Not sure how this thread split, but here's what I wrote in the other thread:<div><br></div><div><span style>Aren't there already rules in place that allow for "balancing" a class that's kind of big? It feels to me like we're trying to do gymnastics around the FAI class (which, I think, should be treated as FAI: 4 P and 2 F rounds, but then, I'm just a Sportsman, what do I know :-) to solve a problem in the Masters class. The masters class is a destination in and of itself, by the very nature of things, it will grow over time as people continue to matriculate into it. The solution is already in the rulebook though -- you can run more than one flight line for masters, with 2 sets of judges, as long as everyone flies in front of a given pair of judges an equal number of times, the scoring for the class as a whole works fine. So it would go something like this:</span><div style>
<br></div><div style>Today, you might take 1 advanced and 1 FAI pilot (call them A and B) to judge a full round 1 of, say 16 masters pilots, then another advanced and FAI pilot (call them C and D) to judge a full round 2 of the same 16 masters pilots, etc.</div>
<div style><br></div><div style>Following the AMA rulebook, you could instead do this: </div><div style>1. Break the 16 masters pilots into two groups X and Y, 8 pilots each</div><div style>2. In round 1 A+B judge group X, and C+D judge group Y</div>
<div style>3. In round 2 A+B judge group Y, and C+D judge group X</div><div style><br></div><div style>Similarly for rounds 3+4 (judges E-H) , 5+6 (judges I-L).</div><div style><br></div><div style>Same amount of overall time in the judges chair for A,B,C+D, etc. but instead of having completed only 1 round of judging, they've completed 2, and broke the chair time with a flight of their own in advanced + FAI rounds.</div>
<div style><br></div><div style>Rounds would complete somewhat faster, in theory, but at some point the flightline is consumed entirely by masters pilots, or you run sportsman + masters group X on left + right stations and then intermediate and masters group Y on left+right stations, then advanced + FAI on left + right stations. But you never have one line idle for an extended period while the other is still pumping masters pilots through a round</div>
<div style><br></div><div style>Peter+</div><br><div class="gmail_quote">On Tue, Jan 3, 2012 at 8:15 PM, Matthew Kimbro <span dir="ltr"><<a href="mailto:kimbrof3a@gmail.com">kimbrof3a@gmail.com</a>></span> wrote:<br>
<blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex"><div>Hey Guys,</div><div> </div><div>I agree with Tony. Not flying "F" will only hurt the contests. Everyone in FAI wants to fly "F" and everyone else wants to see it flown. The only thing I would like to see is 3 of 4 "P" counted and 1 of 2 "F" counted and each contest. </div>
<div> </div><div>Instead of changing FAI, we need to figure out a way to fix the Master class. </div><div> </div><div>Matt Kimbro<br><br></div><div class="HOEnZb"><div class="h5"><div class="gmail_quote">On Tue, Jan 3, 2012 at 5:48 PM, Anthony Frackowiak <span dir="ltr"><<a href="mailto:frackowiak@sbcglobal.net" target="_blank">frackowiak@sbcglobal.net</a>></span> wrote:<br>
<blockquote style="margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;padding-left:1ex;border-left-color:rgb(204,204,204);border-left-width:1px;border-left-style:solid" class="gmail_quote">Hi,<br>
<br>
I have felt before and I still feel that F3A Pilots should be prepared to fly both. If not, fly Masters. As a CD I am totally against creating classes in this District that are not also National. So I am completely against this idea of a "silver" and "gold' F3A classes. There are other ways to handle the overload of Masters if that is indeed what happens. I also feel that our District Championships in F3A should include Unknown rounds. How in the world does an F3A pilot prepare to fly Unknowns with no competitions including them?<br>
<br>
As to the drop off in F3A pilots, I went back and looked at who was flying in 2009, 2010 and 2011. I think that the drop in F3A competitors are for a lot of other reasons then just having to fly both patterns.<br>
<br>
I agree with much of what Chris said. The real problem is not F3A or Masters. It's Sportsman and Intermediate. If pattern and hence the NSRCA does not start to try to do something to increase the interest in flying pattern, it really doesn't matter. We are a dying event. Making Advanced and Masters more difficult is also not a solution. I'm starting to help Jean Greear work on Intermediate. That in itself is a huge jump from Sportsman. What will making Advanced more difficult do to someone in Intermediate?<br>
<br>
The problem that I see in a very big way lately is that the powers to be who are controlling the event, and by that I mean the NSRCA and the Contest Board, are set in their ways and are apparently happy with the status quo. Any significant change that could really help participation in pattern gets shot down very quickly. Until this changes we need to just be ready for more of the same.<br>
<br>
BTW, I have been flying P-13 and starting to work on F-13. P-13 is a much better pattern then P-11 but it is definitely more difficult then the current Masters pattern. F-13 is crazy hard. It will take a big commitment to fly F-13 well. But if a current F3A pilot or someone thinking of flying F3A can't handle it, then work to get that event changed or fly an AMA class.<br>
<br>
Tony Frackowiak<div><div></div><div><br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
______________________________<u></u>_________________<br>
NSRCA-dist7 mailing list<br>
<a href="mailto:NSRCA-dist7@lists.nsrca.org" target="_blank">NSRCA-dist7@lists.nsrca.org</a><br>
<a href="http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-dist7" target="_blank">http://lists.nsrca.org/<u></u>mailman/listinfo/nsrca-dist7</a><br>
</div></div></blockquote></div><br>
</div></div><br>_______________________________________________<br>
NSRCA-dist7 mailing list<br>
<a href="mailto:NSRCA-dist7@lists.nsrca.org">NSRCA-dist7@lists.nsrca.org</a><br>
<a href="http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-dist7" target="_blank">http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-dist7</a><br>
<br></blockquote></div><br><br clear="all"><div><br></div>-- <br><div>Director, Fixed Wing Flight Training</div><div>Santa Clara County Model Aircraft Skypark</div><img src="http://farm8.staticflickr.com/7163/6513778381_63322ac09c.jpg"><br>
<br>
</div>