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<font color="#cc0000">Tony,<br>
We all have a problem when looking at a sequence we didn't
originate. Compound that with the problem of being too defensive
about sequences we did originate. Instead of calling for fresh
paper, see what you do to fix what is in front of you. <br>
There is no requirement in the guide that a certain percentage of
the maneuvers have to already be in the guide. So anything goes.
Looking at what is in the sequence below, all the maneuvers are
variations on items in the guide, with the exception of the two
integrated maneuvers which do exceed the intent expressed in the
guide. The loop could be changed to a 4-pt over 180 and the golf
ball could be changed to 1/2 rolls(no integration) or a completely
different maneuver such as a humpty with 3/4 rolls for some
variation. That meets the requirements. </font><br>
<font color="#cc0000">John<br>
<br>
<br>
</font>
<div class="moz-cite-prefix">On 7/7/2017 6:37 PM, Frackowiak Tony
wrote:<br>
</div>
<blockquote type="cite"
cite="mid:A5319892-E47D-4DF2-8DEF-53448823724F@sbcglobal.net">Both
of the cross box maneuvers have no options to stay in line. <font
color="#cc0000">No such requirement exists, obviously could be
put in.</font><br>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>Every Square Vertical 8 in the current Guide has a K of 5.
Why would this one be a 4? <font color="#cc0000">Perhaps it is
time to downgrade this class of maneuvers. They are not as
difficult as they were when defined years ago. No where near
as difficult as the bowtie you stuck us with.</font><br>
</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>Downwind KE Golf Ball is still a poor choice and should have
a K of 5. <font color="#cc0000">Current knife edge humpty is a
4 and downwind. Kfactors have to cover a range of difficulty
and this doesn't merit a 5. What would you replace it with?</font><br>
</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>The KE flight with 1 1/4 rolls without some definition of the
length of the KE will end up being two 1 1/4 rolls. Plus simple
KE flight in the current Guide is a K4. Why should this be a K4
with the addition of two 1 1/4 rolls? Should be a 5. <font
color="#cc0000">Not enough difficulty addition to bump it up
to a 5. Look at it as two 1 1/4 rolls with a long hesitation.
Why is that a 5? The eventual maneuver guide should specify
length of the knife edge.<br>
</font>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>Two rolls reversed in the Current Guide is a K4. The
elimination of the pause makes this a more difficult maneuver
yet it stays at K4? Should at least be a 5. <font
color="#cc0000"> Take out the "no hesitation" and keep it at
4.</font><br>
</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>I'm sorry, but in my opinion this needs a fresh piece of
paper and start over. Start by making the composition of the
Sequence Committee according to the Charter.</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>Tony Frackowiak</div>
<div><br>
<div>
<div>On Jul 7, 2017, at 4:35 PM, John Gayer via
NSRCA-discussion wrote:</div>
<br class="Apple-interchange-newline">
<blockquote type="cite">
<meta http-equiv="Content-Type" content="text/html;
charset=windows-1252">
<div text="#3333FF" bgcolor="#FFFFFF"> Let's try this one.<br>
<br>
<br>
<table style="position: static; z-index: auto; "
cellspacing="0" cellpadding="0" width="1550"
border="0">
<colgroup><col style="width:20pt" width="26"> <col
style="mso-width-source:userset;mso-width-alt:20772;width:426pt"
width="568"> <col
style="mso-width-source:userset;mso-width-alt:987;width:20pt"
width="27"> <col
style="mso-width-source:userset;mso-width-alt:2669;
width:55pt" span="2" width="73"> <col
style="mso-width-source:userset;mso-width-alt:19565;width:401pt"
width="535"> <col
style="mso-width-source:userset;mso-width-alt:2377;width:49pt"
width="65"> <col
style="mso-width-source:userset;mso-width-alt:6692;width:137pt"
width="183"> </colgroup><tbody>
<tr style="mso-height-source:userset;height:24.95pt"
height="33">
<td class="xl67" style="height:24.95pt;width:20pt"
width="26" height="33"> </td>
<td class="xl87"
style="border-left:none;width:426pt" width="568">Maneuver</td>
<td class="xl84"
style="border-left:none;width:20pt" width="27">KF</td>
<td class="xl84"
style="border-left:none;width:55pt" width="73">Exit</td>
<td class="xl85" style="width:55pt" width="73"><br>
</td>
<td class="xl86" style="width:401pt" width="535">Change
maneuver to:</td>
<td class="xl86" style="width:49pt" width="65">New
K</td>
<td class="xl86" style="width:137pt" width="183">new
exit</td>
</tr>
<tr style="mso-height-source:userset;height:24.95pt"
height="33">
<td class="xl71" style="height:24.95pt;width:20pt"
width="26" height="33">1</td>
<td class="xl72"
style="border-left:none;width:426pt" width="568">Takeoff</td>
<td class="xl73"
style="border-left:none;width:20pt" width="27">1</td>
<td class="xl74"
style="border-left:none;width:55pt" width="73"> </td>
<td class="xl74"
style="border-left:none;width:55pt" width="73"> </td>
<td class="xl74"
style="border-left:none;width:401pt" width="535"> </td>
<td class="xl74"
style="border-left:none;width:49pt" width="65">1</td>
<td class="xl75"
style="border-left:none;width:137pt" width="183"> </td>
</tr>
<tr style="mso-height-source:userset;height:24.95pt"
height="33">
<td class="xl76"
style="height:24.95pt;border-top:none;
width:20pt" width="26" height="33">2</td>
<td class="xl65"
style="border-top:none;border-left:none;width:426pt"
width="568">Double Immelman with Knife Edge
Flight inside loop then outside loop</td>
<td class="xl66"
style="border-top:none;border-left:none;width:20pt"
width="27">5</td>
<td class="xl66"
style="border-top:none;border-left:none;width:55pt"
width="73">Upright</td>
<td class="xl68"
style="border-top:none;border-left:none;width:55pt"
width="73">U</td>
<td style="border-top:none;border-left:none">Triangle
Loop from top, 1/2 rolls on 45's, 1 1/2 snap on
top leg,</td>
<td class="xl68"
style="border-top:none;border-left:none;width:49pt"
width="65">5</td>
<td class="xl77"
style="border-top:none;border-left:none;width:137pt"
width="183">inverted</td>
</tr>
<tr style="mso-height-source:userset;height:24.95pt"
height="33">
<td class="xl76"
style="height:24.95pt;border-top:none;
width:20pt" width="26" height="33">3</td>
<td class="xl69"
style="border-top:none;border-left:none;width:426pt"
width="568">1/2 Loop with Integrated 1/2 Roll</td>
<td class="xl66"
style="border-top:none;border-left:none;width:20pt"
width="27">3</td>
<td class="xl66"
style="border-top:none;border-left:none;width:55pt"
width="73">Upright</td>
<td class="xl68"
style="border-top:none;border-left:none;width:55pt"
width="73">TA</td>
<td class="xl88"
style="border-top:none;border-left:none;width:401pt"
width="535">2 1/2 turn inverted spin</td>
<td class="xl68"
style="border-top:none;border-left:none;width:49pt"
width="65">3</td>
<td class="xl77"
style="border-top:none;border-left:none;width:137pt"
width="183">inverted</td>
</tr>
<tr style="mso-height-source:userset;height:24.95pt"
height="33">
<td class="xl76"
style="height:24.95pt;border-top:none;
width:20pt" width="26" height="33">4</td>
<td style="border-top:none;border-left:none">Triangle
Loop from top, 1/2 rolls on 45's, 1 1/2 snap on
top leg</td>
<td class="xl66"
style="border-top:none;border-left:none;width:20pt"
width="27">5</td>
<td class="xl66"
style="border-top:none;border-left:none;width:55pt"
width="73">inverted</td>
<td class="xl68"
style="border-top:none;border-left:none;width:55pt"
width="73">D</td>
<td class="xl65"
style="border-top:none;border-left:none;width:401pt"
width="535">Double Immelman with Knife Edge
Flight outside loop then inside loop</td>
<td class="xl68"
style="border-top:none;border-left:none;width:49pt"
width="65">5</td>
<td class="xl77"
style="border-top:none;border-left:none;width:137pt"
width="183">upright</td>
</tr>
<tr style="mso-height-source:userset;height:24.95pt"
height="33">
<td class="xl78"
style="height:24.95pt;border-top:none"
height="33">5</td>
<td style="border-top:none;border-left:none"><span
style="mso-spacerun:yes"> </span>1/2 Square
Loop with Snap Roll in down track</td>
<td class="xl66"
style="border-top:none;border-left:none;width:20pt"
width="27">4</td>
<td class="xl66"
style="border-top:none;border-left:none;width:55pt"
width="73">Upright</td>
<td class="xl68"
style="border-top:none;border-left:none;width:55pt"
width="73">TA</td>
<td class="xl88"
style="border-top:none;border-left:none;width:401pt"
width="535">Top Hat, 3 of 4 Roll up, 3/4 Roll
down</td>
<td class="xl68"
style="border-top:none;border-left:none;width:49pt"
width="65">2</td>
<td class="xl77"
style="border-top:none;border-left:none;width:137pt"
width="183">inverted</td>
</tr>
<tr style="mso-height-source:userset;height:24.95pt"
height="33">
<td class="xl78"
style="height:24.95pt;border-top:none"
height="33">6</td>
<td style="border-top:none;border-left:none"><span
style="mso-spacerun:yes"> </span>Six-sided
Loop, 2 of 4 Rolls in leg 2, two 1/4 Rolls
opposite in leg 4</td>
<td class="xl70"
style="border-top:none;border-left:none">4</td>
<td class="xl66"
style="border-top:none;border-left:none;width:55pt"
width="73">inverted</td>
<td class="xl68"
style="border-top:none;border-left:none;width:55pt"
width="73">U</td>
<td class="xl88"
style="border-top:none;border-left:none;width:401pt"
width="535">Six-sided Loop, 2 of 4 Rolls in leg
2 and 4</td>
<td class="xl68"
style="border-top:none;border-left:none;width:49pt"
width="65">4</td>
<td class="xl77"
style="border-top:none;border-left:none;width:137pt"
width="183">inverted</td>
</tr>
<tr style="mso-height-source:userset;height:24.95pt"
height="33">
<td class="xl76"
style="height:24.95pt;border-top:none;
width:20pt" width="26" height="33">7</td>
<td style="border-top:none;border-left:none">Humpty
Bump with Roll Options, 2 of 2 Roll up, Full
Roll down; or 3/4 Roll up and down</td>
<td class="xl66"
style="border-top:none;border-left:none;width:20pt"
width="27">3</td>
<td class="xl66"
style="border-top:none;border-left:none;width:55pt"
width="73">Upright</td>
<td class="xl68"
style="border-top:none;border-left:none;width:55pt"
width="73">TA</td>
<td style="border-top:none;border-left:none">Stall
Turn with two 1/4 Rolls down</td>
<td class="xl68"
style="border-top:none;border-left:none;width:49pt"
width="65">2</td>
<td class="xl77"
style="border-top:none;border-left:none;width:137pt"
width="183">upright</td>
</tr>
<tr style="mso-height-source:userset;height:24.95pt"
height="33">
<td class="xl76"
style="height:24.95pt;border-top:none;
width:20pt" width="26" height="33">8</td>
<td class="xl65"
style="border-top:none;border-left:none;width:426pt"
width="568">Knife Edge Flight with 1 ¼ Roll in
and out</td>
<td class="xl66"
style="border-top:none;border-left:none;width:20pt"
width="27">4</td>
<td class="xl66"
style="border-top:none;border-left:none;width:55pt"
width="73">inverted</td>
<td class="xl68"
style="border-top:none;border-left:none;width:55pt"
width="73">D</td>
<td class="xl88"
style="border-top:none;border-left:none;width:401pt"
width="535">Knife Edge Flight with 1 ¼ Roll in
and out</td>
<td class="xl68"
style="border-top:none;border-left:none;width:49pt"
width="65">4</td>
<td class="xl77"
style="border-top:none;border-left:none;width:137pt"
width="183">upright</td>
</tr>
<tr style="mso-height-source:userset;height:24.95pt"
height="33">
<td class="xl78"
style="height:24.95pt;border-top:none"
height="33">9</td>
<td style="border-top:none;border-left:none">Stall
Turn with two 1/4 Rolls opposite up, 1/2 Roll
down</td>
<td class="xl66"
style="border-top:none;border-left:none;width:20pt"
width="27">3</td>
<td class="xl66"
style="border-top:none;border-left:none;width:55pt"
width="73">Upright</td>
<td class="xl68"
style="border-top:none;border-left:none;width:55pt"
width="73">TA</td>
<td style="border-top:none;border-left:none">Stall
Turn with two 1/4 Rolls<span
style="mso-spacerun:yes"> </span>up, 1/2
Roll down</td>
<td class="xl68"
style="border-top:none;border-left:none;width:49pt"
width="65">3</td>
<td class="xl77"
style="border-top:none;border-left:none;width:137pt"
width="183">upright</td>
</tr>
<tr style="mso-height-source:userset;height:24.95pt"
height="33">
<td class="xl76"
style="height:24.95pt;border-top:none;
width:20pt" width="26" height="33">10</td>
<td style="border-top:none;border-left:none">Vertical
Cuban 8 with 1/2 Roll, Full Roll</td>
<td class="xl66"
style="border-top:none;border-left:none;width:20pt"
width="27">4</td>
<td class="xl66"
style="border-top:none;border-left:none;width:55pt"
width="73">Inverted</td>
<td class="xl68"
style="border-top:none;border-left:none;width:55pt"
width="73">U</td>
<td class="xl88"
style="border-top:none;border-left:none;width:401pt"
width="535">Vertical square 8 from bottom,<span
style="mso-spacerun:yes"> </span>full roll
at mid-level, 1/2 roll 2nd mid-level</td>
<td class="xl68"
style="border-top:none;border-left:none;width:49pt"
width="65">4</td>
<td class="xl77"
style="border-top:none;border-left:none;width:137pt"
width="183">inverted</td>
</tr>
<tr style="mso-height-source:userset;height:24.95pt"
height="33">
<td class="xl78"
style="height:24.95pt;border-top:none"
height="33">11</td>
<td style="border-top:none;border-left:none">Trombone
with Roll</td>
<td class="xl66"
style="border-top:none;border-left:none;width:20pt"
width="27">2</td>
<td class="xl66"
style="border-top:none;border-left:none;width:55pt"
width="73">Upright</td>
<td class="xl68"
style="border-top:none;border-left:none;width:55pt"
width="73">TA</td>
<td class="xl88"
style="border-top:none;border-left:none;width:401pt"
width="535">reverse shark, snap on 45</td>
<td class="xl68"
style="border-top:none;border-left:none;width:49pt"
width="65">4</td>
<td class="xl77"
style="border-top:none;border-left:none;width:137pt"
width="183">upright</td>
</tr>
<tr style="mso-height-source:userset;height:24.95pt"
height="33">
<td class="xl78"
style="height:24.95pt;border-top:none"
height="33">12</td>
<td style="border-top:none;border-left:none"><span
style="mso-spacerun:yes"> </span>Golf Ball
with 3/4 Rolls and Knife Edge Loop</td>
<td class="xl66"
style="border-top:none;border-left:none;width:20pt"
width="27">4</td>
<td class="xl66"
style="border-top:none;border-left:none;width:55pt"
width="73">Upright</td>
<td class="xl68"
style="border-top:none;border-left:none;width:55pt"
width="73">D</td>
<td class="xl88"
style="border-top:none;border-left:none;width:401pt"
width="535">Golf Ball with 1/4 Rolls and Knife
Edge Loop</td>
<td class="xl68"
style="border-top:none;border-left:none;width:49pt"
width="65">4</td>
<td class="xl77"
style="border-top:none;border-left:none;width:137pt"
width="183">inverted</td>
</tr>
<tr style="mso-height-source:userset;height:24.95pt"
height="33">
<td class="xl79"
style="height:24.95pt;border-top:none;
width:20pt" width="26" height="33">13</td>
<td style="border-top:none;border-left:none"><span
style="mso-spacerun:yes"> </span>Top Hat, 3 of
4 Roll up, 3/4 Roll down</td>
<td class="xl66"
style="border-top:none;border-left:none;width:20pt"
width="27">2</td>
<td class="xl66"
style="border-top:none;border-left:none;width:55pt"
width="73">Upright</td>
<td class="xl68"
style="border-top:none;border-left:none;width:55pt"
width="73">TA</td>
<td class="xl88"
style="border-top:none;border-left:none;width:401pt"
width="535">Humpty Bump push top, 3/4 Roll up
and down</td>
<td class="xl68"
style="border-top:none;border-left:none;width:49pt"
width="65">2</td>
<td class="xl77"
style="border-top:none;border-left:none;width:137pt"
width="183">upright</td>
</tr>
<tr style="mso-height-source:userset;height:24.95pt"
height="33">
<td class="xl78"
style="height:24.95pt;border-top:none"
height="33">14</td>
<td style="border-top:none;border-left:none"><span
style="mso-spacerun:yes"> </span>Figure Z with
4 of 8 Roll in 45</td>
<td class="xl70"
style="border-top:none;border-left:none">4</td>
<td class="xl66"
style="border-top:none;border-left:none;width:55pt"
width="73">Inverted</td>
<td class="xl68"
style="border-top:none;border-left:none;width:55pt"
width="73">U</td>
<td class="xl88"
style="border-top:none;border-left:none;width:401pt"
width="535"> </td>
<td class="xl68"
style="border-top:none;border-left:none;width:49pt"
width="65">4</td>
<td class="xl77"
style="border-top:none;border-left:none;width:137pt"
width="183"> </td>
</tr>
<tr style="mso-height-source:userset;height:24.95pt"
height="33">
<td class="xl79"
style="height:24.95pt;border-top:none;
width:20pt" width="26" height="33">15</td>
<td style="border-top:none;border-left:none"><span
style="mso-spacerun:yes"> </span>Inverted
2-turn Spin<span style="mso-spacerun:yes"> </span></td>
<td class="xl66"
style="border-top:none;border-left:none;width:20pt"
width="27">2</td>
<td class="xl66"
style="border-top:none;border-left:none;width:55pt"
width="73">Upright</td>
<td class="xl68"
style="border-top:none;border-left:none;width:55pt"
width="73">TA</td>
<td class="xl88"
style="border-top:none;border-left:none;width:401pt"
width="535">1/2 square loop with full roll</td>
<td class="xl68"
style="border-top:none;border-left:none;width:49pt"
width="65">2</td>
<td class="xl77"
style="border-top:none;border-left:none;width:137pt"
width="183">upright</td>
</tr>
<tr style="mso-height-source:userset;height:24.95pt"
height="33">
<td class="xl76"
style="height:24.95pt;border-top:none;
width:20pt" width="26" height="33">16</td>
<td class="xl65"
style="border-top:none;border-left:none;width:426pt"
width="568">Two Slow Rolls opposite, no
hesitation</td>
<td class="xl66"
style="border-top:none;border-left:none;width:20pt"
width="27">4</td>
<td class="xl66"
style="border-top:none;border-left:none;width:55pt"
width="73">Upright</td>
<td class="xl68"
style="border-top:none;border-left:none;width:55pt"
width="73">D</td>
<td class="xl88"
style="border-top:none;border-left:none;width:401pt"
width="535"> </td>
<td class="xl68"
style="border-top:none;border-left:none;width:49pt"
width="65">4</td>
<td class="xl77"
style="border-top:none;border-left:none;width:137pt"
width="183"> </td>
</tr>
<tr style="mso-height-source:userset;height:24.95pt"
height="33">
<td class="xl78"
style="height:24.95pt;border-top:none"
height="33">17</td>
<td style="border-top:none;border-left:none"><span
style="mso-spacerun:yes"> </span>Stall turn
with half rolls up and down</td>
<td class="xl66"
style="border-top:none;border-left:none;width:20pt"
width="27">2</td>
<td class="xl66"
style="border-top:none;border-left:none;width:55pt"
width="73">Upright</td>
<td class="xl68"
style="border-top:none;border-left:none;width:55pt"
width="73">TA</td>
<td class="xl88"
style="border-top:none;border-left:none;width:401pt"
width="535"> </td>
<td class="xl68"
style="border-top:none;border-left:none;width:49pt"
width="65">2</td>
<td class="xl77"
style="border-top:none;border-left:none;width:137pt"
width="183"> </td>
</tr>
<tr style="mso-height-source:userset;height:24.95pt"
height="33">
<td class="xl76"
style="height:24.95pt;border-top:none;
width:20pt" width="26" height="33">18</td>
<td class="xl65"
style="border-top:none;border-left:none;width:426pt"
width="568">Loop with Integrated Roll in top 180</td>
<td class="xl70"
style="border-top:none;border-left:none">5</td>
<td class="xl66"
style="border-top:none;border-left:none;width:55pt"
width="73">Upright</td>
<td class="xl68"
style="border-top:none;border-left:none;width:55pt"
width="73">U</td>
<td class="xl88"
style="border-top:none;border-left:none;width:401pt"
width="535"> </td>
<td class="xl68"
style="border-top:none;border-left:none;width:49pt"
width="65">5</td>
<td class="xl77"
style="border-top:none;border-left:none;width:137pt"
width="183"> </td>
</tr>
<tr style="mso-height-source:userset;height:24.95pt"
height="33">
<td class="xl76"
style="height:24.95pt;border-top:none;
width:20pt" width="26" height="33">19</td>
<td class="xl65"
style="border-top:none;border-left:none;width:426pt"
width="568">Landing</td>
<td class="xl66"
style="border-top:none;border-left:none;width:20pt"
width="27">1</td>
<td class="xl66"
style="border-top:none;border-left:none;width:55pt"
width="73"> </td>
<td class="xl68"
style="border-top:none;border-left:none;width:55pt"
width="73"> </td>
<td class="xl68"
style="border-top:none;border-left:none;width:401pt"
width="535"> </td>
<td class="xl68"
style="border-top:none;border-left:none;width:49pt"
width="65">1</td>
<td class="xl77"
style="border-top:none;border-left:none;width:137pt"
width="183"> </td>
</tr>
<tr style="mso-height-source:userset;height:24.95pt"
height="33">
<td class="xl76"
style="height:24.95pt;border-top:none;
width:20pt" width="26" height="33"> </td>
<td class="xl65"
style="border-top:none;border-left:none;width:426pt"
width="568"> </td>
<td class="xl66"
style="border-top:none;border-left:none;width:20pt"
width="27"> </td>
<td class="xl66"
style="border-top:none;border-left:none;width:55pt"
width="73"> </td>
<td class="xl68"
style="border-top:none;border-left:none;width:55pt"
width="73"> </td>
<td class="xl68"
style="border-top:none;border-left:none;width:401pt"
width="535"> </td>
<td class="xl68"
style="border-top:none;border-left:none;width:49pt"
width="65"> </td>
<td class="xl77"
style="border-top:none;border-left:none;width:137pt"
width="183"> </td>
</tr>
<tr style="mso-height-source:userset;height:24.95pt"
height="33">
<td class="xl80"
style="height:24.95pt;border-top:none;
width:20pt" width="26" height="33"> </td>
<td class="xl81"
style="border-top:none;border-left:none;width:426pt"
width="568">Total K-factor</td>
<td class="xl81"
style="border-top:none;border-left:none;width:20pt"
width="27">62</td>
<td class="xl81"
style="border-top:none;border-left:none;width:55pt"
width="73"> </td>
<td class="xl82"
style="border-top:none;border-left:none;width:55pt"
width="73"> </td>
<td class="xl82"
style="border-top:none;border-left:none;width:401pt"
width="535"> </td>
<td class="xl82"
style="border-top:none;border-left:none;width:49pt"
width="65">61</td>
<td class="xl83"
style="border-top:none;border-left:none;width:137pt"
width="183"> </td>
</tr>
</tbody>
</table>
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