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It appears these days that sport fliers do not do consecutive
horizontal rolls. At best, they will point the nose up 45-90 degrees
and do a few just using ailerons. This is the experience that new
entrants to pattern bring to the table. There is no concept anymore of
learning as a sport flyer to do horizontal rolls at a roll rate that
allows appropriate elevator corrections to be made.<br>
What I see in Sportsman and early intermediate is "get the nose up a
bit, bang the ailerons and hope you make it through before the nose is
pointing at the ground"<br>
You can get away with this, sort of, for one roll and sometimes two,
but you will not get through three without exiting with a drastic
recovery.<br>
So, just because we can demonstrate fitting three, four or even five
rolls in the box, does not mean that these beginning pattern flyers can
duplicate your results.<br>
<br>
The real question is why the sport flyers have gotten so far removed
from flying anything resembling standard aerobatic manuevers? When was
the last time you saw someone besides a pattern flyer do an 8 point
roll, cuban eight, three consecutive loops? Have pattern, and even IMAC
for that matter, become so marginalized that noone gives a hoot what we
are up to or try to fly some of the maneuvers we perform on a regular
basis?<br>
I know I could do a centered three horizontal rolls years before I even
thought about entering a pattern contest. I just believed flying
aerobatic maneuvers was part of becoming an accomplished RC pilot.
Times change I guess- that was 40 years ago.<br>
<br>
John<br>
<br>
Bill Glaze wrote:
<blockquote cite="mid:7E18D4B53AD54AFE9E86E69BE389469F@glazecstp32xp"
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<div><font face="Arial" size="2">Amazes me too, Georgie. Practicing
today, just for fun, I did 4 rolls, after a stall turn, and then
entered a half square loop; had plenty room to spare,and at less than
150 meters out.. When we were doing the 3 rolls before I recall some
people objected not about the space required, but that the 3 rolls were
"too difficult" and "too dangerous." I'd sure like to know what
happens between the second and third rolls that puts a huge danger
factor at the end of the maneuver. I've looked for the boogie man, and
just can't seem to find him.</font></div>
<div><font face="Arial" size="2">Bill</font></div>
<blockquote
style="border-left: 2px solid rgb(0, 0, 0); padding-right: 0px; padding-left: 5px; margin-left: 5px; margin-right: 0px;">
<div
style="font-family: arial; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; font-size: 10pt; line-height: normal; font-size-adjust: none; font-stretch: normal;">-----
Original Message ----- <b>From:</b> <a moz-do-not-send="true"
title="geobet4@verizon.net" href="mailto:geobet4@verizon.net">George
W.Kennie</a> </div>
<div
style="font-family: arial; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; font-size: 10pt; line-height: normal; font-size-adjust: none; font-stretch: normal;"><b>To:</b>
<a moz-do-not-send="true" title="nsrca-discussion@lists.nsrca.org"
href="mailto:nsrca-discussion@lists.nsrca.org">General pattern
discussion</a> </div>
<div
style="font-family: arial; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; font-size: 10pt; line-height: normal; font-size-adjust: none; font-stretch: normal;"><b>Sent:</b>
Saturday, May 09, 2009 9:21 PM</div>
<div
style="font-family: arial; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; font-size: 10pt; line-height: normal; font-size-adjust: none; font-stretch: normal;"><b>Subject:</b>
Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Advancement System</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div> </div>
<div><font face="Arial" size="2">Isn't it amazing that we have
combination maneuvers like Two of Two folowed by a Slow Roll opposite
all on one line, including entry and exit lines, and people still think
that you can't get three consecutive rolls in the box.</font></div>
<div> </div>
<div><font face="Arial" size="2">Stymies me !</font></div>
<div> </div>
<div><font face="Arial" size="2">Who else?</font> </div>
<div> </div>
<div> </div>
<div> </div>
<div> </div>
<blockquote
style="border-left: 2px solid rgb(0, 0, 0); padding-right: 0px; padding-left: 5px; margin-left: 5px; margin-right: 0px;">
<div
style="font-family: arial; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; font-size: 10pt; line-height: normal; font-size-adjust: none; font-stretch: normal;">-----
Original Message ----- </div>
<div
style="background: rgb(228, 228, 228) none repeat scroll 0%; -moz-background-clip: -moz-initial; -moz-background-origin: -moz-initial; -moz-background-inline-policy: -moz-initial; font-family: arial; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; font-size: 10pt; line-height: normal; font-size-adjust: none; font-stretch: normal;"><b>From:</b>
<a moz-do-not-send="true" title="ghwatson@comcast.net"
href="mailto:ghwatson@comcast.net">Glen Watson</a> </div>
<div
style="font-family: arial; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; font-size: 10pt; line-height: normal; font-size-adjust: none; font-stretch: normal;"><b>To:</b>
<a moz-do-not-send="true" title="nsrca-discussion@lists.nsrca.org"
href="mailto:nsrca-discussion@lists.nsrca.org">'General pattern
discussion'</a> </div>
<div
style="font-family: arial; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; font-size: 10pt; line-height: normal; font-size-adjust: none; font-stretch: normal;"><b>Sent:</b>
Saturday, May 09, 2009 1:02 PM</div>
<div
style="font-family: arial; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; font-size: 10pt; line-height: normal; font-size-adjust: none; font-stretch: normal;"><b>Subject:</b>
Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Advancement System</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div class="Section1">
<p class="MsoNormal"><font color="blue" face="Arial" size="2"><span
style="font-size: 10pt; color: blue; font-family: Arial;">Chuck,<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><font color="blue" face="Arial" size="2"><span
style="font-size: 10pt; color: blue; font-family: Arial;"><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><font color="blue" face="Arial" size="2"><span
style="font-size: 10pt; color: blue; font-family: Arial;">In the early
nineties when I got started in pattern the Sportsman sequence now known
as Intermediate had three rolls. I flew 2cycle then (Saphire, LA-1)
and had no problem fitting the maneuver in the box as well as
centering. I believe this built many early skill sets that have helped
me in the long run over the years.<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><font color="blue" face="Arial" size="2"><span
style="font-size: 10pt; color: blue; font-family: Arial;"><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><font color="blue" face="Arial" size="2"><span
style="font-size: 10pt; color: blue; font-family: Arial;">I’m of the
opinion pattern sequences should present challenges to ones current
skill set. Without a challenge why do pattern at all.<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><font color="blue" face="Arial" size="2"><span
style="font-size: 10pt; color: blue; font-family: Arial;"><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><font color="blue" face="Arial" size="2"><span
style="font-size: 10pt; color: blue; font-family: Arial;">Glen<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><font color="blue" face="Arial" size="2"><span
style="font-size: 10pt; color: blue; font-family: Arial;"><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<div>
<div class="MsoNormal" style="text-align: center;" align="center"><font
face="Times New Roman" size="3"><span style="font-size: 12pt;">
<hr tabindex="-1" align="center" size="2" width="100%"> </span></font></div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><b><font face="Tahoma" size="2"><span
style="font-weight: bold; font-size: 10pt; font-family: Tahoma;">From:</span></font></b><font
face="Tahoma" size="2"><span
style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: Tahoma;">
<a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces@lists.nsrca.org">nsrca-discussion-bounces@lists.nsrca.org</a>
[<a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces@lists.nsrca.org">mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces@lists.nsrca.org</a>] <b><span
style="font-weight: bold;">On Behalf Of </span></b>Chuck Hochhalter<br>
<b><span style="font-weight: bold;">Sent:</span></b> Saturday,
May 09, 2009 11:15 AM<br>
<b><span style="font-weight: bold;">To:</span></b> <st1:PersonName
w:st="on">General pattern discussion</st1:PersonName><br>
<b><span style="font-weight: bold;">Subject:</span></b> Re:
[NSRCA-discussion] Advancement System</span></font><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><font face="Times New Roman" size="3"><span
style="font-size: 12pt;"><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><font face="Calibri" size="3"><span
style="font-size: 12pt; font-family: Calibri;">Anyone notice how much
airpace 3 rolls takes in FAI... I don’t think they lower class has the
box management skills to fit 3 rolls into the box, let alone be ready
to center them.</span></font><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><font face="Times New Roman" size="3"><span
style="font-size: 12pt;"> <o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><font face="Calibri" size="3"><span
style="font-size: 12pt; font-family: Calibri;">Chuck</span></font><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><font face="Tahoma" size="2"><span
style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: Tahoma;"><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<div>
<div style="">
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="background: whitesmoke none repeat scroll 0%; -moz-background-clip: -moz-initial; -moz-background-origin: -moz-initial; -moz-background-inline-policy: -moz-initial;"><b><font
face="Tahoma" size="2"><span
style="font-weight: bold; font-size: 10pt; font-family: Tahoma;">From:</span></font></b><font
face="Tahoma" size="2"><span
style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: Tahoma;"> <a
moz-do-not-send="true" title="ronlock@comcast.net"
href="mailto:ronlock@comcast.net">ronlock@comcast.net</a> <o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="background: whitesmoke none repeat scroll 0%; -moz-background-clip: -moz-initial; -moz-background-origin: -moz-initial; -moz-background-inline-policy: -moz-initial;"><b><font
face="Tahoma" size="2"><span
style="font-weight: bold; font-size: 10pt; font-family: Tahoma;">Sent:</span></font></b><font
face="Tahoma" size="2"><span
style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: Tahoma;"> Friday, May 08, 2009
9:25 PM<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="background: whitesmoke none repeat scroll 0%; -moz-background-clip: -moz-initial; -moz-background-origin: -moz-initial; -moz-background-inline-policy: -moz-initial;"><b><font
face="Tahoma" size="2"><span
style="font-weight: bold; font-size: 10pt; font-family: Tahoma;">To:</span></font></b><font
face="Tahoma" size="2"><span
style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: Tahoma;"> <a
moz-do-not-send="true" title="nsrca-discussion@lists.nsrca.org"
href="mailto:nsrca-discussion@lists.nsrca.org">General pattern
discussion</a> <o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="background: whitesmoke none repeat scroll 0%; -moz-background-clip: -moz-initial; -moz-background-origin: -moz-initial; -moz-background-inline-policy: -moz-initial;"><b><font
face="Tahoma" size="2"><span
style="font-weight: bold; font-size: 10pt; font-family: Tahoma;">Subject:</span></font></b><font
face="Tahoma" size="2"><span
style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: Tahoma;"> Re: [NSRCA-discussion]
Advancement System<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
</div>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><font face="Times New Roman" size="3"><span
style="font-size: 12pt;"><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-bottom: 12pt;"><font
color="black" face="Arial" size="3"><span
style="font-size: 12pt; color: black; font-family: Arial;">Re comments
below-<br>
I believe part of reason the current Intermediate sequence has two
rolls, and not three, is-<br>
Figuring two rolls are challenge and training enough for most
intermediate pilots -<br>
And two is enough for judging- Particularly, if you see two going
badly, not many of us<br>
want to see a third.<br>
<br>
Also below - having to move out of Sportsman after first year because
of beating 4 other pilots -<br>
That is already fixed. The 2009 rule "..flier must move out of
Sportsman class at the end of he calendar year of his/her second or
subsequent year of participation if he/she places first or second and
above at least 4 other fliers..."<br>
<br>
Ron Lockhart<br>
<br>
----- Original Message -----<br>
From: "Ron Hansen" <a class="moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" href="mailto:rcpilot@wowway.com"><rcpilot@wowway.com></a><br>
To: "<st1:PersonName w:st="on">General pattern discussion</st1:PersonName>"
<a class="moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" href="mailto:nsrca-discussion@lists.nsrca.org"><nsrca-discussion@lists.nsrca.org></a><br>
Sent: Friday, May 8, 2009 10:03:36 PM (GMT-0500) Auto-Detected<br>
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Advancement System<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><font color="navy" face="Arial" size="2"><span
style="font-size: 10pt; color: navy; font-family: Arial;">I’ve been
flying intermediate for about 3 years going on 4. The two rolls are
still kicking my you know what. I can do one slow roll and one 4 pt
roll but not two consecutive rolls. I’m certain that the average
advance pilot would really have trouble with 3 rolls. I see a lot of
intermediate, advanced and sometimes even masters pilots almost loose
airplanes on the horizontal rolling maneuvers. They shouldn’t be
underestimated.</span></font><font color="black"><span
style="color: black;"><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><font color="black" face="Times New Roman"
size="3"><span style="font-size: 12pt; color: black;"> <o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><font color="navy" face="Arial" size="2"><span
style="font-size: 10pt; color: navy; font-family: Arial;">I agree with
Mark, lets make advancement at all levels a guideline. I had to move
up from sportsman to intermediate after my first year in sportsman
because I beat 4 other pilots. I was flying a Kaos and the other
pilots were all flying their 1<sup>st</sup> contests with trainers.
They had no chance. In the end I’m glade I moved up but at the time it
made me real nervous. I was so determined to fly pattern that I
decided to give it the old college try in intermediate.</span></font><font
color="black"><span style="color: black;"><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><font color="black" face="Times New Roman"
size="3"><span style="font-size: 12pt; color: black;"> <o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><font color="navy" face="Arial" size="2"><span
style="font-size: 10pt; color: navy; font-family: Arial;">I think
Advance could use a few more maneuvers that exit inverted. Otherwise,
I believe all the sequences are pretty good.</span></font><font
color="black"><span style="color: black;"><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><font color="black" face="Times New Roman"
size="3"><span style="font-size: 12pt; color: black;"> <o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><font color="navy" face="Arial" size="2"><span
style="font-size: 10pt; color: navy; font-family: Arial;">Ron </span></font><font
color="black"><span style="color: black;"><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><font color="black" face="Times New Roman"
size="3"><span style="font-size: 12pt; color: black;"> <o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left: 0.5in;"><font
color="black" face="Tahoma" size="2"><span
style="font-size: 10pt; color: black; font-family: Tahoma;">-----Original
Message-----<br>
<b><span style="font-weight: bold;">From:</span></b>
<a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces@lists.nsrca.org">nsrca-discussion-bounces@lists.nsrca.org</a>
[<a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces@lists.nsrca.org">mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces@lists.nsrca.org</a>] <b><span
style="font-weight: bold;">On Behalf Of </span></b>Richard Lewis<br>
<b><span style="font-weight: bold;">Sent:</span></b> Friday, May
08, 2009 4:38 PM<br>
<b><span style="font-weight: bold;">To:</span></b> <st1:PersonName
w:st="on">General pattern discussion</st1:PersonName><br>
<b><span style="font-weight: bold;">Subject:</span></b> Re:
[NSRCA-discussion] Advancement System</span></font><font color="black"><span
style="color: black;"><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left: 0.5in;"><font
color="black" face="Times New Roman" size="3"><span
style="font-size: 12pt; color: black;"> <o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left: 0.5in;"><font
color="black" face="Times New Roman" size="3"><span
style="font-size: 12pt; color: black;">There is a provision in the
current rule set to accomodate these situations, see 8.1.2 of the
competition regulations....<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left: 0.5in;"><font
color="black" face="Times New Roman" size="3"><span
style="font-size: 12pt; color: black;"> <o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left: 0.5in;"><font
color="black" face="Times New Roman" size="3"><span
style="font-size: 12pt; color: black;">Richard<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left: 0.5in;"><font
color="black" face="Times New Roman" size="3"><span
style="font-size: 12pt; color: black;"> <o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<div>
<div style="margin-left: 0.5in;">
<div class="MsoNormal" style="text-align: center;" align="center"><font
color="black" face="Tahoma" size="2"><span
style="font-size: 10pt; color: black; font-family: Tahoma;">
<hr align="center" size="1" width="100%"> </span></font></div>
</div>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom: 12pt; margin-left: 0.5in; margin-right: 0in;"><b><font
color="black" face="Tahoma" size="2"><span
style="font-weight: bold; font-size: 10pt; color: black; font-family: Tahoma;">From:</span></font></b><font
color="black" face="Tahoma" size="2"><span
style="font-size: 10pt; color: black; font-family: Tahoma;">
<a class="moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" href="mailto:jeffghughes@comcast.net">"jeffghughes@comcast.net"</a> <a class="moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" href="mailto:jeffghughes@comcast.net"><jeffghughes@comcast.net></a><br>
<b><span style="font-weight: bold;">To:</span></b> <st1:PersonName
w:st="on">General pattern discussion</st1:PersonName>
<a class="moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" href="mailto:nsrca-discussion@lists.nsrca.org"><nsrca-discussion@lists.nsrca.org></a><br>
<b><span style="font-weight: bold;">Sent:</span></b> Friday, May
8, 2009 3:30:24 PM<br>
<b><span style="font-weight: bold;">Subject:</span></b> Re:
[NSRCA-discussion] Advancement System</span></font><font color="black"><span
style="color: black;"><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<div>
<p style="margin-left: 0.5in;"><font color="black" face="Arial"
size="3"><span
style="font-size: 12pt; color: black; font-family: Arial;">Bob,</span></font><font
color="black"><span style="color: black;"><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p style="margin-left: 0.5in;"><font color="black" face="Arial"
size="3"><span
style="font-size: 12pt; color: black; font-family: Arial;">I
understand completely, I moved up to advanced, then my daughter got
sick and I've been to one contest in 4 years. My flying has regressed,
and my confidence along with it. </span></font><font color="black"><span
style="color: black;"><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p style="margin-left: 0.5in;"><font color="black" face="Arial"
size="3"><span
style="font-size: 12pt; color: black; font-family: Arial;">Jeff</span></font><font
color="black"><span style="color: black;"><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p
style="margin-bottom: 12pt; margin-left: 0.5in; margin-right: 0in;"><font
color="black" face="Arial" size="3"><span
style="font-size: 12pt; color: black; font-family: Arial;"><br>
----- Original Message -----<br>
From: "Mark Atwood" <a class="moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" href="mailto:atwoodm@paragon-inc.com"><atwoodm@paragon-inc.com></a><br>
To: "<st1:PersonName w:st="on">General pattern discussion</st1:PersonName>"
<a class="moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" href="mailto:nsrca-discussion@lists.nsrca.org"><nsrca-discussion@lists.nsrca.org></a><br>
Sent: Friday, May 8, 2009 2:52:19 PM GMT -05:00 US/Canada Eastern<br>
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Advancement System</span></font><font
color="black"><span style="color: black;"><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left: 0.5in;"><font
color="#1f497d" face="Calibri" size="2"><span
style="font-size: 11pt; color: rgb(31, 73, 125); font-family: Calibri;">I
know you’re joking some Bob, but I think you’re actually a great
example of someone that was able to fly a lot, and progressed nicely
through the system, but then when you got to Masters…a time when you
really need to practice even more to be competitive, your job suddenly
changed, home life became more complex, and you’re lucky to fly 10
practice flights a year outside of contests. Your experience and
skill would allow you to be competitive in Advanced, without dominating
and likely have a lot more fun being a spoiler to that crowd, rather
than trying to fly masters without hardly even knowing the pattern.</span></font><font
color="black"><span style="color: black;"><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left: 0.5in;"><font
color="black" face="Times New Roman" size="3"><span
style="font-size: 12pt; color: black;"> <o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left: 0.5in;"><font
color="#1f497d" face="Calibri" size="2"><span
style="font-size: 11pt; color: rgb(31, 73, 125); font-family: Calibri;">You’re
the perfect candidate for someone that should be able to choose where
they fly (which pattern) and have the most enjoyment. </span></font><font
color="black"><span style="color: black;"><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left: 0.5in;"><font
color="black" face="Times New Roman" size="3"><span
style="font-size: 12pt; color: black;"> <o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
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<div
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left: 0.5in;"><b><font
color="black" face="Tahoma" size="2"><span
style="font-weight: bold; font-size: 10pt; color: black; font-family: Tahoma;">From:</span></font></b><font
color="black" face="Tahoma" size="2"><span
style="font-size: 10pt; color: black; font-family: Tahoma;">
<a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces@lists.nsrca.org">nsrca-discussion-bounces@lists.nsrca.org</a>
[<a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces@lists.nsrca.org">mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces@lists.nsrca.org</a>] <b><span
style="font-weight: bold;">On Behalf Of </span></b>Bob Kane<br>
<b><span style="font-weight: bold;">Sent:</span></b> Friday, May
08, 2009 2:40 PM<br>
<b><span style="font-weight: bold;">To:</span></b> <st1:PersonName
w:st="on">General pattern discussion</st1:PersonName><br>
<b><span style="font-weight: bold;">Subject:</span></b> Re:
[NSRCA-discussion] Advancement System</span></font><font color="black"><span
style="color: black;"><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
</div>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left: 0.5in;"><font
color="black" face="Times New Roman" size="3"><span
style="font-size: 12pt; color: black;"> <o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left: 0.5in;"><font
color="black" face="Times New Roman" size="3"><span
style="font-size: 12pt; color: black;">Hey, I resemble that remark . .
. . . . .<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left: 0.5in;"><font
color="black" face="Times New Roman" size="3"><span
style="font-size: 12pt; color: black;"> <o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left: 0.5in;"><font
color="black" face="Times New Roman" size="3"><span
style="font-size: 12pt; color: black;">Bob Kane<br>
<a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:getterflash@yahoo.com">getterflash@yahoo.com</a><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left: 0.5in;"><font
color="black" face="Times New Roman" size="3"><span
style="font-size: 12pt; color: black;"> <o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left: 0.5in;"><font
color="black" face="Times New Roman" size="3"><span
style="font-size: 12pt; color: black;"> <o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<div>
<div style="margin-left: 0.5in;">
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color="black" face="Tahoma" size="2"><span
style="font-size: 10pt; color: black; font-family: Tahoma;">
<hr align="center" size="1" width="100%"> </span></font></div>
</div>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom: 12pt; margin-left: 0.5in; margin-right: 0in;"><b><font
color="black" face="Tahoma" size="2"><span
style="font-weight: bold; font-size: 10pt; color: black; font-family: Tahoma;">From:</span></font></b><font
color="black" face="Tahoma" size="2"><span
style="font-size: 10pt; color: black; font-family: Tahoma;">
<a class="moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" href="mailto:jeffghughes@comcast.net">"jeffghughes@comcast.net"</a> <a class="moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" href="mailto:jeffghughes@comcast.net"><jeffghughes@comcast.net></a><br>
<b><span style="font-weight: bold;">To:</span></b> <st1:PersonName
w:st="on">General pattern discussion</st1:PersonName>
<a class="moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" href="mailto:nsrca-discussion@lists.nsrca.org"><nsrca-discussion@lists.nsrca.org></a><br>
<b><span style="font-weight: bold;">Cc:</span></b> Don Ramsey
<a class="moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" href="mailto:don.ramsey@suddenlink.net"><don.ramsey@suddenlink.net></a><br>
<b><span style="font-weight: bold;">Sent:</span></b> Friday, May
8, 2009 12:17:58 PM<br>
<b><span style="font-weight: bold;">Subject:</span></b> Re:
[NSRCA-discussion] Advancement System</span></font><font color="black"><span
style="color: black;"><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<div>
<p style="margin-left: 0.5in;"><font color="black" face="Arial"
size="3"><span
style="font-size: 12pt; color: black; font-family: Arial;">This is all
pretty interesting. From my perspective, I didn't really care who beat
me when I was in intermediate or advanced. I just knew that I was
seeing the skill level necessary to win. While it's nice to win a
trophy in the lower classes, I understood I wasn't competing against
the best pilots anyway. From what I've seen there is a huge variation
of talent within a class anyway. I've seen Masters pilots fly that
wouldn't win in advanced if they bumped back down (maybe not even in
intermediate). People move up for all kinds of reasons unrelated to
skill level. It's also interesting that we talk about using each class
to improve our flying until we get to Masters, then it appears nobody
wants to improve to FAI. </span></font><font color="black"><span
style="color: black;"><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p style="margin-left: 0.5in;"><font color="black"
face="Times New Roman" size="3"><span
style="font-size: 12pt; color: black;"> <o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p style="margin-left: 0.5in;"><font color="black"
face="Times New Roman" size="3"><span
style="font-size: 12pt; color: black;"> <o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
</div>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left: 0.5in;"><font
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style="font-size: 12pt; color: black;"> <o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
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