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<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>I totally agree with Mike’s
comments. I had 2 different SIGS contact me (when I was an AMA District
VP) about poor-performing CB members. This was looked into and they were
replaced. If the VP does not hear from anyone, nothing will be
done! I would recommend that anyone not happy with a contest board
member, bring it to the SIG first, then to the AMA VP.<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>Tony Stillman, President</span></font><font
color=navy><span style='color:navy'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>Radio South, Inc.</span></font><font
color=navy><span style='color:navy'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>139 Altama Connector, <st1:address w:st="on"><st1:Street
w:st="on">Box</st1:Street> 322</st1:address></span></font><font color=navy><span
style='color:navy'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><st1:place w:st="on"><st1:City w:st="on"><font size=2
color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;
color:navy'>Brunswick</span></font></st1:City><font size=2 color=navy
face=Arial><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>, <st1:State
w:st="on">GA</st1:State> <st1:PostalCode w:st="on">31525</st1:PostalCode></span></font></st1:place><font
color=navy><span style='color:navy'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>1-800-962-7802</span></font><font
color=navy><span style='color:navy'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>www.radiosouthrc.com</span></font><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<div class=MsoNormal align=center style='text-align:center'><font size=3
face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:12.0pt'>
<hr size=2 width="100%" align=center tabindex=-1>
</span></font></div>
<p class=MsoNormal><b><font size=2 face=Tahoma><span style='font-size:10.0pt;
font-family:Tahoma;font-weight:bold'>From:</span></font></b><font size=2
face=Tahoma><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Tahoma'>
nsrca-discussion-bounces@lists.nsrca.org
[mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces@lists.nsrca.org] <b><span style='font-weight:
bold'>On Behalf Of </span></b>Dr Mike<br>
<b><span style='font-weight:bold'>Sent:</span></b> Thursday, August 19, 2010
11:41 AM<br>
<b><span style='font-weight:bold'>To:</span></b> 'General pattern discussion'<br>
<b><span style='font-weight:bold'>Subject:</span></b> Re: [NSRCA-discussion]
weight difference</span></font><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:
12.0pt'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color="#1f497d" face=Calibri><span
style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Calibri;color:#1F497D'>Tim,<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color="#1f497d" face=Calibri><span
style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Calibri;color:#1F497D'>If I may, that is a
nice response to Lance and I do understand what you are saying, but a couple of
my comments would be that these CB members should have some time and wisdom
relating to the issues at hand. In that vein I believe most of the time
they respond to the membership desires. However, if they see an issue
with which experience has shown them the vote would not be in the best interest
of the sport, that or those <o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color="#1f497d" face=Calibri><span
style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Calibri;color:#1F497D'>CB members might
risk a different vote. <o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color="#1f497d" face=Calibri><span
style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Calibri;color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color="#1f497d" face=Calibri><span
style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Calibri;color:#1F497D'>The main reason that
CB members are on the board way past their productive time is apathy, not them,
but us, the membership. So if the board is not any good, it is our fault,
not AMA or the system.<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color="#1f497d" face=Calibri><span
style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Calibri;color:#1F497D'>We need to force a
change going through channels.<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color="#1f497d" face=Calibri><span
style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Calibri;color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color="#1f497d" face=Calibri><span
style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Calibri;color:#1F497D'>Respects,<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color="#1f497d" face=Calibri><span
style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Calibri;color:#1F497D'>Mike <o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color="#1f497d" face=Calibri><span
style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Calibri;color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<div style='border:none;border-top:solid #B5C4DF 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0in 0in 0in'>
<p class=MsoNormal><b><font size=2 face=Tahoma><span style='font-size:10.0pt;
font-family:Tahoma;font-weight:bold'>From:</span></font></b><font size=2
face=Tahoma><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Tahoma'>
nsrca-discussion-bounces@lists.nsrca.org
[mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces@lists.nsrca.org] <b><span style='font-weight:
bold'>On Behalf Of </span></b>Tim Taylor<br>
<b><span style='font-weight:bold'>Sent:</span></b> Thursday, August 19, 2010
9:37 AM<br>
<b><span style='font-weight:bold'>To:</span></b> General pattern discussion<br>
<b><span style='font-weight:bold'>Subject:</span></b> Re: [NSRCA-discussion]
weight difference<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:
12.0pt'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<table class=MsoNormalTable border=0 cellspacing=0 cellpadding=0>
<tr>
<td valign=top style='padding:0in 0in 0in 0in'>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 face="Times New Roman"><span
style='font-size:12.0pt'>Lance, first off let me apologize for
ruffling feathers it was not meant as a slam on those that freely give
of their time and effort. I know you guys want whats best for our sport.<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 face="Times New Roman"><span
style='font-size:12.0pt'> <o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 face="Times New Roman"><span
style='font-size:12.0pt'>This one CB member I had the run in with was years
ago, in fact decades ago. I didn't take kindly to the rebuff. In fact it made
me hopping mad at the time. It wasn't the subject matter at hand either but
the fact he wouldn't even discuss it as he is required to do.<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 face="Times New Roman"><span
style='font-size:12.0pt'> <o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 face="Times New Roman"><span
style='font-size:12.0pt'>I applaud the NSRCA for leading the charge in the
rules process for our sport.<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 face="Times New Roman"><span
style='font-size:12.0pt'> <o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 face="Times New Roman"><span
style='font-size:12.0pt'>My problem is we have 11 guys with votes
that count without a recourse to the general membership, I think this is
wrong. What happens if the general membership wants change XXX but the
CB member votes against XXX? There is no requirement for the CB member to
vote the wishes of his district. <o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 face="Times New Roman"><span
style='font-size:12.0pt'> <o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 face="Times New Roman"><span
style='font-size:12.0pt'>The CB is not voted into or out of office but
appointed by the DVP. Which can lead to a almost lifetime
appointment. <o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 face="Times New Roman"><span
style='font-size:12.0pt'> <o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 face="Times New Roman"><span
style='font-size:12.0pt'>I don't mind getting my hat handed to me at times, I
was on the wrong side of the subject back then with this CB member,
I'm likely to be wrong now.<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 face="Times New Roman"><span
style='font-size:12.0pt'> <o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 face="Times New Roman"><span
style='font-size:12.0pt'>Tim<br>
<br>
--- On <b><span style='font-weight:bold'>Thu, 8/19/10, Pete Cosky <i><span
style='font-style:italic'><pcosky@comcast.net></span></i></span></b>
wrote:<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<blockquote style='border:none;border-left:solid #1010FF 1.5pt;padding:0in 0in 0in 3.0pt;
margin-left:3.0pt;margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt'>
<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><font size=3
face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:12.0pt'><br>
From: Pete Cosky <pcosky@comcast.net><br>
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] weight difference<br>
To: "General pattern discussion"
<nsrca-discussion@lists.nsrca.org><br>
Date: Thursday, August 19, 2010, 9:46 AM<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 face="Times New Roman"><span
style='font-size:12.0pt'>Well stated....I have seen limiting rules changed in
other hobbies of mine over the years to help make it easier for people to
competehave the exact opposite effect.<br>
<br>
I am one of those lower class guys who whould like to see pattern become less
expensive and eliminating a limiting rule IMO is not the way.<br>
<br>
Just my $1.98 (2 cents inflation adjusted)<br>
<br>
Pete Cosky<br>
sent from my mobile device<br>
<br>
-----Original Message-----<br>
From: Atwood, Mark <<a
href="http://us.mc623.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=atwoodm@paragon-inc.com">atwoodm@paragon-inc.com</a>><br>
Sent: Thursday, August 19, 2010 9:05 AM<br>
To: General pattern discussion <<a
href="http://us.mc623.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=nsrca-discussion@lists.nsrca.org">nsrca-discussion@lists.nsrca.org</a>><br>
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] weight difference<br>
<br>
The challenge here is that rules of this nature, limiting rules, be it in
Pattern, Sailing, Stock car, whatever, are NOT in place to restrict the
average guy, they're in place to restrict the innovator. The guys that
push the limit.<br>
<br>
In our sport, the "average" guy is stuck pushing the limit because
he's trying to copy and follow the innovators. We all want the triple
volumetric 2 meter bird because that's what Chip/Andrew/Quique and company
have pushed the boundary's too. A prophecy still makes weight with
nooooo problem.<br>
<br>
So the problem is simple. IF the rules change, it clearly will help the
average guy for a year or two. But then the innovators will once again
push the limits (they wouldn't BE limits if no one was pushing) and we would
see new designs that the average guy can't easily keep within the rules.<br>
<br>
Bipes have not really caught on because they're too difficult to make weight
with. Only the very best builders with very few limits on funding for
all the best and lightest equipment have made them work. Add a pound
and that will very likely change...to where all the top guys can make them
work, which will then push the average guy to try and make them
work. At the end of the day, all it adds is cost as we
obsolete a whole generation of viable aircraft to the dumpster.<br>
<br>
All one needs to do for confirmation on that is to review the evolution of
aircraft that occurred when we removed the LAST limiter...engine
displacement. Prior to that, weight was only a secondary
limiter because displacement restricted how big of a plane you could carry
around. Once removed, we had 10 years of growing aircraft and growing
engines. All costing more, NOT just because the new stuff was more
expensive...that's just natural inflation and evolution, but because the
lifespan of a model was shorter. Designs changed
SIGNIFICANTLY every year.<br>
<br>
Finally, we're back to a semi stable development cycle which has aircraft
like the Integral enjoying a 5-6 year run and is still considered competitive
even in FAI (I believe that's what Pete Collinson flew in the finals this
year).<br>
<br>
It's not that we're not listening... We're simply trying to avoid
mistakes from the past and make as sure as we can that the rule changes won't
have disastrous unintended consequences.<br>
<br>
The rule change that is currently on the ballot provides a sizeable variance
for those in the lower classes to help accommodate aging aircraft (which seem
to gain weight magically), repaired used aircraft, and beginning
builders....without changing the goal (and therefore the designers goal) of
maintaining a 5KG weight limit.<br>
<br>
Ok...off my soapbox. Sorry for the diatribe.<br>
<br>
-Mark<br>
CB for Dist 3<br>
<br>
Mark Atwood<br>
Paragon Consulting, Inc. | President<br>
<st1:address w:st="on"><st1:Street w:st="on">5885 Landerbrook Drive Suite 130</st1:Street>,
<st1:City w:st="on">Cleveland</st1:City> <st1:State w:st="on">Ohio</st1:State>,
<st1:PostalCode w:st="on">44124</st1:PostalCode></st1:address><br>
Phone: 440.684.3101 x102 | Fax: 440.684.3102<br>
<a
href="http://us.mc623.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=mark.atwood@paragon-inc.com">mark.atwood@paragon-inc.com</a><mailto:<a
href="http://us.mc623.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=mark.atwood@paragon-inc.com">mark.atwood@paragon-inc.com</a>>
| www.paragon-inc.com<<a href="http://www.paragon-inc.com/"
target="_blank">http://www.paragon-inc.com/</a>><br>
<br>
From: <a
href="http://us.mc623.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=nsrca-discussion-bounces@lists.nsrca.org">nsrca-discussion-bounces@lists.nsrca.org</a>
[mailto:<a
href="http://us.mc623.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=nsrca-discussion-bounces@lists.nsrca.org">nsrca-discussion-bounces@lists.nsrca.org</a>]
On Behalf Of Dr Mike<br>
Sent: Thursday, August 19, 2010 8:42 AM<br>
To: 'General pattern discussion'<br>
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] weight difference<br>
<br>
Lance,<br>
Regarding the CB, I agree with you that those generalities are anal comments.
Most of the guys are giving freely of their time and we are lucky to have
them. On the weight issue, the 11 pounds is a bit restricting.
When that rule was made, planes had a 60 inch span, were 48 inches long and
weighed 7 lbs. now they are volumetrically double or triple so the wing
loading is the same or lighter. Needs to go up at least a pound or two.<br>
Mike<br>
<br>
From: <a
href="http://us.mc623.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=nsrca-discussion-bounces@lists.nsrca.org">nsrca-discussion-bounces@lists.nsrca.org</a>
[mailto:<a
href="http://us.mc623.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=nsrca-discussion-bounces@lists.nsrca.org">nsrca-discussion-bounces@lists.nsrca.org</a>]
On Behalf Of Patterndude<br>
Sent: Wednesday, August 18, 2010 8:35 PM<br>
To: General pattern discussion<br>
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] weight difference<br>
<br>
I have a 10 lb e-symphony, there are low 10 lb Evo's and both these planes
are super rigid an tough. There are e planes that I'm afraid to touch because
of fragility and they cost more too. Point is, the consumer has choices and
don't need to fly a dangerous airframe. They choose to. Remember the glow
Impacts that lost their tail in a snap but hundreds were sold AFTER this fact
was known on this list?<br>
<br>
As a CB guy I don't like being generalized against. I ask for input all the
time. Even call people and tell people where my head is at all the time
without preaching.<br>
<br>
Sent from my iPhone<br>
<br>
On Aug 18, 2010, at 8:11 PM, Tim Taylor <<a
href="http://us.mc623.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=timsautopro@yahoo.com">timsautopro@yahoo.com</a><mailto:<a
href="http://us.mc623.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=timsautopro@yahoo.com">timsautopro@yahoo.com</a>>>
wrote:<br>
We can always ignore it, we've done that for years unless you're in the top 3-5
at the Nats.<br>
<br>
In this day and age of instant communication we no longer need a Contest
Board to decide what we do or not. With all due respect to the CB we don't
need you guys anymore, we can poll the membership directly and set the rules.
Far more representative that way.<br>
<br>
The only time I ever tried to talk to a CB member about a rules proposal in
person I got the old "I know better than you and I'm going to do what I
want so we don't need to discuss it." He then refused to even talk
about anything at that point. Left a very bad taste I tell you.<br>
<br>
Tim<br>
--- On Wed, 8/18/10, Dave <st1:City w:st="on"><st1:place w:st="on">Burton</st1:place></st1:City>
<<a href="http://us.mc623.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=burtona@atmc.net">burtona@atmc.net</a><mailto:<a
href="http://us.mc623.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=burtona@atmc.net">burtona@atmc.net</a>>>
wrote:<br>
<br>
From: Dave Burton <<a
href="http://us.mc623.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=burtona@atmc.net">burtona@atmc.net</a><mailto:<a
href="http://us.mc623.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=burtona@atmc.net">burtona@atmc.net</a>>><br>
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] weight difference<br>
To: "'General pattern discussion'" <<a
href="http://us.mc623.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=nsrca-discussion@lists.nsrca.org">nsrca-discussion@lists.nsrca.org</a><mailto:<a
href="http://us.mc623.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=nsrca-discussion@lists.nsrca.org">nsrca-discussion@lists.nsrca.org</a>>><br>
Date: Wednesday, August 18, 2010, 7:53 PM<br>
The rules proposal to eliminate the weight limit didn't make the first CB<br>
vote. Too bad IMO!<br>
Dave<br>
<br>
-----Original Message-----<br>
From: <a
href="http://us.mc623.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=nsrca-discussion-bounces@lists.nsrca.org">nsrca-discussion-bounces@lists.nsrca.org</a><mailto:<a
href="http://us.mc623.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=nsrca-discussion-bounces@lists.nsrca.org">nsrca-discussion-bounces@lists.nsrca.org</a>><br>
[mailto:<a
href="http://us.mc623.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=nsrca-discussion-bounces@lists.nsrca.org">nsrca-discussion-bounces@lists.nsrca.org</a><mailto:<a
href="http://us.mc623.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=nsrca-discussion-bounces@lists.nsrca.org">nsrca-discussion-bounces@lists.nsrca.org</a>>]
On Behalf Of Ron Hansen<br>
Sent: Wednesday, August 18, 2010 7:35 PM<br>
To: 'General pattern discussion'<br>
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] weight difference<br>
<br>
I'm concerned that these new electric only planes that are designed to make<br>
weight won't hold up to the normal wear and tear of an average intermediate<br>
or advanced pilot or flying off of a rough grass runway. Is this a
valid<br>
concern? I think so but maybe I'm over reacting. That is why I'm
in favor<br>
of eliminating the weight limit altogether. The proposal to slightly
raise<br>
the weight limit won't allow someone to fly an electric Focus II for<br>
example.<br>
<br>
-----Original Message-----<br>
From: <a
href="http://us.mc623.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=nsrca-discussion-bounces@lists.nsrca.org">nsrca-discussion-bounces@lists.nsrca.org</a><mailto:<a
href="http://us.mc623.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=nsrca-discussion-bounces@lists.nsrca.org">nsrca-discussion-bounces@lists.nsrca.org</a>><br>
[mailto:<a
href="http://us.mc623.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=nsrca-discussion-bounces@lists.nsrca.org">nsrca-discussion-bounces@lists.nsrca.org</a><mailto:<a
href="http://us.mc623.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=nsrca-discussion-bounces@lists.nsrca.org">nsrca-discussion-bounces@lists.nsrca.org</a>>]
On Behalf Of J N Hiller<br>
Sent: Tuesday, August 17, 2010 2:17 PM<br>
To: General pattern discussion<br>
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] weight difference<br>
<br>
I've been following this with interest. E-power is looking better all the<br>
time and I probably will make the change. I like to build prefer a wood<br>
airplane. About how much total weight is in a suitable E-power system or<br>
empty airframe ready for radio etc? Any numbers readily available would be<br>
helpful in understanding the distribution of weight.<br>
Thanks<br>
Jim Hiller<br>
<br>
-----Original Message-----<br>
From: <a
href="http://us.mc623.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=nsrca-discussion-bounces@lists.nsrca.org">nsrca-discussion-bounces@lists.nsrca.org</a><mailto:<a
href="http://us.mc623.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=nsrca-discussion-bounces@lists.nsrca.org">nsrca-discussion-bounces@lists.nsrca.org</a>><br>
[mailto:<a
href="http://us.mc623.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=nsrca-discussion-bounces@lists.nsrca.org">nsrca-discussion-bounces@lists.nsrca.org</a><mailto:<a
href="http://us.mc623.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=nsrca-discussion-bounces@lists.nsrca.org">nsrca-discussion-bounces@lists.nsrca.org</a>>]On
Behalf Of Dave<br>
Sent: Tuesday, August 17, 2010 9:02 AM<br>
To: 'General pattern discussion'<br>
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] weight difference<br>
<br>
And to recall.....that is the Spark with custom wings and stabs, which saves<br>
substantial weight? There are very few unmodified kits available that
are<br>
RTF electric at 10.25. There are some airframe examples for which glow
/<br>
electric are similar weight, but that is not the norm - not yet anyway - my<br>
opinion.<br>
<br>
My electric Bravo was 10 lbs even at the 2009 NATs (only 4 oz more than the<br>
Vivat I flew in 2005) and I would be scared of the structure if it were any<br>
lighter. Of course it could be lighter still IF I went from 5000 to
4350<br>
lipos (~6 oz) and ditched the dual RX batts and Vregs (~2 oz) and used<br>
lighter ESC and wiring (~ 2 oz).<br>
<br>
Point being....even tho 10 lb electrics are possible, and becoming more<br>
common, it is still pretty easy to build electrics at 11+ lbs without<br>
careful planning and attention to detail. I think it will become a<br>
non-issue soon enough.....even in Europe and <st1:place w:st="on">Asia</st1:place>
electrics are coming on<br>
strong.....so the glow kits will become increasingly scarce.<br>
<br>
Regards,<br>
<br>
Dave<br>
<br>
-----Original Message-----<br>
From: <a
href="http://us.mc623.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=nsrca-discussion-bounces@lists.nsrca.org">nsrca-discussion-bounces@lists.nsrca.org</a><mailto:<a
href="http://us.mc623.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=nsrca-discussion-bounces@lists.nsrca.org">nsrca-discussion-bounces@lists.nsrca.org</a>><br>
[mailto:<a
href="http://us.mc623.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=nsrca-discussion-bounces@lists.nsrca.org">nsrca-discussion-bounces@lists.nsrca.org</a><mailto:<a
href="http://us.mc623.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=nsrca-discussion-bounces@lists.nsrca.org">nsrca-discussion-bounces@lists.nsrca.org</a>>]
On Behalf Of Atwood, Mark<br>
Sent: Tuesday, August 17, 2010 10:06 AM<br>
To: General pattern discussion<br>
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] weight difference<br>
<br>
I would argue that you can't "disregard" the airframe given that an
all<br>
electric airframe is much lighter.<br>
<br>
My answer to the question? There is almost no
difference. I'm flying a<br>
full 2M plane that weighs 10lbs 4oz with light batteries, 10lbs, 8oz with<br>
very heavy batteries. My two Black Magics with glow weighed
10lbs 6oz and<br>
10lbs 8oz RTF minus CDI (add approx 4oz for that).<br>
<br>
I believe we're just now seeing full electric designs that are optimized for<br>
weight and are coming in light. Prior to that, many of the
designs still<br>
had unnecessary structure as a legacy from Glow. I'm pretty sure that<br>
evolution is not complete yet either.<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
Mark Atwood<br>
Paragon Consulting, Inc. | President<br>
<st1:address w:st="on"><st1:Street w:st="on">5885 Landerbrook Drive Suite 130</st1:Street>,
<st1:City w:st="on">Cleveland</st1:City> <st1:State w:st="on">Ohio</st1:State>,
<st1:PostalCode w:st="on">44124</st1:PostalCode></st1:address><br>
Phone: 440.684.3101 x102 | Fax: 440.684.3102<br>
<a
href="http://us.mc623.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=mark.atwood@paragon-inc.com">mark.atwood@paragon-inc.com</a><mailto:<a
href="http://us.mc623.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=mark.atwood@paragon-inc.com">mark.atwood@paragon-inc.com</a>>
| www.paragon-inc.com<<a href="http://www.paragon-inc.com/"
target="_blank">http://www.paragon-inc.com</a>><br>
<br>
<br>
-----Original Message-----<br>
From: <a
href="http://us.mc623.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=nsrca-discussion-bounces@lists.nsrca.org">nsrca-discussion-bounces@lists.nsrca.org</a><mailto:<a
href="http://us.mc623.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=nsrca-discussion-bounces@lists.nsrca.org">nsrca-discussion-bounces@lists.nsrca.org</a>><br>
[mailto:<a
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href="http://us.mc623.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=nsrca-discussion-bounces@lists.nsrca.org">nsrca-discussion-bounces@lists.nsrca.org</a>>]
On Behalf Of Ron Van Putte<br>
Sent: Tuesday, August 17, 2010 9:58 AM<br>
To: General pattern discussion<br>
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] weight difference<br>
<br>
Tough question. Will you insist on using 30C lipos, when 20C lipos<br>
are much lighter? Do you plan on using a particular motor? Motor<br>
weights vary substantially. Some ESCs are a lot heavier than others.<br>
<br>
My guess would be that the weight difference between a complete<br>
electric-power system and a complete glow-power system, disregarding<br>
the airplane, would be 10-16 ounces.<br>
<br>
Ron<br>
<br>
On Aug 17, 2010, at 8:51 AM, Dr Mike wrote:<br>
<br>
> Ok so I am going to ask the question again... in your estimation<br>
> what is the<br>
> difference in weight between the complete electric power system and<br>
> the<br>
> complete glow system-disregarding the airplane?<br>
> Mike<br>
><br>
> -----Original Message-----<br>
> From: <a
href="http://us.mc623.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=nsrca-discussion-bounces@lists.nsrca.org">nsrca-discussion-bounces@lists.nsrca.org</a><mailto:<a
href="http://us.mc623.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=nsrca-discussion-bounces@lists.nsrca.org">nsrca-discussion-bounces@lists.nsrca.org</a>><br>
> [mailto:<a
href="http://us.mc623.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=nsrca-discussion-bounces@lists.nsrca.org">nsrca-discussion-bounces@lists.nsrca.org</a><mailto:<a
href="http://us.mc623.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=nsrca-discussion-bounces@lists.nsrca.org">nsrca-discussion-bounces@lists.nsrca.org</a>>]
On Behalf Of Ron<br>
> Van Putte<br>
> Sent: Tuesday, August 17, 2010 8:30 AM<br>
> To: General pattern discussion<br>
> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] weight difference<br>
><br>
> Dave WAS trying to show the difference between glow and electric.<br>
><br>
<br>
<br>
[The entire original message is not included]<br>
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