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</o:shapelayout></xml><![endif]--></head><body bgcolor=white lang=EN-US link=blue vlink=purple><div class=WordSection1><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>Hi Keith,<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>I think most of the escapes are designed to be inactive (if that’s the right word) until a signal is received from the Rx. <o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>I don’t trust that just like I wouldn’t trust a glow engine idling at a safe, low rpm in the pits without someone restraining the plane. It’s not just the escape we have to worry about. Our systems reside in a minefield of radio signals flying all over the place. Safe procedures trump electronics every time in the pits and in close proximity to people. The last thing that should be plugged in is the motor batteries and the plane should be restrained by someone when that happens in a contest environment. You don’t need an arming plug to accomplish that unless you feel more secure doing it that way. An unrestrained plane is a potential hazard with or without the arming plug.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>Verne<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><div><div style='border:none;border-top:solid #B5C4DF 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0in 0in 0in'><p class=MsoNormal><b><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"'>From:</span></b><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"'> nsrca-discussion-bounces@lists.nsrca.org [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces@lists.nsrca.org] <b>On Behalf Of </b>Keith Hoard<br><b>Sent:</b> Monday, February 13, 2012 6:32 PM<br><b>To:</b> General pattern discussion<br><b>Subject:</b> Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Arming Switch<o:p></o:p></span></p></div></div><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'> I guess I'd have to defer to the ESC manufacturer on that one. Does anyone know Castle's official position about killing the receiver signal to disarm the ESC? Apparently Tony has done it enough that he's confident with that method. <o:p></o:p></p><div><p class=MsoNormal><span class=apple-style-span>Keith Hoard</span><o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal>Collierville, TN<o:p></o:p></p></div></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><br>On Feb 13, 2012, at 17:17, John Gayer <<a href="mailto:jgghome@comcast.net">jgghome@comcast.net</a>> wrote:<o:p></o:p></p></div><blockquote style='margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><div><p class=MsoNormal>Keith<br><br>Tony advocated doing just that on RCU post #35:<br><a href="http://www.rcuniverse.com/forum/m_10952866/anchors_10955113/mpage_2/key_/anchor/tm.htm#10955113">http://www.rcuniverse.com/forum/m_10952866/anchors_10955113/mpage_2/key_/anchor/tm.htm#10955113</a><br><br>John Gayer<br><br>On 2/13/2012 3:45 PM, Keith Hoard wrote: <o:p></o:p></p><div><p class=MsoNormal>Bob,<o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal> OK, you're right, I thought you were talking about the transmitter. I couldn't imagine anyone wanting to turn off the receiver signal ON PURPOSE as a means to disarm an ESC. You're really relying on that firmware to do the right thing. <o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'> Ya gotta treat these things like a loaded gun. What's the best Gun Control Law? Use both hands!!<o:p></o:p></p><div><p class=MsoNormal><span class=apple-style-span>Keith Hoard</span><o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal>Collierville, TN<o:p></o:p></p></div></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><br>On Feb 13, 2012, at 16:12, Bob Richards <<a href="mailto:bob@toprudder.com">bob@toprudder.com</a>> wrote:<o:p></o:p></p></div><blockquote style='margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><div><table class=MsoNormalTable border=0 cellspacing=0 cellpadding=0><tr><td valign=top style='padding:0in 0in 0in 0in'><div><p class=MsoNormal>Keith,<o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal> <o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal>Agree with everything you say, except your #2. I said that turning off the "rx" (receiver) is not completely safe. Perhaps you thought I said "transmitter". Turning off the receiver has nothing to do with failsafe settings as the rx can't output ANYTHING including whatever the "failsafe" setting may be. Some of the so called "arming switches" included on some ESCs do nothing more than turn power off to the rx, or disconnect the signal wire from the rx to the ESC. As someone pointed out, this leaves the ESC open to possible interference after it has been armed.<o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal> <o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal>Bob R.<br><br>--- On <b>Mon, 2/13/12, Keith Hoard <i><<a href="mailto:khoard@gmail.com">khoard@gmail.com</a>></i></b> wrote:<o:p></o:p></p></div><blockquote style='border:none;border-left:solid #1010FF 1.5pt;padding:0in 0in 0in 4.0pt;margin-left:3.75pt;margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p><div id=yiv259333457><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'>Bob,<br><br>1) So is leaving your canopy off with ESC plug displayed until you are in the ready box. I'd argue that it is more visible AND directly addresses the problem. Arming plugs are small and can only be seen from one side of your airplane. <br>2) That is a failsafe setting issue that an affect your airplane any time the batteries are connected, even during a flight where the disconnect device is useless. I agree with demonstrating proper failsafe setup.<br>3) Very true.<br><br> What I don't agree with is the NSRCA issuing an "Airworthiness Directive" ("AD" in FAA-speak) requiring me to install equipment to address a <i>potential </i>problem when I can address that problem in other ways. I think the Board would be much better off proposing a rule defining WHAT outcome they are desiring, then allowing the competitor to come up with an effective way to accomplish that objective. I think we'd be better off adopting the FAI rule that mandates when power can be connected to the plane and let the competitor accomplish that objective in any manner they wish, either through good battery management techniques or disconnect devices.<br><br clear=all> Besides, if you read the NSRCA rule proposal, all it says is that you have to install a disconnect device. It does not mandate when it will be utilized to arm or disarm the plane. So. . . according to the rule, I can install the arming plug and leave it connected at all times, thus not even solving the original "problem".<br><br>Keith Hoard<br>Collierville, TN<br><a href="http://us.mc1616.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=khoard@gmail.com" target="_blank">khoard@gmail.com</a><br><br><br><br><o:p></o:p></p><div><p class=MsoNormal>On Mon, Feb 13, 2012 at 2:18 PM, Bob Richards <<a href="http://us.mc1616.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=bob@toprudder.com" target="_blank">bob@toprudder.com</a>> wrote:<o:p></o:p></p><table class=MsoNormalTable border=0 cellspacing=0 cellpadding=0><tr><td valign=top style='padding:0in 0in 0in 0in'><div><p class=MsoNormal>Keith,<o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal> <o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal>What you say it true.<o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal> <o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal>What I have taken from this discussion:<o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal> <o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal>1) An arming plug is an externally visible indicator of "ready and dangerous".<o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal>2) Turning the rx off alone is not a completely safe condition, and less so AFTER a flight.<o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal>3) No safety measure is 100% infallible, simply due to human error.<o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal> <o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal>Regardless of how you render your aircraft safe, you still have to remember to do it!!! People will forget, and that unfortunately will happen regardless.<o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal> <o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal>Bob R.<o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><br><br>--- On <b>Mon, 2/13/12, Keith Hoard <i><<a href="http://us.mc1616.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=khoard@gmail.com" target="_blank">khoard@gmail.com</a>></i></b> wrote:<o:p></o:p></p></div><blockquote style='border:none;border-left:solid #1010FF 1.5pt;padding:0in 0in 0in 4.0pt;margin-left:3.75pt;margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p><div><p class=MsoNormal>Just how many airplanes have we seen fly out of caller's hands at contests? Is this a widespread problem, or just isolated to a couple contests? Why can't the caller maintain positive control of the airplane until the owner gets over to disconnect the battery? If the caller and/or pilot are that distracted after a flight, what is to keep them from forgetting to removing the arming plug? <br><br>I think this is a solution wandering around looking for a problem. If you can't remember to disconnect your battery as soon as possible after a flight and to only connect it just prior to flight then you won't remember to use your arming plug to perform the same functions.<br clear=all><o:p></o:p></p></div></blockquote></td></tr></table><p class=MsoNormal><br>_______________________________________________<br>NSRCA-discussion mailing list<br><a href="http://us.mc1616.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=NSRCA-discussion@lists.nsrca.org" target="_blank">NSRCA-discussion@lists.nsrca.org</a><br><a href="http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion" target="_blank">http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion</a><o:p></o:p></p></div><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p></div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><br>-----Inline Attachment Follows-----<o:p></o:p></p><div><p class=MsoNormal>_______________________________________________<br>NSRCA-discussion mailing list<br><a href="http://us.mc1616.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=NSRCA-discussion@lists.nsrca.org">NSRCA-discussion@lists.nsrca.org</a><br><a href="http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion" target="_blank">http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion</a><o:p></o:p></p></div></blockquote></td></tr></table></div></blockquote><blockquote style='margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><div><p class=MsoNormal>_______________________________________________<br>NSRCA-discussion mailing list<br><a href="mailto:NSRCA-discussion@lists.nsrca.org">NSRCA-discussion@lists.nsrca.org</a><br><a href="http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion">http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion</a><o:p></o:p></p></div></blockquote><p class=MsoNormal><br><br><br><o:p></o:p></p><pre>_______________________________________________<o:p></o:p></pre><pre>NSRCA-discussion mailing list<o:p></o:p></pre><pre><a href="mailto:NSRCA-discussion@lists.nsrca.org">NSRCA-discussion@lists.nsrca.org</a><o:p></o:p></pre><pre><a href="http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion">http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion</a><o:p></o:p></pre></div></blockquote><blockquote style='margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><div><p class=MsoNormal>_______________________________________________<br>NSRCA-discussion mailing list<br><a href="mailto:NSRCA-discussion@lists.nsrca.org">NSRCA-discussion@lists.nsrca.org</a><br><a href="http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion">http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion</a><o:p></o:p></p></div></blockquote></div></body></html>