      Jim, I really appreciate your always candid responses and willingness to assist others on the list.

      Thanks,
      Keith
        ----- Original Message ----- 
        From: JOddino 
        To: discussion at nsrca.org 
        Sent: Friday, May 07, 2004 10:30 AM
        Subject: Re: Charging concerns/questions with NMP Lithium Ion batteries


        Hi Kieth,
        I believe the NMP solves most of the problems we have all read about.  1) it is the right type of charger for Li-Ions and is dedicated to that chemistry by limiting the current and the voltage. 2) it is set for two-cell packs and that cannot be changed by the operator or on its own. 3) it limits the current to less than the 1C rate (for 2000 mAh packs).
        Probably its best feature vs. the other chargers is the meter that tells the operator what is going on.  After you use it a few times you will be able to predict the current at the beginning and during the charge cycle depending on how many flights you had.  If something is wrong, like a cell way out of wack, it will give you an indication.  Of course it tells you when the pack is charged and if for some reason it was taking too long you would figure it out.  In other words you will learn what is normal proper charge current vs. time and could spot an unbalanced pack.  It cannot assure you a cell will not be overcharged if the cells are not matched but I believe you would spot it.
        I've been using it for over a year and always charge the packs in the plane.  The total charge time is relatively short so you can monitor it, but I have left them plugged in over night.  
        I have only seen one pack (a Duralite which was in a plane I bought) with a slight unbalance.  It was a 2S2P configuration and I don't have much experience with that configuration.  I have never seen a simple 2 cells in series pack unbalanced.
        Where you really need to worry about this is in long strings like those used in electric flight.  I talked to Fred Marks (FMA) about bringing out each node so each cell could be checked and charged individually if required.  He said they plan to do that in the future.
        In the mean time, I believe one could stick a pin through the heat shrink to check the cell balance.  I'll try that today and get back to the list.
        Regards, Jim
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