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<p class=MsoNormal><span class=EmailStyle80><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;mso-bidi-font-size:12.0pt;font-family:Arial'>John I
felt the same about the telemetry rule and as I was composing my response to
Scott it occurred to me that a modified auto pilot to light indicator lights on
the airplane to advise the pilot of 'Wings Not Level'. Being neither
specifically allowed or prohibited it could be used as well as perceived as an
unfair advantage.<o:p></o:p></span></font></span></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><span class=EmailStyle80><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;mso-bidi-font-size:12.0pt;font-family:Arial'>The
ongoing problem of maintaining the list seamed overwhelming until I got to the
'Intent' part of the rule which led me to believe that a CD could likely rule
on the use of unlisted devices as either in compliance with the intent or not.<o:p></o:p></span></font></span></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><span class=EmailStyle80><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;mso-bidi-font-size:12.0pt;font-family:Arial'>As rapidly
as technology advances there is no way to get in front of it.<o:p></o:p></span></font></span></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><span class=EmailStyle80><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;mso-bidi-font-size:12.0pt;font-family:Arial'>Jim<o:p></o:p></span></font></span></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><span class=EmailStyle80><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;mso-bidi-font-size:12.0pt;font-family:Arial'><![if !supportEmptyParas]> <![endif]><o:p></o:p></span></font></span></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:.5in'><font size=2 color=black
face=Tahoma><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Tahoma;color:black'>-----Original
Message-----<br>
<b><span style='font-weight:bold'>From:</span></b>
nsrca-discussion-bounces@lists.nsrca.org
[mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces@lists.nsrca.org]<b><span style='font-weight:
bold'>On Behalf Of </span></b>John Ford<br>
<b><span style='font-weight:bold'>Sent:</span></b> Sunday, February 12, 2012
6:23 AM<br>
<b><span style='font-weight:bold'>To:</span></b> General pattern discussion<br>
<b><span style='font-weight:bold'>Subject:</span></b> Re: [NSRCA-discussion]
NSRCA candidate rules proposal surveyisavailable</span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:.5in'><font size=3 face="Times New Roman"><span
style='font-size:12.0pt'><![if !supportEmptyParas]> <![endif]><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<table border=0 cellspacing=0 cellpadding=0 width=588 style='width:440.9pt;
mso-cellspacing:0in;margin-left:.5in;mso-padding-alt:0in 0in 0in 0in'>
<tr>
<td valign=top style='padding:0in 0in 0in 0in'>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 color=black face=inherit><span
style='font-size:12.0pt;font-family:inherit;color:black'>I don't often post
on this list, but for what it is worth, the survey has proposals that are
timely and that reflect the issues of the day as I recall from so many
discussions on the flight line. I didn't immediately think the BoD forced my
hand or made assumptions that were premature. </span></font><font
color=black face=inherit><span style='font-family:inherit;color:black;
mso-color-alt:windowtext'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 color=black face=inherit><span
style='font-size:12.0pt;font-family:inherit;color:black'>I think I am able to
complete the survey without being influenced by the wording of the preamble.
However, I trust that the results of the survey will be tabulated and posted
here prior to taking them to the AMA. </span></font><font color=black
face=inherit><span style='font-family:inherit;color:black;mso-color-alt:windowtext'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 color=black face=inherit><span
style='font-size:12.0pt;font-family:inherit;color:black'>On the other hand,
asking for opinions on this list about the proposals is risky business since
at least one of the proposals is a historical hot potato (Contestant
Classification). Personally, I feel that a lot more is broken about our
development classes than the ability to move up or down from one class to the
other. (...that comment alone is good for at least 247 vitriolic responses,
I'm sure)</span></font><font color=black face=inherit><span style='font-family:
inherit;color:black;mso-color-alt:windowtext'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 color=black face=inherit><span
style='font-size:12.0pt;font-family:inherit;color:black'>All the other
proposals are hard to argue against, although the
Equipment/Telemetry rule would be a nightmare to enforce, in my opinion. Not
right or wrong, just hard to enforce.</span></font><font color=black
face=inherit><span style='font-family:inherit;color:black;mso-color-alt:windowtext'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 color=black face=inherit><span
style='font-size:12.0pt;font-family:inherit;color:black'> </span></font><font
color=black face=inherit><span style='font-family:inherit;color:black;
mso-color-alt:windowtext'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 color=black face=inherit><span
style='font-size:12.0pt;font-family:inherit;color:black'>Without indicating
what I voted on the survey, I'm OK with the process. Gonna be interesting to
see the results.</span></font><font color=black face=inherit><span
style='font-family:inherit;color:black;mso-color-alt:windowtext'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 color=black face=inherit><span
style='font-size:12.0pt;font-family:inherit;color:black'> </span></font><font
color=black face=inherit><span style='font-family:inherit;color:black;
mso-color-alt:windowtext'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 color=black face=inherit><span
style='font-size:12.0pt;font-family:inherit;color:black'>John</span></font><font
color=black face=inherit><span style='font-family:inherit;color:black;
mso-color-alt:windowtext'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 color=black face=inherit><span
style='font-size:12.0pt;font-family:inherit;color:black'><br>
<br>
--- On <b><span style='font-weight:bold'>Sat, 2/11/12, J N Hiller <i><span
style='font-style:italic'><jnhiller@earthlink.net></span></i></span></b>
wrote:</span></font><font color=black face=inherit><span style='font-family:
inherit;color:black;mso-color-alt:windowtext'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<div style='border:none;border-left:solid #1010FF 1.5pt;padding:0in 0in 0in 4.0pt'>
<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-right:.5in;mso-margin-top-alt:auto;
margin-bottom:12.0pt;margin-left:3.75pt;border:none;mso-border-left-alt:solid #1010FF 1.5pt;
padding:0in;mso-padding-alt:0in 0in 0in 4.0pt'><font size=3 color=black
face=inherit><span style='font-size:12.0pt;font-family:inherit;color:black'><br>
From: J N Hiller <jnhiller@earthlink.net><br>
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] NSRCA candidate rules proposal survey
isavailable<br>
To: "General pattern discussion"
<nsrca-discussion@lists.nsrca.org><br>
Date: Saturday, February 11, 2012, 7:17 PM</span></font><font color=black
face=inherit><span style='font-family:inherit;color:black;mso-color-alt:windowtext'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=yiv1304192167msonormal style='margin-right:.5in;margin-left:3.75pt;
border:none;mso-border-left-alt:solid #1010FF 1.5pt;padding:0in;mso-padding-alt:
0in 0in 0in 4.0pt'><span class=yiv1304192167emailstyle18><font size=2
color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;
color:navy'>
<div id=yiv1304192167>Peter I did exactly what you are suggesting by sending
my suggestions for changes to the initial proposal directly to Scott for the
contest board's consideration when writing the final proposal to be submitted
to AMA.</span></font></span><font color=black face=inherit><span
style='font-family:inherit;color:black;mso-color-alt:windowtext'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=yiv1304192167msonormal style='margin-right:.5in;margin-left:3.75pt;
border:none;mso-border-left-alt:solid #1010FF 1.5pt;padding:0in;mso-padding-alt:
0in 0in 0in 4.0pt'><span class=yiv1304192167emailstyle18><font size=2
color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;
color:navy'> </span></font></span><font color=black face=inherit><span
style='font-family:inherit;color:black;mso-color-alt:windowtext'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=yiv1304192167msonormal style='margin-right:.5in;margin-left:3.75pt;
border:none;mso-border-left-alt:solid #1010FF 1.5pt;padding:0in;mso-padding-alt:
0in 0in 0in 4.0pt'><span class=yiv1304192167emailstyle18><font size=2
color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;
color:navy'>I didn't post it here because these discussion topics quickly deteriorate
to off subject usually private conversations.</span></font></span><font
color=black face=inherit><span style='font-family:inherit;color:black;
mso-color-alt:windowtext'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<p class=yiv1304192167msonormal style='margin-right:.5in;margin-left:3.75pt;
border:none;mso-border-left-alt:solid #1010FF 1.5pt;padding:0in;mso-padding-alt:
0in 0in 0in 4.0pt'><span class=yiv1304192167emailstyle18><font size=2
color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;
color:navy'>Of all the posts today I haven't seen any discussion on the
content of the proposals. If we fail to express constructive suggestions the
proposals will likely be submitted in their present configuration.</span></font></span><font
color=black face=inherit><span style='font-family:inherit;color:black;
mso-color-alt:windowtext'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=yiv1304192167msonormal style='margin-right:.5in;margin-left:3.75pt;
border:none;mso-border-left-alt:solid #1010FF 1.5pt;padding:0in;mso-padding-alt:
0in 0in 0in 4.0pt'><span class=yiv1304192167emailstyle18><font size=2
color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;
color:navy'> </span></font></span><font color=black face=inherit><span
style='font-family:inherit;color:black;mso-color-alt:windowtext'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=yiv1304192167msonormal style='margin-right:.5in;margin-left:3.75pt;
border:none;mso-border-left-alt:solid #1010FF 1.5pt;padding:0in;mso-padding-alt:
0in 0in 0in 4.0pt'><span class=yiv1304192167emailstyle18><font size=2
color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;
color:navy'>I apologize in advance if some of you find my remarks offensive
it isn't meant to be.</span></font></span><font color=black face=inherit><span
style='font-family:inherit;color:black;mso-color-alt:windowtext'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=yiv1304192167msonormal style='margin-right:.5in;margin-left:3.75pt;
border:none;mso-border-left-alt:solid #1010FF 1.5pt;padding:0in;mso-padding-alt:
0in 0in 0in 4.0pt'><span class=yiv1304192167emailstyle18><font size=2
color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;
color:navy'>Jim</span></font></span><font color=black face=inherit><span
style='font-family:inherit;color:black;mso-color-alt:windowtext'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=yiv1304192167msonormal style='margin-right:.5in;margin-left:3.75pt;
border:none;mso-border-left-alt:solid #1010FF 1.5pt;padding:0in;mso-padding-alt:
0in 0in 0in 4.0pt'><span class=yiv1304192167emailstyle18><font size=2
color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;
color:navy'> </span></font></span><font color=black face=inherit><span
style='font-family:inherit;color:black;mso-color-alt:windowtext'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=yiv1304192167msonormal style='margin-right:.5in;margin-left:3.75pt;
border:none;mso-border-left-alt:solid #1010FF 1.5pt;padding:0in;mso-padding-alt:
0in 0in 0in 4.0pt'><span class=yiv1304192167emailstyle18><font size=2
color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;
color:navy'> </span></font></span><font color=black face=inherit><span
style='font-family:inherit;color:black;mso-color-alt:windowtext'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=yiv1304192167msonormal style='margin-right:.5in;margin-left:3.75pt;
border:none;mso-border-left-alt:solid #1010FF 1.5pt;padding:0in;mso-padding-alt:
0in 0in 0in 4.0pt'><span class=yiv1304192167emailstyle18><font size=2
color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;
color:navy'> </span></font></span><font color=black face=inherit><span
style='font-family:inherit;color:black;mso-color-alt:windowtext'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<div style='border:none;border-left:solid #1010FF 1.5pt;padding:0in 0in 0in 4.0pt'>
<p class=yiv1304192167msonormal style='margin-right:.5in;margin-left:39.75pt;
border:none;mso-border-left-alt:solid #1010FF 1.5pt;padding:0in;mso-padding-alt:
0in 0in 0in 4.0pt'><font size=2 color=black face=Tahoma><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Tahoma;color:black'>-----Original
Message-----<br>
<b><span style='font-weight:bold'>From:</span></b>
nsrca-discussion-bounces@lists.nsrca.org
[mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces@lists.nsrca.org]<b><span style='font-weight:
bold'>On Behalf Of </span></b>Peter Vogel<br>
<b><span style='font-weight:bold'>Sent:</span></b> Saturday, February 11,
2012 2:59 PM<br>
<b><span style='font-weight:bold'>To:</span></b> General pattern discussion<br>
<b><span style='font-weight:bold'>Cc:</span></b> General pattern discussion<br>
<b><span style='font-weight:bold'>Subject:</span></b> Re: [NSRCA-discussion]
NSRCA candidate rules proposal survey isavailable</span></font><font
color=black face=inherit><span style='font-family:inherit;color:black;
mso-color-alt:windowtext'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=yiv1304192167msonormal style='margin-right:.5in;margin-left:39.75pt;
border:none;mso-border-left-alt:solid #1010FF 1.5pt;padding:0in;mso-padding-alt:
0in 0in 0in 4.0pt'><font size=3 color=black face="Times New Roman"><span
style='font-size:12.0pt;color:black'> </span></font><font color=black
face=inherit><span style='font-family:inherit;color:black;mso-color-alt:windowtext'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=yiv1304192167msonormal style='margin-right:.5in;margin-left:39.75pt;
border:none;mso-border-left-alt:solid #1010FF 1.5pt;padding:0in;mso-padding-alt:
0in 0in 0in 4.0pt'><font size=3 color=black face="Times New Roman"><span
style='font-size:12.0pt;color:black'>I fail to see why the board's opinion on
the rules proposals as written is relevant. They are doing what I would
expect the board of an org like outs to do: asking the membership for
their opinions on the proposals. </span></font><font color=black
face=inherit><span style='font-family:inherit;color:black;mso-color-alt:windowtext'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=yiv1304192167msonormal style='margin-right:.5in;margin-left:39.75pt;
border:none;mso-border-left-alt:solid #1010FF 1.5pt;padding:0in;mso-padding-alt:
0in 0in 0in 4.0pt'><font size=3 color=black face="Times New Roman"><span
style='font-size:12.0pt;color:black'> </span></font><font color=black
face=inherit><span style='font-family:inherit;color:black;mso-color-alt:windowtext'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=yiv1304192167msonormal style='margin-right:.5in;margin-left:39.75pt;
border:none;mso-border-left-alt:solid #1010FF 1.5pt;padding:0in;mso-padding-alt:
0in 0in 0in 4.0pt'><font size=3 color=black face="Times New Roman"><span
style='font-size:12.0pt;color:black'>The only thing I would have liked to see
was a fourth option on the survey questions: ' I would support this
proposal with modifications: ' with a text field for verbatim feedback
on the modifications. </span></font><font color=black face=inherit><span
style='font-family:inherit;color:black;mso-color-alt:windowtext'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=yiv1304192167msonormal style='margin-right:.5in;margin-left:39.75pt;
border:none;mso-border-left-alt:solid #1010FF 1.5pt;padding:0in;mso-padding-alt:
0in 0in 0in 4.0pt'><font size=3 color=black face="Times New Roman"><span
style='font-size:12.0pt;color:black'> </span></font><font color=black
face=inherit><span style='font-family:inherit;color:black;mso-color-alt:windowtext'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=yiv1304192167msonormal style='margin-right:.5in;margin-left:39.75pt;
border:none;mso-border-left-alt:solid #1010FF 1.5pt;padding:0in;mso-padding-alt:
0in 0in 0in 4.0pt'><font size=3 color=black face="Times New Roman"><span
style='font-size:12.0pt;color:black'>Peter+<br>
<br>
Sent from my iPhone4S</span></font><font color=black face=inherit><span
style='font-family:inherit;color:black;mso-color-alt:windowtext'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=yiv1304192167msonormal style='margin-right:.5in;margin-bottom:12.0pt;
margin-left:39.75pt;border:none;mso-border-left-alt:solid #1010FF 1.5pt;
padding:0in;mso-padding-alt:0in 0in 0in 4.0pt'><font size=3 color=black
face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:12.0pt;color:black'><br>
On Feb 11, 2012, at 12:57 PM, Dan Curtis <<a
href="http://us.mc1205.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=warrior523@att.net"
target="_blank" rel=nofollow ymailto="mailto:warrior523@att.net">warrior523@att.net</a>>
wrote:</span></font><font color=black face=inherit><span style='font-family:
inherit;color:black;mso-color-alt:windowtext'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<div style='border:none;border-left:solid #1010FF 1.5pt;padding:0in 0in 0in 4.0pt'>
<p class=yiv1304192167msonormal style='margin-right:1.0in;margin-left:75.75pt;
border:none;mso-border-left-alt:solid #1010FF 1.5pt;padding:0in;mso-padding-alt:
0in 0in 0in 4.0pt'><font size=3 color=black face="Times New Roman"><span
style='font-size:12.0pt;color:black'>That is not what is written in the
introduction. I would like to see each board member answer the question
on this membership list, are they for it as it is stated or are they for the
process in general?</span></font><font color=black face=inherit><span
style='font-family:inherit;color:black;mso-color-alt:windowtext'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=yiv1304192167msonormal style='margin-right:1.0in;margin-left:75.75pt;
border:none;mso-border-left-alt:solid #1010FF 1.5pt;padding:0in;mso-padding-alt:
0in 0in 0in 4.0pt'><font size=3 color=black face="Times New Roman"><span
style='font-size:12.0pt;color:black'> </span></font><font color=black
face=inherit><span style='font-family:inherit;color:black;mso-color-alt:windowtext'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=yiv1304192167msonormal style='margin-right:1.0in;margin-left:75.75pt;
border:none;mso-border-left-alt:solid #1010FF 1.5pt;padding:0in;mso-padding-alt:
0in 0in 0in 4.0pt'><font size=3 color=black face="Times New Roman"><span
style='font-size:12.0pt;color:black'>Dan</span></font><font color=black
face=inherit><span style='font-family:inherit;color:black;mso-color-alt:windowtext'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=yiv1304192167msonormal style='margin-right:1.0in;margin-left:75.75pt;
border:none;mso-border-left-alt:solid #1010FF 1.5pt;padding:0in;mso-padding-alt:
0in 0in 0in 4.0pt'><font size=3 color=black face="Times New Roman"><span
style='font-size:12.0pt;color:black'> </span></font><font color=black
face=inherit><span style='font-family:inherit;color:black;mso-color-alt:windowtext'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<div class=MsoNormal align=center style='margin-right:1.0in;mso-margin-top-alt:
auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:75.75pt;text-align:center;
border:none;mso-border-left-alt:solid #1010FF 1.5pt;padding:0in;mso-padding-alt:
0in 0in 0in 4.0pt'><font size=2 color=black face=Tahoma><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Tahoma;color:black'>
<hr size=1 width="100%" align=center>
</span></font></div>
<p class=yiv1304192167msonormal style='margin-right:1.0in;margin-bottom:12.0pt;
margin-left:75.75pt;border:none;mso-border-left-alt:solid #1010FF 1.5pt;
padding:0in;mso-padding-alt:0in 0in 0in 4.0pt'><b><font size=2 color=black
face=Tahoma><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Tahoma;color:black;
font-weight:bold'>From:</span></font></b><font size=2 color=black
face=Tahoma><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Tahoma;color:black'>
Scott McHarg <<a
href="http://us.mc1205.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=scmcharg@gmail.com"
target="_blank" rel=nofollow ymailto="mailto:scmcharg@gmail.com">scmcharg@gmail.com</a>><br>
<b><span style='font-weight:bold'>To:</span></b> General pattern discussion <<a
href="http://us.mc1205.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=nsrca-discussion@lists.nsrca.org"
target="_blank" rel=nofollow ymailto="mailto:nsrca-discussion@lists.nsrca.org">nsrca-discussion@lists.nsrca.org</a>><br>
<b><span style='font-weight:bold'>Sent:</span></b> Sat, February 11, 2012
2:49:29 PM<br>
<b><span style='font-weight:bold'>Subject:</span></b> Re: [NSRCA-discussion]
NSRCA candidate rules proposal survey is available<br>
</span></font><font color=black face=inherit><span style='font-family:inherit;
color:black'><br>
Dan,<br>
I guess you'd have to ask each individual member of the BoD.
I can tell you that prior to finalizing what you see as a candidate proposal,
we presented where we were and what we were working on to the BoD in a
telephonic meeting. Although they did not have the proposals in their
hand, each proposal was explained and the floor was open for discussion.
Not one single person said something to the contrary other than they felt we
were doing a good job and we were on the right track. That says to me
that we were pursuing what was asked of us. The survey will then tell
us if our community feels the same.<br>
<br>
Scott</span></font><font color=black face=inherit><span style='font-family:
inherit;color:black;mso-color-alt:windowtext'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=yiv1304192167msonormal style='margin-right:1.0in;margin-left:75.75pt;
border:none;mso-border-left-alt:solid #1010FF 1.5pt;padding:0in;mso-padding-alt:
0in 0in 0in 4.0pt'><font size=3 color=black face="Times New Roman"><span
style='font-size:12.0pt;color:black'>On Sat, Feb 11, 2012 at 2:44 PM, Dan
Curtis <<a
href="http://us.mc1205.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=warrior523@att.net"
target="_blank" rel=nofollow ymailto="mailto:warrior523@att.net">warrior523@att.net</a>>
wrote:</span></font><font color=black face=inherit><span style='font-family:
inherit;color:black;mso-color-alt:windowtext'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<p class=yiv1304192167msonormal style='margin-right:1.0in;margin-bottom:0in;
margin-left:80.55pt;margin-bottom:.0001pt'><font size=3 color=black
face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:12.0pt;color:black'>As I asked
in the previous post, does the current board feel that these proposals are
valid and good for the pattern community. This is what is states in the
survey introduction and is this a fact?</span></font><font color=black
face=inherit><span style='font-family:inherit;color:black;mso-color-alt:windowtext'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=yiv1304192167msonormal style='margin-right:1.0in;margin-bottom:0in;
margin-left:80.55pt;margin-bottom:.0001pt'><font size=3 color=black
face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:12.0pt;color:black'> </span></font><font
color=black face=inherit><span style='font-family:inherit;color:black;
mso-color-alt:windowtext'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=yiv1304192167msonormal style='margin-right:1.0in;margin-bottom:0in;
margin-left:80.55pt;margin-bottom:.0001pt'><font size=3 color=black
face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:12.0pt;color:black'>The survey
could have also had a question asking if the membership or the community
feels that any changes are needed at this point and time.</span></font><font
color=black face=inherit><span style='font-family:inherit;color:black;
mso-color-alt:windowtext'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=yiv1304192167msonormal style='margin-right:1.0in;margin-bottom:0in;
margin-left:80.55pt;margin-bottom:.0001pt'><font size=3 color=black
face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:12.0pt;color:black'> </span></font><font
color=black face=inherit><span style='font-family:inherit;color:black;
mso-color-alt:windowtext'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=yiv1304192167msonormal style='margin-right:1.0in;margin-bottom:0in;
margin-left:80.55pt;margin-bottom:.0001pt'><font size=3 color=black
face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:12.0pt;color:black'>This
survey, with its introduction statement, seems to show a bit of
predispostion. </span></font><font color=black face=inherit><span
style='font-family:inherit;color:black;mso-color-alt:windowtext'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=yiv1304192167msonormal style='margin-right:1.0in;margin-bottom:0in;
margin-left:80.55pt;margin-bottom:.0001pt'><font size=3 color=black
face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:12.0pt;color:black'> </span></font><font
color=black face=inherit><span style='font-family:inherit;color:black;
mso-color-alt:windowtext'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=yiv1304192167msonormal style='margin-right:1.0in;margin-bottom:0in;
margin-left:80.55pt;margin-bottom:.0001pt'><font size=3 color=black
face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:12.0pt;color:black'>Dan</span></font><font
color=black face=inherit><span style='font-family:inherit;color:black;
mso-color-alt:windowtext'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=yiv1304192167msonormal style='margin-right:1.0in;margin-bottom:0in;
margin-left:80.55pt;margin-bottom:.0001pt'><font size=3 color=black
face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:12.0pt;color:black'> </span></font><font
color=black face=inherit><span style='font-family:inherit;color:black;
mso-color-alt:windowtext'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<div class=MsoNormal align=center style='margin-right:1.0in;mso-margin-top-alt:
auto;margin-left:80.55pt;text-align:center'><font size=3 color=black
face=Tahoma><span style='font-size:12.0pt;font-family:Tahoma;color:black'>
<hr size=1 width="100%" align=center>
</span></font></div>
<p class=yiv1304192167msonormal style='margin-right:1.0in;margin-bottom:0in;
margin-left:80.55pt;margin-bottom:.0001pt'><b><font size=3 color=black
face=Tahoma><span style='font-size:12.0pt;font-family:Tahoma;color:black;
font-weight:bold'>From:</span></font></b><font color=black face=Tahoma><span
style='font-family:Tahoma;color:black'> Scott McHarg <<a
href="http://us.mc1205.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=scmcharg@gmail.com"
target="_blank" rel=nofollow ymailto="mailto:scmcharg@gmail.com">scmcharg@gmail.com</a>><br>
<b><span style='font-weight:bold'>To:</span></b> General pattern discussion <<a
href="http://us.mc1205.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=nsrca-discussion@lists.nsrca.org"
target="_blank" rel=nofollow ymailto="mailto:nsrca-discussion@lists.nsrca.org">nsrca-discussion@lists.nsrca.org</a>></span></font><font
color=black face=inherit><span style='font-family:inherit;color:black;
mso-color-alt:windowtext'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=yiv1304192167msonormal style='margin-right:1.0in;margin-bottom:0in;
margin-left:80.55pt;margin-bottom:.0001pt'><b><font size=3 color=black
face=Tahoma><span style='font-size:12.0pt;font-family:Tahoma;color:black;
font-weight:bold'>Sent:</span></font></b><font color=black face=Tahoma><span
style='font-family:Tahoma;color:black'> Sat, February 11, 2012 2:29:53 PM </span></font><font
color=black face=inherit><span style='font-family:inherit;color:black;
mso-color-alt:windowtext'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=yiv1304192167msonormal style='margin-right:1.0in;margin-bottom:0in;
margin-left:80.55pt;margin-bottom:.0001pt'><font size=3 color=black
face=Tahoma><span style='font-size:12.0pt;font-family:Tahoma;color:black'><br>
<b><span style='font-weight:bold'>Subject:</span></b> Re: [NSRCA-discussion]
NSRCA candidate rules proposal survey is available</span></font><font
color=black face=inherit><span style='font-family:inherit;color:black;
mso-color-alt:windowtext'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=yiv1304192167msonormal style='margin-right:1.0in;margin-bottom:12.0pt;
margin-left:80.55pt'><font size=3 color=black face="Times New Roman"><span
style='font-size:12.0pt;color:black'><br>
Gentlemen,<br>
As you can see from the forums, everyone of us has our own
opinion. The BoD asked us to make "proposals". These
are not "the rules" nor are they set in stone. We came up
with said proposals based on input from individuals who took the time to
email, phone and post their requests. The survey is doing exactly what
it was meant to do, get everyone's opinion based on what we laid out
there. If you don't like it, that's fine. This is simply a
starting point. The results of the survey will tell us whether we are
on, off or close to what our community wants. Once the survey finishes,
the results will be taken back and, if needed, proposals amended. I'd
suggest that the results will indicate what percentile are in favor of vs.
those that are against. I don't think any of you would expect everyone
that flies pattern to get in a room and try to formulate proposals based on
every single opinion in that room. That would be a nightmare.<br>
The Board of Directors recognize that change is a <u>possibility</u>
but not necessarily warranted in all cases. Again, that would be the
purpose of the focus group to try to get something done and out there for the
community to weigh in on. At that point, the amended proposals are then
taken to the BoD for endorsement and then to the AMA Rules Committee which,
in reality, is the group that must find out if these proposals are realistic
and what the community wants. AMA owns precision aerobatics, not the
NSRCA and the NSRCA does not make the rules. The 5500g rule came from
other development classes that are around the world i.e. France and
South Africa who have implemented said changes to their development
classes. MAYBE the number is off to an extent. MAYBE we don't
need that kind of increase. I guess that's what the survey will tell
us. I'd suggest telling all that you know to get out there and take the
survey if you feel strongly about something. This is how we begin the
process.<br>
<br>
Scott</span></font><font color=black face=inherit><span style='font-family:
inherit;color:black;mso-color-alt:windowtext'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=yiv1304192167msonormal style='margin-right:1.0in;margin-bottom:0in;
margin-left:80.55pt;margin-bottom:.0001pt'><font size=3 color=black
face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:12.0pt;color:black'>On Sat, Feb
11, 2012 at 2:04 PM, Vicente "Vince" Bortone <<a
href="http://us.mc1205.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=vicenterc@comcast.net"
target="_blank" rel=nofollow ymailto="mailto:vicenterc@comcast.net">vicenterc@comcast.net</a>>
wrote:</span></font><font color=black face=inherit><span style='font-family:
inherit;color:black;mso-color-alt:windowtext'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=yiv1304192167msonormal style='margin-right:1.0in;margin-bottom:0in;
margin-left:85.35pt;margin-bottom:.0001pt'><font size=3 color=black
face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:12.0pt;color:black'>So is this
a second survey? I remember one few months ago and didn't have those
proposals. I am confused now.<br>
</span></font><font color="#888888" face=inherit><span style='font-family:
inherit;color:#888888'><br>
Vicente "Vince" Bortone</span></font><font color=black
face=inherit><span style='font-family:inherit;color:black;mso-color-alt:windowtext'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=yiv1304192167msonormal style='margin-right:1.0in;margin-bottom:0in;
margin-left:85.35pt;margin-bottom:.0001pt'><font size=3 color=black
face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:12.0pt;color:black'>-----
Original Message -----<br>
From: Dan Curtis &<a
href="http://us.mc1205.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=lt%3Bwarrior523@att.net"
target="_blank" rel=nofollow ymailto="mailto:lt%3Bwarrior523@att.net">lt;warrior523@att.net</a>&gt;<br>
To: General pattern discussion &<a
href="http://us.mc1205.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=lt%3Bnsrca-discussion@lists.nsrca.org"
target="_blank" rel=nofollow
ymailto="mailto:lt%3Bnsrca-discussion@lists.nsrca.org">lt;nsrca-discussion@lists.nsrca.org</a>&gt;<br>
Sent: Sat, 11 Feb 2012 19:17:53 -0000 (UTC)<br>
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] NSRCA candidate rules proposal survey is
available<br>
I was re-reading the post about the survey and am really having a problem
with<br>
the 4th paragraph. It says:<br>
The NSRCA BoD encourages your support in responding to the survey as the
changes<br>
are believed to be appropriate for the continued growth and sustainment of
AMA<br>
pattern. <br>
<br>
Is this actually saying that our board of directors is for the changes stated
in<br>
the survey. This is really hard to believe and even harder to fathom.<br>
<br>
Where did these "candidate rule proposals" come from? Why the
5500 gram weight<br>
rule? Where did that one come from? This whole thing seems
strange and my<br>
goodness how many times have some of these isssues been hashed before?<br>
<br>
Dan Curtis<br>
________________________________<br>
From: Scott McHarg <<a
href="http://us.mc1205.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=scmcharg@gmail.com"
target="_blank" rel=nofollow ymailto="mailto:scmcharg@gmail.com">scmcharg@gmail.com</a>><br>
To: General pattern discussion <<a
href="http://us.mc1205.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=nsrca-discussion@lists.nsrca.org"
target="_blank" rel=nofollow ymailto="mailto:nsrca-discussion@lists.nsrca.org">nsrca-discussion@lists.nsrca.org</a>><br>
Sent: Fri, February 10, 2012 12:24:44 PM<br>
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] NSRCA candidate rules proposal survey is
available<br>
The NSRCA Board of Directors (BoD), in consideration of NSRCA bylaws
indicating<br>
that the NSRCA should take responsibility for making a consensus statement to<br>
the AMA Rules Committee on rules pertaining to Radio Control Aerobatics, has<br>
convened a Rules Proposal Committee. The purpose of this committee is
to<br>
prepare candidate rule proposals for endorsement by the NSRCA BoD. The<br>
committee is chaired by Scott McHarg and its members include Jon Carter, John<br>
Gayer, Michael McEvilley, and Rick Sweeney.<br>
<br>
The NSRCA BoD requested the rules committee to craft proposals with a focus
on<br>
safety and contestant participation concerns. The rules committee was
further<br>
requested to craft proposals in consideration of the varying and oftentimes<br>
conflicting opinions of the individuals that comprise the AMA pattern
community,<br>
while recognizing that change is warranted. In response to NSRCA BoD
direction,<br>
the rules committee has developed four (4) candidate proposals for
endorsement<br>
by the NSRCA BoD.<br>
<br>
In the spirit reflected by the direction of the NSRCA BoD, this survey is<br>
offered to provide the AMA pattern community the opportunity to review,<br>
consider, and provide feedback by supporting or not supporting each of the<br>
candidate proposals to the NSRCA BoD. This survey is not a vote; it is
only a<br>
means for the NSRCA BoD to gather information to be used in making their
final<br>
determination of those proposals to be endorsed by the NSRCA.<br>
<br>
The NSRCA BoD encourages your support in responding to the survey as the
changes<br>
are believed to be appropriate for the continued growth and sustainment of
AMA<br>
pattern. <br>
<br>
Finally, it should be understood that individual AMA members are free to
submit<br>
commentary on these proposals to the AMA Contest Board, and are also able to<br>
submit individual proposals on the same topics as those endorsed by the NSRCA<br>
BoD.<br>
This survey will be available until midnight March 1, 2012 and may be
taken<br>
only once. The survey is available at <a href="http://www.nsrca.us/"
target="_blank" rel=nofollow>www.nsrca.us</a> and you must be registered<br>
with the website and logged in but being a current member is NOT
required. <br>
Thank you for your understanding and participation in this rules proposal<br>
survey.<br>
--<br>
Scott A. McHarg</span></font><font color=black face=inherit><span
style='font-family:inherit;color:black;mso-color-alt:windowtext'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=yiv1304192167msonormal style='margin-right:1.0in;margin-bottom:0in;
margin-left:85.35pt;margin-bottom:.0001pt'><font size=3 color=black
face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:12.0pt;color:black'>_______________________________________________<br>
NSRCA-discussion mailing list<br>
<a
href="http://us.mc1205.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=NSRCA-discussion@lists.nsrca.org"
target="_blank" rel=nofollow ymailto="mailto:NSRCA-discussion@lists.nsrca.org">NSRCA-discussion@lists.nsrca.org</a><br>
<a href="http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion"
target="_blank" rel=nofollow>http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion</a></span></font><font
color=black face=inherit><span style='font-family:inherit;color:black;
mso-color-alt:windowtext'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=yiv1304192167msonormal style='margin-right:1.0in;margin-bottom:12.0pt;
margin-left:80.55pt'><font size=3 color=black face="Times New Roman"><span
style='font-size:12.0pt;color:black'><br>
<br clear=all>
<br>
-- <br>
</span></font><b><font size=4 color="#3333ff" face="Comic Sans MS"><span
style='font-size:13.5pt;font-family:"Comic Sans MS";color:#3333FF;font-weight:
bold'>Scott A. McHarg</span></font></b><font color=black face=inherit><span
style='font-family:inherit;color:black;mso-color-alt:windowtext'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=yiv1304192167msonormal style='margin-right:1.0in;margin-bottom:0in;
margin-left:80.55pt;margin-bottom:.0001pt'><font size=3 color=black
face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:12.0pt;color:black'><br>
_______________________________________________<br>
NSRCA-discussion mailing list<br>
<a
href="http://us.mc1205.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=NSRCA-discussion@lists.nsrca.org"
target="_blank" rel=nofollow ymailto="mailto:NSRCA-discussion@lists.nsrca.org">NSRCA-discussion@lists.nsrca.org</a><br>
<a href="http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion"
target="_blank" rel=nofollow>http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion</a></span></font><font
color=black face=inherit><span style='font-family:inherit;color:black;
mso-color-alt:windowtext'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<div style='border:none;border-left:solid #1010FF 1.5pt;padding:0in 0in 0in 4.0pt'>
<p class=yiv1304192167msonormal style='margin-right:1.0in;margin-bottom:12.0pt;
margin-left:75.75pt;border:none;mso-border-left-alt:solid #1010FF 1.5pt;
padding:0in;mso-padding-alt:0in 0in 0in 4.0pt'><font size=3 color=black
face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:12.0pt;color:black'><br>
<br clear=all>
<br>
-- <br>
</span></font><b><font size=4 color="#3333ff" face="Comic Sans MS"><span
style='font-size:13.5pt;font-family:"Comic Sans MS";color:#3333FF;font-weight:
bold'>Scott A. McHarg</span></font></b><font color=black face=inherit><span
style='font-family:inherit;color:black;mso-color-alt:windowtext'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=yiv1304192167msonormal style='margin-right:1.0in;margin-left:75.75pt;
border:none;mso-border-left-alt:solid #1010FF 1.5pt;padding:0in;mso-padding-alt:
0in 0in 0in 4.0pt'><font size=3 color=black face="Times New Roman"><span
style='font-size:12.0pt;color:black'>_______________________________________________<br>
NSRCA-discussion mailing list<br>
<a
href="http://us.mc1205.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=NSRCA-discussion@lists.nsrca.org"
target="_blank" rel=nofollow ymailto="mailto:NSRCA-discussion@lists.nsrca.org">NSRCA-discussion@lists.nsrca.org</a><br>
<a href="http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion"
target="_blank" rel=nofollow>http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion</a></span></font><font
color=black face=inherit><span style='font-family:inherit;color:black;
mso-color-alt:windowtext'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<div style='border:none;border-left:solid #1010FF 1.5pt;padding:0in 0in 0in 4.0pt'>
<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-right:.5in;mso-margin-top-alt:auto;
margin-bottom:12.0pt;margin-left:3.75pt;border:none;mso-border-left-alt:solid #1010FF 1.5pt;
padding:0in;mso-padding-alt:0in 0in 0in 4.0pt'><font size=3 color=black
face=inherit><span style='font-size:12.0pt;font-family:inherit;color:black'><br>
-----Inline Attachment Follows-----</span></font><font color=black
face=inherit><span style='font-family:inherit;color:black;mso-color-alt:windowtext'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-right:.5in;mso-margin-top-alt:auto;
margin-left:3.75pt;border:none;mso-border-left-alt:solid #1010FF 1.5pt;
padding:0in;mso-padding-alt:0in 0in 0in 4.0pt'><font size=3 color=black
face=inherit><span style='font-size:12.0pt;font-family:inherit;color:black'>_______________________________________________<br>
NSRCA-discussion mailing list<br>
<a
href="http://us.mc1205.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=NSRCA-discussion@lists.nsrca.org"
ymailto="mailto:NSRCA-discussion@lists.nsrca.org">NSRCA-discussion@lists.nsrca.org</a><br>
<a href="http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion"
target="_blank">http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion</a></span></font><font
color=black face=inherit><span style='font-family:inherit;color:black;
mso-color-alt:windowtext'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
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