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<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>Yup and I do use that as an indicator.
Remember the old Masters Reverse Avalanche? Sometimes the plane would actually
almost stop moving right after the snap (if it was done correctly). If the plane
cruises right through a "snap-roll" with no visible dissipation of energy, it's
probably a twinkle.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>John Pavlick<BR><A
href="http://www.idseng.com">http://www.idseng.com</A></FONT></DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE
style="PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px">
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial">----- Original Message ----- </DIV>
<DIV
style="BACKGROUND: #e4e4e4; FONT: 10pt arial; font-color: black"><B>From:</B>
<A title=js.smith@verizon.net href="mailto:js.smith@verizon.net">Scott
Smith</A> </DIV>
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>To:</B> <A
title=nsrca-discussion@lists.nsrca.org
href="mailto:nsrca-discussion@lists.nsrca.org">'General pattern
discussion'</A> </DIV>
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Sent:</B> Sunday, October 11, 2009 8:03
PM</DIV>
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Subject:</B> Re: [NSRCA-discussion]
Snap</DIV>
<DIV><BR></DIV>
<DIV class=Section1>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 11pt; COLOR: #1f497d; FONT-FAMILY: 'Calibri','sans-serif'">So
why don’t we use speed as a criteria? A true snap roll will slow the
aircraft significantly. (It’s at least worth a mention the aircraft
should decelerate in the description!) <o:p></o:p></SPAN></P>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 11pt; COLOR: #1f497d; FONT-FAMILY: 'Calibri','sans-serif'"><o:p> </o:p></SPAN></P>
<DIV>
<DIV
style="BORDER-RIGHT: medium none; PADDING-RIGHT: 0in; BORDER-TOP: #b5c4df 1pt solid; PADDING-LEFT: 0in; PADDING-BOTTOM: 0in; BORDER-LEFT: medium none; PADDING-TOP: 3pt; BORDER-BOTTOM: medium none">
<P class=MsoNormal><B><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Tahoma','sans-serif'">From:</SPAN></B><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Tahoma','sans-serif'"> <A
href="mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces@lists.nsrca.org">nsrca-discussion-bounces@lists.nsrca.org</A>
[mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces@lists.nsrca.org] <B>On Behalf Of </B>Ed
Alt<BR><B>Sent:</B> Sunday, October 11, 2009 7:44 PM<BR><B>To:</B> General
pattern discussion<BR><B>Subject:</B> Re: [NSRCA-discussion]
Snap<o:p></o:p></SPAN></P></DIV></DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></P>
<DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Arial','sans-serif'">You can fake a snap
just by adding some elevator and rudder, enough to get the tail to cone
around. Fools a lot of judges.</SPAN><o:p></o:p></P></DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE
style="BORDER-RIGHT: medium none; PADDING-RIGHT: 0in; BORDER-TOP: medium none; PADDING-LEFT: 4pt; PADDING-BOTTOM: 0in; MARGIN: 5pt 0in 5pt 3.75pt; BORDER-LEFT: black 1.5pt solid; PADDING-TOP: 0in; BORDER-BOTTOM: medium none">
<DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Arial','sans-serif'">----- Original
Message ----- <o:p></o:p></SPAN></P></DIV>
<DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal style="BACKGROUND: #e4e4e4"><B><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Arial','sans-serif'">From:</SPAN></B><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Arial','sans-serif'"> <A
title=warrior523@mchsi.com href="mailto:warrior523@mchsi.com">Dan</A>
<o:p></o:p></SPAN></P></DIV>
<DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal><B><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Arial','sans-serif'">To:</SPAN></B><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Arial','sans-serif'"> <A
title=nsrca-discussion@lists.nsrca.org
href="mailto:nsrca-discussion@lists.nsrca.org">General pattern
discussion</A> <o:p></o:p></SPAN></P></DIV>
<DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal><B><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Arial','sans-serif'">Sent:</SPAN></B><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Arial','sans-serif'"> Sunday, October
11, 2009 6:14 PM<o:p></o:p></SPAN></P></DIV>
<DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal><B><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Arial','sans-serif'">Subject:</SPAN></B><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Arial','sans-serif'"> Re:
[NSRCA-discussion] Snap<o:p></o:p></SPAN></P></DIV>
<DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></P></DIV>
<DIV>
<DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Arial','sans-serif'">No pitch break =
no snap roll. It's not a matter of anyone's opinion, it's an
aerodynamic fact. If it's truly this hard to judge, they should simply
be eliminated.<o:p></o:p></SPAN></P></DIV>
<DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Arial','sans-serif'"> <o:p></o:p></SPAN></P></DIV>
<DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Arial','sans-serif'">Ed<o:p></o:p></SPAN></P></DIV>
<DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Arial','sans-serif'"> <o:p></o:p></SPAN></P></DIV>
<DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Arial','sans-serif'">Okay if you say
so but what is it if it is not a barrel roll or an axial roll?
Certainly it is a snap, and certainly there is a pitch break but it does not
have to come before the rotation it can happen simoultaneously. I can
fly level or vertical (up or down) or at any other angle in between and flip
my elevator stick repeatedly from one end of a line to another and my plane
does not stall (oops I know I should say the wing or wings do not
stall) The arguement for a pitch break is fascious reguarding our
models. I go ahead and do the bump prior to the snap if that is how
the judges at that time want it, but to say that a plane did not snap just
because there was not an initial pitch break does not equal
actuality. <o:p></o:p></SPAN></P></DIV>
<DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Arial','sans-serif'"> <o:p></o:p></SPAN></P></DIV>
<DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Arial','sans-serif'">Dan<o:p></o:p></SPAN></P></DIV></DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE
style="BORDER-RIGHT: medium none; PADDING-RIGHT: 0in; BORDER-TOP: medium none; PADDING-LEFT: 4pt; PADDING-BOTTOM: 0in; MARGIN: 5pt 0in 5pt 3.75pt; BORDER-LEFT: black 1.5pt solid; PADDING-TOP: 0in; BORDER-BOTTOM: medium none">
<DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Arial','sans-serif'">----- Original
Message ----- <o:p></o:p></SPAN></P></DIV>
<DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal style="BACKGROUND: #e4e4e4"><B><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Arial','sans-serif'">From:</SPAN></B><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Arial','sans-serif'"> <A
title=ed_alt@hotmail.com href="mailto:ed_alt@hotmail.com">Ed Alt</A>
<o:p></o:p></SPAN></P></DIV>
<DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal><B><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Arial','sans-serif'">To:</SPAN></B><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Arial','sans-serif'"> <A
title=nsrca-discussion@lists.nsrca.org
href="mailto:nsrca-discussion@lists.nsrca.org">General pattern
discussion</A> <o:p></o:p></SPAN></P></DIV>
<DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal><B><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Arial','sans-serif'">Sent:</SPAN></B><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Arial','sans-serif'"> Sunday,
October 11, 2009 5:45 PM<o:p></o:p></SPAN></P></DIV>
<DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal><B><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Arial','sans-serif'">Subject:</SPAN></B><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Arial','sans-serif'"> Re:
[NSRCA-discussion] Snap<o:p></o:p></SPAN></P></DIV>
<DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></P></DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE
style="BORDER-RIGHT: medium none; PADDING-RIGHT: 0in; BORDER-TOP: medium none; PADDING-LEFT: 4pt; PADDING-BOTTOM: 0in; MARGIN: 5pt 0in 5pt 3.75pt; BORDER-LEFT: black 1.5pt solid; PADDING-TOP: 0in; BORDER-BOTTOM: medium none">
<DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Arial','sans-serif'">-----
Original Message ----- <o:p></o:p></SPAN></P></DIV>
<DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal style="BACKGROUND: #e4e4e4"><B><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Arial','sans-serif'">From:</SPAN></B><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Arial','sans-serif'"> <A
title=warrior523@mchsi.com href="mailto:warrior523@mchsi.com">Dan</A>
<o:p></o:p></SPAN></P></DIV>
<DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal><B><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Arial','sans-serif'">To:</SPAN></B><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Arial','sans-serif'"> <A
title=nsrca-discussion@lists.nsrca.org
href="mailto:nsrca-discussion@lists.nsrca.org">General pattern
discussion</A> <o:p></o:p></SPAN></P></DIV>
<DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal><B><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Arial','sans-serif'">Sent:</SPAN></B><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Arial','sans-serif'"> Sunday,
October 11, 2009 5:12 PM<o:p></o:p></SPAN></P></DIV>
<DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal><B><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Arial','sans-serif'">Subject:</SPAN></B><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Arial','sans-serif'"> Re:
[NSRCA-discussion] Snap<o:p></o:p></SPAN></P></DIV>
<DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></P></DIV>
<DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Arial','sans-serif'">I know better
than to enter this conversation but, but, well here goes. Don, I
agree with your post about the three types of rolls. If it is not
axial and it is not a barrell roll the it is a snap roll. Some one
at some time put in the description of a snap the requirement of a ptich
break. Man has this caused problems. Now tell me if a plane
does a snap roll without a leading pitch break then what roll was it,
axial, nope don't think so. Was it a barrel roll, nope not that
either so low and behold it must have been a snap roll. We have
all set in a judging chair and watched snap manuevers and we have flown
these maneuvers. We can all say that we have seen and or
flown many true snap rolls that did not have a any visible pitch
break, some are judged on our 1 to 10 scale and others at times receive
the zero. In the current Masters sequence the 45 degree downline
snap for example. I have flown that manuever many many times and I
have thrown in the "required" pitch bump and I have at times neglected
to do the bump, but you know what, in either method the
airplane performed a snap roll.</SPAN><o:p></o:p></P></DIV>
<DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal> <o:p></o:p></P></DIV>
<DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Arial','sans-serif'">I have been
flying pattern since the late sixties and going all the way back to then
I have know and been able to recognize a stall turn and its difference
from a hammerhead turn. I for the life of me it seems that a
stall turn is named very aptly.</SPAN><o:p></o:p></P></DIV>
<DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal> <o:p></o:p></P></DIV>
<DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Arial','sans-serif'">Some of us
live for the nitpicking discussions of stalls and snaps and wording in
maneuver descriptions, others just want a simple description and go
out and fly or judge it to our perceived perfection. Is it any
wonder we seem to be decreasing in our
numbers.</SPAN> <o:p></o:p></P></DIV>
<DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal> <o:p></o:p></P></DIV>
<DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Arial','sans-serif'">Dan
Curtis</SPAN><o:p></o:p></P></DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE
style="BORDER-RIGHT: medium none; PADDING-RIGHT: 0in; BORDER-TOP: medium none; PADDING-LEFT: 4pt; PADDING-BOTTOM: 0in; MARGIN: 5pt 0in 5pt 3.75pt; BORDER-LEFT: black 1.5pt solid; PADDING-TOP: 0in; BORDER-BOTTOM: medium none">
<DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Arial','sans-serif'">-----
Original Message ----- <o:p></o:p></SPAN></P></DIV>
<DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal style="BACKGROUND: #e4e4e4"><B><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Arial','sans-serif'">From:</SPAN></B><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Arial','sans-serif'"> <A
title=vicenterc@comcast.net
href="mailto:vicenterc@comcast.net">Vicente "Vince" Bortone</A>
<o:p></o:p></SPAN></P></DIV>
<DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal><B><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Arial','sans-serif'">To:</SPAN></B><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Arial','sans-serif'"> <A
title=nsrca-discussion@lists.nsrca.org
href="mailto:nsrca-discussion@lists.nsrca.org">General pattern
discussion</A> <o:p></o:p></SPAN></P></DIV>
<DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal><B><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Arial','sans-serif'">Sent:</SPAN></B><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Arial','sans-serif'"> Sunday,
October 11, 2009 7:47 AM<o:p></o:p></SPAN></P></DIV>
<DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal><B><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Arial','sans-serif'">Subject:</SPAN></B><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Arial','sans-serif'"> Re:
[NSRCA-discussion] Snap<o:p></o:p></SPAN></P></DIV>
<DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></P></DIV>
<DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN
style="COLOR: black; FONT-FAMILY: 'Arial','sans-serif'">Amen....<BR><BR>Vicente
"Vince" Bortone<BR><BR>----- Original Message -----<BR>From: "Ed Alt"
<<A
href="mailto:ed_alt@hotmail.com">ed_alt@hotmail.com</A>><BR>To:
"General pattern discussion" <<A
href="mailto:nsrca-discussion@lists.nsrca.org">nsrca-discussion@lists.nsrca.org</A>><BR>Sent:
Sunday, October 11, 2009 7:33:56 AM GMT -06:00 US/Canada
Central<BR>Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Snap<BR><BR>
<o:p></o:p></SPAN></P>
<DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: black; FONT-FAMILY: 'Arial','sans-serif'">Don:</SPAN><SPAN
style="COLOR: black; FONT-FAMILY: 'Arial','sans-serif'"><o:p></o:p></SPAN></P></DIV>
<DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: black; FONT-FAMILY: 'Arial','sans-serif'">I
don't agree with that. You need to see a distinct pitch break and
yawing action to accompany the pitch break, otherwise there is no real
evidence that autorotation occurred. "Tail coning" alone is not even a
reliable indicator of a snap. You can easily cheat that to sell
a "snap". A snap is a stalled wing, autorotation
maneuver. Also, the tendency to downgrade snaps because of any line
displacement goes entirely against the physics of what must occur in
order for a real snap roll take happen. I think we should have a
rule that most clearly accounts for the physics of what must occur for
it to be a real snap, or just take them of sequences entirely.
And of course, educate judges and pilots accordingly. Also, when
you're a judge, don't be afraid to zero or severely downgrade a
wiffle snap, or whatever is being presented to you if it's not a real
snap. Especially don't be afraid of zeroing snaps when it's a big name
trying to sneak a snap cheat in front of you.</SPAN><SPAN
style="COLOR: black; FONT-FAMILY: 'Arial','sans-serif'"><o:p></o:p></SPAN></P></DIV>
<DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN
style="COLOR: black; FONT-FAMILY: 'Arial','sans-serif'"> <o:p></o:p></SPAN></P></DIV>
<DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: black; FONT-FAMILY: 'Arial','sans-serif'">Regards,</SPAN><SPAN
style="COLOR: black; FONT-FAMILY: 'Arial','sans-serif'"><o:p></o:p></SPAN></P></DIV>
<DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: black; FONT-FAMILY: 'Arial','sans-serif'">Ed</SPAN><SPAN
style="COLOR: black; FONT-FAMILY: 'Arial','sans-serif'"><o:p></o:p></SPAN></P></DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE
style="BORDER-RIGHT: medium none; PADDING-RIGHT: 0in; BORDER-TOP: medium none; PADDING-LEFT: 4pt; PADDING-BOTTOM: 0in; MARGIN: 5pt 0in 5pt 3.75pt; BORDER-LEFT: black 1.5pt solid; PADDING-TOP: 0in; BORDER-BOTTOM: medium none">
<DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: black; FONT-FAMILY: 'Arial','sans-serif'">-----
Original Message ----- <o:p></o:p></SPAN></P></DIV>
<DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal style="BACKGROUND: #e4e4e4"><B><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: black; FONT-FAMILY: 'Arial','sans-serif'">From:</SPAN></B><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: black; FONT-FAMILY: 'Arial','sans-serif'">
<A title=donramsey@gmail.com href="mailto:donramsey@gmail.com"
target=_blank>Don Ramsey</A> <o:p></o:p></SPAN></P></DIV>
<DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal><B><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: black; FONT-FAMILY: 'Arial','sans-serif'">To:</SPAN></B><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: black; FONT-FAMILY: 'Arial','sans-serif'">
<A title=nsrca-discussion@lists.nsrca.org
href="mailto:nsrca-discussion@lists.nsrca.org"
target=_blank>'General pattern discussion'</A>
<o:p></o:p></SPAN></P></DIV>
<DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal><B><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: black; FONT-FAMILY: 'Arial','sans-serif'">Sent:</SPAN></B><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: black; FONT-FAMILY: 'Arial','sans-serif'">
Sunday, October 11, 2009 7:01 AM<o:p></o:p></SPAN></P></DIV>
<DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal><B><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: black; FONT-FAMILY: 'Arial','sans-serif'">Subject:</SPAN></B><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: black; FONT-FAMILY: 'Arial','sans-serif'">
[NSRCA-discussion] Snap<o:p></o:p></SPAN></P></DIV>
<DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN
style="COLOR: black; FONT-FAMILY: 'Arial','sans-serif'"><o:p> </o:p></SPAN></P></DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 11pt; COLOR: #1f497d">Ok,
how about this for the snap? “If its not a barrel roll and not
an axial roll, it’s a snap.” Maybe have the coning of the tail in
the description. This eliminates about 90% of the judging
differences.</SPAN><SPAN style="COLOR: black"><o:p></o:p></SPAN></P>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN
style="COLOR: black"> <o:p></o:p></SPAN></P>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 11pt; COLOR: #1f497d">Don</SPAN><SPAN
style="COLOR: black"><o:p></o:p></SPAN></P>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN
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<P class=MsoNormal><B><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: black; FONT-FAMILY: 'Tahoma','sans-serif'">From:</SPAN></B><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: black; FONT-FAMILY: 'Tahoma','sans-serif'">
<A href="mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces@lists.nsrca.org"
target=_blank>nsrca-discussion-bounces@lists.nsrca.org</A>
[mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces@lists.nsrca.org] <B>On Behalf Of
</B>Bob Richards<BR><B>Sent:</B> Saturday, October 10, 2009 8:09
PM<BR><B>To:</B> General pattern discussion<BR><B>Subject:</B> Re:
[NSRCA-discussion] basic judging question (warning 4 letter
word)</SPAN><SPAN style="COLOR: black"><o:p></o:p></SPAN></P></DIV>
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<P class=MsoNormal>I think changing the judging criteria, just
for the snap part of the manuever, would suffice.<BR><BR>---
On <B>Sat, 10/10/09, John Ferrell
<I><jferrell13@triad.rr.com></I></B>
wrote:<o:p></o:p></P>
<P class=MsoNormal> <o:p></o:p></P>
<DIV id=yiv1062628926>
<P class=MsoNormal>? <o:p></o:p></P>
<DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Arial','sans-serif'">I
believe "</SPAN><SPAN
style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Arial','sans-serif'">We could fix most of
that, by assigning a low K to snap maneuvers" is the only
appropriate solution. If you cast them out, it is giving up.
</SPAN><o:p></o:p></P></DIV>
<DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal> <o:p></o:p></P></DIV>
<DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal>John Ferrell
W8CCW<BR> <o:p></o:p></P></DIV></DIV></TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE>
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