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Larry,<br>
<br>
A rear mounted outrunner (on a firewall) or a nose mounted outrunner
or inrunner with rear support are all safe ways to go. Find your
budget and get suggestions of combos that are currently ( that's
funny) in use and are successful and copy the working setup
EXACTLY. 99.99% of problems from new electric guys are when they
start experimenting or want to try something different - don't.
Just copy what works and you will have success, and please don't
rely on the many faceless experts on RCU etc. Guys on this thread
like Earl and Verne and Mike have tons of experience and can lead
you to a working setup from day 1.<br>
<br>
Electric is not that difficult at all but you need to learn a new
language and that takes a while so rely on any good teacher here on
the list.<br>
<br>
Chris<br>
<br>
<br>
<div class="moz-cite-prefix">On 12/5/2012 2:30 PM, Larry Diamond
wrote:<br>
</div>
<blockquote
cite="mid:1354735810.46115.YahooMailNeo@web5715.biz.mail.ne1.yahoo.com"
type="cite">
<div style="color:#000; background-color:#fff; font-family:times
new roman, new york, times, serif;font-size:12pt">
<div style="RIGHT: auto"><span style="RIGHT: auto">As somebody
who is trying to get back into Pattern and those like me
that have Zero experience with high power <var
id="yui-ie-cursor"></var>electric setups, is there an
article or a something posted that we can reference?</span></div>
<div style="RIGHT: auto"><span style="RIGHT: auto"></span> </div>
<div style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent; FONT-STYLE: normal;
FONT-FAMILY: times new roman, new york, times, serif; COLOR:
rgb(0,0,0); FONT-SIZE: 16px; RIGHT: auto"><span style="RIGHT:
auto">Maybe something on the NSRCA Website that can be
accessed by all under Tips an Set Up...Yada Yada Yada...</span></div>
<div style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent; FONT-STYLE: normal;
FONT-FAMILY: times new roman, new york, times, serif; COLOR:
rgb(0,0,0); FONT-SIZE: 16px; RIGHT: auto"><span style="RIGHT:
auto"></span> </div>
<div style="RIGHT: auto"><span style="RIGHT: auto">Larry Diamond</span></div>
<div style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent; FONT-STYLE: normal;
FONT-FAMILY: times new roman, new york, times, serif; COLOR:
rgb(0,0,0); FONT-SIZE: 16px; RIGHT: auto"><br style="RIGHT:
auto">
</div>
<div style="FONT-FAMILY: times new roman, new york, times,
serif; FONT-SIZE: 12pt">
<div style="FONT-FAMILY: times new roman, new york, times,
serif; FONT-SIZE: 12pt">
<div style="RIGHT: auto" dir="ltr"><font face="Arial"
size="2">
<b><span style="FONT-WEIGHT: bold">From:</span></b>
Verne Koester <a class="moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" href="mailto:verne@twmi.rr.com"><verne@twmi.rr.com></a><br>
<b><span style="FONT-WEIGHT: bold">To:</span></b>
'General pattern discussion'
<a class="moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" href="mailto:nsrca-discussion@lists.nsrca.org"><nsrca-discussion@lists.nsrca.org></a> <br>
<b><span style="FONT-WEIGHT: bold">Sent:</span></b>
Wednesday, December 5, 2012 12:16 PM<br>
<b><span style="FONT-WEIGHT: bold">Subject:</span></b>
Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Fw: Serious Torque on the Nose of
the Model- RESUBMITTED<br>
</font></div>
<br>
<div id="yiv1683548014">
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<div class="yiv1683548014WordSection1">
<div class="yiv1683548014MsoNormal"><span
style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Arial', 'sans-serif'; COLOR:
#1f497d">I agree with Chris. I’ve personally had
thousands of flights with nose mounted motors with
rear supports and never had so much as a hint of
failure. If you count all the flights I’ve seen
Andrew fly with his nose mounted, rear supported
motors as well as countless others at the practice
field and on the contest trail, the number
probably reaches into the tens of thousands. </span></div>
<div class="yiv1683548014MsoNormal"><span
style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Arial', 'sans-serif'; COLOR:
#1f497d"> </span></div>
<div class="yiv1683548014MsoNormal"><span
style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Arial', 'sans-serif'; COLOR:
#1f497d">The only time I’ve ever witnessed a
catastrophic motor induced fuselage failure was
while I was judging an FAI pilot flying an
Axi-equipped Smaragd a few years back. Following a
turnaround, there was a short, deep, rumbling
sound that sounded a little like flutter with
heavy bass followed by the departure of the motor
and a significant section of the nose of the fuse.
The motor was nose mounted and had no rear
support. </span></div>
<div class="yiv1683548014MsoNormal"><span
style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Arial', 'sans-serif'; COLOR:
#1f497d"> </span></div>
<div class="yiv1683548014MsoNormal"><span
style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Arial', 'sans-serif'; COLOR:
#1f497d">My best guess, and it is just a guess,
was that the prop arc coupled with the forces of
the looping turnaround, set up a harmonic, or
flutter if you will, that the fuse couldn’t
contain. The rumble was very brief before it came
apart. </span></div>
<div class="yiv1683548014MsoNormal"><span
style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Arial', 'sans-serif'; COLOR:
#1f497d"> </span></div>
<div class="yiv1683548014MsoNormal"><span
style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Arial', 'sans-serif'; COLOR:
#1f497d">I have no engineering data to report,
just practical experience. A nose mounted motor
without a rear support is a disaster about to
happen. As Chris said, it’s just a matter of when.</span></div>
<div class="yiv1683548014MsoNormal"><span
style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Arial', 'sans-serif'; COLOR:
#1f497d"> </span></div>
<div class="yiv1683548014MsoNormal"><span
style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Arial', 'sans-serif'; COLOR:
#1f497d">Verne Koester</span></div>
<div class="yiv1683548014MsoNormal"><span
style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Arial', 'sans-serif'; COLOR:
#1f497d"> </span></div>
<div>
<div style="BORDER-BOTTOM: medium none; BORDER-LEFT:
medium none; PADDING-BOTTOM: 0in; PADDING-LEFT:
0in; PADDING-RIGHT: 0in; BORDER-TOP: #b5c4df 1pt
solid; BORDER-RIGHT: medium none; PADDING-TOP:
3pt">
<div class="yiv1683548014MsoNormal"><b><span
style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Tahoma', 'sans-serif';
COLOR: windowtext; FONT-SIZE: 10pt">From:</span></b><span
style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Tahoma', 'sans-serif';
COLOR: windowtext; FONT-SIZE: 10pt">
<a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces@lists.nsrca.org">nsrca-discussion-bounces@lists.nsrca.org</a>
[<a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces@lists.nsrca.org">mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces@lists.nsrca.org</a>]
<b>On Behalf Of </b>Chris<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Wednesday, December 05, 2012
12:50 PM<br>
<b>To:</b> Bob Kane; General pattern
discussion<br>
<b>Subject:</b> Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Fw:
Serious Torque on the Nose of the Model-
RESUBMITTED</span></div>
</div>
</div>
<div class="yiv1683548014MsoNormal"> </div>
<div style="MARGIN-BOTTOM: 12pt"
class="yiv1683548014MsoNormal">Early in the electric
transition, many of us found out the hard way that
nose mounted outrunners without a rear support would
lead to structural failures with nearly 100%
certainty. My nose mounted Genesis lasted 1 1/2
flights before failure. Others had many more
flights but even the best cases I know of had nose
structure stresses and cracking due to the
unsupported nose mounting. Jerry Budd and I did a
lot of testing and posting about this issue back in
2006 or 2007. Newer designs have reinforced noses
which help but bottom line, don't nose mount an
electric motor without rear support. It "might" last
1 or 500 flights but 501 won't be as successful.<br>
<br>
Chris</div>
<div>
<div class="yiv1683548014MsoNormal">On 12/5/2012
12:38 PM, Bob Kane wrote:</div>
</div>
<blockquote style="MARGIN-TOP: 5pt; MARGIN-BOTTOM:
5pt">
<div>
<div>
<div style="BACKGROUND: white"
class="yiv1683548014MsoNormal">Great
observations. I am curious about the numbers
myself, maybe in my spare time (ha!) I'll pull
out my old physics books and crunch some
numbers. </div>
</div>
<div>
<div class="yiv1683548014MsoNormal"> </div>
</div>
<div>
<div style="BACKGROUND: white"
class="yiv1683548014MsoNormal">Bob Kane<br>
<a moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:getterflash@yahoo.com"
rel="nofollow" target="_blank"
ymailto="mailto:getterflash@yahoo.com">getterflash@yahoo.com</a></div>
</div>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<div style="TEXT-ALIGN: center; BACKGROUND:
white" class="yiv1683548014MsoNormal"
align="center"><span style="FONT-FAMILY:
'Arial', 'sans-serif'; FONT-SIZE: 10pt">
</span></div>
<div style="BACKGROUND: white"
class="yiv1683548014MsoNormal"><b><span
style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Arial',
'sans-serif'; FONT-SIZE: 10pt">From:</span></b><span
style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Arial',
'sans-serif'; FONT-SIZE: 10pt"> ehaury <a
moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:ejhaury@comcast.net"
rel="nofollow" target="_blank"
ymailto="mailto:ejhaury@comcast.net">mailto:ejhaury@comcast.net</a><br>
<b>To:</b> mike mueller <a
moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:mikemueller@f3aunlimited.com"
rel="nofollow" target="_blank"
ymailto="mailto:mikemueller@f3aunlimited.com">mailto:mikemueller@f3aunlimited.com</a>;
General pattern discussion <a
moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:nsrca-discussion@lists.nsrca.org"
rel="nofollow" target="_blank"
ymailto="mailto:nsrca-discussion@lists.nsrca.org">mailto:nsrca-discussion@lists.nsrca.org</a>
<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Wednesday, December 5, 2012
11:02 AM<br>
<b>Subject:</b> Re: [NSRCA-discussion]
Fw: Serious Torque on the Nose of the
Model- RESUBMITTED</span></div>
</div>
<div style="BACKGROUND: white"
class="yiv1683548014MsoNormal"> </div>
<div id="yiv1683548014">
<div>
<div>
<div style="BACKGROUND: white"
class="yiv1683548014MsoNormal"><span
style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Arial',
'sans-serif'">I don't know what
caused Charlie's failure, we've
discussed possibilities - obviously
forces occurred that were beyond
what the structure could handle.</span></div>
</div>
<div>
<div style="BACKGROUND: white"
class="yiv1683548014MsoNormal"> </div>
</div>
<div>
<div style="BACKGROUND: white"
class="yiv1683548014MsoNormal"><span
style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Arial',
'sans-serif'">Torque &
precession have been with us since
we stuck engines & props on the
front of airplanes. They really
haven't changed much with the advent
of E power - actually went down with
the use of lighter props.</span></div>
</div>
<div>
<div style="BACKGROUND: white"
class="yiv1683548014MsoNormal"> </div>
</div>
<div>
<div style="BACKGROUND: white"
class="yiv1683548014MsoNormal"><span
style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Arial',
'sans-serif'">I'd just like to offer
that the Hacker Q80 design doesn't
change much. The rotating outer
member (Q80-14) weighs about
100g and rotates up to 7K rpm with
an 1 1/2" radius. The rotor in a C50
also weighs around 100g, but it
rotates up to 40K rpm on a 3/8"
radius. The latter, with the
gearbox, can probably apply torque
quicker than the outie. Most other
popular outrunners fall somewhere
between these. (Be neat if someone
actually made the calcs.)</span></div>
</div>
<div>
<div style="BACKGROUND: white"
class="yiv1683548014MsoNormal"> </div>
</div>
<div>
<div style="BACKGROUND: white"
class="yiv1683548014MsoNormal"><span
style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Arial',
'sans-serif'">I've lots of flights
with the Q80-11 without issue (the
Q80-14 is less powerful). It is
firmly front mounted with also a
solid rear mount. I think we all
know the importance of a nose ring
on a YS and there's been no success
running inrunners without a rear
support. While some have had success
running the Q without a rear support
(bet the prop was light), these
things really need a more sturdy
rear support (or very stout front
mnt / fuse nose) than may be
obvious.</span></div>
</div>
<div>
<div style="BACKGROUND: white"
class="yiv1683548014MsoNormal"> </div>
</div>
<div>
<div style="BACKGROUND: white"
class="yiv1683548014MsoNormal"><span
style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Arial',
'sans-serif'">Essentially something
slightly different that adds to the
learning curve, hopefully Charlie's
experience and these discussions
will prevent further occurrences.</span></div>
</div>
<div>
<div style="BACKGROUND: white"
class="yiv1683548014MsoNormal"> </div>
</div>
<div>
<div style="BACKGROUND: white"
class="yiv1683548014MsoNormal"><span
style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Arial',
'sans-serif'">Earl</span></div>
</div>
<blockquote style="BORDER-BOTTOM: medium
none; BORDER-LEFT: black 1.5pt solid;
PADDING-BOTTOM: 0in; MARGIN: 5pt 0in 5pt
3.75pt; PADDING-LEFT: 4pt;
PADDING-RIGHT: 0in; BORDER-TOP: medium
none; BORDER-RIGHT: medium none;
PADDING-TOP: 0in">
<div>
<div style="BACKGROUND: white"
class="yiv1683548014MsoNormal"><span
style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Arial',
'sans-serif'; FONT-SIZE: 10pt">-----
Original Message ----- </span></div>
</div>
<div>
<div style="BACKGROUND: #e4e4e4"
class="yiv1683548014MsoNormal"><b><span
style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Arial',
'sans-serif'; FONT-SIZE: 10pt">From:</span></b><span
style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Arial',
'sans-serif'; FONT-SIZE: 10pt"> <a
moz-do-not-send="true"
title="mikemueller@f3aunlimited.com"
href="mailto:mikemueller@f3aunlimited.com" rel="nofollow"
target="_blank"
ymailto="mailto:mikemueller@f3aunlimited.com">mike
mueller</a> </span></div>
</div>
<div>
<div style="BACKGROUND: white"
class="yiv1683548014MsoNormal"><b><span
style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Arial',
'sans-serif'; FONT-SIZE: 10pt">To:</span></b><span
style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Arial',
'sans-serif'; FONT-SIZE: 10pt"> <a
moz-do-not-send="true"
title="getterflash@yahoo.com"
href="mailto:getterflash@yahoo.com"
rel="nofollow" target="_blank"
ymailto="mailto:getterflash@yahoo.com">Bob
Kane</a> ; <a
moz-do-not-send="true"
title="nsrca-discussion@lists.nsrca.org"
href="mailto:nsrca-discussion@lists.nsrca.org" rel="nofollow"
target="_blank"
ymailto="mailto:nsrca-discussion@lists.nsrca.org">General
pattern discussion</a> </span></div>
</div>
<div>
<div style="BACKGROUND: white"
class="yiv1683548014MsoNormal"><b><span
style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Arial',
'sans-serif'; FONT-SIZE: 10pt">Sent:</span></b><span
style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Arial',
'sans-serif'; FONT-SIZE: 10pt">
Wednesday, December 05, 2012 8:26
AM</span></div>
</div>
<div>
<div style="BACKGROUND: white"
class="yiv1683548014MsoNormal"><b><span
style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Arial',
'sans-serif'; FONT-SIZE: 10pt">Subject:</span></b><span
style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Arial',
'sans-serif'; FONT-SIZE: 10pt">
Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Fw: Serious
Torque on the Nose of the Model-
RESUBMITTED</span></div>
</div>
<div>
<div style="BACKGROUND: white"
class="yiv1683548014MsoNormal"> </div>
</div>
<div>
<div>
<div style="BACKGROUND: white"
class="yiv1683548014MsoNormal">Very
cool video. I've learned a lot of
neat things watching Youtube
video's. Thanks Bob</div>
</div>
<div>
<div style="BACKGROUND: white"
class="yiv1683548014MsoNormal"> </div>
</div>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<div style="BACKGROUND: white"
class="yiv1683548014MsoNormal"><b><span
style="FONT-FAMILY:
'Arial', 'sans-serif';
FONT-SIZE: 10pt">From:</span></b><span
style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Arial',
'sans-serif'; FONT-SIZE:
10pt"> Bob Kane <<a
moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:getterflash@yahoo.com"
rel="nofollow"
target="_blank"
ymailto="mailto:getterflash@yahoo.com">getterflash@yahoo.com</a>><br>
<b>To:</b>
Generalpatterndiscussion
<<a
moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:nsrca-discussion@lists.nsrca.org"
rel="nofollow"
target="_blank"
ymailto="mailto:nsrca-discussion@lists.nsrca.org">nsrca-discussion@lists.nsrca.org</a>>
<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Wednesday,
December 5, 2012 7:07 AM<br>
<b>Subject:</b>
[NSRCA-discussion] Fw:
Serious Torque on the Nose
of the Model - RESUBMITTED</span></div>
</div>
<div style="BACKGROUND: white"
class="yiv1683548014MsoNormal"> </div>
<div id="yiv1683548014">
<div>
<div>
<div>
<div style="BACKGROUND:
white"
class="yiv1683548014MsoNormal">Charlie
was spot on with his
comment on torque, but
there are two torque
vectors at work, the
first is the obvious
force required to turn
the prop and the "equal
but opposite" torque the
motor transmits to it's
mount. If that was all
we had to worry about,
the single mount would
probably be fine. But
there is the other
torque (gyroscopic
precession) resulting
from attempting to move
a rotating mass in the
pitch or yaw axis. Here
is a good youtube video
demonstrating the effect
. .. . </div>
</div>
<div>
<div>
<div id="yiv1683548014">
<div>
<div>
<div
class="yiv1683548014MsoNormal"> </div>
</div>
<div>
<div
class="yiv1683548014MsoNormal"><a
moz-do-not-send="true" href="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ty9QSiVC2g0"
rel="nofollow"
target="_blank">http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ty9QSiVC2g0</a></div>
</div>
<div>
<div
class="yiv1683548014MsoNormal"> </div>
</div>
<div>
<div
style="BACKGROUND:
white"
class="yiv1683548014MsoNormal"> </div>
</div>
<div>
<div
style="BACKGROUND:
white"
class="yiv1683548014MsoNormal">Bob
Kane<br>
<a
moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:getterflash@yahoo.com" rel="nofollow" target="_blank"
ymailto="mailto:getterflash@yahoo.com">getterflash@yahoo.com</a></div>
</div>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<div
style="BACKGROUND:
white"
class="yiv1683548014MsoNormal"><b><span
style="FONT-FAMILY:
'Arial',
'sans-serif';
FONT-SIZE:
10pt">From:</span></b><span
style="FONT-FAMILY:
'Arial',
'sans-serif';
FONT-SIZE:
10pt"> mike
mueller <a
moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:mikemueller@f3aunlimited.com" rel="nofollow"
target="_blank"
ymailto="mailto:mikemueller@f3aunlimited.com">mailto:mikemueller@f3aunlimited.com</a><br>
<b>To:</b> Bob
Kane <a
moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:getterflash@yahoo.com" rel="nofollow" target="_blank"
ymailto="mailto:getterflash@yahoo.com">mailto:getterflash@yahoo.com</a>
<br>
<b>Sent:</b>
Tuesday,
December 4,
2012 4:34 PM<br>
<b>Subject:</b>
Re:
[NSRCA-discussion]
Serious Torque
on the Nose of
the Model -
RESUBMITTED</span></div>
</div>
<div
style="BACKGROUND:
white"
class="yiv1683548014MsoNormal"> </div>
<div
id="yiv1683548014">
<div>
<div>
<div>
<div
style="BACKGROUND:
white"
class="yiv1683548014MsoNormal">Say
what?</div>
</div>
<div>
<div
class="yiv1683548014MsoNormal">"a
large
reactionary
force called
gyroscopic
precession"</div>
</div>
<div>
<div
class="yiv1683548014MsoNormal"> I
feel
infinitlty
smarter</div>
</div>
<div>
<div
class="yiv1683548014MsoNormal"> Is
it violent
warble?</div>
</div>
<div>
<div
class="yiv1683548014MsoNormal"> What
prop were you
running????</div>
</div>
<div>
<div
class="yiv1683548014MsoNormal"> Mike</div>
</div>
<div>
<div
style="BACKGROUND:
white"
class="yiv1683548014MsoNormal"> </div>
</div>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<div
style="BACKGROUND:
white"
class="yiv1683548014MsoNormal"><b><span
style="FONT-FAMILY:
'Arial',
'sans-serif';
FONT-SIZE:
10pt">From:</span></b><span
style="FONT-FAMILY:
'Arial',
'sans-serif';
FONT-SIZE:
10pt"> Bob
Kane <a
moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:getterflash@yahoo.com" rel="nofollow" target="_blank"
ymailto="mailto:getterflash@yahoo.com">mailto:getterflash@yahoo.com</a><br>
<b>To:</b> <a
moz-do-not-send="true" href="mailto:vicenterc@comcast.net"
rel="nofollow"
target="_blank" ymailto="mailto:vicenterc@comcast.net">mailto:vicenterc@comcast.net</a>
<a
moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:vicenterc@comcast.net" rel="nofollow" target="_blank"
ymailto="mailto:vicenterc@comcast.net">mailto:vicenterc@comcast.net</a>;
General
pattern
discussion <a
moz-do-not-send="true" href="mailto:nsrca-discussion@lists.nsrca.org"
rel="nofollow"
target="_blank" ymailto="mailto:nsrca-discussion@lists.nsrca.org">mailto:nsrca-discussion@lists.nsrca.org</a>
<br>
<b>Sent:</b>
Tuesday,
December 4,
2012 7:54 AM<br>
<b>Subject:</b>
Re:
[NSRCA-discussion]
Serious Torque
on the Nose of
the Model -
RESUBMITTED</span></div>
</div>
<div
style="BACKGROUND:
white"
class="yiv1683548014MsoNormal"> </div>
<div
id="yiv1683548014">
<div>
<div>
<div>
<div
style="BACKGROUND:
white"
class="yiv1683548014MsoNormal"><span
style="FONT-FAMILY:
'Times',
'serif'">The
Q80 has a
large diameter rotating
mass, and it
brings with it
a large
reactionary
force called
gyroscopic
precession
when it is
spinning. In
laymen terms
it will
strongly
resist
changing
direction in
yaw or pitch.
A rear brace
would help
keep this
force in
check. </span></div>
</div>
<div>
<div
class="yiv1683548014MsoNormal"> </div>
</div>
<div>
<div
class="yiv1683548014MsoNormal"><br>
</div>
</div>
<div>
<div
style="BACKGROUND:
white"
class="yiv1683548014MsoNormal">Bob
Kane<br>
<a
moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:getterflash@yahoo.com" rel="nofollow" target="_blank"
ymailto="mailto:getterflash@yahoo.com">getterflash@yahoo.com</a></div>
</div>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<div
style="BACKGROUND:
white"
class="yiv1683548014MsoNormal"><b><span
style="FONT-FAMILY:
'Arial',
'sans-serif';
FONT-SIZE:
10pt">From:</span></b><span
style="FONT-FAMILY:
'Arial',
'sans-serif';
FONT-SIZE:
10pt"> <a
moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:vicenterc@comcast.net" rel="nofollow" target="_blank"
ymailto="mailto:vicenterc@comcast.net">mailto:vicenterc@comcast.net</a>
<a
moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:vicenterc@comcast.net" rel="nofollow" target="_blank"
ymailto="mailto:vicenterc@comcast.net">mailto:vicenterc@comcast.net</a><br>
<b>To:</b>
General
pattern
discussion <a
moz-do-not-send="true" href="mailto:nsrca-discussion@lists.nsrca.org"
rel="nofollow"
target="_blank" ymailto="mailto:nsrca-discussion@lists.nsrca.org">mailto:nsrca-discussion@lists.nsrca.org</a>
<br>
<b>Sent:</b>
Tuesday,
December 4,
2012 8:27 AM<br>
<b>Subject:</b>
Re:
[NSRCA-discussion]
Serious Torque
on the Nose of
the Model -
RESUBMITTED</span></div>
</div>
<div
style="MARGIN-BOTTOM:
12pt;
BACKGROUND:
white"
class="yiv1683548014MsoNormal"><br>
I understand
that a rear
brace is a
must for this
motor. <br>
<br>
Vicente
"Vince"
Bortone<br>
Sent via
BlackBerry by
AT&T<br>
<br>
-----Original
Message-----<br>
From: "Charlie
Barrera" <<a
moz-do-not-send="true" href="mailto:charliebarrera@consolidated.net"
rel="nofollow"
target="_blank" ymailto="mailto:charliebarrera@consolidated.net">charliebarrera@consolidated.net</a>><br>
Sender: <a
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href="mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces@lists.nsrca.org" rel="nofollow"
target="_blank"
ymailto="mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces@lists.nsrca.org">nsrca-discussion-bounces@lists.nsrca.org</a><br>
Date: Tue, 4
Dec 2012
07:02:47 <br>
To: <<a
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href="mailto:nsrca-discussion@lists.nsrca.org" rel="nofollow"
target="_blank"
ymailto="mailto:nsrca-discussion@lists.nsrca.org">nsrca-discussion@lists.nsrca.org</a>><br>
Reply-To:
General
pattern
discussion
<<a
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href="mailto:nsrca-discussion@lists.nsrca.org" rel="nofollow"
target="_blank"
ymailto="mailto:nsrca-discussion@lists.nsrca.org">nsrca-discussion@lists.nsrca.org</a>><br>
Subject:
[NSRCA-discussion]
Serious Torque
on the Nose of
the Model -<br>
RESUBMITTED<br>
<br>
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<div style="BACKGROUND: white"
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Checked by AVG - <a
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<pre>_______________________________________________</pre>
<pre>NSRCA-discussion mailing list</pre>
<pre><a moz-do-not-send="true" href="mailto:NSRCA-discussion@lists.nsrca.org" rel="nofollow" target="_blank" ymailto="mailto:NSRCA-discussion@lists.nsrca.org">NSRCA-discussion@lists.nsrca.org</a></pre>
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<br>
<pre wrap="">_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
<a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:NSRCA-discussion@lists.nsrca.org">NSRCA-discussion@lists.nsrca.org</a>
<a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion">http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion</a></pre>
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