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Let me add that the majority of the plane mfg (other than the very
few left in the US) could not care less about what WE do with the
rules here. I deal with them every day and will tell you that they
will not produce something that is only legal in the US and only for
the non-FAI classes. Unless a whole new group of people decide to
start making kits here, this will have zero effect on what's
available. So we will have a rule with nobody making planes to
fit. Giving a small allowance to the lower classes as is proposed
now seems like a good compromise as it allows the currently
available designs to be used.<br>
<br>
Chris<br>
<br>
On 8/19/2010 9:28 AM, <a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:ronlock@comcast.net">ronlock@comcast.net</a> wrote:
<blockquote
cite="mid:1996441123.528571.1282224538341.JavaMail.root@sz0086a.westchester.pa.mail.comcast.net"
type="cite">
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0);">
<p>An excellent discussion - especially the "unintended
consequences" part. Thanks for the diatribe Mark !</p>
<p> </p>
<p>I think we should be particularly sensitive to an increase in
AMA weight standard resulting (in a couple of years) in larger
designs that take up more room, cost more, and are no
longer compatible with F3A.</p>
<p> </p>
<p>Ron Lockhart</p>
<p>Dist II CB </p>
<p> </p>
<p><br>
----- Original Message -----<br>
From: "Mark Atwood" <a class="moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" href="mailto:atwoodm@paragon-inc.com"><atwoodm@paragon-inc.com></a><br>
To: "General pattern discussion"
<a class="moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" href="mailto:nsrca-discussion@lists.nsrca.org"><nsrca-discussion@lists.nsrca.org></a><br>
Sent: Thursday, August 19, 2010 9:05:03 AM<br>
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] weight difference<br>
<br>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size: 11pt; color:
rgb(31, 73, 125); font-family: 'Calibri','sans-serif';">The
challenge here is that rules of this nature, limiting
rules, be it in Pattern, Sailing, Stock car, whatever, are
NOT in place to restrict the average guy, they’re in place
to restrict the innovator. The guys that push the limit.</span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size: 11pt; color:
rgb(31, 73, 125); font-family: 'Calibri','sans-serif';"></span> </p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size: 11pt; color:
rgb(31, 73, 125); font-family: 'Calibri','sans-serif';">In
our sport, the “average” guy is stuck pushing the limit
because he’s trying to copy and follow the innovators. We
all want the triple volumetric 2 meter bird because that’s
what Chip/Andrew/Quique and company have pushed the
boundary’s too. A prophecy still makes weight with nooooo
problem. </span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size: 11pt; color:
rgb(31, 73, 125); font-family: 'Calibri','sans-serif';"></span> </p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size: 11pt; color:
rgb(31, 73, 125); font-family: 'Calibri','sans-serif';">So
the problem is simple. IF the rules change, it clearly
will help the average guy for a year or two. But then the
innovators will once again push the limits (they wouldn’t
BE limits if no one was pushing) and we would see new
designs that the average guy can’t easily keep within the
rules.</span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size: 11pt; color:
rgb(31, 73, 125); font-family: 'Calibri','sans-serif';"></span> </p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size: 11pt; color:
rgb(31, 73, 125); font-family: 'Calibri','sans-serif';">Bipes
have not really caught on because they’re too difficult to
make weight with. Only the very best builders with very
few limits on funding for all the best and lightest
equipment have made them work. Add a pound and that will
very likely change…to where all the top guys can make them
work, which will then push the average guy to try and make
them work. At the end of the day, all it adds is cost as
we obsolete a whole generation of viable aircraft to the
dumpster. </span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size: 11pt; color:
rgb(31, 73, 125); font-family: 'Calibri','sans-serif';"></span> </p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size: 11pt; color:
rgb(31, 73, 125); font-family: 'Calibri','sans-serif';">All
one needs to do for confirmation on that is to review the
evolution of aircraft that occurred when we removed the
LAST limiter…engine displacement. Prior to that, weight
was only a secondary limiter because displacement
restricted how big of a plane you could carry around.
Once removed, we had 10 years of growing aircraft and
growing engines. All costing more, NOT just because the
new stuff was more expensive…that’s just natural inflation
and evolution, but because the lifespan of a model was
shorter. Designs changed SIGNIFICANTLY every year.</span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size: 11pt; color:
rgb(31, 73, 125); font-family: 'Calibri','sans-serif';"></span> </p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size: 11pt; color:
rgb(31, 73, 125); font-family: 'Calibri','sans-serif';">Finally,
we’re back to a semi stable development cycle which has
aircraft like the Integral enjoying a 5-6 year run and is
still considered competitive even in FAI (I believe that’s
what Pete Collinson flew in the finals this year). </span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size: 11pt; color:
rgb(31, 73, 125); font-family: 'Calibri','sans-serif';"></span> </p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size: 11pt; color:
rgb(31, 73, 125); font-family: 'Calibri','sans-serif';">It’s
not that we’re not listening… We’re simply trying to
avoid mistakes from the past and make as sure as we can
that the rule changes won’t have disastrous unintended
consequences. </span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size: 11pt; color:
rgb(31, 73, 125); font-family: 'Calibri','sans-serif';"></span> </p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size: 11pt; color:
rgb(31, 73, 125); font-family: 'Calibri','sans-serif';">The
rule change that is currently on the ballot provides a
sizeable variance for those in the lower classes to help
accommodate aging aircraft (which seem to gain weight
magically), repaired used aircraft, and beginning
builders….without changing the goal (and therefore the
designers goal) of maintaining a 5KG weight limit.</span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size: 11pt; color:
rgb(31, 73, 125); font-family: 'Calibri','sans-serif';"></span> </p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size: 11pt; color:
rgb(31, 73, 125); font-family: 'Calibri','sans-serif';">Ok…off
my soapbox. Sorry for the diatribe.</span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size: 11pt; color:
rgb(31, 73, 125); font-family: 'Calibri','sans-serif';"></span> </p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size: 11pt; color:
rgb(31, 73, 125); font-family: 'Calibri','sans-serif';">-Mark
</span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size: 11pt; color:
rgb(31, 73, 125); font-family: 'Calibri','sans-serif';">CB
for Dist 3 </span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size: 11pt; color:
rgb(31, 73, 125); font-family: 'Calibri','sans-serif';"></span> </p>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><b><span style="font-size: 10pt; color:
black; font-family: 'Verdana','sans-serif';">Mark
Atwood</span></b><span style="font-size: 11pt; color:
rgb(31, 73, 125); font-family: 'Calibri','sans-serif';"></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><b><span style="font-size: 9pt; color:
black; font-family: 'Verdana','sans-serif';">Paragon
Consulting, Inc.</span></b><span style="font-size:
9pt; color: black; font-family: 'Verdana','sans-serif';"> </span><b><span
style="font-size: 10pt; color: black; font-family:
'Verdana','sans-serif';">|</span></b><span
style="font-size: 9pt; color: black; font-family:
'Verdana','sans-serif';"> President</span><span
style="font-size: 11pt; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);
font-family: 'Calibri','sans-serif';"></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size: 8.5pt; color:
black; font-family: 'Verdana','sans-serif';">5885 Landerbrook Drive
Suite 130, Cleveland Ohio, 44124</span><span
style="font-size: 10.5pt; color: black; font-family:
'Verdana','sans-serif';"> </span><span style="font-size:
11pt; color: rgb(31, 73, 125); font-family:
'Calibri','sans-serif';"></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size: 8.5pt; color:
black; font-family: 'Verdana','sans-serif';">Phone:
440.684.3101 x102 </span><b><span style="font-size:
9pt; color: black; font-family:
'Verdana','sans-serif';">|</span></b><span
style="font-size: 8.5pt; color: black; font-family:
'Verdana','sans-serif';"> Fax: 440.684.3102</span><span
style="font-size: 11pt; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);
font-family: 'Calibri','sans-serif';"></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size: 8.5pt; color:
rgb(19, 81, 243); font-family: 'Verdana','sans-serif';"><a
moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:mark.atwood@paragon-inc.com"
target="_blank">mark.atwood@paragon-inc.com</a> </span><b><span
style="font-size: 9pt; color: black; font-family:
'Verdana','sans-serif';">|</span></b><span
style="font-size: 8.5pt; color: black; font-family:
'Verdana','sans-serif';"> </span><span
style="font-size: 8.5pt; color: rgb(19, 81, 243);
font-family: 'Verdana','sans-serif';"><a
moz-do-not-send="true"
href="http://www.paragon-inc.com/" target="_blank">www.paragon-inc.com</a></span><span
style="font-size: 11pt; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);
font-family: 'Calibri','sans-serif';"></span></p>
</div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size: 11pt; color:
rgb(31, 73, 125); font-family: 'Calibri','sans-serif';"></span> </p>
<div>
<div style="border-right: medium none; padding: 3pt 0in 0in;
border-width: 1pt medium medium; border-style: solid none
none; border-color: rgb(181, 196, 223) -moz-use-text-color
-moz-use-text-color;">
<p class="MsoNormal"><b><span style="font-size: 10pt;
font-family: 'Tahoma','sans-serif';">From:</span></b><span
style="font-size: 10pt; font-family:
'Tahoma','sans-serif';">
<a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces@lists.nsrca.org">nsrca-discussion-bounces@lists.nsrca.org</a>
[<a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces@lists.nsrca.org">mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces@lists.nsrca.org</a>] <b>On
Behalf Of </b>Dr Mike<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Thursday, August 19, 2010 8:42 AM<br>
<b>To:</b> 'General pattern discussion'<br>
<b>Subject:</b> Re: [NSRCA-discussion] weight
difference</span></p>
</div>
</div>
<p class="MsoNormal"> </p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size: 11pt; color:
rgb(31, 73, 125); font-family: 'Calibri','sans-serif';">Lance,</span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size: 11pt; color:
rgb(31, 73, 125); font-family: 'Calibri','sans-serif';">Regarding
the CB, I agree with you that those generalities are anal
comments. Most of the guys are giving freely of their
time and we are lucky to have them. On the weight issue,
the 11 pounds is a bit restricting. When that rule was
made, planes had a 60 inch span, were 48 inches long and
weighed 7 lbs. now they are volumetrically double or
triple so the wing loading is the same or lighter. Needs
to go up at least a pound or two.</span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size: 11pt; color:
rgb(31, 73, 125); font-family: 'Calibri','sans-serif';">Mike
</span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size: 11pt; color:
rgb(31, 73, 125); font-family: 'Calibri','sans-serif';"></span> </p>
<div>
<div style="border-right: medium none; padding: 3pt 0in 0in;
border-width: 1pt medium medium; border-style: solid none
none; border-color: rgb(181, 196, 223) -moz-use-text-color
-moz-use-text-color;">
<p class="MsoNormal"><b><span style="font-size: 10pt;
font-family: 'Tahoma','sans-serif';">From:</span></b><span
style="font-size: 10pt; font-family:
'Tahoma','sans-serif';">
<a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces@lists.nsrca.org">nsrca-discussion-bounces@lists.nsrca.org</a>
[<a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces@lists.nsrca.org">mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces@lists.nsrca.org</a>] <b>On
Behalf Of </b>Patterndude<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Wednesday, August 18, 2010 8:35 PM<br>
<b>To:</b> General pattern discussion<br>
<b>Subject:</b> Re: [NSRCA-discussion] weight
difference</span></p>
</div>
</div>
<p class="MsoNormal"> </p>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal">I have a 10 lb e-symphony, there are
low 10 lb Evo's and both these planes are super rigid an
tough. There are e planes that I'm afraid to touch because
of fragility and they cost more too. Point is, the
consumer has choices and don't need to fly a dangerous
airframe. They choose to. Remember the glow Impacts that
lost their tail in a snap but hundreds were sold AFTER
this fact was known on this list? </p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"> </p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal">As a CB guy I don't like being
generalized against. I ask for input all the time. Even
call people and tell people where my head is at all the
time without preaching. <br>
<br>
Sent from my iPhone</p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-bottom: 12pt;"><br>
On Aug 18, 2010, at 8:11 PM, Tim Taylor <<a
moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:timsautopro@yahoo.com" target="_blank">timsautopro@yahoo.com</a>>
wrote:</p>
</div>
<blockquote style="margin-top: 5pt; margin-bottom: 5pt;">
<div>
<table class="MsoNormalTable" border="0" cellpadding="0"
cellspacing="0">
<tbody>
<tr>
<td style="padding: 0in;" valign="top">
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal">We can always ignore it,
we've done that for years unless you're in the
top 3-5 at the Nats.</p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"> </p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal">In this day and age
of instant communication we no longer need a
Contest Board to decide what we do or
not. With all due respect to the CB we don't
need you guys anymore, we can poll the
membership directly and set the rules. Far
more representative that way.</p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"> </p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal">The only time I ever tried
to talk to a CB member about a rules proposal
in person I got the old "I know better than
you and I'm going to do what I want so we
don't need to discuss it." He then refused to
even talk about anything at that point. Left a
very bad taste I tell you.</p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"> </p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal">Tim<br>
--- On <b>Wed, 8/18/10, Dave Burton <i><<a
moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:burtona@atmc.net"
target="_blank">burtona@atmc.net</a>></i></b>
wrote:</p>
</div>
<blockquote style="border-right: medium none;
padding: 0in 0in 0in 3pt; border-width: medium
medium medium 1.5pt; border-style: none none
none solid; border-color: -moz-use-text-color
-moz-use-text-color -moz-use-text-color rgb(16,
16, 255); margin-top: 5pt; margin-bottom: 5pt;
margin-left: 3pt;">
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-bottom:
12pt;"><br>
From: Dave Burton <<a
moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:burtona@atmc.net"
target="_blank">burtona@atmc.net</a>><br>
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] weight
difference<br>
To: "'General pattern discussion'" <<a
moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:nsrca-discussion@lists.nsrca.org"
target="_blank">nsrca-discussion@lists.nsrca.org</a>><br>
Date: Wednesday, August 18, 2010, 7:53 PM</p>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal">The rules proposal to
eliminate the weight limit didn't make the
first CB<br>
vote. Too bad IMO!<br>
Dave<br>
<br>
-----Original Message-----<br>
From: <a moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces@lists.nsrca.org"
target="_blank">nsrca-discussion-bounces@lists.nsrca.org</a><br>
[mailto:<a moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces@lists.nsrca.org"
target="_blank">nsrca-discussion-bounces@lists.nsrca.org</a>]
On Behalf Of Ron Hansen<br>
Sent: Wednesday, August 18, 2010 7:35 PM<br>
To: 'General pattern discussion'<br>
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] weight
difference<br>
<br>
I'm concerned that these new electric only
planes that are designed to make<br>
weight won't hold up to the normal wear and
tear of an average intermediate<br>
or advanced pilot or flying off of a rough
grass runway. Is this a valid<br>
concern? I think so but maybe I'm over
reacting. That is why I'm in favor<br>
of eliminating the weight limit altogether.
The proposal to slightly raise<br>
the weight limit won't allow someone to fly
an electric Focus II for<br>
example.<br>
<br>
-----Original Message-----<br>
From: <a moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces@lists.nsrca.org"
target="_blank">nsrca-discussion-bounces@lists.nsrca.org</a><br>
[mailto:<a moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces@lists.nsrca.org"
target="_blank">nsrca-discussion-bounces@lists.nsrca.org</a>]
On Behalf Of J N Hiller<br>
Sent: Tuesday, August 17, 2010 2:17 PM<br>
To: General pattern discussion<br>
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] weight
difference<br>
<br>
I've been following this with interest.
E-power is looking better all the<br>
time and I probably will make the change. I
like to build prefer a wood<br>
airplane. About how much total weight is in
a suitable E-power system or<br>
empty airframe ready for radio etc? Any
numbers readily available would be<br>
helpful in understanding the distribution of
weight.<br>
Thanks<br>
Jim Hiller<br>
<br>
-----Original Message-----<br>
From: <a moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces@lists.nsrca.org"
target="_blank">nsrca-discussion-bounces@lists.nsrca.org</a><br>
[mailto:<a moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces@lists.nsrca.org"
target="_blank">nsrca-discussion-bounces@lists.nsrca.org</a>]On
Behalf Of Dave<br>
Sent: Tuesday, August 17, 2010 9:02 AM<br>
To: 'General pattern discussion'<br>
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] weight
difference<br>
<br>
And to recall.....that is the Spark with
custom wings and stabs, which saves<br>
substantial weight? There are very few
unmodified kits available that are<br>
RTF electric at 10.25. There are some
airframe examples for which glow /<br>
electric are similar weight, but that is not
the norm - not yet anyway - my<br>
opinion.<br>
<br>
My electric Bravo was 10 lbs even at the
2009 NATs (only 4 oz more than the<br>
Vivat I flew in 2005) and I would be scared
of the structure if it were any<br>
lighter. Of course it could be lighter
still IF I went from 5000 to 4350<br>
lipos (~6 oz) and ditched the dual RX batts
and Vregs (~2 oz) and used<br>
lighter ESC and wiring (~ 2 oz).<br>
<br>
Point being....even tho 10 lb electrics are
possible, and becoming more<br>
common, it is still pretty easy to build
electrics at 11+ lbs without<br>
careful planning and attention to detail. I
think it will become a<br>
non-issue soon enough.....even in Europe and
Asia electrics are coming on<br>
strong.....so the glow kits will become
increasingly scarce.<br>
<br>
Regards,<br>
<br>
Dave<br>
<br>
-----Original Message-----<br>
From: <a moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces@lists.nsrca.org"
target="_blank">nsrca-discussion-bounces@lists.nsrca.org</a><br>
[mailto:<a moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces@lists.nsrca.org"
target="_blank">nsrca-discussion-bounces@lists.nsrca.org</a>]
On Behalf Of Atwood, Mark<br>
Sent: Tuesday, August 17, 2010 10:06 AM<br>
To: General pattern discussion<br>
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] weight
difference<br>
<br>
I would argue that you can't "disregard" the
airframe given that an all<br>
electric airframe is much lighter.<br>
<br>
My answer to the question? There is almost
no difference. I'm flying a<br>
full 2M plane that weighs 10lbs 4oz with
light batteries, 10lbs, 8oz with<br>
very heavy batteries. My two Black Magics
with glow weighed 10lbs 6oz and<br>
10lbs 8oz RTF minus CDI (add approx 4oz for
that).<br>
<br>
I believe we're just now seeing full
electric designs that are optimized for<br>
weight and are coming in light. Prior to
that, many of the designs still<br>
had unnecessary structure as a legacy from
Glow. I'm pretty sure that<br>
evolution is not complete yet either.<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
Mark Atwood<br>
Paragon Consulting, Inc. | President<br>
5885 Landerbrook Drive Suite 130, Cleveland
Ohio, 44124<br>
Phone: 440.684.3101 x102 | Fax:
440.684.3102<br>
<a moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:mark.atwood@paragon-inc.com"
target="_blank">mark.atwood@paragon-inc.com</a>
| <a moz-do-not-send="true"
href="http://www.paragon-inc.com/"
target="_blank">www.paragon-inc.com</a><br>
<br>
<br>
-----Original Message-----<br>
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On Behalf Of Ron Van Putte<br>
Sent: Tuesday, August 17, 2010 9:58 AM<br>
To: General pattern discussion<br>
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] weight
difference<br>
<br>
Tough question. Will you insist on using
30C lipos, when 20C lipos<br>
are much lighter? Do you plan on using a
particular motor? Motor<br>
weights vary substantially. Some ESCs are a
lot heavier than others.<br>
<br>
My guess would be that the weight difference
between a complete<br>
electric-power system and a complete
glow-power system, disregarding<br>
the airplane, would be 10-16 ounces.<br>
<br>
Ron<br>
<br>
On Aug 17, 2010, at 8:51 AM, Dr Mike wrote:<br>
<br>
> Ok so I am going to ask the question
again... in your estimation<br>
> what is the<br>
> difference in weight between the
complete electric power system and<br>
> the<br>
> complete glow system-disregarding the
airplane?<br>
> Mike<br>
><br>
> -----Original Message-----<br>
> From: <a moz-do-not-send="true"
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target="_blank">nsrca-discussion-bounces@lists.nsrca.org</a><br>
> [mailto:<a moz-do-not-send="true"
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On Behalf Of Ron<br>
> Van Putte<br>
> Sent: Tuesday, August 17, 2010 8:30 AM<br>
> To: General pattern discussion<br>
> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] weight
difference<br>
><br>
> Dave WAS trying to show the difference
between glow and electric.<br>
><br>
> Generally, airplanes that started out
as glow-powered are heavier<br>
> than one for electric power, because of
the vibration. The<br>
> difference between the two packages
gets complicated. For glow, you<br>
> include spinner, prop, engine, motor
mount, ignition system, fuel<br>
> tubing (and fittings), fuel tank and
anything else which is<br>
> exclusively for glow. For electric,
you include spinner, prop,<br>
> motor, motor mount, ESC, wiring, lipo
batteries and anything else<br>
> which is exclusively for electric.
When you add it up, the weight<br>
> differences can be pretty dramatic. If
you don't carefully select<br>
> all the components, you can easily add
an unneeded 4 ounces to an<br>
> electric-powered airplane.<br>
><br>
> Ron<br>
><br>
> On Aug 17, 2010, at 7:49 AM, Dr Mike
wrote:<br>
><br>
>> Thanks Dave, I am referring only to
the power packages,not the<br>
>> planes. Those are what I am looking
for, the difference between<br>
>> glow and electric.<br>
>><br>
>> Mike<br>
>><br>
>><br>
>><br>
>> From: <a moz-do-not-send="true"
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target="_blank">nsrca-discussion-bounces@lists.nsrca.org</a>
[<a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="mailto:nsrca">mailto:nsrca</a>-<br>
>> <a moz-do-not-send="true"
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On Behalf Of Dave<br>
>> Sent: Tuesday, August 17, 2010 7:41
AM<br>
>> To: 'General pattern discussion'<br>
>> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion]
weight difference<br>
>><br>
>><br>
>><br>
>> 12 oz +/-4 oz.<br>
>><br>
>><br>
>><br>
>> Exact number depends on a bunch of
things -<br>
>><br>
>> - on the electric side, which
motor, motor mounting, ESC, lipo, RX<br>
>> power system?<br>
>><br>
>> - was the plane originally built
lighter for electric, or with more<br>
>> beef for glow?<br>
>><br>
>> - CDI / non CDI, type of mount, and
what type of ignition and RX<br>
>> power?<br>
>><br>
>><br>
>><br>
>> I can tell you that a number of
Prestige planes have been built<br>
>> with various glow and electric
power plants. For the most part,<br>
>> the glow airframes are +4 oz to
start with (the added beef for glow<br>
>> vibration). Most of the glow
setups ended up at 9.5 lbs, +/- 4<br>
>> oz. Most of the electrics ended up
at 10.25 lbs, +/- 4 oz.<br>
>><br>
>><br>
>><br>
>> Regards,<br>
>><br>
>><br>
>><br>
>> Dave<br>
>><br>
>> From: <a moz-do-not-send="true"
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>> <a moz-do-not-send="true"
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On Behalf Of Dr Mike<br>
>> Sent: Tuesday, August 17, 2010 8:33
AM<br>
>> To: 'General pattern discussion'<br>
>> Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] weight
difference<br>
>><br>
>><br>
>><br>
>> Could someone tell me the
difference in weight between say a YS 1.7<br>
>> with muffler/tank,etc vs electric?<br>
>><br>
>> Thanks<br>
>><br>
>> Mike<br>
>><br>
>>
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