<table cellspacing="0" cellpadding="0" border="0" ><tr><td valign="top" style="font: inherit;"><DIV>I quit using 5 min epoxy altogether. Partly for the reasons mentioned (I have noticed it turns rubbery with age, etc) and also because I am not as fast at mixing and applying as I used to be. :-) Whenever possible, I use slow-cure epoxy since I feel it does a better job wetting the surfaces and ultimately gives better adhesion. </DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV>I used to be able to buy 2 hour epoxy but now the longest cure time I see in hobby shops is 30 minute, so I typically use either 15 min or 30 min epoxy.</DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV>I have also gotten into the habit of setting the assembly in a hot environment (like inside my car on a hot sunny day) to aid in the final curing. Seems to cure harder and be more resilient when I do that.</DIV>
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<DIV>Bob R.</DIV>
<DIV><BR><BR>--- On <B>Tue, 9/13/11, Phil S. <I><chuenkan@comcast.net></I></B> wrote:<BR></DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE style="BORDER-LEFT: rgb(16,16,255) 2px solid; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px"><BR>From: Phil S. <chuenkan@comcast.net><BR>Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] 5 min expoxy<BR>To: "General pattern discussion" <nsrca-discussion@lists.nsrca.org><BR>Date: Tuesday, September 13, 2011, 3:53 PM<BR><BR>
<DIV id=yiv443932097>Mike, the laminate layer will not protect the 5-min from heat -- only sunlight/UV and chemicals -- maybe. OTOH, you have the testimony of several who have used the 5-min with no problems. Why not use 15-min if you have a question about the 5-min variety???<BR><BR>On 9/13/2011 1:23 PM, Michael S. Harrison wrote:
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<P class=yiv443932097MsoNormal><SPAN style="COLOR: rgb(31,73,125); FONT-SIZE: 11pt">Matt,</SPAN></DIV>
<P class=yiv443932097MsoNormal><SPAN style="COLOR: rgb(31,73,125); FONT-SIZE: 11pt">This is the critidcal info I needed. 100 ‘ deformation is a real concern since batteries,etc go to well over 100’, sometimes in the order of 140’. Even sitting in the sun will go to 120 or more. I believe the double layer, 5min/laminating will work. It will be stronger and redundant.</SPAN></DIV>
<P class=yiv443932097MsoNormal><SPAN style="COLOR: rgb(31,73,125); FONT-SIZE: 11pt">Thanks</SPAN></DIV>
<P class=yiv443932097MsoNormal><SPAN style="COLOR: rgb(31,73,125); FONT-SIZE: 11pt">Mike </SPAN></DIV>
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<P class=yiv443932097MsoNormal><B><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt">From:</SPAN></B><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt"> <A class=yiv443932097moz-txt-link-abbreviated href="http://us.mc11.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=nsrca-discussion-bounces@lists.nsrca.org" rel=nofollow target=_blank ymailto="mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces@lists.nsrca.org">nsrca-discussion-bounces@lists.nsrca.org</A> [<A class=yiv443932097moz-txt-link-freetext href="http://us.mc11.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=nsrca-discussion-bounces@lists.nsrca.org" rel=nofollow target=_blank ymailto="mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces@lists.nsrca.org">mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces@lists.nsrca.org</A>] <B>On Behalf Of </B><A class=yiv443932097moz-txt-link-abbreviated href="http://us.mc11.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=rcmaster199@aol.com" rel=nofollow target=_blank ymailto="mailto:rcmaster199@aol.com">rcmaster199@aol.com</A><BR><B>Sent:</B> Tuesday, September 13, 2011 11:26 AM<BR><B>To:</B> <A
class=yiv443932097moz-txt-link-abbreviated href="http://us.mc11.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=nsrca-discussion@lists.nsrca.org" rel=nofollow target=_blank ymailto="mailto:nsrca-discussion@lists.nsrca.org">nsrca-discussion@lists.nsrca.org</A><BR><B>Subject:</B> Re: [NSRCA-discussion] 5 min expoxy</SPAN></DIV></DIV>
<P class=yiv443932097MsoNormal> </DIV>
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<P class=yiv443932097MsoNormal><SPAN style="COLOR: black; FONT-SIZE: 10pt">Mike,</SPAN></DIV></DIV>
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<P class=yiv443932097MsoNormal><SPAN style="COLOR: black; FONT-SIZE: 10pt"> </SPAN></DIV></DIV>
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<P class=yiv443932097MsoNormal><SPAN style="COLOR: black; FONT-SIZE: 10pt">Deformation temp of 5 minute is usually very low, on order of 100F. I no longer use 5 minute for anything load bearing.</SPAN></DIV></DIV>
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<P class=yiv443932097MsoNormal><SPAN style="COLOR: black; FONT-SIZE: 10pt"> </SPAN></DIV></DIV>
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<P class=yiv443932097MsoNormal><SPAN style="COLOR: black; FONT-SIZE: 10pt">You are correct on sunlight degradation for the amine cured epoxies (most of the stuff we use) but the process is fairly slow. Usually don't have to worry about that as RVP pointed out, unless you are like me and keep your planes for 8-10 years plus</SPAN></DIV></DIV>
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<P class=yiv443932097MsoNormal><SPAN style="COLOR: black; FONT-SIZE: 10pt"> </SPAN></DIV></DIV>
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<P class=yiv443932097MsoNormal><SPAN style="COLOR: black; FONT-SIZE: 10pt">For much better sunlight protection there are other curing systems (J Greer) available but these are slow curing and could be counteproductive for your purposes</SPAN></DIV></DIV>
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<P class=yiv443932097MsoNormal><SPAN style="COLOR: black; FONT-SIZE: 10pt"> </SPAN></DIV></DIV>
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<P style="MARGIN-BOTTOM: 12pt" class=yiv443932097MsoNormal><SPAN style="COLOR: black; FONT-SIZE: 10pt">MattK</SPAN></DIV></DIV>
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<P style="MARGIN-BOTTOM: 12pt" class=yiv443932097MsoNormal><SPAN style="COLOR: black; FONT-SIZE: 10pt">-----Original Message-----<BR>From: Michael S. Harrison <A class=yiv443932097moz-txt-link-rfc2396E href="http://us.mc11.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=drmikedds@sbcglobal.net" rel=nofollow target=_blank ymailto="mailto:drmikedds@sbcglobal.net"><drmikedds@sbcglobal.net></A><BR>To: 'General pattern discussion' <A class=yiv443932097moz-txt-link-rfc2396E href="http://us.mc11.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=nsrca-discussion@lists.nsrca.org" rel=nofollow target=_blank ymailto="mailto:nsrca-discussion@lists.nsrca.org"><nsrca-discussion@lists.nsrca.org></A><BR>Sent: Tue, Sep 13, 2011 11:52 am<BR>Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] 5 min expoxy</SPAN></DIV>
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<P class=yiv443932097MsoNormal><SPAN style="COLOR: black; FONT-SIZE: 10pt">Thanks Ted and others. This is all helpful, my concern is what I have witnessed over many years as the heat and fuel ruined the 5 min epoxy. Since it is electric, fuel is not an issue but there is plenty of concern about heat. I don’t know the deformation temp of the epoxy nor the exposure to normal environment so that is why I was asking. I am going with the 5 min and doing a thin coating of laminating to have a seal and redundancy. Sunlight will eventually ruin the epoxies but since it is inside the fuse, that is not an issue. </SPAN></DIV></DIV>
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<P class=yiv443932097MsoNormal><SPAN style="COLOR: black; FONT-SIZE: 10pt">Thanks</SPAN></DIV></DIV>
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<P class=yiv443932097MsoNormal><SPAN style="COLOR: black; FONT-SIZE: 10pt">Mike </SPAN></DIV></DIV>
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<P class=yiv443932097MsoNormal><SPAN style="COLOR: black; FONT-SIZE: 10pt"> </SPAN></DIV></DIV>
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<P class=yiv443932097MsoNormal><B><SPAN style="COLOR: black; FONT-SIZE: 10pt">From:</SPAN></B><SPAN style="COLOR: black; FONT-SIZE: 10pt"> <A href="http://us.mc11.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=nsrca-discussion-bounces@lists.nsrca.org" rel=nofollow target=_blank ymailto="mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces@lists.nsrca.org"><U><SPAN style="COLOR: blue">nsrca-discussion-bounces@lists.nsrca.org</SPAN></U></A> [<A href="http://us.mc11.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=nsrca-discussion-bounces@lists.nsrca.org&" rel=nofollow target=_blank ymailto="mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces@lists.nsrca.org?"><U><SPAN style="COLOR: blue">mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces@lists.nsrca.org</SPAN></U></A>] <B>On Behalf Of </B>Ted Sander<BR><B>Sent:</B> Tuesday, September 13, 2011 6:54 AM<BR><B>To:</B> 'General pattern discussion'<BR><B>Subject:</B> Re: [NSRCA-discussion] 5 min expoxy</SPAN></DIV></DIV></DIV></DIV>
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<P class=yiv443932097MsoNormal><SPAN style="COLOR: black; FONT-SIZE: 10pt"> </SPAN></DIV></DIV>
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<P class=yiv443932097MsoNormal><SPAN style="COLOR: black; FONT-SIZE: 10pt">I tend to use whatever the local shop carries – but do lean toward Z-poxy. The current Pres. Of our local club spent his career formulating adhesives, so I trust his opinions, and in his view all hobby marketed expoxies are far stronger and longer lasting than we ever need, so go with price. That said, longer curing is stronger than shorter curing (but once you are good enough, do you really need it stronger?) and using laminating is better than thinning with alcohol, acetone, or whatever if you need to coat an area…..(thinning does dramatically reduce strength).</SPAN></DIV></DIV>
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<P class=yiv443932097MsoNormal><SPAN style="COLOR: black; FONT-SIZE: 10pt">If you are getting into whole plane fabrication with epoxies (glass/composite construction, etc.) then you need to do some more research for thin film strengths, viscosity, etc. , especially since weight becomes a big factor. But for general gluing of firewalls, wing halves, or the like – go with what you can easily get/afford.</SPAN></DIV></DIV>
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<P class=yiv443932097MsoNormal><SPAN style="COLOR: black; FONT-SIZE: 10pt"> </SPAN></DIV></DIV>
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<P class=yiv443932097MsoNormal><B><SPAN style="COLOR: black; FONT-SIZE: 10pt">From:</SPAN></B><SPAN style="COLOR: black; FONT-SIZE: 10pt"> <A href="http://us.mc11.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=nsrca-discussion-bounces@lists.nsrca.org" rel=nofollow target=_blank ymailto="mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces@lists.nsrca.org"><U><SPAN style="COLOR: blue">nsrca-discussion-bounces@lists.nsrca.org</SPAN></U></A> [<A href="http://us.mc11.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=nsrca-discussion-bounces@lists.nsrca.org&" rel=nofollow target=_blank ymailto="mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces@lists.nsrca.org?"><U><SPAN style="COLOR: blue">mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces@lists.nsrca.org</SPAN></U></A>] <B>On Behalf Of </B>Michael S. Harrison<BR><B>Sent:</B> Monday, September 12, 2011 2:31 PM<BR><B>To:</B> 'General pattern discussion'<BR><B>Subject:</B> Re: [NSRCA-discussion] 5 min expoxy</SPAN></DIV></DIV></DIV></DIV>
<DIV>
<P class=yiv443932097MsoNormal><SPAN style="COLOR: black; FONT-SIZE: 10pt"> </SPAN></DIV></DIV>
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<P class=yiv443932097MsoNormal><SPAN style="COLOR: black; FONT-SIZE: 10pt">Thanks,</SPAN></DIV></DIV>
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<P class=yiv443932097MsoNormal><SPAN style="COLOR: black; FONT-SIZE: 10pt">Ted what was the brand you used?</SPAN></DIV></DIV>
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<P class=yiv443932097MsoNormal><SPAN style="COLOR: black; FONT-SIZE: 10pt">Mike </SPAN></DIV></DIV>
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<P class=yiv443932097MsoNormal><SPAN style="COLOR: black; FONT-SIZE: 10pt"> </SPAN></DIV></DIV>
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<P class=yiv443932097MsoNormal><B><SPAN style="COLOR: black; FONT-SIZE: 10pt">From:</SPAN></B><SPAN style="COLOR: black; FONT-SIZE: 10pt"> <A href="http://us.mc11.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=nsrca-discussion-bounces@lists.nsrca.org" rel=nofollow target=_blank ymailto="mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces@lists.nsrca.org"><U><SPAN style="COLOR: blue">nsrca-discussion-bounces@lists.nsrca.org</SPAN></U></A> [<A href="http://us.mc11.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=nsrca-discussion-bounces@lists.nsrca.org&" rel=nofollow target=_blank ymailto="mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces@lists.nsrca.org?"><U><SPAN style="COLOR: blue">mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces@lists.nsrca.org</SPAN></U></A>] <B>On Behalf Of </B>Ted Sander<BR><B>Sent:</B> Monday, September 12, 2011 1:51 PM<BR><B>To:</B> General pattern discussion<BR><B>Subject:</B> Re: [NSRCA-discussion] 5 min expoxy</SPAN></DIV></DIV></DIV></DIV>
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<P class=yiv443932097MsoNormal><SPAN style="COLOR: black; FONT-SIZE: 10pt"> </SPAN></DIV></DIV>
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<P class=yiv443932097MsoNormal><SPAN style="COLOR: black; FONT-SIZE: 10pt">You'd just be adding weight. I have 20 yr old planes where the 5 min is still perfect. Enough heat to be a problem with the epoxy will be a much bigger problem for everything else in the plane!</SPAN></DIV></DIV></DIV>
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<P class=yiv443932097MsoNormal><SPAN style="COLOR: black; FONT-SIZE: 10pt"> </SPAN></DIV></DIV></DIV>
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<P class=yiv443932097MsoNormal><SPAN style="COLOR: black; FONT-SIZE: 10pt">Ted Sander<BR><BR>On Sep 12, 2011, at 11:57 AM, "Michael S. Harrison" <<A href="http://us.mc11.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=drmikedds@sbcglobal.net" rel=nofollow target=_blank ymailto="mailto:drmikedds@sbcglobal.net"><U><SPAN style="COLOR: blue">drmikedds@sbcglobal.net</SPAN></U></A>> wrote:</SPAN></DIV></DIV></DIV>
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<P class=yiv443932097MsoNormal><SPAN style="COLOR: rgb(31,73,125); FONT-SIZE: 10pt">Thanks Dwane,</SPAN><SPAN style="COLOR: black; FONT-SIZE: 10pt"></SPAN></DIV></DIV>
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<P class=yiv443932097MsoNormal><SPAN style="COLOR: rgb(31,73,125); FONT-SIZE: 10pt">Sorry, I was very ambiguous in my search for answers. I am referring to the cured state. I am using it for construction and I have decided to coat the cured 5 min epoxy with a high quality laminating epoxy to seal/insulate it from solvents, air, etc so that it is preserved-don’t know that it will work but gonna do it that way.</SPAN><SPAN style="COLOR: black; FONT-SIZE: 10pt"></SPAN></DIV></DIV>
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<P class=yiv443932097MsoNormal><SPAN style="COLOR: rgb(31,73,125); FONT-SIZE: 10pt">Mike </SPAN><SPAN style="COLOR: black; FONT-SIZE: 10pt"></SPAN></DIV></DIV>
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<P class=yiv443932097MsoNormal><SPAN style="COLOR: rgb(31,73,125); FONT-SIZE: 10pt"> </SPAN><SPAN style="COLOR: black; FONT-SIZE: 10pt"></SPAN></DIV></DIV>
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<P class=yiv443932097MsoNormal><B><SPAN style="COLOR: black; FONT-SIZE: 10pt">From:</SPAN></B><SPAN style="COLOR: black; FONT-SIZE: 10pt"> <A href="http://us.mc11.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=nsrca-discussion-bounces@lists.nsrca.org" rel=nofollow target=_blank ymailto="mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces@lists.nsrca.org"><U><SPAN style="COLOR: blue">nsrca-discussion-bounces@lists.nsrca.org</SPAN></U></A> [<A href="http://us.mc11.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=nsrca-discussion-bounces@lists.nsrca.org&" rel=nofollow target=_blank ymailto="mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces@lists.nsrca.org?"><U><SPAN style="COLOR: blue">mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces@lists.nsrca.org</SPAN></U></A>] <B>On Behalf Of </B>Dwayne Brown<BR><B>Sent:</B> Monday, September 12, 2011 11:28 AM<BR><B>To:</B> 'General pattern discussion'<BR><B>Subject:</B> Re: [NSRCA-discussion] 5 min expoxy</SPAN></DIV></DIV></DIV></DIV>
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<P class=yiv443932097MsoNormal><SPAN style="COLOR: black; FONT-SIZE: 10pt">Keep it in the freezer until needed and it will outlive all of us on the NSRCA group. Dwayne</SPAN></DIV></DIV>
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<P class=yiv443932097MsoNormal><SPAN style="COLOR: black; FONT-SIZE: 10pt">-----Original Message-----<BR><B>From:</B> <A href="http://us.mc11.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=nsrca-discussion-bounces@lists.nsrca.org" rel=nofollow target=_blank ymailto="mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces@lists.nsrca.org"><U><SPAN style="COLOR: blue">nsrca-discussion-bounces@lists.nsrca.org</SPAN></U></A> [<A href="http://us.mc11.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=nsrca-discussion-bounces@lists.nsrca.org&" rel=nofollow target=_blank ymailto="mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces@lists.nsrca.org?"><U><SPAN style="COLOR: blue">mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces@lists.nsrca.org</SPAN></U></A>] <B>On Behalf Of </B>Michael S. Harrison<BR><B>Sent:</B> Saturday, September 10, 2011 1:59 PM<BR><B>To:</B> 'General pattern discussion'<BR><B>Subject:</B> [NSRCA-discussion] 5 min expoxy</SPAN></DIV></DIV>
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<P class=yiv443932097MsoNormal><SPAN style="COLOR: black; FONT-SIZE: 10pt">Tech question.</SPAN></DIV></DIV>
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<P class=yiv443932097MsoNormal><SPAN style="COLOR: black; FONT-SIZE: 10pt">What is the lifespan quality of 5 min epoxy. How long does it last? I am using in an electric for construction and I am concerned about degradation over time. How does the heat affect it? I am building to ca models fuse. What is your choice of adhesive in this case?</SPAN></DIV></DIV>
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<P class=yiv443932097MsoNormal><SPAN style="COLOR: black; FONT-SIZE: 10pt">Thanks</SPAN></DIV></DIV>
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<P class=yiv443932097MsoNormal><SPAN style="COLOR: black; FONT-SIZE: 10pt">Mike Harrison</SPAN></DIV></DIV></DIV></DIV></BLOCKQUOTE>
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AMA 1294 Scientific Leader Member
SPA 177 Board Member
(865) 435-1476v, (865) 604-0541c</PRE></DIV><BR>-----Inline Attachment Follows-----<BR><BR>
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