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<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:#1F497D'>that is a fair plan, thanks<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
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<div style='border:none;border-top:solid #B5C4DF 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0in 0in 0in'>
<p class=MsoNormal><b><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif";
color:windowtext'>From:</span></b><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:
"Tahoma","sans-serif";color:windowtext'>
nsrca-discussion-bounces@lists.nsrca.org
[mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces@lists.nsrca.org] <b>On Behalf Of </b>Del R<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Saturday, March 17, 2012 6:25 PM<br>
<b>To:</b> General pattern discussion<br>
<b>Subject:</b> Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Rules Proposals<o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p>
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<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";
color:blue'>HMMMmmm!!! Why both having rules if they are only
occasionally adhered to. In fairness to all honorable contestants, rules should
be honored whether PATTERN police are present or not. I sure would not
want to bust my butt spending the buckaroos and committing the time to be
legal at any local or regional or national event to know that some can show up
to beat up on me because they spent their time practicing, but not flying a
legal plane.</span><o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";
color:blue'> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
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<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";
color:blue'>I have never understood the desire for some to encourage hollow
victories. </span><o:p></o:p></p>
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<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";
color:blue'> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
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<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";
color:blue'> Del </span> <o:p></o:p></p>
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<blockquote style='border:none;border-left:solid blue 1.5pt;padding:0in 0in 0in 4.0pt;
margin-left:3.75pt;margin-top:5.0pt;margin-right:0in;margin-bottom:5.0pt'>
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<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>-----
OriginaI Message ----- <o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal style='background:#E4E4E4'><b><span style='font-size:10.0pt;
font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>From:</span></b><span style='font-size:10.0pt;
font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'> <a href="mailto:jgghome@comcast.net"
title="jgghome@comcast.net">John Gayer</a> <o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><b><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>To:</span></b><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'> <a
href="mailto:nsrca-discussion@lists.nsrca.org"
title="nsrca-discussion@lists.nsrca.org">General pattern discussion</a> <o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><b><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Sent:</span></b><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'> Friday, March 16,
2012 10:19 PM<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><b><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Subject:</span></b><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'> Re:
[NSRCA-discussion] Rules Proposals<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p>
</div>
<p class=MsoNormal>Arch,<br>
I certainly was not objecting to you enforcing the weight rule at the Nats. I'm
with you 100% on that and any other rule enforcement at the Nats you can
afford to do. You have to admit that your decision to weigh every plane created
a lot of "discussion" on this list.<br>
Can't see anyone going to the Nats knowing they are going to get just a
tearsheet and a bunch of zeros for their efforts. Again, this is not to imply
you should be doing anything different, just that we should change the rule to
encourage participation in the future.<br>
John<br>
<br>
On 3/16/2012 7:55 PM, Archie Stafford wrote: <o:p></o:p></p>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal>Hey, all I did was decide to enforce an existing rule.
Actually, I didn't have to say a thing except for how it was going to be
enforced. Frankly, if I had the number of people available to strictly enforce
every rule, I would. If nothing else my decision has at least sparked
the debate about the rule. It has never made sense to me to never enforce it.
Personally I think it needs to be left alone, but others don't. Even this year,
no one is saying you can't fly a heavy airplane. You just wont get to keep the
scores for that round. I seriously doubt someone with a real shot at winning
would show up with a heavy airplane anyway. People can even have their tear
sheets for the round. It just wont be listed in the results. <o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
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<p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p>
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<p class=MsoNormal>Arch<br>
<br>
Sent from my iPhone<o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><br>
On Mar 16, 2012, at 9:48 PM, John Gayer <<a href="mailto:jgghome@comcast.net">jgghome@comcast.net</a>>
wrote:<o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<blockquote style='margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt'>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal>Point taken about having to serve notice that you are going
to enforce a rule at a local contest. Note that Arch had to do that for the
Nats this year and such a clatter did arise....<br>
<br>
<br>
On 3/16/2012 6:53 PM, Dave Burton wrote: <o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:#1F497D'>John, one issue about waive a rule notification in really
bothers me in your suggestion. Having to post in advance 30 days that a CD will
enforce a rule is counter to any other process I’ve seen. </span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:#1F497D'>It becoming clear -eliminating the max weight rule is the only
system that really works. LOL</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<div>
<div style='border:none;border-top:solid #B5C4DF 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0in 0in 0in'>
<p class=MsoNormal><b><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif";
color:windowtext'>From:</span></b><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:
"Tahoma","sans-serif";color:windowtext'> <a
href="mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces@lists.nsrca.org">nsrca-discussion-bounces@lists.nsrca.org</a>
[<a href="mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces@lists.nsrca.org">mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces@lists.nsrca.org</a>]
<b>On Behalf Of </b>John Gayer<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Friday, March 16, 2012 8:20 PM<br>
<b>To:</b> General pattern discussion<br>
<b>Subject:</b> Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Rules Proposals</span><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
</div>
<p class=MsoNormal>This won't work very well, in my opinion. Who is going to
the Nats if they start out 5-10% behind? This does nothing to increase
attendance and is detrimental to operation of local contests. All it takes is
an unhappy pilot feeling he was home-towned protesting vociferously about the
heavy airplane that just beat him and demanding a weight check that might
reverse the first and second places. <br>
<br>
IF the CD denies the protest, you've lost a pilot. If you do a weight check and
it fails, then you've lost a different pilot. To prevent this, a CD must waive
the weight rules on his sanction which is not normally done now, although it
should be. So extra work and/or hassle for the CD and extra work for
scorekeeper/scorekeeping systems. For what gain? A rule that will not be
enforced locally and will keep pilots away from the Nats just as much as no
weight allowance at all. <br>
<br>
At the very least, preface the rule proposal with something like:<br>
This weight rule will be enforced at the Nats. If a CD chooses to include
this rule at a local contest, he must publicize that fact appropriately to all
potential attendees at least 30 days prior to the contest. <br>
<br>
At a local contest, this officially leaves us with no weight rule at all in AMA
classes. That's probably OK as we could reject on size if needed. Personally I
would only turn someone away if they brought a 42% Extra to fly in Masters and
maybe not even then...<br>
<br>
Cheers<br>
John<br>
<br>
<br>
On 3/15/2012 7:54 AM, <a href="mailto:ronlock@comcast.net">ronlock@comcast.net</a>
wrote: <o:p></o:p></p>
<div>
<p><span style='font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Hi All,</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p><span style='font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Here is a copy of another
proposal for consideration by the Contest Board along with the others that
have been submitted.</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p><span style='font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>This one does not disqualify
a model for not meeting weight limits. It imposes a score penalty, but
still allows the </span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p><span style='font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>model to participate.</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p><span style='font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Ron Lockhart</span><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
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