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Well thought out discussion. Thanks Larry.<br>
<br>
As has already been pointed out, the FAI 5kg rules defines how our
pattern models are designed. If we change the AMA rules to go along
with common practice at local and regional contest, it will have
zero impact on the pattern models commonly available to us. On the
other hand, if the FAI changes/eliminates the 5Kg rule and we don't
follow, very soon we will have no legal pattern models available.
Not likely to happen. I'm just pointing out who is in charge here.<br>
<br>
It's been fairly well established that there is no advantage in
flying a heavy model so what does an AMA weight rule accomplish?
Locally absolutely nothing since no one has ever checked weights at
a local contest with the intent of disqualifying overweight models.
At the Nats, who knows. Most of the overweight models never showed
up. I have checked model weights at a local contest. As I recall,
about half were over 5Kg. All were recognized pattern models.<br>
<br>
There is also a whole class of sport scale models in the 75-78 inch
span area costing about $350 into which you can put a DLE 30cc for
about $300 and operate much cheaper than four stroke or battery.
Many of these can be set up for less than it cost to put an Osiris
in the air and can be made to fly very well. Unlikely that you will
stay under 5Kg, however. Part of what we should be looking for is a
way to improve participation and lower costs. Including this class
of models as legal might help.<br>
<br>
There are two types of participants. One shows up at a contest to
win and the other shows up to participate. Of course there is some
overlap there. <span class="moz-smiley-s1"><span>:-)</span></span>
The contestant looking to win shows up with a current design and it
will weigh less than 5Kg regardless of weight rules. The second
might be interested in reducing participation costs and doesn't care
about the weight rule either as long as his model is acceptable to
the CD.<br>
<br>
Other countries recognize the distinction between the FAI
requirements of 5Kg and the weight limits for their national
classes. The French have a limit of 5.5Kg + 1% which I believe is
only checked at their Nats. Why shouldn't we do something about the
weight rule for AMA classes? I don't see the French designing planes
around 5.5Kg.<br>
<br>
I firmly believe we could abolish or diminish the impact of the AMA
weight rule without any negative impact on model design and it might
do some good in legalizing some hand me down models and increase the
variety of legal models .<br>
<br>
John Gayer<br>
<br>
<div class="moz-cite-prefix">On 1/28/2017 10:40 AM, Larry Diamond
via NSRCA-discussion wrote:<br>
</div>
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<div class="WordSection1">
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F497D">I
personally have never attended the NATS. I hope to in the
future. With that said, my point of view from a competitor
stand point:<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F497D"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F497D">We
have rules and these rules apply to all those that compete
in any sport or event. If you are traveling to a National
Event and you know they will be checking and you don’t take
the initiative to ensure you comply with the rules, you
deserve to be sent home or you can get your equipment to
comply with the rules.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F497D"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F497D">Why
do I have this view? If at least one who is present for the
National Event, spent time and money to make certain their
equipment is within the rules, any relief to any other
participant grossly disenfranchises the effort of those that
comply. This is why we have rules.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F497D"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F497D">For
Instance, another SIG such as IMAC. A plane must represent a
full scale aerobatic aircraft that has either competed or
was designed to compete in full scale aerobatics. For me,
this is a much more silly rule as often the application of
the rule could be influenced by subjectivity. One could
argue that the wing span dictates the other features.
However, if your IMAC aircraft is deemed to not be
compliant, will they let you compete for a National
Championship? I think you would get sent home or need to
find an aircraft that is compliant, and I would agree with
that as well.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F497D"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F497D">Now
with the weight issue. We have struggled with this issue
since I have been an NSRCA member from 2003. This is has
been tabled evidently from the beginning of Pattern. If the
rules are changed to whatever, then they are the rules and
binding at a National Event. Comply or be sent home.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F497D"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F497D">There
are other SIGS which do not have weight or size limits. We
are free to participate in them as well. However, here we
are talking about Pattern. Changing a rule will not be the
reason Pattern will grow or decline. Interestingly enough,
these debates may contribute to the elitist stigma and
influence the reason for decline.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F497D"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F497D">Again
I will state, we (Pattern) exist because of a purpose and a
<u>culture</u>. Changing the rule simply because people
don’t like it will result in an evolutional change of
Pattern (Good or Bad). You may agree or disagree, but I
would ask to look at the history as outlined in another post
which shows the facts of this result.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F497D"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F497D">Interestingly
enough, those that fly pattern control the market of design
and cost (including robustness of LG). If you are buying
inferior products which can’t make weight, then you are part
of the weight problem not the NSRCA and/or rules. Designers
and companies will build what sells. Pattern is a Pull
market, not a push market unless we allow/accept it as
consumers.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F497D"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F497D">If
we are to propose a rule change, we must understand the
potential outcomes (good or bad). The decision must be based
on the Vision of Pattern, Principles, and ultimately our
culture.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F497D"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F497D">My
.02, I could be wrong…<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F497D"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F497D">Best
Regards,<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F497D"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:#1F497D">Larry
Diamond</span><span style="color:#1F497D"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F497D"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<div>
<div style="border:none;border-top:solid #E1E1E1
1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0in 0in 0in">
<p class="MsoNormal"><b><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">From:</span></b><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">
NSRCA-discussion
[<a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces@lists.nsrca.org">mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces@lists.nsrca.org</a>] <b>On
Behalf Of </b>Randy Forbus via NSRCA-discussion<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Saturday, January 28, 2017 8:30 AM<br>
<b>To:</b> Larry and Eileen <a class="moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" href="mailto:fitch5@frontier.com"><fitch5@frontier.com></a>;
'General pattern discussion'
<a class="moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" href="mailto:nsrca-discussion@lists.nsrca.org"><nsrca-discussion@lists.nsrca.org></a><br>
<b>Subject:</b> Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Rules Proposal
Cycle?<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
</div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
<div id="divtagdefaultwrapper">
<p><span
style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:black">I'm
sure its happed before<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-bottom:12.0pt"><span
style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:black"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<div>
<div class="MsoNormal" style="text-align:center"
align="center"><span
style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:black">
<hr align="center" size="2" width="98%"></span></div>
<div id="divRplyFwdMsg">
<p class="MsoNormal"><b><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:black">From:</span></b><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:black">
Larry and Eileen <<a moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:fitch5@frontier.com">fitch5@frontier.com</a>><br>
<b>Sent:</b> Saturday, January 28, 2017 2:28 PM<br>
<b>To:</b> 'Randy Forbus'; 'General pattern
discussion'<br>
<b>Subject:</b> RE: [NSRCA-discussion] Rules Proposal
Cycle?</span><span
style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:black">
<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:black"> <o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
</div>
<div>
<div>
<p><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F497D">If
50grams sends a person home, I think you have a
silly rule. Just saying….</span><span
style="color:black"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p><a moz-do-not-send="true" name="_MailEndCompose"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F497D"> </span></a><span
style="color:black"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<div>
<div style="border:none;border-top:solid windowtext
1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0in 0in
0in;border-color:currentColor
currentColor;border-image: none">
<p><b><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:black">From:</span></b><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:black">
NSRCA-discussion [<a moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces@lists.nsrca.org">mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces@lists.nsrca.org</a>]
<b>On Behalf Of </b>Randy Forbus via
NSRCA-discussion<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Saturday, January 28, 2017 6:20 AM<br>
<b>To:</b> Dr. Mike Harrison <<a
moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:drmikedds@sbcglobal.net">drmikedds@sbcglobal.net</a>>;
General pattern discussion <<a
moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:nsrca-discussion@lists.nsrca.org">nsrca-discussion@lists.nsrca.org</a>><br>
<b>Subject:</b> Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Rules
Proposal Cycle?</span><span style="color:black"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
</div>
<p><span style="color:black"> <o:p></o:p></span></p>
<div id="divtagdefaultwrapper">
<p><span
style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:black"> I
think the point is , if a person drives 20 hours
to the Nats , and then gets turned away because he
is 50 grams overweight, that person wont be going
to the Nats anymore, everyone knows the rules, but
you can do everything right and still be over
weight.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p><span
style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:black"> </span><span
style="color:black"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<div>
<div class="MsoNormal" style="text-align:center"
align="center"><span
style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:black">
<hr align="center" size="2" width="98%"></span></div>
<div id="divRplyFwdMsg">
<p><b><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:black">From:</span></b><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:black">
NSRCA-discussion <<a moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces@lists.nsrca.org">nsrca-discussion-bounces@lists.nsrca.org</a>>
on behalf of Dr. Mike Harrison via
NSRCA-discussion <<a moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:nsrca-discussion@lists.nsrca.org">nsrca-discussion@lists.nsrca.org</a>><br>
<b>Sent:</b> Thursday, January 26, 2017 4:27
PM<br>
<b>To:</b> 'John Fuqua'; 'General pattern
discussion'<br>
<b>Subject:</b> Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Rules
Proposal Cycle?</span><span
style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:black">
</span><span style="color:black"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<div>
<p><span
style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:black"> </span><span
style="color:black"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
</div>
<div>
<div>
<p><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F497D">What
I take away from here is that there are very
good points by all. </span><span
style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:black"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F497D"> </span><span
style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:black"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<div>
<div style="border:none;border-top:solid
windowtext 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0in 0in
0in;border-color:currentColor;border-image:
none">
<p><b><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:black">From:</span></b><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:black">
NSRCA-discussion [<a
moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces@lists.nsrca.org">mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces@lists.nsrca.org</a>]
<b>On Behalf Of </b>John Fuqua via
NSRCA-discussion<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Thursday, January 26, 2017
8:26 AM<br>
<b>To:</b> 'General pattern discussion'
<<a moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:nsrca-discussion@lists.nsrca.org">nsrca-discussion@lists.nsrca.org</a>><br>
<b>Subject:</b> Re: [NSRCA-discussion]
Rules Proposal Cycle?</span><span
style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:black"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
</div>
<p><span
style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:black"> <o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F497D">Agree
totally. Weight is a false flag for
Masters and FAI. It made some sense to
raise the weight for the lower classes as
they often fly pass down previously owned
planes which tend to grow in weight as they
are passed around.</span><span
style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:black"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F497D"> </span><span
style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:black"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F497D">My
fear has always been the law of unintended
consequences when a radical change is made
without fully appreciating the ingenuity of
the pattern people. </span><span
style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:black"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F497D"> </span><span
style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:black"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F497D"> </span><span
style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:black"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<div>
<div style="border:none;border-top:solid
windowtext 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0in 0in
0in;border-color:currentColor;border-image:
none">
<p><b><span
style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma",sans-serif;color:black">From:</span></b><span
style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma",sans-serif;color:black">
NSRCA-discussion [<a
moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces@lists.nsrca.org">mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces@lists.nsrca.org</a>]
<b>On Behalf Of </b>Dave Lockhart via
NSRCA-discussion<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Thursday, January 26, 2017
7:45 AM<br>
<b>To:</b> 'General pattern discussion'<br>
<b>Subject:</b> Re: [NSRCA-discussion]
Rules Proposal Cycle?</span><span
style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:black"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
</div>
<p><span
style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:black"> <o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F497D">IF
all other things are equal, heavier does not
fly better. The “IF” is rarely (if ever)
considered by proponents of raising the
weight limit.</span><span
style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:black"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F497D"> </span><span
style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:black"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F497D">IF
the added weight is used to increase power,
size, or performance, it is an advantage
that will raise the performance (and cost)
and nothing changes except the cost has
increased for everyone. The reason so many
planes are close to the limits is because
they have been designed for the greatest
performance available within the limits, by
pushing right up to the limits.</span><span
style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:black"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F497D"> </span><span
style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:black"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F497D">Most
airplane designers have recommended
equipment to complete the plane at or below
the weight limit. The electric “pigs” that
won’t make the weight limit are ALL the
modern day large 2M planes when equipped
with the heaviest motor, heaviest motor
batteries, heaviest RX/servo power supply
(dual redundant everything with 10 amp
magnetic switches), heaviest servos,
heaviest linkages, heaviest wheels, plethora
of telemetry sensors, etc. Any airplane can
be made overweight. If someone has the
opinion it is ok to be less competitive for
being overweight, being less competitive
with a smaller plane that does make weight
is pretty much the same scenario (but is
legal to the letter of the rules).</span><span
style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:black"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F497D"> </span><span
style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:black"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F497D">I
don’t think we get a lot of new people
flying pattern at the NATs…which…in practice
is the only contest where weight is
checked. In the northeast US, any number of
contests have advertised waivers of the
weight limit, and in ~20 years, there have
been very few overweight entrants, and I
can’t think of any pattern converts as a
result of waiving the weight limit.</span><span
style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:black"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F497D"> </span><span
style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:black"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F497D">Regards,</span><span
style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:black"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F497D"> </span><span
style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:black"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F497D">Dave</span><span
style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:black"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F497D"> </span><span
style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:black"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<div>
<div style="border:none;border-top:solid
windowtext 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0in 0in
0in;border-color:currentColor;border-image:
none">
<p><b><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:black">From:</span></b><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:black">
NSRCA-discussion [<a
moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces@lists.nsrca.org">mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces@lists.nsrca.org</a>]
<b>On Behalf Of </b>Oscar via
NSRCA-discussion<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Wednesday, January 25, 2017
9:27 PM<br>
<b>To:</b> Patternpilot One <<a
moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:patternpilot1@hotmail.com">patternpilot1@hotmail.com</a>>;
General pattern discussion <<a
moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:nsrca-discussion@lists.nsrca.org">nsrca-discussion@lists.nsrca.org</a>><br>
<b>Subject:</b> Re: [NSRCA-discussion]
Rules Proposal Cycle?</span><span
style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:black"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
</div>
<p><span
style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:black"> <o:p></o:p></span></p>
<div>
<p><span style="font-family:"Segoe UI
Symbol",sans-serif;color:black">😀😀😀</span><span
style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:black"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p><span
style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:black"><br>
On Jan 25, 2017, at 5:46 PM, Patternpilot
One via NSRCA-discussion <<a
moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:nsrca-discussion@lists.nsrca.org">nsrca-discussion@lists.nsrca.org</a>>
wrote:<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<blockquote
style="margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt">
<div>
<div>
<p><span
style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:black">I
see the potential for more people to
fly pattern without the weight limit.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p><span
style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:black"> <o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p><span
style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:black">Sa.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p><span
style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:black"> <o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p><span
style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:black"> <o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p><span
style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:black"> <o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div id="composer_signature">
<div>
<p><span
style="font-size:10.5pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#364F67">Sent
from my Verizon 4G LTE smartphone</span><span
style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:black"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
</div>
<p><span
style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:black"><br>
<br>
-------- Original message --------<br>
From: Larry Diamond via NSRCA-discussion
<<a moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:nsrca-discussion@lists.nsrca.org">nsrca-discussion@lists.nsrca.org</a>>
<br>
Date: 1/25/17 5:34 PM (GMT-05:00) <br>
To: Whodaddy Whodaddy <<a
moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:whodaddy10@gmail.com">whodaddy10@gmail.com</a>>,
General pattern discussion <<a
moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:nsrca-discussion@lists.nsrca.org">nsrca-discussion@lists.nsrca.org</a>>
<br>
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Rules
Proposal Cycle? <o:p></o:p></span></p>
<div>
<div>
<p><span
style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:black">Hmmmm.
No weight limit...<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p><span
style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:black"> <o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p><span
style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:black">I
see a new market for a full 2M wing
span on bi-planes sporting a
YS-300DZ twin on the horizon... vbg<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p><span
style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:black"> <o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p><span
style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:black"> <o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p><span
style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:black"> <o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div id="composer_signature">
<div>
<p><span
style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#575757">Sent
via the Samsung Galaxy S® 6, an
AT&T 4G LTE smartphone</span><span
style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:black"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
</div>
<div>
<p><span
style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:black"> <o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<div>
<p><span
style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:black">--------
Original message --------<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p><span
style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:black">From:
Whodaddy Whodaddy via
NSRCA-discussion <<a
moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:nsrca-discussion@lists.nsrca.org">nsrca-discussion@lists.nsrca.org</a>>
<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p><span
style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:black">Date:
1/25/17 4:20 PM (GMT-06:00) <o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p><span
style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:black">To:
Jas S <<a
moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:justanotherflyr@gmail.com">justanotherflyr@gmail.com</a>>,
General pattern discussion <<a
moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:nsrca-discussion@lists.nsrca.org">nsrca-discussion@lists.nsrca.org</a>>
<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p><span
style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:black">Subject:
Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Rules
Proposal Cycle? <o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p><span
style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:black"> <o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
</div>
<div>
<p><span
style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:black">Not
a fan of rule change for weight ..
Cost is an obsolete argument blah
blah blah ... Im well under with no
extravagant $$$ or measures ... If
manufacturers are building heavy
components for their planes and
that plane is overweight then dont
buy the dang thing .. There is
enough information as to the dews
and donts to get planes under weight
and wat planes leave the factory as
over weight pigs... .. I you dont
pay attention its ur fault u fly a
pig ... Dont change the rules cause
u refuse to pay attention ... <o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div id="AppleMailSignature">
<p><span
style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:black"> <o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div id="AppleMailSignature">
<p><span
style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:black">Nuff
said<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div id="AppleMailSignature">
<p><span
style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:black"> <o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div id="AppleMailSignature">
<p><span
style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:black">G<br>
<br>
Sent from my iPhone<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p><span
style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:black"><br>
On Jan 25, 2017, at 12:20 PM, Jas S
via NSRCA-discussion <<a
moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:nsrca-discussion@lists.nsrca.org">nsrca-discussion@lists.nsrca.org</a>>
wrote:<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<blockquote
style="margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt">
<div>
<div>
<p><span
style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:black">There
is one. The pilot with an 'over
weight' can now compete at the
Nats<br>
<br>
Jas iP<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p><span
style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:black"><br>
On Jan 25, 2017, at 1:20 PM,
Ronald Van Putte via
NSRCA-discussion <<a
moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:nsrca-discussion@lists.nsrca.org">nsrca-discussion@lists.nsrca.org</a>>
wrote:<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<blockquote
style="margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt">
<div>
<p><span
style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:black">Come
on now! How can hobby shops
make some $$$ on a customer
who needs to “buy some
lightness” if the weight limit
is thrown in the trash? <o:p></o:p></span></p>
<div>
<p><span
style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:black"> <o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p><span
style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:black">I
hope that all readers
realize that my tongue was
firmly in my cheek when I
posted the above. There is
no advantage in R/C
aerobatic competition for a
pilot to fly a heavy
airplane.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p><span
style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:black"> <o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p><span
style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:black">Ron
Van Putte<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p><span
style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:black"> <o:p></o:p></span></p>
<div>
<blockquote
style="margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt">
<div>
<p><span
style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:black">On
Jan 25, 2017, at 10:58
AM, Keith Hoard via
NSRCA-discussion <<a
moz-do-not-send="true" href="mailto:nsrca-discussion@lists.nsrca.org">nsrca-discussion@lists.nsrca.org</a>>
wrote:<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<p><span
style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:black"> <o:p></o:p></span></p>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<p><span
style="font-size:14.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F497D">I
think its time to
throw the weight
limit in the
trash. There is
nothing keeping
anyone from
voluntarily
spending half of a
paycheck to drop a
few grams.</span><span
style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:black"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p><span
style="font-size:14.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F497D"> </span><span
style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:black"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<div
style="border:none;border-top:solid
windowtext
1.0pt;padding:3.0pt
0in 0in
0in;border-color:currentColor;border-image:
none">
<div>
<p><b><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:black">From:</span></b><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:black"> NSRCA-discussion
[<a
moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces@lists.nsrca.org"><span
style="color:#954F72">mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces@lists.nsrca.org</span></a>] <b>On
Behalf Of </b>blotch44026---
via
NSRCA-discussion<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Wednesday,
January 25,
2017 10:56<br>
<b>To:</b> Joe
Lachowski <<a
moz-do-not-send="true" href="mailto:jlachow@hotmail.com"><span
style="color:#954F72">jlachow@hotmail.com</span></a>>;
General
pattern
discussion
<<a
moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:nsrca-discussion@lists.nsrca.org"><span
style="color:#954F72">nsrca-discussion@lists.nsrca.org</span></a>>;
General
pattern
discussion
<<a
moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:nsrca-discussion@lists.nsrca.org"><span
style="color:#954F72">nsrca-discussion@lists.nsrca.org</span></a>><br>
<b>Subject:</b> Re:
[NSRCA-discussion] Rules Proposal Cycle?</span><span
style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:black"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
</div>
</div>
<div>
<p><span
style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:black"> <o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p><span
style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:black">+1</span><span
style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:black"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<blockquote
style="border:none;border-left:solid
windowtext
1.5pt;padding:0in
0in 0in
4.0pt;margin-left:0in;margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt;border-color:currentColor
currentColor
currentColor
blue;border-image:
none">
<div>
<p><span
style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:black">-----Original
Message----- <br>
From: Joe
Lachowski via
NSRCA-discussion <br>
Sent: Jan 24,
2017 5:04 PM <br>
To: General
pattern
discussion <br>
Subject:
[NSRCA-discussion]
Rules Proposal
Cycle? </span><span
style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:black"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div
id="divtagdefaultwrapper">
<p><span
style="font-size:10.5pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:black">Does
anyone know
when the next
rules proposal
cycle begins?</span><span
style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:black"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p><span
style="font-size:10.5pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:black"> </span><span
style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:black"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p><span
style="font-size:10.5pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:black">I
think it is
time to
stretch the
weight limit
to at least 4
ozs over 11
lbs. for
electrics in
ALL the AMA
classes. Tired
of paying the
proverbial
$100 and ounce
to get there.
Glow setups
have an
advantage. No
doubt in my
mind.</span><span
style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:black"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p><span
style="font-size:10.5pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:black"> </span><span
style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:black"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p><span
style="font-size:10.5pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:black">Flame
on.</span><span
style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:black"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
</blockquote>
</div>
</div>
<p><span
style="font-size:10.5pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:black">_______________________________________________<br>
NSRCA-discussion
mailing list<br>
</span><span
style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:black"><a
moz-do-not-send="true" href="mailto:NSRCA-discussion@lists.nsrca.org"><span
style="font-size:10.5pt;color:#954F72">NSRCA-discussion@lists.nsrca.org</span></a></span><span
style="font-size:10.5pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:black"><br>
</span><span
style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:black"><a
moz-do-not-send="true"
href="http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion"><span
style="font-size:10.5pt;color:#954F72">http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion</span></a><o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
</blockquote>
</div>
<p><span
style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:black"> <o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
</div>
</blockquote>
<blockquote
style="margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt">
<div>
<p><span
style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:black">_______________________________________________<br>
NSRCA-discussion mailing list<br>
<a moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:NSRCA-discussion@lists.nsrca.org">NSRCA-discussion@lists.nsrca.org</a><br>
<a moz-do-not-send="true"
href="http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion">http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion</a><o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
</blockquote>
</div>
</blockquote>
<blockquote
style="margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt">
<div>
<p><span
style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:black">_______________________________________________<br>
NSRCA-discussion mailing list<br>
<a moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:NSRCA-discussion@lists.nsrca.org">NSRCA-discussion@lists.nsrca.org</a><br>
<a moz-do-not-send="true"
href="http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion">http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion</a><o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
</blockquote>
</div>
</div>
</blockquote>
<blockquote
style="margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt">
<div>
<p><span
style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:black">_______________________________________________<br>
NSRCA-discussion mailing list<br>
<a moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:NSRCA-discussion@lists.nsrca.org">NSRCA-discussion@lists.nsrca.org</a><br>
<a moz-do-not-send="true"
href="http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion">http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion</a><o:p></o:p></span></p>
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</div>
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<fieldset class="mimeAttachmentHeader"></fieldset>
<br>
<pre wrap="">_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
<a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:NSRCA-discussion@lists.nsrca.org">NSRCA-discussion@lists.nsrca.org</a>
<a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion">http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion</a></pre>
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