<p dir="ltr">We've seen that the FAI catalog is inconsistent in applying Kfactors. In the original masters proposal, the double key was a K5, while a much simpler version in FAI advanced is also a K5. Both cannot be K5's. The one in the original masters is really a K6.</p>
<p dir="ltr">Jon</p>
</br></br><div class="device_aol_et_org_dt_dd_quote"></div><hr style="border:0;height:1px;color:#999;background-color:#999;width:100%;margin:0 0 9px 0;padding:0;"></hr><span style="font-size:14px; color:#999999;">On Friday, July 7, 2017 Ed Alt via NSRCA-discussion <<span style="color:#0000A0">nsrca-discussion@lists.nsrca.org</span>> wrote:</span><br></br>
<div id="AOLMsgPart_1.2_9f2ddbe6-123f-451d-8a27-db10fc7d463d">
<div dir="ltr" class="aolReplacedBody">
<div id="divtagdefaultwrapper" style="font-size:12pt;color:#000000;font-family:Calibri,Helvetica,sans-serif;" dir="ltr">
<p>Yep</p>
<br>
<br>
<div style="color: rgb(0, 0, 0);">
<hr style="display:inline-block; width:98%">
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<div class="begin_alto_quote"></div>From:</b> NSRCA-discussion <nsrca-discussion-<a href='mailto:bounces@lists.nsrca.org'>bounces@lists.nsrca.org</a>> on behalf of Frackowiak Tony via NSRCA-discussion <nsrca-<a href='mailto:discussion@lists.nsrca.org'>discussion@lists.nsrca.org</a>><br>
<b>Sent:</b> Friday, July 7, 2017 9:33 PM<br>
<b>To:</b> Stuart Chale<br>
<b>Cc:</b> General pattern discussion<br>
<b>Subject:</b> Re: [NSRCA-discussion] New Masters Sequence</font>
<div> </div>
</div>
<div>Well, there's the problem. The Sequence Committee is supposed to be creating patterns using the Sequence Development Guide, not the F3A catalog. So it should be using K-Factors from the Guide.
<div><br>
</div>
<div>Tony Frackowiak</div>
<div><br>
<div>
<div>On Jul 7, 2017, at 6:19 PM, Stuart Chale wrote:</div>
<br class="Apple-interchange-newline">
<blockquote>
<div dir="auto">
<div>Some of the K factors like the knife edge roll are taken from the FAI catalog.  <br>
<br>
Sent from my iPhone</div>
<div><br>
On Jul 7, 2017, at 8:38 PM, Frackowiak Tony via NSRCA-discussion <<a href="mailto:nsrca-discussion@lists.nsrca.org" target="_blank">nsrca-discussion@lists.nsrca.org</a>> wrote:<br>
<br>
</div>
<blockquote>
<div>Both of the cross box maneuvers have no options to stay in line. 
<div><br>
</div>
<div>Every Square Vertical 8 in the current Guide has a K of 5. Why would this one be a 4? </div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>Downwind KE Golf Ball is still a poor choice and should have a K of 5. </div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>The KE flight with 1 1/4 rolls without some definition of the length of the KE will end up being two 1 1/4 rolls. Plus simple KE flight in the current Guide is a K4. Why should this be a K4 with the addition of two 1 1/4 rolls? Should be a 5.
<div><br>
</div>
<div>Two rolls reversed in the Current Guide is a K4. The elimination of the pause makes this a more difficult maneuver yet it stays at K4? Should at least be a 5.</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>I'm sorry, but in my opinion this needs a fresh piece of paper and start over. Start by making the composition of the Sequence Committee according to the Charter.</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>Tony Frackowiak</div>
<div><br>
<div>
<div>On Jul 7, 2017, at 4:35 PM, John Gayer via NSRCA-discussion wrote:</div>
<br class="Apple-interchange-newline">
<blockquote>
<div>Let's try this one.<br>
<br>
<br>
<table cellspacing="0" cellpadding="0" width="1550" border="0" style="position:static; z-index:auto">
<colgroup><col width="26" style="width:20pt"><col width="568" style="width:426pt"><col width="27" style="width:20pt"><col span="2" width="73" style="width:55pt"><col width="535" style="width:401pt"><col width="65" style="width:49pt"><col width="183" style="width:137pt"></colgroup>
<tbody>
<tr height="33" style="height:24.95pt">
<td class="xl67" width="26" height="33" style="height:24.95pt; width:20pt"> </td>
<td class="xl87" width="568" style="border-left:none; width:426pt">Maneuver</td>
<td class="xl84" width="27" style="border-left:none; width:20pt">KF</td>
<td class="xl84" width="73" style="border-left:none; width:55pt">Exit</td>
<td class="xl85" width="73" style="width:55pt"><br>
</td>
<td class="xl86" width="535" style="width:401pt">Change maneuver to:</td>
<td class="xl86" width="65" style="width:49pt">New K</td>
<td class="xl86" width="183" style="width:137pt">new exit</td>
</tr>
<tr height="33" style="height:24.95pt">
<td class="xl71" width="26" height="33" style="height:24.95pt; width:20pt">1</td>
<td class="xl72" width="568" style="border-left:none; width:426pt">Takeoff</td>
<td class="xl73" width="27" style="border-left:none; width:20pt">1</td>
<td class="xl74" width="73" style="border-left:none; width:55pt"> </td>
<td class="xl74" width="73" style="border-left:none; width:55pt"> </td>
<td class="xl74" width="535" style="border-left:none; width:401pt"> </td>
<td class="xl74" width="65" style="border-left:none; width:49pt">1</td>
<td class="xl75" width="183" style="border-left:none; width:137pt"> </td>
</tr>
<tr height="33" style="height:24.95pt">
<td class="xl76" width="26" height="33" style="height:24.95pt; border-top:none; width:20pt">
2</td>
<td class="xl65" width="568" style="border-top:none; border-left:none; width:426pt">
Double Immelman with Knife Edge Flight inside loop then outside loop</td>
<td class="xl66" width="27" style="border-top:none; border-left:none; width:20pt">
5</td>
<td class="xl66" width="73" style="border-top:none; border-left:none; width:55pt">
Upright</td>
<td class="xl68" width="73" style="border-top:none; border-left:none; width:55pt">
U</td>
<td style="border-top:none; border-left:none">Triangle Loop from top, 1/2 rolls on 45's, 1 1/2 snap on top leg,</td>
<td class="xl68" width="65" style="border-top:none; border-left:none; width:49pt">
5</td>
<td class="xl77" width="183" style="border-top:none; border-left:none; width:137pt">
inverted</td>
</tr>
<tr height="33" style="height:24.95pt">
<td class="xl76" width="26" height="33" style="height:24.95pt; border-top:none; width:20pt">
3</td>
<td class="xl69" width="568" style="border-top:none; border-left:none; width:426pt">
1/2 Loop with Integrated 1/2 Roll</td>
<td class="xl66" width="27" style="border-top:none; border-left:none; width:20pt">
3</td>
<td class="xl66" width="73" style="border-top:none; border-left:none; width:55pt">
Upright</td>
<td class="xl68" width="73" style="border-top:none; border-left:none; width:55pt">
TA</td>
<td class="xl88" width="535" style="border-top:none; border-left:none; width:401pt">
2 1/2 turn inverted spin</td>
<td class="xl68" width="65" style="border-top:none; border-left:none; width:49pt">
3</td>
<td class="xl77" width="183" style="border-top:none; border-left:none; width:137pt">
inverted</td>
</tr>
<tr height="33" style="height:24.95pt">
<td class="xl76" width="26" height="33" style="height:24.95pt; border-top:none; width:20pt">
4</td>
<td style="border-top:none; border-left:none">Triangle Loop from top, 1/2 rolls on 45's, 1 1/2 snap on top leg</td>
<td class="xl66" width="27" style="border-top:none; border-left:none; width:20pt">
5</td>
<td class="xl66" width="73" style="border-top:none; border-left:none; width:55pt">
inverted</td>
<td class="xl68" width="73" style="border-top:none; border-left:none; width:55pt">
D</td>
<td class="xl65" width="535" style="border-top:none; border-left:none; width:401pt">
Double Immelman with Knife Edge Flight outside loop then inside loop</td>
<td class="xl68" width="65" style="border-top:none; border-left:none; width:49pt">
5</td>
<td class="xl77" width="183" style="border-top:none; border-left:none; width:137pt">
upright</td>
</tr>
<tr height="33" style="height:24.95pt">
<td class="xl78" height="33" style="height:24.95pt; border-top:none">5</td>
<td style="border-top:none; border-left:none"><span style=""> </span>1/2 Square Loop with Snap Roll in down track</td>
<td class="xl66" width="27" style="border-top:none; border-left:none; width:20pt">
4</td>
<td class="xl66" width="73" style="border-top:none; border-left:none; width:55pt">
Upright</td>
<td class="xl68" width="73" style="border-top:none; border-left:none; width:55pt">
TA</td>
<td class="xl88" width="535" style="border-top:none; border-left:none; width:401pt">
Top Hat, 3 of 4 Roll up, 3/4 Roll down</td>
<td class="xl68" width="65" style="border-top:none; border-left:none; width:49pt">
2</td>
<td class="xl77" width="183" style="border-top:none; border-left:none; width:137pt">
inverted</td>
</tr>
<tr height="33" style="height:24.95pt">
<td class="xl78" height="33" style="height:24.95pt; border-top:none">6</td>
<td style="border-top:none; border-left:none"><span style=""> </span>Six-sided Loop, 2 of 4 Rolls in leg 2, two 1/4 Rolls opposite in leg 4</td>
<td class="xl70" style="border-top:none; border-left:none">4</td>
<td class="xl66" width="73" style="border-top:none; border-left:none; width:55pt">
inverted</td>
<td class="xl68" width="73" style="border-top:none; border-left:none; width:55pt">
U</td>
<td class="xl88" width="535" style="border-top:none; border-left:none; width:401pt">
Six-sided Loop, 2 of 4 Rolls in leg 2 and 4</td>
<td class="xl68" width="65" style="border-top:none; border-left:none; width:49pt">
4</td>
<td class="xl77" width="183" style="border-top:none; border-left:none; width:137pt">
inverted</td>
</tr>
<tr height="33" style="height:24.95pt">
<td class="xl76" width="26" height="33" style="height:24.95pt; border-top:none; width:20pt">
7</td>
<td style="border-top:none; border-left:none">Humpty Bump with Roll Options, 2 of 2 Roll up, Full Roll down; or 3/4 Roll up and down</td>
<td class="xl66" width="27" style="border-top:none; border-left:none; width:20pt">
3</td>
<td class="xl66" width="73" style="border-top:none; border-left:none; width:55pt">
Upright</td>
<td class="xl68" width="73" style="border-top:none; border-left:none; width:55pt">
TA</td>
<td style="border-top:none; border-left:none">Stall Turn with two 1/4 Rolls down</td>
<td class="xl68" width="65" style="border-top:none; border-left:none; width:49pt">
2</td>
<td class="xl77" width="183" style="border-top:none; border-left:none; width:137pt">
upright</td>
</tr>
<tr height="33" style="height:24.95pt">
<td class="xl76" width="26" height="33" style="height:24.95pt; border-top:none; width:20pt">
8</td>
<td class="xl65" width="568" style="border-top:none; border-left:none; width:426pt">
Knife Edge Flight with 1 ¼ Roll in and out</td>
<td class="xl66" width="27" style="border-top:none; border-left:none; width:20pt">
4</td>
<td class="xl66" width="73" style="border-top:none; border-left:none; width:55pt">
inverted</td>
<td class="xl68" width="73" style="border-top:none; border-left:none; width:55pt">
D</td>
<td class="xl88" width="535" style="border-top:none; border-left:none; width:401pt">
Knife Edge Flight with 1 ¼ Roll in and out</td>
<td class="xl68" width="65" style="border-top:none; border-left:none; width:49pt">
4</td>
<td class="xl77" width="183" style="border-top:none; border-left:none; width:137pt">
upright</td>
</tr>
<tr height="33" style="height:24.95pt">
<td class="xl78" height="33" style="height:24.95pt; border-top:none">9</td>
<td style="border-top:none; border-left:none">Stall Turn with two 1/4 Rolls opposite up, 1/2 Roll down</td>
<td class="xl66" width="27" style="border-top:none; border-left:none; width:20pt">
3</td>
<td class="xl66" width="73" style="border-top:none; border-left:none; width:55pt">
Upright</td>
<td class="xl68" width="73" style="border-top:none; border-left:none; width:55pt">
TA</td>
<td style="border-top:none; border-left:none">Stall Turn with two 1/4 Rolls<span style=""> 
</span>up, 1/2 Roll down</td>
<td class="xl68" width="65" style="border-top:none; border-left:none; width:49pt">
3</td>
<td class="xl77" width="183" style="border-top:none; border-left:none; width:137pt">
upright</td>
</tr>
<tr height="33" style="height:24.95pt">
<td class="xl76" width="26" height="33" style="height:24.95pt; border-top:none; width:20pt">
10</td>
<td style="border-top:none; border-left:none">Vertical Cuban 8 with 1/2 Roll, Full Roll</td>
<td class="xl66" width="27" style="border-top:none; border-left:none; width:20pt">
4</td>
<td class="xl66" width="73" style="border-top:none; border-left:none; width:55pt">
Inverted</td>
<td class="xl68" width="73" style="border-top:none; border-left:none; width:55pt">
U</td>
<td class="xl88" width="535" style="border-top:none; border-left:none; width:401pt">
Vertical square 8 from bottom,<span style="">  </span>full roll at mid-level, 1/2 roll 2nd mid-level</td>
<td class="xl68" width="65" style="border-top:none; border-left:none; width:49pt">
4</td>
<td class="xl77" width="183" style="border-top:none; border-left:none; width:137pt">
inverted</td>
</tr>
<tr height="33" style="height:24.95pt">
<td class="xl78" height="33" style="height:24.95pt; border-top:none">11</td>
<td style="border-top:none; border-left:none">Trombone with Roll</td>
<td class="xl66" width="27" style="border-top:none; border-left:none; width:20pt">
2</td>
<td class="xl66" width="73" style="border-top:none; border-left:none; width:55pt">
Upright</td>
<td class="xl68" width="73" style="border-top:none; border-left:none; width:55pt">
TA</td>
<td class="xl88" width="535" style="border-top:none; border-left:none; width:401pt">
reverse shark, snap on 45</td>
<td class="xl68" width="65" style="border-top:none; border-left:none; width:49pt">
4</td>
<td class="xl77" width="183" style="border-top:none; border-left:none; width:137pt">
upright</td>
</tr>
<tr height="33" style="height:24.95pt">
<td class="xl78" height="33" style="height:24.95pt; border-top:none">12</td>
<td style="border-top:none; border-left:none"><span style=""> </span>Golf Ball with 3/4 Rolls and Knife Edge Loop</td>
<td class="xl66" width="27" style="border-top:none; border-left:none; width:20pt">
4</td>
<td class="xl66" width="73" style="border-top:none; border-left:none; width:55pt">
Upright</td>
<td class="xl68" width="73" style="border-top:none; border-left:none; width:55pt">
D</td>
<td class="xl88" width="535" style="border-top:none; border-left:none; width:401pt">
Golf Ball with 1/4 Rolls and Knife Edge Loop</td>
<td class="xl68" width="65" style="border-top:none; border-left:none; width:49pt">
4</td>
<td class="xl77" width="183" style="border-top:none; border-left:none; width:137pt">
inverted</td>
</tr>
<tr height="33" style="height:24.95pt">
<td class="xl79" width="26" height="33" style="height:24.95pt; border-top:none; width:20pt">
13</td>
<td style="border-top:none; border-left:none"><span style=""> </span>Top Hat, 3 of 4 Roll up, 3/4 Roll down</td>
<td class="xl66" width="27" style="border-top:none; border-left:none; width:20pt">
2</td>
<td class="xl66" width="73" style="border-top:none; border-left:none; width:55pt">
Upright</td>
<td class="xl68" width="73" style="border-top:none; border-left:none; width:55pt">
TA</td>
<td class="xl88" width="535" style="border-top:none; border-left:none; width:401pt">
Humpty Bump push top, 3/4 Roll up and down</td>
<td class="xl68" width="65" style="border-top:none; border-left:none; width:49pt">
2</td>
<td class="xl77" width="183" style="border-top:none; border-left:none; width:137pt">
upright</td>
</tr>
<tr height="33" style="height:24.95pt">
<td class="xl78" height="33" style="height:24.95pt; border-top:none">14</td>
<td style="border-top:none; border-left:none"><span style=""> </span>Figure Z with 4 of 8 Roll in 45</td>
<td class="xl70" style="border-top:none; border-left:none">4</td>
<td class="xl66" width="73" style="border-top:none; border-left:none; width:55pt">
Inverted</td>
<td class="xl68" width="73" style="border-top:none; border-left:none; width:55pt">
U</td>
<td class="xl88" width="535" style="border-top:none; border-left:none; width:401pt">
 </td>
<td class="xl68" width="65" style="border-top:none; border-left:none; width:49pt">
4</td>
<td class="xl77" width="183" style="border-top:none; border-left:none; width:137pt">
 </td>
</tr>
<tr height="33" style="height:24.95pt">
<td class="xl79" width="26" height="33" style="height:24.95pt; border-top:none; width:20pt">
15</td>
<td style="border-top:none; border-left:none"><span style=""> </span>Inverted 2-turn Spin<span style=""> </span></td>
<td class="xl66" width="27" style="border-top:none; border-left:none; width:20pt">
2</td>
<td class="xl66" width="73" style="border-top:none; border-left:none; width:55pt">
Upright</td>
<td class="xl68" width="73" style="border-top:none; border-left:none; width:55pt">
TA</td>
<td class="xl88" width="535" style="border-top:none; border-left:none; width:401pt">
1/2 square loop with full roll</td>
<td class="xl68" width="65" style="border-top:none; border-left:none; width:49pt">
2</td>
<td class="xl77" width="183" style="border-top:none; border-left:none; width:137pt">
upright</td>
</tr>
<tr height="33" style="height:24.95pt">
<td class="xl76" width="26" height="33" style="height:24.95pt; border-top:none; width:20pt">
16</td>
<td class="xl65" width="568" style="border-top:none; border-left:none; width:426pt">
Two Slow Rolls opposite, no hesitation</td>
<td class="xl66" width="27" style="border-top:none; border-left:none; width:20pt">
4</td>
<td class="xl66" width="73" style="border-top:none; border-left:none; width:55pt">
Upright</td>
<td class="xl68" width="73" style="border-top:none; border-left:none; width:55pt">
D</td>
<td class="xl88" width="535" style="border-top:none; border-left:none; width:401pt">
 </td>
<td class="xl68" width="65" style="border-top:none; border-left:none; width:49pt">
4</td>
<td class="xl77" width="183" style="border-top:none; border-left:none; width:137pt">
 </td>
</tr>
<tr height="33" style="height:24.95pt">
<td class="xl78" height="33" style="height:24.95pt; border-top:none">17</td>
<td style="border-top:none; border-left:none"><span style=""> </span>Stall turn with half rolls up and down</td>
<td class="xl66" width="27" style="border-top:none; border-left:none; width:20pt">
2</td>
<td class="xl66" width="73" style="border-top:none; border-left:none; width:55pt">
Upright</td>
<td class="xl68" width="73" style="border-top:none; border-left:none; width:55pt">
TA</td>
<td class="xl88" width="535" style="border-top:none; border-left:none; width:401pt">
 </td>
<td class="xl68" width="65" style="border-top:none; border-left:none; width:49pt">
2</td>
<td class="xl77" width="183" style="border-top:none; border-left:none; width:137pt">
 </td>
</tr>
<tr height="33" style="height:24.95pt">
<td class="xl76" width="26" height="33" style="height:24.95pt; border-top:none; width:20pt">
18</td>
<td class="xl65" width="568" style="border-top:none; border-left:none; width:426pt">
Loop with Integrated Roll in top 180</td>
<td class="xl70" style="border-top:none; border-left:none">5</td>
<td class="xl66" width="73" style="border-top:none; border-left:none; width:55pt">
Upright</td>
<td class="xl68" width="73" style="border-top:none; border-left:none; width:55pt">
U</td>
<td class="xl88" width="535" style="border-top:none; border-left:none; width:401pt">
 </td>
<td class="xl68" width="65" style="border-top:none; border-left:none; width:49pt">
5</td>
<td class="xl77" width="183" style="border-top:none; border-left:none; width:137pt">
 </td>
</tr>
<tr height="33" style="height:24.95pt">
<td class="xl76" width="26" height="33" style="height:24.95pt; border-top:none; width:20pt">
19</td>
<td class="xl65" width="568" style="border-top:none; border-left:none; width:426pt">
Landing</td>
<td class="xl66" width="27" style="border-top:none; border-left:none; width:20pt">
1</td>
<td class="xl66" width="73" style="border-top:none; border-left:none; width:55pt">
 </td>
<td class="xl68" width="73" style="border-top:none; border-left:none; width:55pt">
 </td>
<td class="xl68" width="535" style="border-top:none; border-left:none; width:401pt">
 </td>
<td class="xl68" width="65" style="border-top:none; border-left:none; width:49pt">
1</td>
<td class="xl77" width="183" style="border-top:none; border-left:none; width:137pt">
 </td>
</tr>
<tr height="33" style="height:24.95pt">
<td class="xl76" width="26" height="33" style="height:24.95pt; border-top:none; width:20pt">
 </td>
<td class="xl65" width="568" style="border-top:none; border-left:none; width:426pt">
 </td>
<td class="xl66" width="27" style="border-top:none; border-left:none; width:20pt">
 </td>
<td class="xl66" width="73" style="border-top:none; border-left:none; width:55pt">
 </td>
<td class="xl68" width="73" style="border-top:none; border-left:none; width:55pt">
 </td>
<td class="xl68" width="535" style="border-top:none; border-left:none; width:401pt">
 </td>
<td class="xl68" width="65" style="border-top:none; border-left:none; width:49pt">
 </td>
<td class="xl77" width="183" style="border-top:none; border-left:none; width:137pt">
 </td>
</tr>
<tr height="33" style="height:24.95pt">
<td class="xl80" width="26" height="33" style="height:24.95pt; border-top:none; width:20pt">
 </td>
<td class="xl81" width="568" style="border-top:none; border-left:none; width:426pt">
Total K-factor</td>
<td class="xl81" width="27" style="border-top:none; border-left:none; width:20pt">
62</td>
<td class="xl81" width="73" style="border-top:none; border-left:none; width:55pt">
 </td>
<td class="xl82" width="73" style="border-top:none; border-left:none; width:55pt">
 </td>
<td class="xl82" width="535" style="border-top:none; border-left:none; width:401pt">
 </td>
<td class="xl82" width="65" style="border-top:none; border-left:none; width:49pt">
61</td>
<td class="xl83" width="183" style="border-top:none; border-left:none; width:137pt">
 </td>
</tr>
</tbody>
</table>
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