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Derek,<br>
The input radius of the first quarter loop is part of the maneuver
and defines the radius of the 3/4 loop. If you initiate the 1/4 loop
on the center pole, the center of the maneuver does not shift with
radius size and is centered in the box. In other words,size doesn't
matter.<br>
John<br>
<div class="moz-cite-prefix">On 4/8/2014 4:24 PM, Derek Koopowitz
wrote:<br>
</div>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D">I
don’t think you can leave off the input radius because the
input radius size will change where center is located.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><b><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif"">From:</span></b><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif"">
<a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces@lists.nsrca.org">nsrca-discussion-bounces@lists.nsrca.org</a>
[<a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces@lists.nsrca.org">mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces@lists.nsrca.org</a>] <b>On
Behalf Of </b>Jas S<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Tuesday, April 08, 2014 3:15 PM<br>
<b>To:</b> General pattern discussion<br>
<b>Subject:</b> Re: [NSRCA-discussion] >From the Judges
Chair<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-bottom:12.0pt">I've
always enjoyed that pattern had definition (centers,
box...) and that's why I don't fly IMAC but once a
year if at that. <o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<p class="MsoNormal">If the start of the 9 is at the
bottom 1/4 loop (minus entry line),<o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<p class="MsoNormal">and the end is at the end of the 3/4
loop (minus the exit line),<o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<p class="MsoNormal">and the bottom and top radii are equal
(as are the entry and exit lines),<o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<p class="MsoNormal">wouldn't the center be the start of the
bottom loop/middle of roll/top of 3/4 loop/finish of 3/4
loop?<o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-bottom:12.0pt"><o:p> </o:p></p>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal">On Tue, Apr 8, 2014 at 6:05 PM, Daniel
Underkofler <<a moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:underdw@gmail.com" target="_blank">underdw@gmail.com</a>>
wrote:<o:p></o:p></p>
<blockquote style="border:none;border-left:solid #CCCCCC
1.0pt;padding:0in 0in 0in
6.0pt;margin-left:4.8pt;margin-right:0in">
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal">Thank you! My thoughts exactly<o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-bottom:12.0pt"><o:p> </o:p></p>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal">On Tue, Apr 8, 2014 at 4:02
PM, John Gayer <<a moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:jgghome@comcast.net"
target="_blank">jgghome@comcast.net</a>>
wrote:<o:p></o:p></p>
<blockquote style="border:none;border-left:solid
#CCCCCC 1.0pt;padding:0in 0in 0in
6.0pt;margin-left:4.8pt;margin-right:0in">
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal">Derek,<br>
"Somewhere in the 3/4 loop portion" is
awfully vague and unjudgeable. I could buy
anywhere in the 3/4 loop portion but not
somewhere.<br>
The center you are describing would appear
to be affected somehow by the entry and exit
lines of the maneuver as per your
description in the March K-Factor. I don't
see that. This maneuver(figure 9) could be
described as a single loop with a straight
vertical line between the first quadrant and
the last three quadrants. What rolls occur
do not affect that basic shape. That places
the center of the maneuver at the initial
pullup into a quarter loop just as it would
for a simple loop. The apex of the 3/4 loop
would also be on the centerline and so would
the return to level flight at the exit.<br>
As far as the straight line entry and exit
being somehow offset, I don't see that
either. The entry line ends at the quarter
loop pullup and exit line begins upon
completion of the 3/4 loop. Those two points
should form a vertical line. I see that as
the maneuver centerline as well.<br>
It's certainly true that the aresti shows
the wrong center and it is certainly true
that the sub-committee chair has the last
word but he should be using a better word
than "somewhere".<br>
John<o:p></o:p></p>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal">On 4/8/2014 3:22 PM,
Derek Koopowitz wrote:<o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<blockquote
style="margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt">
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D">Anthony,</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D">This
shouldn’t be confusing at all… the
center of the maneuver is the middle
point between the start and end of the
maneuver. How much more simple can it
get? The statement that the “middle
should be somewhere in the ¾ loop
portion” is correct – depending on the
size of the ¾ loop which must match
the radius of the ¼ loop from
horizontal to vertical when the
maneuver starts. That center portion
will change for every pilot as each
pilot will fly it differently.</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D">Your
comment about “many outside the US”
isn’t accurate – if they see it
differently then they are incorrect.
The clarification I got is straight
from the F3 sub-committee chair…</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D">-Derek</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
<div>
<div style="border:none;border-top:solid
#E1E1E1 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0in 0in
0in">
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"><b><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif"">From:</span></b><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif"">
<a moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces@lists.nsrca.org"
target="_blank">nsrca-discussion-bounces@lists.nsrca.org</a>
[<a moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces@lists.nsrca.org"
target="_blank">mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces@lists.nsrca.org</a>]
<b>On Behalf Of </b>Anthony
Romano<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Tuesday, April 08,
2014 11:27 AM<br>
<b>To:</b> <a
moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:nsrca-discussion@lists.nsrca.org"
target="_blank">nsrca-discussion@lists.nsrca.org</a><br>
<b>Subject:</b> Re:
[NSRCA-discussion] From the Judges
Chair</span><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
</div>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"> <o:p></o:p></p>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"><span
style="font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif"">Would
love to see a review of maneuver 13
of the Finals sequence. In the March
Kfactor the center was described as
"should be the middle of the
maneuver somewhere in the ¾ loop
portion." While the many outside the
US see it that the loop is centered
and the Aresti in the latest FAI
sporting code show the upline being
centered.</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"><span
style="font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif""> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"><span
style="font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif"">A bit
confusing,</span><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"><span
style="font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif""> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;margin-bottom:12.0pt"><span
style="font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif"">Anthony</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<div>
<div class="MsoNormal"
style="text-align:center"
align="center"><span
style="font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif"">
<hr align="center" size="2"
width="100%"></span></div>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;margin-bottom:12.0pt"><span
style="font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif"">Date:
Tue, 8 Apr 2014 09:28:00 -0700<br>
From: <a moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:joncarter60@comcast.net" target="_blank">joncarter60@comcast.net</a><br>
To: <a moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:nsrca-discussion@lists.nsrca.org"
target="_blank">nsrca-discussion@lists.nsrca.org</a><br>
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] From
the Judges Chair</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"><span
style="font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif"">Hey guys
- we got an excellent
suggestion from the group for
last month's article so I
thought I would ask again!
Anyone have a burning maneuver
or judging question? Just let
me know.</span><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"><span
style="font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif""> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"><span
style="font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif"">Thanks,</span><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"><span
style="font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif""> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"><span
style="font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif"">Jon
Carter</span><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"><span
style="font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif"">Judging
Committee Chairman</span><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"><span
style="font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif""> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"><span
style="font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif""> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"><span
style="font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif""> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"><span
style="font-size:7.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#575757">Sent
via the Samsung GALAXY S®4,
an AT&T 4G LTE
smartphone</span><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
</div>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"><span
style="font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif""><br>
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<p class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12.0pt"><o:p> </o:p></p>
<pre>_______________________________________________<o:p></o:p></pre>
<pre>NSRCA-discussion mailing list<o:p></o:p></pre>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><br>
<br clear="all">
<br>
-- <o:p></o:p></p>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal">Jason<br>
<a moz-do-not-send="true"
href="http://jasonshangar.weebly.com/" target="_blank">http://jasonshangar.weebly.com/</a><o:p></o:p></p>
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