<html><head><meta http-equiv="Content-Type" content="text/html charset=windows-1252"></head><body style="word-wrap: break-word; -webkit-nbsp-mode: space; -webkit-line-break: after-white-space;" class=""><div class="">Looking back at your Part 91 post under uncongested areas, and thinking of the case John Ford mentioned earlier…</div><div class=""><br class=""></div><div class=""><span style="font-family: Georgia, 'Times New Roman', Times, serif; widows: 1; background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255);" class="">In the circumstance where you are over open water or sparsely populated areas, you may operate your aircraft at any altitude, but you must not fly closer than 500 feet to any person, vessel, vehicle, or structure (including electrical or telephone wires). This 500-foot minimum distance requirement may be measured horizontally, vertically, or at a slant angle.</span></div><div class=""><br class=""></div><div class="">This gives the pilot of a manned aircraft the latitude to fly below 500’ AGL over an uncongested area as long as adequate separation is maintained. For example, helicopters, crop dusters, sight seeing, aerial photography or just plain old buzzing the field. <b class="">The nuance being that just because they are asking UAV to stay below 400’ doesn’t mean that other aircraft will always be expected to remain above 500’ AGL. </b> This expectation will vary with the local terrain and as charted. Where we are in NJ/PA is almost always a congested area, which kinda works in our favor as it is rare, except for the life flight choppers who know well we are, to find aircraft below 1,000’-1,500’ over our club fields. What kind of air traffic do others see and avoid locally?</div><br class=""><div><blockquote type="cite" class=""><div class="">On Jan 21, 2016, at 6:27 PM, John Gayer via NSRCA-discussion <<a href="mailto:nsrca-discussion@lists.nsrca.org" class="">nsrca-discussion@lists.nsrca.org</a>> wrote:</div><br class="Apple-interchange-newline"><div class="">
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Dana,<br class="">
Of course we need to see and avoid. That is true for anything in the
sky that is controlled.<br class="">
The FAR relating to airspace has no reference that requires the
pilot to be onboard.<br class="">
<br class="">
I was referring to class G airspace rules below 500 feet.<br class="">
<br class="">
John<br class="">
<br class="">
<div class="moz-cite-prefix">On 1/21/2016 2:51 PM, Dana Beaton via
NSRCA-discussion wrote:<br class="">
</div>
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@ John Gayer, the thing is, regardless of what the FARs dictate to
pilots of manned aircraft, the smaller more maneuverable craft is
alway obligated to give way, and that will always be the Small UAS
with respect to anything manned. We will always be obligated to
see and avoid when flying our models. The legal basis for this
goes back to antiquity probably as a custom of the high seas, or
whenever mariners started making right of way rules for each
other. Aviation follows in this time honored tradition of
navigation, smaller craft seeing and avoiding larger vessels for
practical reasons. The onus will always be on us and guess what,
we are up to the task because we have been doing it for decades
now. Amazing actually! Safe flying guys! Dana
<div class=""><br class="">
</div>
<div class=""><br class="">
<div class="">
<blockquote type="cite" class="">
<div class="">On Jan 21, 2016, at 4:14 PM, Keith Hoard via
NSRCA-discussion <<a moz-do-not-send="true" href="mailto:nsrca-discussion@lists.nsrca.org" class="">nsrca-discussion@lists.nsrca.org</a>>
wrote:</div>
<br class="Apple-interchange-newline">
<div class="">
<div class="WordSection1" style="page: WordSection1;
font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px; font-style:
normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal;
letter-spacing: normal; orphans: auto; text-align:
start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none;
white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px;
-webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;">
<div style="margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt;
font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;" class=""><span style="font-size: 14pt; font-family: Calibri,
sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);" class="">Having
our own airspace would also have significant
financial graft appeal for the AMA, thus motivating
them to pursue this option.<o:p class=""></o:p></span></div>
<div style="margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt;
font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;" class=""><span style="font-size: 14pt; font-family: Calibri,
sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);" class=""><o:p class=""> </o:p></span></div>
<div style="margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt;
font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;" class=""><span style="font-size: 14pt; font-family: Calibri,
sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);" class="">Right
now the AMA is trying to make their “scope” the
entire surface of the U.S.A. as well as every
modeler and moron with a credit card. By spreading
themselves so thin they are setting themselves up
for failure.<o:p class=""></o:p></span></div>
<div style="margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt;
font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;" class=""><span style="font-size: 14pt; font-family: Calibri,
sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);" class=""><o:p class=""> </o:p></span></div>
<div style="margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt;
font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;" class=""><span style="font-size: 14pt; font-family: Calibri,
sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);" class="">If
the AMA would limit their “scope” to folks who
operate at designated model fields within protected
airspace, then they would funnel anyone who wishes
to operate legally to an AMA field –
“$$Cha$$-$$Ching$$” - $75/year. However, that also
means that they need to tell the FAA that they are
not responsible for anyone operating outside Class
“M” airspace and they are on their own.<o:p class=""></o:p></span></div>
<div class="">
<div style="margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt;
font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;" class=""><span style="font-size: 14pt; font-family: Calibri,
sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);" class=""><o:p class=""> </o:p></span></div>
<div style="margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt;
font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;" class=""><span style="font-size: 14pt; font-family: Calibri,
sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);" class="">-Keith
Hoard<o:p class=""></o:p></span></div>
<div style="margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt;
font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;" class=""><span style="font-size: 14pt; font-family: Calibri,
sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);" class="">-<a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:klhoard@outlook.com"></a><a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:klhoard@outlook.com">klhoard@outlook.com</a><o:p class=""></o:p></span></div>
</div>
<div style="margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt;
font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;" class=""><span style="font-size: 14pt; font-family: Calibri,
sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);" class=""><o:p class=""> </o:p></span></div>
<div class="">
<div style="border-style: solid none none;
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<div style="margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size:
12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;" class=""><b class=""><span style="font-size: 11pt;
font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;" class="">From:</span></b><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri,
sans-serif;" class=""><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span>Dana
Beaton [<a moz-do-not-send="true" href="mailto:danamaenia@me.com" class="">mailto:danamaenia@me.com</a>]<span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><br class="">
<b class="">Sent:</b><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span>Thursday,
January 21, 2016 14:59<br class="">
<b class="">To:</b><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span>Keith
Hoard <<a moz-do-not-send="true" href="mailto:klhoard@outlook.com" class="">klhoard@outlook.com</a>>;
General pattern discussion <<a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:nsrca-discussion@lists.nsrca.org"></a><a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:nsrca-discussion@lists.nsrca.org">nsrca-discussion@lists.nsrca.org</a>><br class="">
<b class="">Subject:</b><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span>Re:
[NSRCA-discussion] Update - UAS Registration
Frequently Asked Questions | AMA Government
Relations Blog<o:p class=""></o:p></span></div>
</div>
</div>
<div style="margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt;
font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;" class=""><o:p class=""> </o:p></div>
<div class="">
<div style="margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt;
font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;" class="">You
missed your big opportunity Keith! Class F airspace
is not yet defined in the good old US of A! Go for
it!!!<o:p class=""></o:p></div>
</div>
<div class="">
<div style="margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt;
font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;" class=""><o:p class=""> </o:p></div>
</div>
<div style="margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt;
font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;" class=""><o:p class=""> </o:p></div>
<div class="">
<blockquote style="margin-top: 5pt; margin-bottom:
5pt;" class="" type="cite">
<div class="">
<div style="margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size:
12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;" class="">On Jan 21, 2016, at 3:55 PM, Keith
Hoard via NSRCA-discussion <<a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:nsrca-discussion@lists.nsrca.org"></a><a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:nsrca-discussion@lists.nsrca.org">nsrca-discussion@lists.nsrca.org</a>>
wrote:<o:p class=""></o:p></div>
</div>
<div style="margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size:
12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;" class=""><o:p class=""> </o:p></div>
<div class="">
<div class="">
<div style="margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size:
12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;" class=""><span style="font-size: 14pt;
font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color:
rgb(31, 73, 125);" class="">Actually, you
could write the rules for Class “M” airspace
so that those type licenses and restrictions
wouldn’t apply.</span><o:p class=""></o:p></div>
</div>
<div class="">
<div class="">
<div style="margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt;
font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New
Roman', serif;" class=""><span style="font-size: 14pt; font-family:
Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73,
125);" class=""> </span><o:p class=""></o:p></div>
</div>
<div class="">
<div style="margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt;
font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New
Roman', serif;" class=""><span style="font-size: 14pt; font-family:
Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73,
125);" class="">-Keith Hoard</span><o:p class=""></o:p></div>
</div>
<div class="">
<div style="margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt;
font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New
Roman', serif;" class=""><span style="font-size: 14pt; font-family:
Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73,
125);" class="">-<a moz-do-not-send="true" href="mailto:klhoard@outlook.com" style="color: purple; text-decoration:
underline;" class=""><span style="color:
purple;" class="">klhoard@outlook.com</span></a></span><o:p class=""></o:p></div>
</div>
</div>
<div class="">
<div style="margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size:
12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;" class=""><span style="font-size: 14pt;
font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color:
rgb(31, 73, 125);" class=""> </span><o:p class=""></o:p></div>
</div>
<div class="">
<div class="">
<div class="">
<div class="">
<div style="margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt;
font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New
Roman', serif;" class=""> <o:p class=""></o:p></div>
</div>
</div>
<div class="">
<div class="">
<div class="">
<div style="margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt;
font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times
New Roman', serif;" class=""><span style="font-family: Calibri,
sans-serif;" class="">What class of
airspace are you asking for Keith
and do we really need that much? If
we ask for the same airspace access
as licensed private or commercial
pilots have, then we will need to
get those tickets. </span><o:p class=""></o:p></div>
</div>
</div>
<div class="">
<div class="">
<div style="margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt;
font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times
New Roman', serif;" class=""><span style="font-family: Calibri,
sans-serif;" class=""> </span><o:p class=""></o:p></div>
</div>
</div>
<div class="">
<div style="margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt;
font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New
Roman', serif;" class=""><span style="font-family: Calibri,
sans-serif;" class=""> </span><o:p class=""></o:p></div>
</div>
<div class="">
<blockquote style="margin-top: 5pt;
margin-bottom: 5pt;" class="" type="cite">
<div class="">
<div class="">
<div style="margin: 0in 0in
0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt;
font-family: 'Times New Roman',
serif;" class=""><span style="font-family: Calibri,
sans-serif;" class="">On Jan 21,
2016, at 3:09 PM, Keith Hoard
<<a moz-do-not-send="true" href="mailto:klhoard@outlook.com" style="color: purple;
text-decoration: underline;" class=""><span style="color:
purple;" class="">klhoard@outlook.com</span></a>>
wrote:</span><o:p class=""></o:p></div>
</div>
</div>
<div class="">
<div style="margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt;
font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times
New Roman', serif;" class=""><span style="font-family: Calibri,
sans-serif;" class=""> </span><o:p class=""></o:p></div>
</div>
<div class="">
<div class="">
<div class="">
<div class="">
<div style="margin: 0in 0in
0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt;
font-family: 'Times New
Roman', serif;" class=""><span style="font-size: 11pt;
font-family: Calibri,
sans-serif;" class="">Why
cant we be granted 2000
AGL? We're frickin’ full
fledged tax payin’ grown up
users of the stinkin’
National Airspace System,
right? </span><o:p class=""></o:p></div>
</div>
</div>
<div class="">
<div class="">
<div style="margin: 0in 0in
0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt;
font-family: 'Times New
Roman', serif;" class=""><span style="font-size: 11pt;
font-family: Calibri,
sans-serif;" class=""> </span><o:p class=""></o:p></div>
</div>
</div>
<div class="">
<div class="">
<div style="margin: 0in 0in
0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt;
font-family: 'Times New
Roman', serif;" class=""><span style="font-size: 11pt;
font-family: Calibri,
sans-serif;" class="">If the
FA&A has upgraded our
planes to Full Scale Status,
then they need to provide us
the proper airspace
protections we deserve.</span><o:p class=""></o:p></div>
</div>
</div>
<div class="">
<div class="">
<div style="margin: 0in 0in
0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt;
font-family: 'Times New
Roman', serif;" class=""><span style="font-size: 11pt;
font-family: Calibri,
sans-serif;" class=""> </span><o:p class=""></o:p></div>
</div>
</div>
<div class="">
<div class="">
<div style="margin: 0in 0in
0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt;
font-family: 'Times New
Roman', serif;" class=""><span style="font-size: 11pt;
font-family: Calibri,
sans-serif;" class="">Sent
from<span class="ecxxapple-converted-space"> </span><a moz-do-not-send="true" href="http://go.microsoft.com/fwlink/?LinkId=550987" target="_blank" style="color: purple;
text-decoration:
underline;" class=""><span style="color: rgb(149,
79, 114);" class="">Outlook
Mail</span></a><span class="ecxxapple-converted-space"> </span>for
Windows 10 phone</span><o:p class=""></o:p></div>
</div>
</div>
<div class="">
<div class="">
<div style="margin: 0in 0in
0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt;
font-family: 'Times New
Roman', serif;" class=""> <o:p class=""></o:p></div>
</div>
</div>
<div style="border-style: solid none
none; border-top-color: rgb(225,
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padding: 3pt 0in 0in;" class="">
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font-family: 'Times New
Roman', serif;" class=""><span style="font-size: 11pt;
font-family: Calibri,
sans-serif;" class=""><br class="">
</span><br class="">
</div>
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</blockquote>
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</blockquote>
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</blockquote>
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</blockquote>
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