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The alternative scenario is the problem Matt. The top flyers (and typically those that are designing the planes) are able to “drive perfectly”. So they will design their plane to maximize the parameters given to them. Bigger planes fly better. Period. And
with no power limits (especially with glow), added weight means I can add power, and add size. Yes, I still have to build a fragile plane (have you looked at some of the bi-planes???) but that’s ok for that set of flyers.
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<div class="">Now here’s the problem. If the top guys are winning with giant 12lb bi-planes that barely make weight… Are you still going to be happy flying your (now little) 2m beefy plane that was designed to fly at 10.5lbs but currently weighs 11.5lbs?
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<div class="">Clearly not. I say clearly not, because if that WERE the case, you’d be happy flying a 2003 design which can easily make weight today (and is still likely 2m in both directions). </div>
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<div class="">Dave’s point is simply that the limit is there to keep the top flyers “bound” in their limits. Making weight is easy if you stop chasing the top flyers and their equipment. But if you raise your limits, you raise their limits as well. And
they will make good use of the extra pound and it WONT be for durability.<br class="">
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<div class="">As an aside, my current plane (Proteus) is 3650 RTF with 2 Rx batteries and a 1200gm 10s5000. Stock Pletty motor and stock Mezon ESC (not the “lite” version) and a 94gm wooden prop. You’re correct… it has über light built up (and therefore
fragile) wings, and while I consider the landing gear pretty beefy (I fly off rough grass at my home field) I’m pretty gentle on most landings or there could be trouble. In this particular case, you could EASILY have foam wings and beefier gear and still
make weight with room to spare.</div>
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<b style="font-size: 11pt; text-align: -webkit-auto; orphans: auto; widows: auto;" class=""><span style="font-family: Lato, sans-serif; color: rgb(101, 100, 106);" class="">MARK </span></b><b style="font-size: 11pt; text-align: -webkit-auto; orphans: auto; widows: auto;" class=""><span style="font-family: Lato, sans-serif; color: rgb(128, 189, 1);" class="">ATWOOD</span></b></div>
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<div style="margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 11pt;" class=""><span style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: Lato, sans-serif; color: rgb(101, 100, 106);" class="">e. </span><a href="mailto:atwoodm@paragon-inc.com" style="font-size: 11pt; text-align: -webkit-auto;" class=""><span style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: Lato, sans-serif; color: rgb(101, 100, 106);" class="">atwoodm@paragon-inc.com</span></a></div>
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<div style="margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 11pt;" class=""><b class=""><span style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: Lato, sans-serif; color: rgb(101, 100, 106);" class="">Paragon Consulting, Inc.</span></b><b class=""><span style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: Lato, sans-serif; color: rgb(101, 100, 106);" class=""><o:p class=""></o:p></span></b></div>
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<div style="margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 11pt;" class=""><a href="http://www.paragon-inc.com/" style="color: purple;" class=""></a><u class=""><span style="color: rgb(101, 100, 106);" class=""><o:p class=""></o:p></span></u></div>
<div style="margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 11pt;" class=""><b class=""><span style="font-size: 8pt; font-family: Lato, sans-serif; color: rgb(101, 100, 106);" class="">Powering The Digital Experience</span></b></div>
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<div class="">On Jan 26, 2017, at 9:08 AM, Matthew Finley via NSRCA-discussion <<a href="mailto:nsrca-discussion@lists.nsrca.org" class="">nsrca-discussion@lists.nsrca.org</a>> wrote:</div>
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<div style="margin-top: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px;" class="">Here is my two cents on this matter, and I will see how this is taken......</div>
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<div style="margin-top: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px;" class="">Lets say we raise the weight limit to lets say a reasonable 12 pounds.... Manufactures then would be able to not sacrifice strength in areas that are " In my Opinion " very poorly strengthened now....
Ie Landing gear mounts, built up wings vs sheeted foam cores... " In my Opinion " it is very sad that we are so orientated around weight that a high $$$ plane that just makes weight before the first semi-hard landing, does not make it after repairs are done<strong id="OWAStrongID" style="font-family: Calibri, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif; font-size: 16px;" class=""></strong></div>
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<div style="margin-top: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px;" class="">once the landing gear is ripped out, and holes repaired in bottom of wings due to wheel pants driving up through them.<strong id="OWAStrongID" style="font-size: 12pt;" class=""></strong></div>
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<div style="margin-top: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px;" class="">Car Salesman : You will love this Car as it has the newest lightest and greatest glass filled nylon wheel bolts !!!</div>
<div style="margin-top: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px;" class="">Buyer : Um.... Don't you think they are a little " marginal " to handle the stress and weight of the car ?</div>
<div style="margin-top: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px;" class="">Car Salesman : Well, drive perfect, don't hit a McDonald's drive through curb, don't skid, and don't slam on the breaks and you will be fine !!</div>
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<i class=""><b class="">Matthew E. Finley</b></i><br class="">
QCI - Technology Assistant<br class="">
614-557-3846 Mobile<br class="">
<a href="mailto:mfinley@qcillc.com" class="">mfinley@qcillc.com</a><br class="">
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<div id="divRplyFwdMsg" dir="ltr" class=""><font face="Calibri, sans-serif" style="font-size: 11pt;" class=""><b class="">From:</b><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span>NSRCA-discussion <<a href="mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces@lists.nsrca.org" class="">nsrca-discussion-bounces@lists.nsrca.org</a>>
on behalf of Dave Lockhart via NSRCA-discussion <<a href="mailto:nsrca-discussion@lists.nsrca.org" class="">nsrca-discussion@lists.nsrca.org</a>><br class="">
<b class="">Sent:</b><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span>Thursday, January 26, 2017 8:45:18 AM<br class="">
<b class="">To:</b><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span>'General pattern discussion'<br class="">
<b class="">Subject:</b><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span>Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Rules Proposal Cycle?</font>
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<span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);" class="">IF all other things are equal, heavier does not fly better. The “IF” is rarely (if ever) considered by proponents of raising the weight limit.<o:p class=""></o:p></span></div>
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<span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);" class=""><o:p class=""> </o:p></span></div>
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<span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);" class="">IF the added weight is used to increase power, size, or performance, it is an advantage that will raise the performance (and cost) and nothing changes except
the cost has increased for everyone. The reason so many planes are close to the limits is because they have been designed for the greatest performance available within the limits, by pushing right up to the limits.<o:p class=""></o:p></span></div>
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<span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);" class="">Most airplane designers have recommended equipment to complete the plane at or below the weight limit. The electric “pigs” that won’t make the weight limit are
ALL the modern day large 2M planes when equipped with the heaviest motor, heaviest motor batteries, heaviest RX/servo power supply (dual redundant everything with 10 amp magnetic switches), heaviest servos, heaviest linkages, heaviest wheels, plethora of telemetry
sensors, etc. Any airplane can be made overweight. If someone has the opinion it is ok to be less competitive for being overweight, being less competitive with a smaller plane that does make weight is pretty much the same scenario (but is legal to the letter
of the rules).<o:p class=""></o:p></span></div>
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<span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);" class="">I don’t think we get a lot of new people flying pattern at the NATs…which…in practice is the only contest where weight is checked. In the northeast US, any number
of contests have advertised waivers of the weight limit, and in ~20 years, there have been very few overweight entrants, and I can’t think of any pattern converts as a result of waiving the weight limit.<o:p class=""></o:p></span></div>
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<span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);" class="">Regards,<o:p class=""></o:p></span></div>
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<span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);" class="">Dave<o:p class=""></o:p></span></div>
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<b class=""><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;" class="">From:</span></b><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;" class=""><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span>NSRCA-discussion [<a href="mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces@lists.nsrca.org" class="">mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces@lists.nsrca.org</a>]<span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><b class="">On
Behalf Of<span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span></b>Oscar via NSRCA-discussion<br class="">
<b class="">Sent:</b><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span>Wednesday, January 25, 2017 9:27 PM<br class="">
<b class="">To:</b><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span>Patternpilot One <<a href="mailto:patternpilot1@hotmail.com" class="">patternpilot1@hotmail.com</a>>; General pattern discussion <<a href="mailto:nsrca-discussion@lists.nsrca.org" class="">nsrca-discussion@lists.nsrca.org</a>><br class="">
<b class="">Subject:</b><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span>Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Rules Proposal Cycle?<o:p class=""></o:p></span></div>
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😀😀😀<o:p class=""></o:p></div>
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On Jan 25, 2017, at 5:46 PM, Patternpilot One via NSRCA-discussion <<a href="mailto:nsrca-discussion@lists.nsrca.org" style="color: blue; text-decoration: underline;" class="">nsrca-discussion@lists.nsrca.org</a>> wrote:<o:p class=""></o:p></div>
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I see the potential for more people to fly pattern without the weight limit.<o:p class=""></o:p></div>
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Sa.<o:p class=""></o:p></div>
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<span style="font-size: 10.5pt; color: rgb(54, 79, 103);" class="">Sent from my Verizon 4G LTE smartphone<o:p class=""></o:p></span></div>
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-------- Original message --------<br class="">
From: Larry Diamond via NSRCA-discussion <<a href="mailto:nsrca-discussion@lists.nsrca.org" style="color: blue; text-decoration: underline;" class="">nsrca-discussion@lists.nsrca.org</a>><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><br class="">
Date: 1/25/17 5:34 PM (GMT-05:00)<span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><br class="">
To: Whodaddy Whodaddy <<a href="mailto:whodaddy10@gmail.com" style="color: blue; text-decoration: underline;" class="">whodaddy10@gmail.com</a>>, General pattern discussion <<a href="mailto:nsrca-discussion@lists.nsrca.org" style="color: blue; text-decoration: underline;" class="">nsrca-discussion@lists.nsrca.org</a>><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><br class="">
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Rules Proposal Cycle?<span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><o:p class=""></o:p></div>
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Hmmmm. No weight limit...<o:p class=""></o:p></div>
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I see a new market for a full 2M wing span on bi-planes sporting a YS-300DZ twin on the horizon... vbg<o:p class=""></o:p></div>
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<span style="font-size: 10pt; color: rgb(87, 87, 87);" class="">Sent via the Samsung Galaxy S® 6, an AT&T 4G LTE smartphone<o:p class=""></o:p></span></div>
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<span style="" class="">From: Whodaddy Whodaddy via NSRCA-discussion <<a href="mailto:nsrca-discussion@lists.nsrca.org" style="color: blue; text-decoration: underline;" class="">nsrca-discussion@lists.nsrca.org</a>><o:p class=""></o:p></span></div>
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<span style="" class="">Date: 1/25/17 4:20 PM (GMT-06:00)<span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><o:p class=""></o:p></span></div>
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<span style="" class="">To: Jas S <<a href="mailto:justanotherflyr@gmail.com" style="color: blue; text-decoration: underline;" class="">justanotherflyr@gmail.com</a>>, General pattern discussion <<a href="mailto:nsrca-discussion@lists.nsrca.org" style="color: blue; text-decoration: underline;" class="">nsrca-discussion@lists.nsrca.org</a>><o:p class=""></o:p></span></div>
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<span style="" class="">Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Rules Proposal Cycle?<span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><o:p class=""></o:p></span></div>
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Not a fan of rule change for weight .. Cost is an obsolete argument blah blah blah ... Im well under with no extravagant $$$ or measures ... If manufacturers are building heavy components for their planes and that plane is overweight then dont buy the dang
thing .. There is enough information as to the dews and donts to get planes under weight and wat planes leave the factory as over weight pigs... .. I you dont pay attention its ur fault u fly a pig ... Dont change the rules cause u refuse to pay attention
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Nuff said<o:p class=""></o:p></div>
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On Jan 25, 2017, at 12:20 PM, Jas S via NSRCA-discussion <<a href="mailto:nsrca-discussion@lists.nsrca.org" style="color: blue; text-decoration: underline;" class="">nsrca-discussion@lists.nsrca.org</a>> wrote:<o:p class=""></o:p></div>
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There is one. The pilot with an 'over weight' can now compete at the Nats<br class="">
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Jas iP<o:p class=""></o:p></div>
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On Jan 25, 2017, at 1:20 PM, Ronald Van Putte via NSRCA-discussion <<a href="mailto:nsrca-discussion@lists.nsrca.org" style="color: blue; text-decoration: underline;" class="">nsrca-discussion@lists.nsrca.org</a>> wrote:<o:p class=""></o:p></div>
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Come on now! How can hobby shops make some $$$ on a customer who needs to “buy some lightness” if the weight limit is thrown in the trash?<o:p class=""></o:p></div>
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I hope that all readers realize that my tongue was firmly in my cheek when I posted the above. There is no advantage in R/C aerobatic competition for a pilot to fly a heavy airplane.<o:p class=""></o:p></div>
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Ron Van Putte<o:p class=""></o:p></div>
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On Jan 25, 2017, at 10:58 AM, Keith Hoard via NSRCA-discussion <<a href="mailto:nsrca-discussion@lists.nsrca.org" style="color: blue; text-decoration: underline;" class="">nsrca-discussion@lists.nsrca.org</a>> wrote:<o:p class=""></o:p></div>
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<span style="font-size: 14pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);" class="">I think its time to throw the weight limit in the trash. There is nothing keeping anyone from voluntarily spending half of a paycheck to drop a few grams.</span><o:p class=""></o:p></div>
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<b class=""><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;" class="">From:</span></b><span class=""><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;" class=""> </span></span><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;" class="">NSRCA-discussion
[<a href="mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces@lists.nsrca.org" style="color: blue; text-decoration: underline;" class=""><span style="color: rgb(149, 79, 114);" class="">mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces@lists.nsrca.org</span></a>]<span class=""> </span><b class="">On
Behalf Of<span class=""> </span></b>blotch44026--- via NSRCA-discussion<br class="">
<b class="">Sent:</b><span class=""> </span>Wednesday, January 25, 2017 10:56<br class="">
<b class="">To:</b><span class=""> </span>Joe Lachowski <<a href="mailto:jlachow@hotmail.com" style="color: blue; text-decoration: underline;" class=""><span style="color: rgb(149, 79, 114);" class="">jlachow@hotmail.com</span></a>>; General pattern discussion
<<a href="mailto:nsrca-discussion@lists.nsrca.org" style="color: blue; text-decoration: underline;" class=""><span style="color: rgb(149, 79, 114);" class="">nsrca-discussion@lists.nsrca.org</span></a>>; General pattern discussion <<a href="mailto:nsrca-discussion@lists.nsrca.org" style="color: blue; text-decoration: underline;" class=""><span style="color: rgb(149, 79, 114);" class="">nsrca-discussion@lists.nsrca.org</span></a>><br class="">
<b class="">Subject:</b><span class=""> </span>Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Rules Proposal Cycle?</span><o:p class=""></o:p></div>
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<span style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: Arial, sans-serif;" class="">-----Original Message-----<span class=""> </span><br class="">
From: Joe Lachowski via NSRCA-discussion<span class=""> </span><br class="">
Sent: Jan 24, 2017 5:04 PM<span class=""> </span><br class="">
To: General pattern discussion<span class=""> </span><br class="">
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Rules Proposal Cycle?<span class=""> </span><br class="">
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<span style="font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;" class="">Does anyone know when the next rules proposal cycle begins?</span><span style="font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: ArialMS, serif;" class=""><o:p class=""></o:p></span></div>
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<span style="font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;" class="">I think it is time to stretch the weight limit to at least 4 ozs over 11 lbs. for electrics in ALL the AMA classes. Tired of paying the proverbial $100 and ounce to get there. Glow
setups have an advantage. No doubt in my mind.</span><span style="font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: ArialMS, serif;" class=""><o:p class=""></o:p></span></div>
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<span style="font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;" class="">Flame on.</span><span style="font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: ArialMS, serif;" class=""><o:p class=""></o:p></span></div>
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