<html><head></head><body style="word-wrap: break-word; -webkit-nbsp-mode: space; -webkit-line-break: after-white-space; ">But a local contest CD can do whatever they want if announced ahead.<div><br></div><div>Tony Frackowiak</div><div><br><div><div>On Jul 18, 2017, at 10:51 AM, DaveL322 via NSRCA-discussion wrote:</div><br class="Apple-interchange-newline"><blockquote type="cite"><meta http-equiv="Content-Type" content="text/html; charset=UTF-8"><div><div>By the book.... F should never be flown at a local contest. </div><div><br></div><div id="composer_signature"><meta http-equiv="Content-Type" content="text/html; charset=UTF-8"><div style="font-size:85%;color:#575757">Regards,</div><div style="font-size:85%;color:#575757"><br></div><div style="font-size:85%;color:#575757">Dave</div><div style="font-size:85%;color:#575757"><br></div><div style="font-size:85%;color:#575757">Sent from my Sprint Samsung Galaxy Note5.</div></div><div><br></div><div style="font-size:100%;color:#000000"><!-- originalMessage --><div>-------- Original message --------</div><div>From: Vicente Bortone via NSRCA-discussion <<a href="mailto:nsrca-discussion@lists.nsrca.org">nsrca-discussion@lists.nsrca.org</a>> </div><div>Date: 7/18/17 1:48 PM (GMT-05:00) </div><div>To: General pattern discussion <<a href="mailto:nsrca-discussion@lists.nsrca.org">nsrca-discussion@lists.nsrca.org</a>>, Scott McHarg <<a href="mailto:scmcharg@gmail.com">scmcharg@gmail.com</a>>, Verne Koester <<a href="mailto:verne@mi.rr.com">verne@mi.rr.com</a>> </div><div>Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] New sequences </div><div><br></div></div><div><div dir="auto">Scott,</div><div dir="auto"><br></div><div dir="auto">There has been more than one solution for that. We all know those. In any case, per FAI rules F cannot been flown in a two day contest. I could be wrong on this conclusion. We need to check the rule book. I remember reading this few years back. There was already a similar comment on this. However, this is easy one to take care.</div><div dir="auto"><br></div><div dir="auto"><br></div><br><div class="gmail_quote"><div>On Tue, Jul 18, 2017 at 12:32 PM Scott McHarg <<a href="mailto:scmcharg@gmail.com">scmcharg@gmail.com</a>> wrote:<br></div><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex"><div dir="auto">Because even at local contest, FAI flies both P and F.</div><div class="gmail_extra"><br><div class="gmail_quote">On Jul 18, 2017 11:33 AM, "Verne Koester via NSRCA-discussion" <<a href="mailto:nsrca-discussion@lists.nsrca.org" target="_blank">nsrca-discussion@lists.nsrca.org</a>> wrote:<br type="attribution"><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex"><div dir="auto"><div>And the masters pilots aren't simply </div><div id="m_7842949002626647042m_-4706593933946862062AppleMailSignature">flying fai now because?</div><div id="m_7842949002626647042m_-4706593933946862062AppleMailSignature"><br></div><div id="m_7842949002626647042m_-4706593933946862062AppleMailSignature">Verne Koester<br><br>Sent from my iPhone</div><div><br>On Jul 18, 2017, at 11:44 AM, Vicente Bortone <<a href="mailto:vincebrc@gmail.com" target="_blank">vincebrc@gmail.com</a>> wrote:<br><br></div><blockquote type="cite"><div><div><div><div><div dir="auto">Hi Verne,</div><div dir="auto"><br></div><div dir="auto">I am sure that all Masters pilots that usually come to my contest still will come. They just love this stuff too much. We already discussed. I am also sure more FAI pilots will attend if they see more participation in their class. Yes, I have been collecting a lot of FAI trophies. We will be able to flip flop more easily between Masters and FAI. Then judging becomes easier and a lot more precise since we will be judging similar schedule. In any event, when I see the proposed new Master schedule many of those manuevers were already in old FAI-P so it is not really a big deal. I understand that we want to revise it and change the elements that do not meet the Masters (sometimes we will need to make it more stringent) requirements and fix the flow is required. Furthermore, will make the life of the committe in charge a lot easier. </div><div dir="auto"><br></div><div>Best,</div><div><br></div><div><br></div></div></div><div><div><br><div class="gmail_quote"><div>On Tue, Jul 18, 2017 at 8:38 AM Verne Koester <<a href="mailto:verne@mi.rr.com" target="_blank">verne@mi.rr.com</a>> wrote:<br></div><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;padding-left:1ex;border-left-color:rgb(204,204,204);border-left-width:1px;border-left-style:solid"><div dir="auto"><div>Or perhaps then you won't have any masters pilots at your contests either. </div><div id="m_7842949002626647042m_-4706593933946862062m_-3530512760164894077m_-7459565144064560234m_7364395659320556305AppleMailSignature"><br></div><div id="m_7842949002626647042m_-4706593933946862062m_-3530512760164894077m_-7459565144064560234m_7364395659320556305AppleMailSignature">Verne Koester <br><br>Sent from my iPhone</div></div><div dir="auto"><div><br>On Jul 18, 2017, at 8:39 AM, Vicente Bortone via NSRCA-discussion <<a href="mailto:nsrca-discussion@lists.nsrca.org" target="_blank">nsrca-discussion@lists.nsrca.org</a>> wrote:<br><br></div><blockquote type="cite"><div><div><div><div style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; "><font color="#000000" face="Calibri" size="3">Her my humble opinion:</font></div><p style="margin:0px"><font color="#000000" face="Calibri" size="3"> </font></p><div style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; "><font color="#000000" face="Calibri" size="3">I think the best solution is to adopt the FAI-P modified to
meet Master requirements.<span style="margin:0px"> </span>Here the
reasons:</font></div><p style="margin:0px"><font color="#000000" face="Calibri" size="3"> </font></p><div style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 48px; "><font color="#000000"><span style="margin:0px"><span style="margin:0px"><font face="Calibri" size="3">1.</font><span style="font:7pt/normal "Times New Roman";margin:0px;font-size-adjust:none;font-stretch:normal">
</span></span></span><font face="Calibri" size="3">We are overloading the lower classes judging
Masters in local contest.<span style="margin:0px"> </span>As time pass
we have seen less FAI pilots in local contest.<span style="margin:0px">
</span>Clearly the norm is to have 46-8 Masters, 0-2 FAI, 0-3 Advanced, 0-3 Intermediate
and 0-3 Sportsman.<span style="margin:0px"> </span>This is a reality
that has been happening in the last few years.<span style="margin:0px">
</span>There are some cases different but this has become normal.</font></font></div><div style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 48px; "><font color="#000000"><span style="margin:0px"><span style="margin:0px"><font face="Calibri" size="3">2.</font><span style="font:7pt/normal "Times New Roman";margin:0px;font-size-adjust:none;font-stretch:normal">
</span></span></span><font face="Calibri" size="3">Is we used modified P in Masters the Masters
pilots will be more willing to fly FAI and slit the class.<span style="margin:0px"> </span>This will make the contest more balanced and
avoid overloading the lower classes pilots.</font></font></div><div style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 48px; "><font color="#000000"><span style="margin:0px"><span style="margin:0px"><font face="Calibri" size="3">3.</font><span style="font:7pt/normal "Times New Roman";margin:0px;font-size-adjust:none;font-stretch:normal">
</span></span></span><font face="Calibri"><font size="3">This will help Master pilots to try FAI and
try to practice F.<span style="margin:0px"> </span>Top FAI pilots will be more willing
to go to local contest since they will have more competition.<span style="margin:0px"> </span></font></font></font></div><div style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 48px; "><font color="#000000"><span style="margin:0px"><span style="margin:0px"><font face="Calibri" size="3">4.</font><span style="font:7pt/normal "Times New Roman";margin:0px;font-size-adjust:none;font-stretch:normal">
</span></span></span><font face="Calibri"><font size="3">In my contest one traditional FAI pilot call me
to ask me how many pilots were flying FAI.<span style="margin:0px">
</span>I told him you will be the only one.<span style="margin:0px">
</span>He turned around and went home.<span style="margin:0px">
</span>This is a reality that we need to take into account.<span style="margin:0px"> </span>It is happening.<span style="margin:0px"> </span></font></font></font></div><div style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 48px; "><font color="#000000"><span style="margin:0px"><span style="margin:0px"><font face="Calibri" size="3">5.</font><span style="font:7pt/normal "Times New Roman";margin:0px;font-size-adjust:none;font-stretch:normal">
</span></span></span><font face="Calibri" size="3">If I were and Advanced or Intermediate pilot and
I go to a contest to judge 4-5 times a bunch of Masters pilots I will try to do
something else in my weekend.</font></font></div><p style="margin:0px 0px 0px 48px"><font color="#000000" face="Calibri" size="3"> </font></p><p style="margin:0px"><font color="#000000" face="Calibri" size="3"> </font></p><div style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; "><font face="Calibri"><font size="3"><font color="#000000">I know that there are other reasons but I need to go back to
work.<span style="margin:0px"> </span></font></font></font></div><p style="margin:0px"><font color="#000000" face="Calibri" size="3"> </font></p><div style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; "><font color="#000000" face="Calibri" size="3">Best,</font></div><p style="margin:0px 0px 0px 24px"><font color="#000000" face="Calibri" size="3"> </font></p>
</div></div><div class="gmail_extra"><br clear="all"><div><div class="m_7842949002626647042m_-4706593933946862062m_-3530512760164894077m_-7459565144064560234m_7364395659320556305gmail_signature" data-smartmail="gmail_signature">Vicente "Vince" Bortone</div></div>
<br><div class="gmail_quote">On Mon, Jul 17, 2017 at 7:59 PM, Curt Oberg via NSRCA-discussion <span><<a href="mailto:nsrca-discussion@lists.nsrca.org" target="_blank">nsrca-discussion@lists.nsrca.org</a>></span> wrote:<br><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;padding-left:1ex;border-left-color:rgb(204,204,204);border-left-width:1px;border-left-style:solid">
<u></u>
<u></u>
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<div lang="EN-US" link="blue" vlink="blue">
<div class="m_7842949002626647042m_-4706593933946862062m_-3530512760164894077m_-7459565144064560234m_7364395659320556305m_8709598208801673494Section1"><p class="MsoNormal"><font face="Comic Sans MS" size="3"><span style="font-family:"Comic Sans MS";font-size:12pt">60 aged? YGTBKM. My son is almost that
old.<u></u><u></u></span></font></p><p class="MsoNormal"><font face="Comic Sans MS" size="3"><span style="font-family:"Comic Sans MS";font-size:12pt">Curt<u></u><u></u></span></font></p><p class="MsoNormal"><font face="Comic Sans MS" size="3"><span style="font-family:"Comic Sans MS";font-size:12pt"><u></u> <u></u></span></font></p>
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</span></font></div><p class="MsoNormal"><b><font face="Tahoma" size="2"><span style="font-family:Tahoma;font-size:10pt;font-weight:bold">From:</span></font></b><font face="Tahoma" size="2"><span style="font-family:Tahoma;font-size:10pt"> NSRCA-discussion
[mailto:<u></u><a href="mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces@lists.nsrca.org" target="_blank">nsrca-discussion-bounces@lists.nsrca.org</a><u></u>]
<b><span style="font-weight:bold">On Behalf Of </span></b>Joe Lachowski via
NSRCA-discussion<br>
<b><span style="font-weight:bold">Sent:</span></b> Monday, July 17, 2017 4:07
PM<br>
<b><span style="font-weight:bold">To:</span></b> Derek Koopowitz; <u></u>General pattern discussion<u></u><br>
<b><span style="font-weight:bold">Subject:</span></b> Re: [NSRCA-discussion]
New sequences</span></font><u></u><u></u></p>
</div><p class="MsoNormal"><font face="Times New Roman" size="3"><span style="font-size:12pt"><u></u> <u></u></span></font></p>
<div id="m_7842949002626647042m_-4706593933946862062m_-3530512760164894077m_-7459565144064560234m_7364395659320556305m_8709598208801673494divtagdefaultwrapper"><span><p><font color="black" face="Calibri" size="3"><span style="color:black;font-family:Calibri;font-size:12pt">To that I have to respond. A vast majority of
Masters pilots are in the same category if you think 59 going on 60 is aged.
LOL.<u></u><u></u></span></font></p><p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-bottom:12pt"><font color="black" face="Calibri" size="3"><span style="color:black;font-family:Calibri;font-size:12pt"><u></u> <u></u></span></font></p>
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<hr width="98%" size="3" align="center" style="display:inline-block">
</span></font></div>
<div id="m_7842949002626647042m_-4706593933946862062m_-3530512760164894077m_-7459565144064560234m_7364395659320556305m_8709598208801673494divRplyFwdMsg"><p class="MsoNormal"><b><font color="black" face="Calibri" size="2"><span style="color:black;font-family:Calibri;font-size:11pt;font-weight:bold">From:</span></font></b><font color="black" face="Calibri" size="2"><span style="color:black;font-family:Calibri;font-size:11pt"> Derek Koopowitz <<a href="mailto:derekkoopowitz@gmail.com" target="_blank">derekkoopowitz@gmail.com</a>><span><br>
<b><span style="font-weight:bold">Sent:</span></b> Monday, July 17, 2017 1:59
PM<br>
</span><b><span style="font-weight:bold">To:</span></b> Joe Lachowski; <u></u>General pattern discussion<u></u><br>
<b><span style="font-weight:bold">Subject:</span></b> Re: [NSRCA-discussion]
New sequences</span></font><font color="black" face="Calibri"><span style="color:black;font-family:Calibri"> <u></u><u></u></span></font></p>
<div><p class="MsoNormal"><font color="black" face="Calibri" size="3"><span style="color:black;font-family:Calibri;font-size:12pt"> <u></u><u></u></span></font></p>
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<div><p class="MsoNormal"><font color="black" face="Calibri" size="3"><span style="color:black;font-family:Calibri;font-size:12pt">Age!!!<u></u><u></u></span></font></p>
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<br>
Sent from my iPhone<u></u><u></u></span></font></p>
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<div><p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-bottom:12pt"><font color="black" face="Calibri" size="3"><span style="color:black;font-family:Calibri;font-size:12pt"><br></span></font></p><font color="black" face="Calibri" size="3">
On Jul 17, 2017, at 1:42 PM, Joe Lachowski via NSRCA-discussion <<a href="mailto:nsrca-discussion@lists.nsrca.org" target="_blank">nsrca-discussion@lists.nsrca.org</a>>
wrote:<u></u><u></u></font><div><br class="webkit-block-placeholder"></div>
</div>
<blockquote style="margin-top:5pt;margin-bottom:5pt" type="cite">
<div>
<div id="m_7842949002626647042m_-4706593933946862062m_-3530512760164894077m_-7459565144064560234m_7364395659320556305m_8709598208801673494divtagdefaultwrapper"><p><font color="black" face="Calibri" size="3"><span style="color:black;font-family:Calibri;font-size:12pt">There are two more things we need to seriously
consider with these sequences. Judgeability of course and something no one ever
talks about, ability to memorize a sequence and retain it. Not all of us have a
caller readily available when practicing. The current sequence bit me twice so
far this contest season. I actually started to swap two maneuvers
out of sequence even with a caller. Took my 0's and throw away round. I now
make sure my caller reinforces that part of the sequence when calling for me.
In all my years of flying pattern this has never ever happened to me
before. My memory isn't bad. I usually have a new sequence or previous
seasons sequence down in less than two practice sessions at the
beginning of every season.<u></u><u></u></span></font></p><p class="MsoNormal"><font color="black" face="Calibri" size="3"><span style="color:black;font-family:Calibri;font-size:12pt"><u></u> <u></u></span></font></p>
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</span></font></div>
<div id="m_7842949002626647042m_-4706593933946862062m_-3530512760164894077m_-7459565144064560234m_7364395659320556305m_8709598208801673494divRplyFwdMsg"><p class="MsoNormal"><b><font color="black" face="Calibri" size="2"><span style="color:black;font-family:Calibri;font-size:11pt;font-weight:bold">From:</span></font></b><font color="black" face="Calibri" size="2"><span style="color:black;font-family:Calibri;font-size:11pt"> <u></u>Atwood, Mark<u></u> <<a href="mailto:atwoodm@paragon-inc.com" target="_blank">atwoodm@paragon-inc.com</a>><br>
<b><span style="font-weight:bold">Sent:</span></b> Monday, July 17, 2017 11:43
AM<br>
<b><span style="font-weight:bold">To:</span></b> Joe Lachowski<br>
<b><span style="font-weight:bold">Cc:</span></b> <u></u>General
pattern discussion<u></u><br>
<b><span style="font-weight:bold">Subject:</span></b> Re: New sequences</span></font><font color="black" face="Calibri"><span style="color:black;font-family:Calibri"> <u></u><u></u></span></font></p>
<div><p class="MsoNormal"><font color="black" face="Calibri" size="3"><span style="color:black;font-family:Calibri;font-size:12pt"> <u></u><u></u></span></font></p>
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<div><p class="MsoNormal"><font color="black" face="Calibri" size="3"><span style="color:black;font-family:Calibri;font-size:12pt">In reply I’ll admit I
did not evaluate it against any guideline criteria. I only flew it for
“feel” and admittedly, I’m somewhat proud to say I’ve flown enough F and
Unknown sequences now that it didn’t seem very unusual. So your critique
there is likely valid. Given that all the maneuvers were flyable with
little more than calling the primary maneuver name along with the individual
elements, real time, I’m hard pressed to call them “fabricated garbage”, as I
think that needlessly insults the people that worked hard, with good intent, to
put these together. <u></u><u></u></span></font></p>
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<div><p class="MsoNormal"><font color="black" face="Calibri" size="3"><span style="color:black;font-family:Calibri;font-size:12pt">I do fly a fairly low
drag, power efficient setup, so that point is valid.<u></u><u></u></span></font></p>
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<div><p class="MsoNormal"><font color="black" face="Calibri" size="3"><span style="color:black;font-family:Calibri;font-size:12pt">I will also agree that
our constant evolution and increasing difficulty of sequences has generally
stagnated class advancement. When I was moving up, the classes never
changed. So once you were proficient in a class, the only new challenge
was to move up. Now, with new classes every 2 years, even if the
difficulty is the same, you can stay put and still feel challenged learning
something new.<u></u><u></u></span></font></p>
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<div><p class="MsoNormal"><font color="black" face="Calibri" size="3"><span style="color:black;font-family:Calibri;font-size:12pt"><u></u> <u></u></span></font></p>
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<div><p class="MsoNormal"><font color="black" face="Calibri" size="3"><span style="color:black;font-family:Calibri;font-size:12pt">-M<u></u><u></u></span></font></p>
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<div style="word-spacing:0px;font-size-adjust:none;font-stretch:normal"><p class="MsoNormal"><b><font color="#65646a" face="Arial" size="2"><span style="color:rgb(101,100,106);font-family:Arial;font-size:11pt;font-weight:bold">MARK </span></font></b><b><font color="#80bd01" face="Arial" size="2"><span style="color:rgb(128,189,1);font-family:Arial;font-size:11pt;font-weight:bold">ATWOOD</span></font></b><font color="black" face="Calibri" size="2"><span style="color:black;font-family:Calibri;font-size:11pt"><u></u><u></u></span></font></p>
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<div><p class="MsoNormal"><font color="#65646a" face="Arial" size="2"><span style="color:rgb(101,100,106);font-family:Arial;font-size:10pt">o. (440)
229-2502</span></font><font color="black" face="Calibri" size="2"><span style="color:black;font-family:Calibri;font-size:11pt"><u></u><u></u></span></font></p>
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<div><p class="MsoNormal"><font color="#65646a" face="Arial" size="2"><span style="color:rgb(101,100,106);font-family:Arial;font-size:10pt">c. <a href="tel:(216)%20316-2489" value="+12163162489" target="_blank">(216) 316-2489</a></span></font><font color="black" face="Calibri" size="2"><span style="color:black;font-family:Calibri;font-size:11pt"><u></u><u></u></span></font></p>
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<div><p class="MsoNormal"><font color="#65646a" face="Arial" size="2"><span style="color:rgb(101,100,106);font-family:Arial;font-size:10pt">e. </span></font><font color="black" face="Calibri" size="2"><span style="color:black;font-family:Calibri;font-size:11pt"><a href="mailto:atwoodm@paragon-inc.com" target="_blank"><font color="#65646a" face="Arial" size="2"><span style="color:rgb(101,100,106);font-family:Arial;font-size:10pt">atwoodm@paragon-inc.com</span></font></a><u></u><u></u></span></font></p>
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<div><p class="MsoNormal"><b><font color="#65646a" face="Arial" size="2"><span style="color:rgb(101,100,106);font-family:Arial;font-size:10pt;font-weight:bold">Paragon
Consulting, Inc.</span></font></b><font color="black" face="Calibri" size="2"><span style="color:black;font-family:Calibri;font-size:11pt"><u></u><u></u></span></font></p>
</div>
<div><p class="MsoNormal"><u></u><u></u><font color="#65646a" face="Arial" size="2"><span style="color:rgb(101,100,106);font-family:Arial;font-size:10pt">5900 Landerbrook Drive, Suite 205</span></font><u></u><font color="#65646a" face="Arial" size="2"><span style="color:rgb(101,100,106);font-family:Arial;font-size:10pt">, <u></u>Cleveland<u></u> <u></u>Ohio<u></u>, <u></u>44124<u></u></span></font><u></u><font color="black" face="Calibri" size="2"><span style="color:black;font-family:Calibri;font-size:11pt"><u></u><u></u></span></font></p>
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<div><p class="MsoNormal"><font color="#65646a" face="Arial" size="2"><span style="color:rgb(101,100,106);font-family:Arial;font-size:10pt"><a href="http://www.paragon-inc.com/" target="_blank"><font color="purple"><span style="color:purple">www.paragon-inc.com</span></font></a></span></font><font color="black" face="Calibri" size="2"><span style="color:black;font-family:Calibri;font-size:11pt"><u></u><u></u></span></font></p>
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<div><p class="MsoNormal"><font color="black" face="Calibri" size="2"><span style="color:black;font-family:Calibri;font-size:11pt"><a href="http://www.paragon-inc.com/" target="_blank"></a><u></u><u></u></span></font></p>
</div>
<div><p class="MsoNormal"><b><font color="#65646a" face="Arial" size="1"><span style="color:rgb(101,100,106);font-family:Arial;font-size:8pt;font-weight:bold">Powering
The Digital Experience</span></font></b><font color="black" face="Calibri" size="2"><span style="color:black;font-family:Calibri;font-size:11pt"><u></u><u></u></span></font></p>
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</span></span></div><p class="MsoNormal"><font color="black" face="Calibri" size="3"><span style="color:black;font-family:Calibri;font-size:12pt"><u></u> <u></u></span></font></p>
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<div><p class="MsoNormal"><font color="black" face="Calibri" size="3"><span style="color:black;font-family:Calibri;font-size:12pt">On Jul 17, 2017, at
2:30 PM, Joe Lachowski <<a href="mailto:jlachow@hotmail.com" target="_blank">jlachow@hotmail.com</a>>
wrote:<u></u><u></u></span></font></p>
</div><p class="MsoNormal"><font color="black" face="Calibri" size="3"><span style="color:black;font-family:Calibri;font-size:12pt"><u></u> <u></u></span></font></p>
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<div id="m_7842949002626647042m_-4706593933946862062m_-3530512760164894077m_-7459565144064560234m_7364395659320556305m_8709598208801673494divtagdefaultwrapper" style="word-spacing:0px">
<div><p class="MsoNormal"><font color="black" face="Calibri" size="3"><span style="color:black;font-family:Calibri;font-size:12pt">There are still too
many new maneuvers introduced to the eligible maneuvers list. Only a couple
should be introduced each rules cycle if necessary. That was part of the intent
of the guide. <u></u>Battery<u></u> consumption is too high
with the low drag plane and motor combination that you use Mark in comparison
to others. I'm assuming this is the sequence that is on the NSRCA site.<u></u><u></u></span></font></p>
</div>
<div><p class="MsoNormal"><font color="black" face="Calibri" size="3"><span style="color:black;font-family:Calibri;font-size:12pt"><u></u> <u></u></span></font></p>
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<div><p class="MsoNormal"><font color="black" face="Calibri" size="3"><span style="color:black;font-family:Calibri;font-size:12pt">A few of the maneuvers
are just fabricated garbage. When the guide was put together it was done to
keep getting carried away with this stuff and adding a boat load of
"Oh, this would be cool to do" type maneuvers which have already
infiltrated FAI. There is a lot of stupidity designed into the sequence. <u></u><u></u></span></font></p>
</div>
<div><p class="MsoNormal"><font color="black" face="Calibri" size="3"><span style="color:black;font-family:Calibri;font-size:12pt"><u></u> <u></u></span></font></p>
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<div><p class="MsoNormal"><font color="black" face="Calibri" size="3"><span style="color:black;font-family:Calibri;font-size:12pt">A fellow Masters pilot
tried to fly some of this this weekend and concluded it was a bunch of
crap, ripped it up and threw it into the garbage.<u></u><u></u></span></font></p>
</div>
<div><p class="MsoNormal"><font color="black" face="Calibri" size="3"><span style="color:black;font-family:Calibri;font-size:12pt"><br>
I had an Advanced pilot fly the new sequence for Advanced this weekend also.
The Cobra with snap may be an issue.<u></u><u></u></span></font></p>
</div>
<div><p class="MsoNormal"><font color="black" face="Calibri" size="3"><span style="color:black;font-family:Calibri;font-size:12pt"><u></u> <u></u></span></font></p>
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<div><p class="MsoNormal"><font color="black" face="Calibri" size="3"><span style="color:black;font-family:Calibri;font-size:12pt">There are also a lot
of 3/4 rolls in the sequence that an Advanced pilot will have to figure out
which way to roll. This may be an information overload requirement that might
be overcome by a lot more practice than typically required. You only have some
much time available to practice. The designers did not do a thorough analysis
of the roll elements.<u></u><u></u></span></font></p>
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<div><p class="MsoNormal"><font color="black" face="Calibri" size="3"><span style="color:black;font-family:Calibri;font-size:12pt"><u></u> <u></u></span></font></p>
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<div><p class="MsoNormal"><font color="black" face="Calibri" size="3"><span style="color:black;font-family:Calibri;font-size:12pt">I firmly believe we
need to dumb down on Masters. The current one is already difficult and
requires more practice time than I would care to put into flying pattern.
The fun is starting to dissipate for this flyer and I'm retired.<u></u><u></u></span></font></p>
</div>
<div><p class="MsoNormal"><font color="black" face="Calibri" size="3"><span style="color:black;font-family:Calibri;font-size:12pt"><u></u> <u></u></span></font></p>
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<div><p class="MsoNormal"><font color="black" face="Calibri" size="3"><span style="color:black;font-family:Calibri;font-size:12pt">Not everyone can get
out several evenings during the week and the weekend to practice. I'm thinking
of the 95% not the top 5% and I'm a middle of the road Masters pilot. I have
also seen decline in Masters attendance on the local level. Based on what I see
so far, I will either pack it in or reluctantly drop to Advanced which has
crept ever closer towards being a Masters sequence. This is the first time
I have seen so much controversy over one sequence. Start fresh. There is
still time to form a new committee hopefully with some people who
previously served and get this thing right. There is still plenty of time to
get it right by December 31st. Heck I could do it all on my own and come up
with something more sane that what has been proposed or thrown out in this
discussion list!<span class="m_7842949002626647042m_-4706593933946862062m_-3530512760164894077m_-7459565144064560234m_7364395659320556305m_8709598208801673494apple-converted-space"> </span><u></u><u></u></span></font></p>
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<div align="center" class="MsoNormal" style="text-align:center"><font color="black" face="Calibri" size="3"><span style="color:black;font-family:Calibri;font-size:12pt">
<hr width="1330" size="3" align="center" style="width:797.9pt;display:inline-block">
</span></font></div>
<div id="m_7842949002626647042m_-4706593933946862062m_-3530512760164894077m_-7459565144064560234m_7364395659320556305m_8709598208801673494divRplyFwdMsg"><p class="MsoNormal"><b><font color="black" face="Calibri" size="2"><span style="color:black;font-family:Calibri;font-size:11pt;font-weight:bold">From:</span></font></b><span class="m_7842949002626647042m_-4706593933946862062m_-3530512760164894077m_-7459565144064560234m_7364395659320556305m_8709598208801673494apple-converted-space"><font color="black" face="Calibri" size="2"><span style="color:black;font-family:Calibri;font-size:11pt"> </span></font></span><font color="black" face="Calibri" size="2"><span style="color:black;font-family:Calibri;font-size:11pt">NSRCA-discussion <<a href="mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces@lists.nsrca.org" target="_blank">nsrca-discussion-bounces@lists.nsrca.org</a>>
on behalf of <u></u>Atwood, Mark<u></u> via
NSRCA-discussion <<a href="mailto:nsrca-discussion@lists.nsrca.org" target="_blank">nsrca-discussion@lists.nsrca.org</a>><br>
<b><span style="font-weight:bold">Sent:</span></b><span class="m_7842949002626647042m_-4706593933946862062m_-3530512760164894077m_-7459565144064560234m_7364395659320556305m_8709598208801673494apple-converted-space"> </span>Monday, July 17, 2017 8:09 AM<br>
<b><span style="font-weight:bold">To:</span></b><span class="m_7842949002626647042m_-4706593933946862062m_-3530512760164894077m_-7459565144064560234m_7364395659320556305m_8709598208801673494apple-converted-space"> </span><a href="mailto:nsrca-discussion@lists.nsrca.org" target="_blank">nsrca-discussion@lists.nsrca.org</a><br>
<b><span style="font-weight:bold">Subject:</span></b><span class="m_7842949002626647042m_-4706593933946862062m_-3530512760164894077m_-7459565144064560234m_7364395659320556305m_8709598208801673494apple-converted-space"> </span>[NSRCA-discussion] New sequences</span></font><font color="black" face="Calibri"><span style="color:black;font-family:Calibri"> <u></u><u></u></span></font></p>
<div><p class="MsoNormal"><font color="black" face="Calibri" size="3"><span style="color:black;font-family:Calibri;font-size:12pt"> <u></u><u></u></span></font></p>
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<div><p class="MsoNormal"><font color="black" face="Calibri" size="3"><span style="color:black;font-family:Calibri;font-size:12pt">Hey All, <u></u><u></u></span></font></p>
<div><p class="MsoNormal"><font color="black" face="Calibri" size="3"><span style="color:black;font-family:Calibri;font-size:12pt"><u></u> <u></u></span></font></p>
<div>
<div><p class="MsoNormal"><font color="black" face="Calibri" size="3"><span style="color:black;font-family:Calibri;font-size:12pt">I was able to fly both
the proposed Masters and Advanced sequences this weekend with Chuck Edwards.
All in all good, with a few thoughts.<br>
</span></font><font color="#5856d6" face="Calibri"><span style="color:rgb(88,86,214);font-family:Calibri"><br>
</span></font><b><font color="black" face="Calibri"><span style="color:black;font-family:Calibri;font-weight:bold">Masters</span></font></b><span class="m_7842949002626647042m_-4706593933946862062m_-3530512760164894077m_-7459565144064560234m_7364395659320556305m_8709598208801673494apple-converted-space"><font color="black" face="Calibri"><span style="color:black;font-family:Calibri"> </span></font></span><font color="black" face="Calibri"><span style="color:black;font-family:Calibri">- <u></u><u></u></span></font></p>
</div>
<div><p class="MsoNormal"><font color="black" face="Calibri" size="3"><span style="color:black;font-family:Calibri;font-size:12pt"><u></u> <u></u></span></font></p>
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<div><p class="MsoNormal"><font color="black" face="Calibri" size="3"><span style="color:black;font-family:Calibri;font-size:12pt">I like it. Flows
reasonably well. Some fun challenges, but nothing daunting. The two
rolls opposite is easily the prettiest maneuver in the schedule, and it will
separate anyone not comfortable rolling both ways. <u></u><u></u></span></font></p>
</div>
<div><p class="MsoNormal"><font color="black" face="Calibri" size="3"><span style="color:black;font-family:Calibri;font-size:12pt"><u></u> <u></u></span></font></p>
</div>
<div><p class="MsoNormal"><b><font color="black" face="Calibri" size="3"><span style="color:black;font-family:Calibri;font-size:12pt;font-weight:bold">One
concern</span></font></b><span class="m_7842949002626647042m_-4706593933946862062m_-3530512760164894077m_-7459565144064560234m_7364395659320556305m_8709598208801673494apple-converted-space"><font color="black" face="Calibri"><span style="color:black;font-family:Calibri"> </span></font></span><font color="black" face="Calibri"><span style="color:black;font-family:Calibri">- The
only sticky maneuver I thought is the 1 1/4, KE flight, 1 1/4. It’s
simply too long to make look pretty, and if it’s a strong head wind, will
really look like crap. You’re basically trying to fit 2 1/2 rolls AND
sustained KE flight on a downwind leg and stay in the box, thus forcing
somewhat rapid rolls which simply look rushed. <br>
</span></font><font color="#5856d6" face="Calibri"><span style="color:rgb(88,86,214);font-family:Calibri"><br>
</span></font><font color="black" face="Calibri"><span style="color:black;font-family:Calibri">I would strongly suggest changing it to 3/4 roll, KE, 3/4 roll.
Same difficulty really, but a full roll shorter and thus allows for a
more graceful, controlled roll rate.<br>
</span></font><font color="#5856d6" face="Calibri"><span style="color:rgb(88,86,214);font-family:Calibri"><br>
</span></font><font color="black" face="Calibri"><span style="color:black;font-family:Calibri">Total Mah draw in modest wind (7-9kt cross) was 3580mah
without paying particular attention to throttle management, given that it
was the first time through the sequence. Quite a bit less time and power
than the current schedule.<u></u><u></u></span></font></p>
</div>
<div><p class="MsoNormal"><font color="black" face="Calibri" size="3"><span style="color:black;font-family:Calibri;font-size:12pt"><br>
</span></font><font color="#5856d6" face="Calibri"><span style="color:rgb(88,86,214);font-family:Calibri"><br>
</span></font><b><font color="black" face="Calibri"><span style="color:black;font-family:Calibri;font-weight:bold">Advanced</span></font></b><font color="black" face="Calibri"><span style="color:black;font-family:Calibri">. <u></u><u></u></span></font></p>
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<div><p class="MsoNormal"><font color="black" face="Calibri" size="3"><span style="color:black;font-family:Calibri;font-size:12pt">It’s also nice, with
one<span class="m_7842949002626647042m_-4706593933946862062m_-3530512760164894077m_-7459565144064560234m_7364395659320556305m_8709598208801673494apple-converted-space"> </span><i><span style="font-style:italic">major</span></i><span class="m_7842949002626647042m_-4706593933946862062m_-3530512760164894077m_-7459565144064560234m_7364395659320556305m_8709598208801673494apple-converted-space"> </span>concern.
The Cobra. It’s not as conventional as I think is expected, and I
feel it’s too much for an advanced flyer just learning to snap their airplane
(my opinion). You’re already a bit rushed going into is, and you’re
pushing in from Inverted. No biggie. Half roll up, over the top and
back down on a 45. THEN you have a single snap on the 45 deg DOWN line.
<br>
</span></font><font color="#5856d6" face="Calibri"><span style="color:rgb(88,86,214);font-family:Calibri"><br>
</span></font><font color="black" face="Calibri"><span style="color:black;font-family:Calibri">I can tell you from personal experience and a re-kitted Spark (<u></u>St.<u></u> Clairsville flying F-11 with a 1 1/2 snap down on the
cobra) that a snap like this<span class="m_7842949002626647042m_-4706593933946862062m_-3530512760164894077m_-7459565144064560234m_7364395659320556305m_8709598208801673494apple-converted-space"> </span><b><span style="font-weight:bold">WILL </span></b>crash an airplane. You’re
heading down, not all that high to begin with, and if you badly miss the snap
and lose your orientation, you’re likely on low throttle and low airspeed and
will proceed to stall/snap it into the ground in your attempt to recover.
I’d much rather see a snap on the UP leg of the cobra. It
would still be rushed, but FAR more airplane and pilot friendly. <br>
</span></font><font color="#5856d6" face="Calibri"><span style="color:rgb(88,86,214);font-family:Calibri"><br>
</span></font><font color="black" face="Calibri"><span style="color:black;font-family:Calibri">Other than that, is has all the traditional challenges.
Power was very low as I flew the schedule with only 2800mah (also a
7-9kt crosswind). <u></u><u></u></span></font></p>
</div>
<div><p class="MsoNormal"><font color="black" face="Calibri" size="3"><span style="color:black;font-family:Calibri;font-size:12pt"><u></u> <u></u></span></font></p>
</div>
<div><p class="MsoNormal"><font color="black" face="Calibri" size="3"><span style="color:black;font-family:Calibri;font-size:12pt">My $0.02 worth with 1
time through Advanced and twice through Masters. So limited testing.
Your mileage may vary.<br>
</span></font><font color="#5856d6" face="Calibri"><span style="color:rgb(88,86,214);font-family:Calibri"><br>
</span></font><font color="black" face="Calibri"><span style="color:black;font-family:Calibri">Hope to see a bunch of you in <u></u><u></u>Arkansas<u></u><u></u>! <br>
</span></font><font color="#5856d6" face="Calibri"><span style="color:rgb(88,86,214);font-family:Calibri"><br>
</span></font><font color="black" face="Calibri"><span style="color:black;font-family:Calibri">-Mark<br>
</span></font><strong><b><font color="#65646a" face="Arial" size="2"><span style="color:rgb(101,100,106);font-family:Arial;font-size:11pt">MARK </span></font></b></strong><strong><b><font color="#80bd01" face="Arial" size="2"><span style="color:rgb(128,189,1);font-family:Arial;font-size:11pt">ATWOOD</span></font></b></strong><font color="black" face="Calibri"><span style="color:black;font-family:Calibri"><br>
</span></font><font color="#65646a" face="Arial" size="2"><span style="color:rgb(101,100,106);font-family:Arial;font-size:10pt">o. <a href="tel:(440)%20229-2502" value="+14402292502" target="_blank">(440) 229-2502</a></span></font><font color="black" face="Calibri"><span style="color:black;font-family:Calibri"><br>
</span></font><font color="#65646a" face="Arial" size="2"><span style="color:rgb(101,100,106);font-family:Arial;font-size:10pt">c. <a href="tel:(216)%20316-2489" value="+12163162489" target="_blank">(216) 316-2489</a></span></font><font color="black" face="Calibri"><span style="color:black;font-family:Calibri"><br>
</span></font><font color="#65646a" face="Arial" size="2"><span style="color:rgb(101,100,106);font-family:Arial;font-size:10pt">e. </span></font><font color="black" face="Calibri"><span style="color:black;font-family:Calibri"><a href="mailto:atwoodm@paragon-inc.com" target="_blank"><font color="#65646a" face="Arial" size="2"><span style="color:rgb(101,100,106);font-family:Arial;font-size:10pt">atwoodm@paragon-inc.com</span></font></a><br>
</span></font><font color="#5856d6" face="Calibri" size="1"><span style="color:rgb(88,86,214);font-family:Calibri;font-size:9pt"><br>
</span></font><strong><b><font color="#65646a" face="Arial" size="2"><span style="color:rgb(101,100,106);font-family:Arial;font-size:10pt">Paragon Consulting,
Inc.</span></font></b></strong><font color="black" face="Calibri"><span style="color:black;font-family:Calibri"><br>
</span></font><u></u><u></u><font color="#65646a" face="Arial" size="2"><span style="color:rgb(101,100,106);font-family:Arial;font-size:10pt">5900 Landerbrook Drive, Suite 205</span></font><u></u><font color="#65646a" face="Arial" size="2"><span style="color:rgb(101,100,106);font-family:Arial;font-size:10pt">, <u></u>Cleveland<u></u> <u></u>Ohio<u></u>, <u></u>44124<u></u></span></font><u></u><font color="black" face="Calibri"><span style="color:black;font-family:Calibri"><br>
<a href="http://www.paragon-inc.com/" target="_blank"><font color="purple" face="Arial" size="2"><span style="color:purple;font-family:Arial;font-size:10pt">www.paragon-inc.com</span></font></a><u></u><u></u></span></font></p>
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</div><p class="MsoNormal"><font color="black" face="Calibri" size="3"><span style="color:black;font-family:Calibri;font-size:12pt"><u></u> <u></u></span></font></p>
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</blockquote>
<blockquote style="margin-top:5pt;margin-bottom:5pt" type="cite">
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</div></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><div><span>_______________________________________________</span><br><span>NSRCA-discussion mailing list</span><br><span><a href="mailto:NSRCA-discussion@lists.nsrca.org" target="_blank">NSRCA-discussion@lists.nsrca.org</a></span><br><span><a href="http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion" target="_blank">http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion</a></span></div></blockquote></div></blockquote></div></div><div>-- <br></div><div data-smartmail="gmail_signature">Vicente "Vince" Bortone</div></div></div>
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</blockquote></div></div><div dir="ltr">-- <br></div><div data-smartmail="gmail_signature">Vicente "Vince" Bortone</div>
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