Judge Training /Contest Scoring

[MargueriteVG at aol.com]

Hi Bill & all

 That does sound like a good idea Yes Dave made some very powerful and true 
statements. I like the fact that Dave mentions we should train our scribes 
more. I agree. 

 Our club meetings would be a good start.  Scribes are important and more 
work with them at our events also would avoid problems.

 As Dave suggested that we review the score sheet for a few minutes before 
taking our judges official seat. I have seen Dave do this and he is one of our 
very best judges in the area.
Flying weather is here so we can all practice flying  AND our field judging 
:-)  
Marguerite
In a message dated 4/17/2004 10:04:31 AM Eastern Standard Time, 
billglaze at triad.rr.com writes:
Dave came up with something here that really tweaked my conscience.  I do 
believe that I'm going to download some score sheets and use them at practice 
sessions.  I'm fortunate enough to live where some really good flyers practice 
FAI and Masters.  I could sit back while having a cold drink and actually get 
used to scoring them.  They wouldn't have to know it was going on, but, guess 
what?  I'll bet that, if they knew, they'd come over and ask how the flight 
looked, and probably want to see the scores for their own knowledge.  And, as a 
judge, I wouldn't be under the gun, as at a contest.  We'd all be more relaxed, 
and could work out the bugs.  Does it sound practical?  I'm giving it a try.  
It'll be a few weeks before I can manage it, (contests and things going on) 
but it seems as if it could be beneficial.  Has it been done before?  Comments?

Bill Glaze

Tony Stillman wrote:

Dave:

Well stated....  GOOD judging is something you have to work at!  I know from 
my work on the judging statistics that I am not as good as some 
others.....Time to put more effort into it!

Tony Stillman
Radio South
3702 N. Pace Blvd.
Pensacola, FL 32505
1-800-962-7802
www.radiosouthrc.com
----- Original Message ----- 
From: David Lockhart 
To: discussion at nsrca.org 
Sent: Friday, April 16, 2004 10:14 AM
Subject: Re: Judge Training /Contest Scoring


Whether flashcards, fingers, scoring paddles (with or without clothespins), 
verbal communication, writing on a piece of paper, or an electronic assistant 
are used - I think an issue that still remains is that no one will be 
proficient with a system they have not practiced with.  It is a very rare judge that is 
capable of communicating a score to a scribe or documenting a score by other 
means without missing a single second of the flight - especially with no 
practice to develop proficiency.  Just watch the judges at the next contest - no 
matter what system is being used.

Judging is a very complex task requiring -
- substantial knowledge of the basic elements of all maneuvers and the 
specific downgrades for some specific maneuvers and the application for that 
knowledge needs to be real time,
- documenting the score without missing any of the flight,
- knowing the schedule and the elements of the maneuvers being flown so that 
wrong maneuvers don't get scored (scored zero, actually) and maneuvers with 
elements missing are appropriately downgraded (including zero if needed).

For the first item, judging seminars help by forcing use to read the rules 
and study maneuvers and downgrades.  For the second item, I can't remember the 
last time I saw a seasoned judge or flier practice judging with a scribe 
(outside of warmup flights at NATS/TS) - same the times a seasoned pattern guy sits 
down with a pattern newbie to work them through the judging process.  For the 
third item, I spend a lot of time coaching/critiquing flights every year - I 
think it helps with judging as I usually know every schedule by heart by 
mid-season.  But none of these are the same as real practice judging or contest 
judging.

We all put in many practice flights to improve our flying every year.  And we 
spend substantial time flying in contests.  Only a fraction of the time we 
spend flying in contests do we spend judging (3 rounds average at each of maybe 
an average of 5 contests?) - and how many of us practice judging outside of a 
contest (including the scoring/documentation system)?    I've been regularly 
judging at contests for almost 20 years - and that experience helps, but in a 
given year, I might spend about 5-10% of my time on judging and the rest is 
flying (I do fly a lot).  I tend to think my flying would not look too good if I 
only burnt 10% of the fuel.

Regards,

Dave Lockhart
DaveL322 at comcast.net

----- Original Message ----- 
From: Patternrules at aol.com 
To: discussion at nsrca.org 
Sent: Friday, April 16, 2004 9:30 AM
Subject: Re: Judge Training /Contest Scoring


 Tony & Dean maybe your closer than you think, really if you think about it 
you only need a 2 button system as AMA uses 1/2 point increments say the right 
button every time you push it deducts 1/2 point the left button would be as an 
"enter" which would then go to the next maneuver, could even be programed to 
input the contestant # by the same method say push enter button 3 times for a 
new contestant, for FAI the program would detect that the pilot # is FAI and 
would use 1 point increments. 


Steve Maxwell
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