<html>
  <head>
    <meta content="text/html; charset=UTF-8" http-equiv="Content-Type">
  </head>
  <body bgcolor="#FFFFFF" text="#000000">
    I would think that no matter what, our discharges are going to
    generate much more heat than a less than 1C discharge.  I would
    think the higher discharge rates would result in fewer cycles which
    is just what we see compared to manufacturer specs.<br>
    <br>
    <div class="moz-cite-prefix">On 10/9/2015 4:32 PM, Robert L.
      Beaubien via NSRCA-discussion wrote:<br>
    </div>
    <blockquote
cite="mid:9A5848CCBBDF544699E85744202C854D4A635143@EXCHANGE01.koolsoftware.local"
      type="cite">
      <meta http-equiv="Content-Type" content="text/html; charset=UTF-8">
      <meta name="Generator" content="Microsoft Word 15 (filtered
        medium)">
      <!--[if !mso]><style>v\:* {behavior:url(#default#VML);}
o\:* {behavior:url(#default#VML);}
w\:* {behavior:url(#default#VML);}
.shape {behavior:url(#default#VML);}
</style><![endif]-->
      <style><!--
/* Font Definitions */
@font-face
        {font-family:Wingdings;
        panose-1:5 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0;}
@font-face
        {font-family:"Cambria Math";
        panose-1:2 4 5 3 5 4 6 3 2 4;}
@font-face
        {font-family:Calibri;
        panose-1:2 15 5 2 2 2 4 3 2 4;}
@font-face
        {font-family:Tahoma;
        panose-1:2 11 6 4 3 5 4 4 2 4;}
@font-face
        {font-family:"Berlin Sans FB";
        panose-1:2 14 6 2 2 5 2 2 3 6;}
/* Style Definitions */
p.MsoNormal, li.MsoNormal, div.MsoNormal
        {margin:0in;
        margin-bottom:.0001pt;
        font-size:12.0pt;
        font-family:"Times New Roman",serif;}
a:link, span.MsoHyperlink
        {mso-style-priority:99;
        color:blue;
        text-decoration:underline;}
a:visited, span.MsoHyperlinkFollowed
        {mso-style-priority:99;
        color:purple;
        text-decoration:underline;}
p.msonormal0, li.msonormal0, div.msonormal0
        {mso-style-name:msonormal;
        mso-margin-top-alt:auto;
        margin-right:0in;
        mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;
        margin-left:0in;
        font-size:12.0pt;
        font-family:"Times New Roman",serif;}
p.ecxmsonormal, li.ecxmsonormal, div.ecxmsonormal
        {mso-style-name:ecxmsonormal;
        mso-margin-top-alt:auto;
        margin-right:0in;
        mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;
        margin-left:0in;
        font-size:12.0pt;
        font-family:"Times New Roman",serif;}
span.EmailStyle19
        {mso-style-type:personal-reply;
        font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;
        color:#1F497D;}
.MsoChpDefault
        {mso-style-type:export-only;
        font-size:10.0pt;}
@page WordSection1
        {size:8.5in 11.0in;
        margin:1.0in 1.0in 1.0in 1.0in;}
div.WordSection1
        {page:WordSection1;}
/* List Definitions */
@list l0
        {mso-list-id:1581795176;
        mso-list-type:hybrid;
        mso-list-template-ids:-1050363826 -608942160 67698691 67698693 67698689 67698691 67698693 67698689 67698691 67698693;}
@list l0:level1
        {mso-level-start-at:0;
        mso-level-number-format:bullet;
        mso-level-text:-;
        mso-level-tab-stop:none;
        mso-level-number-position:left;
        text-indent:-.25in;
        font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;
        mso-fareast-font-family:"Times New Roman";
        mso-bidi-font-family:"Times New Roman";}
@list l0:level2
        {mso-level-number-format:bullet;
        mso-level-text:o;
        mso-level-tab-stop:none;
        mso-level-number-position:left;
        text-indent:-.25in;
        font-family:"Courier New";}
@list l0:level3
        {mso-level-number-format:bullet;
        mso-level-text:;
        mso-level-tab-stop:none;
        mso-level-number-position:left;
        text-indent:-.25in;
        font-family:Wingdings;}
@list l0:level4
        {mso-level-number-format:bullet;
        mso-level-text:;
        mso-level-tab-stop:none;
        mso-level-number-position:left;
        text-indent:-.25in;
        font-family:Symbol;}
@list l0:level5
        {mso-level-number-format:bullet;
        mso-level-text:o;
        mso-level-tab-stop:none;
        mso-level-number-position:left;
        text-indent:-.25in;
        font-family:"Courier New";}
@list l0:level6
        {mso-level-number-format:bullet;
        mso-level-text:;
        mso-level-tab-stop:none;
        mso-level-number-position:left;
        text-indent:-.25in;
        font-family:Wingdings;}
@list l0:level7
        {mso-level-number-format:bullet;
        mso-level-text:;
        mso-level-tab-stop:none;
        mso-level-number-position:left;
        text-indent:-.25in;
        font-family:Symbol;}
@list l0:level8
        {mso-level-number-format:bullet;
        mso-level-text:o;
        mso-level-tab-stop:none;
        mso-level-number-position:left;
        text-indent:-.25in;
        font-family:"Courier New";}
@list l0:level9
        {mso-level-number-format:bullet;
        mso-level-text:;
        mso-level-tab-stop:none;
        mso-level-number-position:left;
        text-indent:-.25in;
        font-family:Wingdings;}
ol
        {margin-bottom:0in;}
ul
        {margin-bottom:0in;}
--></style><!--[if gte mso 9]><xml>
<o:shapedefaults v:ext="edit" spidmax="1026" />
</xml><![endif]--><!--[if gte mso 9]><xml>
<o:shapelayout v:ext="edit">
<o:idmap v:ext="edit" data="1" />
</o:shapelayout></xml><![endif]-->
      <div class="WordSection1">
        <p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F497D">My
            guess would be that is a function of the design of the
            battery to keep high current degradation out of the equation
            as long as you operate it within the specs.  I’m betting
            that as long as the battery temp stays reasonable, you
            aren’t “damaging” the battery during discharge.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
        <p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F497D"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
        <div>
          <p class="MsoNormal"
            style="margin-left:.5in;text-indent:-.25in;mso-list:l0
            level1 lfo1">
            <!--[if !supportLists]--><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F4E79"><span
                style="mso-list:Ignore">-<span style="font:7.0pt
                  "Times New Roman"">         
                </span></span></span><!--[endif]--><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F4E79"> Robert
              Beaubien<o:p></o:p></span></p>
          <p class="MsoNormal"
            style="margin-left:.5in;text-indent:-.25in;mso-list:l0
            level1 lfo1">
            <!--[if !supportLists]--><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F4E79"><span
                style="mso-list:Ignore">-<span style="font:7.0pt
                  "Times New Roman"">         
                </span></span></span><!--[endif]--><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F4E79"> Sr.
              Software Architect<o:p></o:p></span></p>
          <p class="MsoNormal"
            style="margin-left:.5in;text-indent:-.25in;mso-list:l0
            level1 lfo1">
            <!--[if !supportLists]--><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F4E79"><span
                style="mso-list:Ignore">-<span style="font:7.0pt
                  "Times New Roman"">         
                </span></span></span><!--[endif]--><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F4E79"> Kool
              Software LLC<o:p></o:p></span></p>
          <p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:.25in"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F497D"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
          <p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F497D">“Dear
              Algebra, Please stop asking us to find your X.  She's
              never coming back and don't ask Y.”<o:p></o:p></span></p>
        </div>
        <p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F497D"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
        <div>
          <div style="border:none;border-top:solid #E1E1E1
            1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0in 0in 0in">
            <p class="MsoNormal"><b><span
                  style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">From:</span></b><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">
                DaveL322 [<a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="mailto:DaveL322@comcast.net">mailto:DaveL322@comcast.net</a>]
                <br>
                <b>Sent:</b> Friday, October 9, 2015 12:01 PM<br>
                <b>To:</b> Robert L. Beaubien <a class="moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" href="mailto:rob@koolsoft.com"><rob@koolsoft.com></a>;
                General pattern discussion
                <a class="moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" href="mailto:nsrca-discussion@lists.nsrca.org"><nsrca-discussion@lists.nsrca.org></a><br>
                <b>Subject:</b> Re: [NSRCA-discussion] FW: 10s LiPo
                Charger Recommendation<o:p></o:p></span></p>
          </div>
        </div>
        <p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
        <div>
          <p class="MsoNormal">Presumably the life cycle data is
            generated from discharges similar to what a cell phone or
            other consumer product would see?  Maybe 1/10C, or 1/4?
             Consumer products are rarely going to see more than 1C
            peaks during discharge.  It would be interesting to know
            just how applicable the data is when the average discharge
            rate is on the order of 6 or 8C, with peaks of 20C. <o:p></o:p></p>
        </div>
        <div>
          <p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
        </div>
        <div id="composer_signature">
          <div>
            <p class="MsoNormal"><span
                style="font-size:10.0pt;color:#575757">Regards,<o:p></o:p></span></p>
          </div>
          <div>
            <p class="MsoNormal"><span
                style="font-size:10.0pt;color:#575757"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
          </div>
          <div>
            <p class="MsoNormal"><span
                style="font-size:10.0pt;color:#575757">Dave<o:p></o:p></span></p>
          </div>
          <div>
            <p class="MsoNormal"><span
                style="font-size:10.0pt;color:#575757"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
          </div>
          <div>
            <p class="MsoNormal"><span
                style="font-size:10.0pt;color:#575757">Please pardon any
                spelling errors or brevity.....Sent on a Sprint Samsung
                Galaxy Note® 3<o:p></o:p></span></p>
          </div>
        </div>
        <p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-bottom:12.0pt"><br>
          <br>
          -------- Original message --------<br>
          From: "Robert L. Beaubien via NSRCA-discussion" <<a
            moz-do-not-send="true"
            href="mailto:nsrca-discussion@lists.nsrca.org"><a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:nsrca-discussion@lists.nsrca.org">nsrca-discussion@lists.nsrca.org</a></a>>
          <br>
          Date: 10/09/2015 13:08 (GMT-05:00) <br>
          To: General pattern discussion <<a moz-do-not-send="true"
            href="mailto:nsrca-discussion@lists.nsrca.org">nsrca-discussion@lists.nsrca.org</a>>
          <br>
          Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] FW: 10s LiPo Charger
          Recommendation <o:p></o:p></p>
        <div>
          <p class="MsoNormal"
            style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F497D">Here
              is an excellent article about prolonging life of lithium
              based batteries.  A typically battery has a 300-500 cycle
              life charged to 4.2v/cell,  dropping to 4.1v/cell
              increases life to 600-1000 cycles.</span><o:p></o:p></p>
          <p class="MsoNormal"
            style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F497D"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
          <p class="MsoNormal"
            style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F497D"><a
                moz-do-not-send="true"
href="http://batteryuniversity.com/learn/article/how_to_prolong_lithium_based_batteries"><a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="http://batteryuniversity.com/learn/article/how_to_prolong_lithium_based_batteries">http://batteryuniversity.com/learn/article/how_to_prolong_lithium_based_batteries</a></a>
            </span><o:p></o:p></p>
          <p class="MsoNormal"
            style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F497D"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
          <div>
            <p class="MsoNormal"
style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:.5in;text-indent:-.25in"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F4E79">-</span><span
                style="font-size:7.0pt;color:#1F4E79">         
              </span><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F4E79"> Robert
                Beaubien</span><o:p></o:p></p>
            <p class="MsoNormal"
style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:.5in;text-indent:-.25in"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F4E79">-</span><span
                style="font-size:7.0pt;color:#1F4E79">         
              </span><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F4E79"> Sr.
                Software Architect</span><o:p></o:p></p>
            <p class="MsoNormal"
style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:.5in;text-indent:-.25in"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F4E79">-</span><span
                style="font-size:7.0pt;color:#1F4E79">         
              </span><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F4E79"> Kool
                Software LLC</span><o:p></o:p></p>
            <p class="MsoNormal"
style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:.25in"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F497D"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
            <p class="MsoNormal"
              style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F497D">“Dear
                Algebra, Please stop asking us to find your X.  She's
                never coming back and don't ask Y.”</span><o:p></o:p></p>
          </div>
          <p class="MsoNormal"
            style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F497D"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
          <div>
            <div style="border:none;border-top:solid #E1E1E1
              1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0in 0in 0in">
              <p class="MsoNormal"
                style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"><b><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">From:</span></b><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">
                  NSRCA-discussion [<a moz-do-not-send="true"
                    href="mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces@lists.nsrca.org">mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces@lists.nsrca.org</a>]
                  <b>On Behalf Of </b>James Hiller via NSRCA-discussion<br>
                  <b>Sent:</b> Friday, October 9, 2015 9:38 AM<br>
                  <b>To:</b> 'General pattern discussion' <<a
                    moz-do-not-send="true"
                    href="mailto:nsrca-discussion@lists.nsrca.org"><a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:nsrca-discussion@lists.nsrca.org">nsrca-discussion@lists.nsrca.org</a></a>><br>
                  <b>Subject:</b> Re: [NSRCA-discussion] FW: 10s LiPo
                  Charger Recommendation</span><o:p></o:p></p>
            </div>
          </div>
          <p class="MsoNormal"
            style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"> <o:p></o:p></p>
          <p class="MsoNormal"
            style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F497D">Using
              only about 45% of capacity it didn't make sense to charge
              to 4.2 so I set the charge cutoff to 4.15 last year which
              charges to about 95%. I have no proof but the batteries
              seam happier with the lower charge voltage.</span><o:p></o:p></p>
          <p class="MsoNormal"
            style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F497D">Jim</span><o:p></o:p></p>
          <p class="MsoNormal"
            style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F497D"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
          <div>
            <div style="border:none;border-top:solid #B5C4DF
              1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0in 0in 0in">
              <p class="MsoNormal"
                style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"><b><span
style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma",sans-serif">From:</span></b><span
style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma",sans-serif">
                  NSRCA-discussion [<a moz-do-not-send="true"
                    href="mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces@lists.nsrca.org">mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces@lists.nsrca.org</a>]
                  <b>On Behalf Of </b>Dave Lockhart via
                  NSRCA-discussion<br>
                  <b>Sent:</b> Friday, October 09, 2015 6:21 AM<br>
                  <b>To:</b> 'General pattern discussion'<br>
                  <b>Subject:</b> Re: [NSRCA-discussion] FW: 10s LiPo
                  Charger Recommendation</span><o:p></o:p></p>
            </div>
          </div>
          <p class="MsoNormal"
            style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"> <o:p></o:p></p>
          <p class="MsoNormal"
            style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F497D">Some
              random comments to a long thread –</span><o:p></o:p></p>
          <p class="MsoNormal"
            style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F497D"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
          <p class="MsoNormal"
            style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F497D">I
              believe a number of commercial lipo applications
              specifically limit “full charge” voltage to less than 4.2
              volts, and limit “discharged” voltage to something higher
              than 3.5 volts.  Operating the lipo in the middle of the
              voltage range increases longevity and reduces the odds of
              failure.  I’ve asked a number of “experts” if RC
              applications would be better served by operating between
              4.2 and 3.75 (typical), or 4.15 and 3.7, or 4.3 and
              3.8……never received a clear answer.  Hyperion is another
              lipo supplier that has been advertising 4.35 volt
              capability for several months now on their latest
              generation of lipo cell.</span><o:p></o:p></p>
          <p class="MsoNormal"
            style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F497D"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
          <p class="MsoNormal"
            style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F497D">ThunderPower
              might know the most about charging lipos for RC use, since
              they have been doing it as long as anyone?  The earliest
              viable packs for pattern use were various “4p”
              configurations.  Early lipo cells could not support high
              discharge rates, so putting cells in parallel was the only
              option to support high discharge rates - even then, the
              first pattern packs had a 6C BURST rating.  ThunderPower
              moved away from the “4p” configurations as soon as it was
              viable to do so.</span><o:p></o:p></p>
          <p class="MsoNormal"
            style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F497D"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
          <p class="MsoNormal"
            style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F497D">I
              don’t personally like the idea of parallel charging…simply
              because I want to see the voltage of each cell….and mah to
              recharge each pack…which is also part of the reason why I
              run the TP5s5000 packs instead of the 5s5400s (which are
              actually 10 2700s in 5s2p configuration).  Tracking the
              voltage at the end of a flight vs the mah needed to
              recharge tells you quite a bit about the actual capacity
              of the cells.</span><o:p></o:p></p>
          <p class="MsoNormal"
            style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F497D"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
          <div>
            <div style="border:none;border-top:solid #E1E1E1
              1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0in 0in 0in">
              <p class="MsoNormal"
                style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F497D">Several
                  years ago, I tried 2C charging (packs were rated for
                  5C charging).  I have not done it since, as I believe
                  2C charging reduced the lifecycles of the packs by
                  about 30%.  I’ll also note that with smaller packs
                  used for indoor flying, 3C charging seems to have
                  negligible impact on lifecycle.  When time allows, I
                  charge my pattern packs at 3.5 amps…figuring if 1C
                  charging is better than 2C charging….     0.7C
                  charging might be better yet.</span><o:p></o:p></p>
              <p class="MsoNormal"
                style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F497D"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
              <p class="MsoNormal"
                style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F497D">The
                  number of good chargers out there is far greater than
                  in the past….the weak point with all of the chargers /
                  charging systems is the balance connectors….they wear
                  out, get dirty, etc, causing false readings in the
                  chargers.</span><o:p></o:p></p>
              <p class="MsoNormal"
                style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F497D"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
              <p class="MsoNormal"
                style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F497D">Solid
                  power supplies are much cheaper than in the past.  If
                  I needed a new power supply, I’d go for a pair of the
                  75 amp HP server power supplies (contact RVP….he has
                  them cheap with leads attached)….lots of charging
                  power, compact, and easy to put a pair in series for
                  1800 watts of power (more than a 15 amp household
                  circuit)…..enough to comfortably power a wide range of
                  charging schemes.  I currently have 2 different
                  charger boxes….one has a pair of IOTA 55 amp supplies
                  in series running a pair of TP820s, and the newer
                  charger box has a pair of HP 47 amp supplies (much
                  lighter) in series running a pair of TP820s.  Both
                  charger boxes have more than enough overhead (chargers
                  and supplies) to charge 4 5s5000s at 2C, should I need
                  to charge rapidly.  Wiring to and from the power
                  supplies becomes increasingly critical as the wattage
                  goes up….at a 1000 watts, plenty of computer monitor
                  power leads (intended for less than 100 watts) will
                  get hot.  Power leads intended for the power supplies
                  have a lot more capacity.</span><o:p></o:p></p>
              <p class="MsoNormal"
                style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F497D"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
              <p class="MsoNormal"
                style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F497D">Regards,</span><o:p></o:p></p>
              <p class="MsoNormal"
                style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F497D"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
              <p class="MsoNormal"
                style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F497D">Dave</span><o:p></o:p></p>
              <p class="MsoNormal"
                style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F497D"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
              <p class="MsoNormal"
                style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F497D"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
              <p class="MsoNormal"
                style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F497D"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
              <p class="MsoNormal"
                style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F497D"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
              <p class="MsoNormal"
                style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F497D"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
              <p class="MsoNormal"
                style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F497D"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
              <p class="MsoNormal"
                style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"><b><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">From:</span></b><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">
                  NSRCA-discussion [<a moz-do-not-send="true"
                    href="mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces@lists.nsrca.org">mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces@lists.nsrca.org</a>]
                  <b>On Behalf Of </b>Peter Vogel via NSRCA-discussion<br>
                  <b>Sent:</b> Friday, October 09, 2015 12:40 AM<br>
                  <b>To:</b> Robert L. Beaubien <<a
                    moz-do-not-send="true"
                    href="mailto:rob@koolsoft.com"><a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:rob@koolsoft.com">rob@koolsoft.com</a></a>>;
                  NSRCA List <<a moz-do-not-send="true"
                    href="mailto:nsrca-discussion@lists.nsrca.org">nsrca-discussion@lists.nsrca.org</a>><br>
                  <b>Subject:</b> Re: [NSRCA-discussion] FW: 10s LiPo
                  Charger Recommendation</span><o:p></o:p></p>
            </div>
          </div>
          <p class="MsoNormal"
            style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"> <o:p></o:p></p>
          <div>
            <p class="MsoNormal"
              style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto">If
              you go to 4.35v/cell your 10s pack voltage is in excess of
              that allowed by the rules by 1.5v<o:p></o:p></p>
          </div>
          <div>
            <p class="MsoNormal"
              style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"> <o:p></o:p></p>
          </div>
          <div>
            <p class="MsoNormal"
              style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;margin-bottom:12.0pt">Peter+<o:p></o:p></p>
            <div>
              <p class="MsoNormal"
                style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto">Sent
                from
                <a moz-do-not-send="true" href="http://aka.ms/Ox5hz3">Outlook</a><o:p></o:p></p>
            </div>
            <p class="MsoNormal"
              style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"> <o:p></o:p></p>
          </div>
          <p class="MsoNormal"
            style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;margin-bottom:12.0pt"> <o:p></o:p></p>
          <div>
            <p class="MsoNormal"
              style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;margin-bottom:12.0pt">On
              Thu, Oct 8, 2015 at 8:46 PM -0700, "Robert L. Beaubien via
              NSRCA-discussion" <<a moz-do-not-send="true"
                href="mailto:nsrca-discussion@lists.nsrca.org"
                target="_blank">nsrca-discussion@lists.nsrca.org</a>>
              wrote:<o:p></o:p></p>
            <blockquote style="border:none;border-left:solid #CCCCCC
              1.0pt;padding:0in 0in 0in
6.0pt;margin-left:4.8pt;margin-top:5.0pt;margin-right:0in;margin-bottom:5.0pt">
              <div>
                <p class="MsoNormal"
                  style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F497D">Ed, 
                  </span><o:p></o:p></p>
                <p class="MsoNormal"
                  style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F497D"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
                <p class="MsoNormal"
                  style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F497D">I
                    have talked with a number of battery manufacturers
                    and while their batteries support as high as 9c
                    charge rates, every one recommend NOT charging any
                    higher than 2c charging rates.  Anything higher,
                    while tolerated by the battery, would definitely
                    shorten the life of the battery.  The best benefit
                    of parallel charging is not using a high C charge
                    rate, but that you are charging multiple batteries
                    at the same time.  It reduces the need to have to
                    charge fast (at least for me).</span><o:p></o:p></p>
                <p class="MsoNormal"
                  style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F497D"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
                <p class="MsoNormal"
                  style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F497D">Also,
                    I’m looking forward to the coming HV Lipo packs
                    where you charge the cells to 4.35v/cell instead of
                    4.2v/cell.  Turnigy ( <a moz-do-not-send="true"
href="http://hobbyking.com/hobbyking/store/__1415__85__Batteries_Accessories-Turnigy_BOLT_LiHV_.html">http://hobbyking.com/hobbyking/store/__1415__85__Batteries_Accessories-Turnigy_BOLT_LiHV_.html</a>
                    ) has them already and GiantPower is close to
                    releasing their packs with these cells.  They should
                    give a nice boost in performance for a similar
                    weight battery.</span><o:p></o:p></p>
                <p class="MsoNormal"
                  style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F497D"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
                <div>
                  <p class="MsoNormal"
style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:.5in;text-indent:-.25in"><span
                      style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">-</span><span
                      style="font-size:7.0pt">         
                    </span><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F4E79"> Robert
                      Beaubien</span><o:p></o:p></p>
                  <p class="MsoNormal"
style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:.5in;text-indent:-.25in"><span
                      style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">-</span><span
                      style="font-size:7.0pt">         
                    </span><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F4E79"> Sr.
                      Software Architect</span><o:p></o:p></p>
                  <p class="MsoNormal"
style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:.5in;text-indent:-.25in"><span
                      style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">-</span><span
                      style="font-size:7.0pt">         
                    </span><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F4E79"> Kool
                      Software LLC</span><o:p></o:p></p>
                  <p class="MsoNormal"
style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:.25in"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F497D"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
                  <p class="MsoNormal"
                    style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F497D">“Dear
                      Algebra, Please stop asking us to find your X. 
                      She's never coming back and don't ask Y.”</span><o:p></o:p></p>
                </div>
                <p class="MsoNormal"
                  style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F497D"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
                <div>
                  <div style="border:none;border-top:solid #E1E1E1
                    1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0in 0in 0in">
                    <p class="MsoNormal"
                      style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"><b><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">From:</span></b><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif"> Ed
                        Alt [<a moz-do-not-send="true"
                          href="mailto:ed_alt@hotmail.com">mailto:ed_alt@hotmail.com</a>]
                        <br>
                        <b>Sent:</b> Thursday, October 8, 2015 6:10 PM<br>
                        <b>To:</b> Robert L. Beaubien <<a
                          moz-do-not-send="true"
                          href="mailto:rob@koolsoft.com"><a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:rob@koolsoft.com">rob@koolsoft.com</a></a>>;
                        NSRCA List <<a moz-do-not-send="true"
                          href="mailto:nsrca-discussion@lists.nsrca.org">nsrca-discussion@lists.nsrca.org</a>><br>
                        <b>Subject:</b> RE: [NSRCA-discussion] FW: 10s
                        LiPo Charger Recommendation</span><o:p></o:p></p>
                  </div>
                </div>
                <p class="MsoNormal"
                  style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"> <o:p></o:p></p>
                <div>
                  <div>
                    <p class="MsoNormal"
                      style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto">Thanks
                      for the response Robert.  I can definitely see
                      doing this at low to moderate C rates as with your
                      example.  I might run a test to see what the
                      voltage difference is between parallel battery
                      sets at higher C rates, maybe around 4 to 5C.  The
                      thing that I have in mind is,  that depending on
                      how things are connected, what the resulting
                      resistance is in the path to the 2nd, 3rd, 4th
                      parallel pack and so forth, and what the charging
                      current is, then you might see a problem with some
                      packs charging more than others.  If you keep the
                      the wiring lengths the same from the charger to
                      each pack, then there should not be an issue.  An
                      example might be something resembling a bicycle
                      wheel, with the charger at the hub of the wheel,
                      and battery packs distributed around the hub with
                      one pack per "spoke".<o:p></o:p></p>
                  </div>
                  <div>
                    <p class="MsoNormal"
                      style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"> <o:p></o:p></p>
                  </div>
                  <div>
                    <p class="MsoNormal"
                      style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto">However,
                      if you instead choose to wire it to resemble a
                      train track, with a relatively simple charger at
                      one end of the track and battery packs strung out
                      like railroad ties along the rails, then a issue
                      may exist at some point.  The reason is that the
                      higher the charging current value is, the more
                      voltage drop there will be along the wiring from
                      one pack to the next, skewing the results from one
                      pack to the next.  Now depending on how the
                      charger algorithm is designed, that may not
                      matter.  For example, an improved charger design
                      could pulse the charging current on and off, and
                      during each brief "off" time, take no load voltage
                      readings that would be virtually unaffected by the
                      extra resistance in the wiring to the 2nd pack.
                       More sophisticated methods could be applied that
                      you might expect could vary from one brand or
                      model charger to the next, but this should
                      illustrate the point that results may vary
                      depending on a number of factors.  <o:p></o:p></p>
                  </div>
                  <div>
                    <p class="MsoNormal"
                      style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"> <o:p></o:p></p>
                  </div>
                  <div>
                    <p class="MsoNormal"
                      style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto">Careful
                      monitoring and not pushing C rates really high as
                      you have done will certainly tell you enough.  If
                      someone wants to really push the limits without
                      incurring too much risk, my suggestion is that
                      they determine the wiring method based on an
                      understanding of how the charging system will be
                      able to measure what is happening.  If your
                      charging system can monitor individual parallel
                      pack voltages and suss out how those separate
                      readings relate to the state of the group of
                      batteries, you get easily push C rates higher
                      without much regard to the wiring scheme (hub and
                      spoke vs RR track, if you will).  If your charging
                      system lacks independent battery voltage sensors,
                      but is known to have an algorithm that can work
                      around that, also good.  Personally, I wouldn't go
                      against any manufacturer's specific recommendation
                      to avoid parallel charging with their product.  <o:p></o:p></p>
                  </div>
                  <div>
                    <p class="MsoNormal"
                      style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"> <o:p></o:p></p>
                  </div>
                  <div>
                    <p class="MsoNormal"
                      style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto">Ed<o:p></o:p></p>
                  </div>
                  <div>
                    <div>
                      <p class="MsoNormal"
                        style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"> <o:p></o:p></p>
                      <div>
                        <div class="MsoNormal" style="text-align:center"
                          align="center">
                          <hr align="center" size="2" width="100%">
                        </div>
                        <p class="MsoNormal"
                          style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;margin-bottom:12.0pt">To:
                          <a moz-do-not-send="true"
                            href="mailto:nsrca-discussion@lists.nsrca.org">
                            nsrca-discussion@lists.nsrca.org</a><br>
                          Date: Thu, 8 Oct 2015 20:39:19 +0000<br>
                          Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] FW: 10s LiPo
                          Charger Recommendation<br>
                          From: <a moz-do-not-send="true"
                            href="mailto:nsrca-discussion@lists.nsrca.org">nsrca-discussion@lists.nsrca.org</a>.<o:p></o:p></p>
                        <div>
                          <p class="ecxmsonormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F497D">I
                              have done a lot of parallel charging this
                              year. I was originally worried about cell
                              balance charging this way when I started
                              so I closely monitored the cell voltages
                              before and after charging.  I’m typically
                              charging 1800 75c 4s packs, 4 at a time at
                              14amps (2c per pack).  Every check of the
                              cells after charging shows they balance
                              very well and are within .02 volts each
                              and I have about 100 cycles on each pack
                              this way.  I use the RMRC ParaBoard ( <a
                                moz-do-not-send="true"
href="http://www.readymaderc.com/store/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=84_387&products_id=2984"
                                target="_blank">
<a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="http://www.readymaderc.com/store/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=84_387&products_id=2984">http://www.readymaderc.com/store/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=84_387&products_id=2984</a></a>
                              ).  Certainly not the 10s packs used in
                              pattern, but charging them as 5s packs
                              would work nicely using this system.</span><o:p></o:p></p>
                          <p class="ecxmsonormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F497D"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
                          <div>
                            <p class="ecxmsonormal"
                              style="text-indent:-.25in"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F4E79">-</span><span
                                style="font-size:7.0pt;color:#1F4E79">         
                              </span><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F4E79"> Robert
                                Beaubien</span><o:p></o:p></p>
                            <p class="ecxmsonormal"
                              style="text-indent:-.25in"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F4E79">-</span><span
                                style="font-size:7.0pt;color:#1F4E79">         
                              </span><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F4E79"> Sr.
                                Software Architect</span><o:p></o:p></p>
                            <p class="ecxmsonormal"
                              style="text-indent:-.25in"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F4E79">-</span><span
                                style="font-size:7.0pt;color:#1F4E79">         
                              </span><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F4E79"> Kool
                                Software LLC</span><o:p></o:p></p>
                            <p class="ecxmsonormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F497D"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
                            <p class="ecxmsonormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F497D">“Dear
                                Algebra, Please stop asking us to find
                                your X.  She's never coming back and
                                don't ask Y.”</span><o:p></o:p></p>
                          </div>
                          <p class="ecxmsonormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F497D"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
                          <div>
                            <div style="border:none;border-top:solid
                              #E1E1E1 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0in 0in 0in">
                              <p class="ecxmsonormal"><b><span
                                    style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">From:</span></b><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">
                                  NSRCA-discussion [<a
                                    moz-do-not-send="true"
                                    href="mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces@lists.nsrca.org"><a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces@lists.nsrca.org">mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces@lists.nsrca.org</a></a>]
                                  <b>On Behalf Of </b>Ed Alt via
                                  NSRCA-discussion<br>
                                  <b>Sent:</b> Thursday, October 8, 2015
                                  12:54 PM<br>
                                  <b>To:</b> Keith Hoard <<a
                                    moz-do-not-send="true"
                                    href="mailto:klhoard@outlook.com"><a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:klhoard@outlook.com">klhoard@outlook.com</a></a>>;
                                  General pattern discussion <<a
                                    moz-do-not-send="true"
                                    href="mailto:nsrca-discussion@lists.nsrca.org"><a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:nsrca-discussion@lists.nsrca.org">nsrca-discussion@lists.nsrca.org</a></a>><br>
                                  <b>Subject:</b> Re: [NSRCA-discussion]
                                  FW: 10s LiPo Charger Recommendation</span><o:p></o:p></p>
                            </div>
                          </div>
                          <p class="ecxmsonormal"> <o:p></o:p></p>
                          <div>
                            <p class="ecxmsonormal">Although I haven't
                              done parallel charging, it seems like it
                              would be ok within certain limits.  The
                              main limiting factor might be the path
                              resistance between parallel cells, but
                              really only in the case of high C rate
                              charging.  That's a theory anyway.  What
                              has your experience been at high C rates?
                              Does it seem to make much difference?<o:p></o:p></p>
                          </div>
                          <div>
                            <p class="ecxmsonormal"> <o:p></o:p></p>
                          </div>
                          <div>
                            <p class="ecxmsonormal">Ed<o:p></o:p></p>
                          </div>
                          <div>
                            <p class="ecxmsonormal"><br>
                              On Oct 8, 2015, at 3:09 PM, Keith Hoard
                              via NSRCA-discussion <<a
                                moz-do-not-send="true"
                                href="mailto:nsrca-discussion@lists.nsrca.org"><a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:nsrca-discussion@lists.nsrca.org">nsrca-discussion@lists.nsrca.org</a></a>>
                              wrote:<o:p></o:p></p>
                          </div>
                          <blockquote
                            style="margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt">
                            <div>
                              <p class="ecxmsonormal"> <o:p></o:p></p>
                              <p class="ecxmsonormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F497D">I
                                  have found that the loudest detractors
                                  of parallel charging have no
                                  experience parallel charging.  When I
                                  ask them to point to an  incident
                                  where parallel charging caused a
                                  problem, the answer is always “Well, I
                                  read on the internet . . . “</span><o:p></o:p></p>
                              <p class="ecxmsonormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F497D">.</span><o:p></o:p></p>
                              <p class="ecxmsonormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F497D">I
                                  do a lot of parallel charging, and
                                  have no problem “putting the spurs” to
                                  my packs during charge if I’m ready to
                                  get in the air.  To dispel one myth
                                  right now, a good quality charger
                                  **WILL** detect a bad cell during
                                  parallel charging. 
                                </span><o:p></o:p></p>
                              <p class="ecxmsonormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F497D"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
                              <p class="ecxmsonormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F497D">(steps
                                  up on soapbox) . . .
                                </span><o:p></o:p></p>
                              <p class="ecxmsonormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F497D"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
                              <p class="ecxmsonormal"><span
                                  style="font-size:14.0pt;font-family:"Berlin
                                  Sans FB",sans-serif;color:red">**I
                                  HAVE ACTUALLY SEEN IT WITH MY OWN EYES
                                  AND CONFIRMED IT WITH FURTHER TESTS**</span><o:p></o:p></p>
                              <p class="ecxmsonormal"><span
                                  style="font-size:14.0pt;font-family:"Berlin
                                  Sans FB",sans-serif;color:red">**PLEASE
                                  DON’T KEEP REFERRING ME BACK TO “THE
                                  INTERNET”**</span><o:p></o:p></p>
                              <p class="ecxmsonormal"><span
                                  style="font-size:14.0pt;font-family:"Berlin
                                  Sans FB",sans-serif;color:red">**IF
                                  YOU GIVE ME ONE OF YOUR CRAPPY PUFFED
                                  UP PACKS, I’LL PUT IT ON WITH ONE OF
                                  MY GOOD PACKS AND SHOW YOU**</span><o:p></o:p></p>
                              <p class="ecxmsonormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F497D"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
                              <p class="ecxmsonormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F497D">OK,
                                  with that statement out of the way . .
                                  . . (steps down off soapbox) . . . .
                                </span><o:p></o:p></p>
                              <p class="ecxmsonormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F497D"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
                              <p class="ecxmsonormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F497D">The
                                  only time that bad cell **MAY** be
                                  masked is if you are parallel charging
                                  4 or 6 packs.  In practical use, you
                                  would only be parallel charging that
                                  many batteries on very rare occasions,
                                  perhaps once per season.  Besides,
                                  most chargers out there don’t have
                                  enough ass to charge 6 pattern packs
                                  in parallel and be done before sundown
                                  anyway.  However, you should not be
                                  relying on your charger as the only
                                  point in your routine to detect bad
                                  cells.</span><o:p></o:p></p>
                              <p class="ecxmsonormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F497D"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
                              <p class="ecxmsonormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F497D">In
                                  my experience,  folks with bad cells
                                  and puffy packs are doing a myriad of
                                  other no-no’s.  The worst is taking
                                  their batteries home on a full charge
                                  and letting them sit all week or all
                                  winter.  My soapbox finally broke down
                                  on that one and now I just smile and
                                  say “That’s too bad” and keep walking
                                  down the flight line. 
                                </span><o:p></o:p></p>
                              <p class="ecxmsonormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F497D"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
                              <p class="ecxmsonormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F497D">Ironically,
                                  the “straw that broke the camel’s
                                  back” for me was an H1B German
                                  Engineer who flies at our field asked
                                  me how I keep my packs from puffing
                                  up. Every time I said “storage charge
                                  at the end of the day”, he would reply
                                  “I don’t do that.” Then I said, “Yes,
                                  that’s why your batteries are all
                                  puffy and trashed.”  To which he
                                  replied “Yes, I charge my batteries to
                                  100% before taking them home.”  . . .
                                  <Sigh> . . .</span><o:p></o:p></p>
                              <p class="ecxmsonormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F497D"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
                              <p class="ecxmsonormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F497D">I
                                  now understand how VW got busted.</span><o:p></o:p></p>
                              <p class="ecxmsonormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F497D"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
                              <p class="ecxmsonormal"><b><span
                                    style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">From:</span></b><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">
                                  NSRCA-discussion [<a
                                    moz-do-not-send="true"
                                    href="mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces@lists.nsrca.org"><a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces@lists.nsrca.org">mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces@lists.nsrca.org</a></a>]
                                  <b>On Behalf Of </b>Vicente Bortone
                                  via NSRCA-discussion<br>
                                  <b>Sent:</b> Thursday, October 8, 2015
                                  13:16<br>
                                  <b>To:</b> James Hiller <<a
                                    moz-do-not-send="true"
                                    href="mailto:jnhiller@earthlink.net"><a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:jnhiller@earthlink.net">jnhiller@earthlink.net</a></a>>;
                                  General pattern discussion <<a
                                    moz-do-not-send="true"
                                    href="mailto:nsrca-discussion@lists.nsrca.org"><a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:nsrca-discussion@lists.nsrca.org">nsrca-discussion@lists.nsrca.org</a></a>><br>
                                  <b>Subject:</b> Re: [NSRCA-discussion]
                                  10s LiPo Charger Recommendation</span><o:p></o:p></p>
                              <p class="ecxmsonormal"> <o:p></o:p></p>
                              <p class="ecxmsonormal">For some reason TP
                                does not recommend parallel charging. 
                                Probably because it is difficult to keep
                                track of each cell and values are
                                averaged.   Is this really an important
                                factor?  At this point I just following
                                instructions.  This factor could
                                be important to decide what charger to
                                buy.<o:p></o:p></p>
                              <div>
                                <p class="ecxmsonormal"> <o:p></o:p></p>
                              </div>
                              <div>
                                <p class="ecxmsonormal">Vicente "Vince"
                                  Bortone<br>
                                  <br>
                                  On Thursday, October 8, 2015, James
                                  Hiller via NSRCA-discussion <<a
                                    moz-do-not-send="true"
                                    href="mailto:nsrca-discussion@lists.nsrca.org"><a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:nsrca-discussion@lists.nsrca.org">nsrca-discussion@lists.nsrca.org</a></a>>
                                  wrote:<o:p></o:p></p>
                                <blockquote
                                  style="border:none;border-left:solid
                                  #CCCCCC 1.0pt;padding:0in 0in 0in
                                  6.0pt;margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt">
                                  <p class="ecxmsonormal">Plug &
                                    play charge box from Progressive RC
                                    (see photo).<br>
                                    Parallel charging 5 flight packs in
                                    one session while having a couple
                                    cold ones!<br>
                                    Jim<br>
                                    <br>
                                    <br>
                                    -----Original Message-----<br>
                                    From: NSRCA-discussion [<a
                                      moz-do-not-send="true"
                                      href="mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces@lists.nsrca.org"><a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces@lists.nsrca.org">mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces@lists.nsrca.org</a></a>]
                                    On Behalf Of Dr. Michael Harrison,
                                    DDS via NSRCA-discussion<br>
                                    Sent: Thursday, October 08, 2015
                                    9:46 AM<br>
                                    To: 'Earl Haury'; 'General pattern
                                    discussion'<br>
                                    Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] 10s
                                    LiPo Charger Recommendation<br>
                                    <br>
                                    lol<br>
                                    <br>
                                    -----Original Message-----<br>
                                    From: NSRCA-discussion [<a
                                      moz-do-not-send="true"
                                      href="mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces@lists.nsrca.org"><a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces@lists.nsrca.org">mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces@lists.nsrca.org</a></a>]
                                    On Behalf Of Earl Haury via
                                    NSRCA-discussion<br>
                                    Sent: Thursday, October 08, 2015
                                    8:26 AM<br>
                                    To: Budd Engineering; General
                                    pattern discussion<br>
                                    Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] 10s
                                    LiPo Charger Recommendation<br>
                                    <br>
                                    Jerry<br>
                                    <br>
                                    Hard to beat the iChargers. The
                                    CellPros taught me that a fuse
                                    between the pack & charger is a
                                    good investment! No issues with
                                    3010b iChargers  (about<br>
                                    3000 charges over 5 years or so).
                                    They  will report cell IR / voltage
                                    and charge a 10S pack at 2C with a
                                    24v supply without breaking a sweat.
                                    The newer 4010 can handle 2x10S and
                                    displays data from both packs
                                    simultaneously. They don't meet your
                                    criteria of charging through the
                                    balance leads, but haven't really
                                    found that to an issue as the
                                    balancing system works fine. Can't
                                    really comment on service, haven't
                                    needed any (that should jinx me).<br>
                                    <br>
                                    Earl<br>
                                    <br>
                                    -----Original Message-----<br>
                                    From: Budd Engineering via
                                    NSRCA-discussion<br>
                                    Sent: Thursday, October 08, 2015
                                    4:59 AM<br>
                                    To: List NSRCA-list<br>
                                    Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] 10s LiPo
                                    Charger Recommendation<br>
                                    <br>
                                    Hi all, I m in need of some
                                    advice/suggestions for a new LiPo
                                    charger for 10s packs.<br>
                                    <br>
                                    For the past several years I ve used
                                    CellPro-10S chargers with good
                                    results.<br>
                                    However recently one of my
                                    CellPro-10s' emitted the dreaded 
                                    magic smoke  when I connected a 10s
                                    pack for charging.  This also
                                    happened at the Nats 3 years ago,
                                    fortunately Mike M. from F3AU was
                                    there with inventory and I was able
                                    to purchase a replacement charger
                                    and press on.  However, after having
                                    a second one give up the ghost a few
                                    weeks ago (and after not many charge
                                    cycles - I don t fly very much), I m
                                    interested in exploring other
                                    options.<br>
                                    <br>
                                    <br>
                                    To try to add some focus to this
                                    here s my search constraints:<br>
                                    <br>
                                    1.  It must be able to charge each
                                    cell individually through the
                                    balance connector, and give me a
                                    relative readout of each cell s
                                    condition compared to the other 9
                                    cells.<br>
                                    <br>
                                    2.  I m not interested in chargers
                                    that have separate balancers from
                                    the charger (e.g. like the TP1010C).<br>
                                    <br>
                                    3.  Reliability and value are
                                    important, as is ease of use.<br>
                                    <br>
                                    4.  Cost no more than a replacement
                                    CellPro 10XP (<$180), unless a
                                    single charger can charge two 10s
                                    packs simultaneously, then I d
                                    consider spending a bit more.<br>
                                    <br>
                                    5.  Customer service matters, if I
                                    can buy it through F3A Unlimited,
                                    that would be a PLUS.<br>
                                    <br>
                                    <br>
                                    With this in mind does anyone have a
                                    suggestion for what chargers I
                                    should<br>
                                    consider?<br>
                                    <br>
                                    <br>
                                    I don t get out much these days so
                                    it s difficult to see what everyone
                                    s<br>
                                    using that works well.  So I really
                                    do appreciate everyone s help with
                                    this.<br>
                                    <br>
                                    Thx, Jerry<br>
_______________________________________________<br>
                                    NSRCA-discussion mailing list<br>
                                    <a moz-do-not-send="true"
                                      href="mailto:NSRCA-discussion@lists.nsrca.org">NSRCA-discussion@lists.nsrca.org</a><br>
                                    <a moz-do-not-send="true"
                                      href="http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion"
                                      target="_blank">http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion</a><br>
                                    <br>
_______________________________________________<br>
                                    NSRCA-discussion mailing list<br>
                                    <a moz-do-not-send="true"
                                      href="mailto:NSRCA-discussion@lists.nsrca.org">NSRCA-discussion@lists.nsrca.org</a><br>
                                    <a moz-do-not-send="true"
                                      href="http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion"
                                      target="_blank">http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion</a><br>
                                    <br>
_______________________________________________<br>
                                    NSRCA-discussion mailing list<br>
                                    <a moz-do-not-send="true"
                                      href="mailto:NSRCA-discussion@lists.nsrca.org">NSRCA-discussion@lists.nsrca.org</a><br>
                                    <a moz-do-not-send="true"
                                      href="http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion"
                                      target="_blank">http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion</a><o:p></o:p></p>
                                </blockquote>
                              </div>
                              <p class="ecxmsonormal"><br>
                                <br>
                                -- <br>
                                Vicente "Vince" Bortone<o:p></o:p></p>
                            </div>
                          </blockquote>
                          <blockquote
                            style="margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt">
                            <div>
                              <p class="ecxmsonormal">_______________________________________________<br>
                                NSRCA-discussion mailing list<br>
                                <a moz-do-not-send="true"
                                  href="mailto:NSRCA-discussion@lists.nsrca.org">NSRCA-discussion@lists.nsrca.org</a><br>
                                <a moz-do-not-send="true"
                                  href="http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion"
                                  target="_blank">http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion</a><o:p></o:p></p>
                            </div>
                          </blockquote>
                        </div>
                        <p class="MsoNormal"
                          style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"><br>
                          _______________________________________________
                          NSRCA-discussion mailing list <a
                            moz-do-not-send="true"
                            href="mailto:NSRCA-discussion@lists.nsrca.org">
                            <a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:NSRCA-discussion@lists.nsrca.org">NSRCA-discussion@lists.nsrca.org</a></a> <a
                            moz-do-not-send="true"
                            href="http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion">
<a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion">http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion</a></a><o:p></o:p></p>
                      </div>
                    </div>
                  </div>
                </div>
              </div>
            </blockquote>
          </div>
        </div>
      </div>
      <br>
      <fieldset class="mimeAttachmentHeader"></fieldset>
      <br>
      <pre wrap="">_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
<a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:NSRCA-discussion@lists.nsrca.org">NSRCA-discussion@lists.nsrca.org</a>
<a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion">http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion</a></pre>
    </blockquote>
    <br>
  </body>
</html>