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<DIV><FONT face=Calibri>Dave, I can see your point here but IMAC does it... and
they are growing right??? So aresti would not be a factor in their
decision, we can still write the schedules out but draing them in aresti is
not a bad idea.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Calibri>Chuck Hochhalter</FONT></DIV>
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt Tahoma">
<DIV><BR></DIV>
<DIV style="BACKGROUND: #f5f5f5">
<DIV style="font-color: black"><B>From:</B> <A title=burtona@atmc.net
href="mailto:burtona@atmc.net">Dave Burton</A> </DIV>
<DIV><B>Sent:</B> Monday, May 11, 2009 10:20 AM</DIV>
<DIV><B>To:</B> <A title=jpavlick@idseng.com
href="mailto:jpavlick@idseng.com">jpavlick@idseng.com</A> ; <A
title=nsrca-discussion@lists.nsrca.org
href="mailto:nsrca-discussion@lists.nsrca.org">'General pattern discussion'</A>
</DIV>
<DIV><B>Subject:</B> Re: [NSRCA-discussion] WRAP UP -
Advancement</DIV></DIV></DIV>
<DIV><BR></DIV>
<DIV class=Section1>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN
style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Calibri','sans-serif'; COLOR: #1f497d; FONT-SIZE: 11pt">See
what happens when you hand an Aresti sportsman schedule to a potential new
pattern flyer and say: Just fly this!<o:p></o:p></SPAN></P>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN
style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Calibri','sans-serif'; COLOR: #1f497d; FONT-SIZE: 11pt">Or
a new pattern flyer goes to the NSRCA web site wanting to see what he has to fly
to compete.<o:p></o:p></SPAN></P>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN
style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Calibri','sans-serif'; COLOR: #1f497d; FONT-SIZE: 11pt">While
it may be the universal aerobatic language, why make it so that it has to
be “translated” (KISS)<o:p></o:p></SPAN></P>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN
style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Calibri','sans-serif'; COLOR: #1f497d; FONT-SIZE: 11pt"><o:p> </o:p></SPAN></P>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN
style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Calibri','sans-serif'; COLOR: #1f497d; FONT-SIZE: 11pt">Dave
Burton<o:p></o:p></SPAN></P>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN
style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Calibri','sans-serif'; COLOR: #1f497d; FONT-SIZE: 11pt"><o:p> </o:p></SPAN></P>
<DIV
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<P class=MsoNormal><B><SPAN
style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Tahoma','sans-serif'; FONT-SIZE: 10pt">From:</SPAN></B><SPAN
style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Tahoma','sans-serif'; FONT-SIZE: 10pt"> <A
href="mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces@lists.nsrca.org">nsrca-discussion-bounces@lists.nsrca.org</A>
[mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces@lists.nsrca.org] <B>On Behalf Of </B>John
Pavlick<BR><B>Sent:</B> Monday, May 11, 2009 11:08 AM<BR><B>To:</B> General
pattern discussion<BR><B>Subject:</B> Re: [NSRCA-discussion] WRAP UP -
Advancement<o:p></o:p></SPAN></P></DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></P>
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<DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal>Don't worry - you can make up your own call cards that
are "translated" to English. Aresti is the universal language of Precision
Aerobatics. It would be nice to see all of our schedules presented this
way. I'm tired of explaining what a stall-turn is to people who fly
full-scale or IMAC. :)<o:p></o:p></P></DIV>
<DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal> <o:p></o:p></P></DIV>
<DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal>John Pavlick<BR><BR>--- On <B>Mon, 5/11/09, Dave Burton
<I><burtona@atmc.net></I></B> wrote:<o:p></o:p></P></DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE
style="BORDER-BOTTOM: medium none; BORDER-LEFT: #1010ff 1.5pt solid; PADDING-BOTTOM: 0in; MARGIN-TOP: 5pt; PADDING-LEFT: 4pt; PADDING-RIGHT: 0in; MARGIN-BOTTOM: 5pt; MARGIN-LEFT: 3.75pt; BORDER-TOP: medium none; BORDER-RIGHT: medium none; PADDING-TOP: 0in">
<P style="MARGIN-BOTTOM: 12pt" class=MsoNormal>From: Dave Burton
<burtona@atmc.net><BR>Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] WRAP UP -
Advancement<BR>To: "'General pattern discussion'"
<nsrca-discussion@lists.nsrca.org><BR>Date: Monday, May 11, 2009,
2:57 PM<o:p></o:p></P>
<DIV id=yiv1059660969>
<DIV>
<P style="mso-margin-top-alt: auto; mso-margin-bottom-alt: auto"
class=MsoNormal><SPAN
style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Calibri','sans-serif'; COLOR: #1f497d; FONT-SIZE: 11pt">Please,
no!</SPAN><o:p></o:p></P></DIV>
<P style="mso-margin-top-alt: auto; mso-margin-bottom-alt: auto"
class=MsoNormal><SPAN
style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Calibri','sans-serif'; COLOR: #1f497d; FONT-SIZE: 11pt"> No
way I’m going to get my practice caller to learn Aresti! It’s hard
enough to get her to go out and read the English descriptions from the
lounge chair.</SPAN><o:p></o:p></P></DIV>
<P style="mso-margin-top-alt: auto; mso-margin-bottom-alt: auto"
class=MsoNormal><SPAN
style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Calibri','sans-serif'; COLOR: #1f497d; FONT-SIZE: 11pt"> </SPAN><o:p></o:p></P></BLOCKQUOTE>
<DIV>
<DIV
style="BORDER-BOTTOM: medium none; BORDER-LEFT: medium none; PADDING-BOTTOM: 0in; PADDING-LEFT: 0in; PADDING-RIGHT: 0in; BORDER-TOP: #b5c4df 1pt solid; BORDER-RIGHT: medium none; PADDING-TOP: 3pt">
<P style="mso-margin-top-alt: auto; mso-margin-bottom-alt: auto"
class=MsoNormal><B><SPAN
style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Tahoma','sans-serif'; FONT-SIZE: 10pt">From:</SPAN></B><SPAN
style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Tahoma','sans-serif'; FONT-SIZE: 10pt">
nsrca-discussion-bounces@lists.nsrca.org
[mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces@lists.nsrca.org] <B>On Behalf Of
</B>Archie Stafford<BR><B>Sent:</B> Monday, May 11, 2009 10:53
AM<BR><B>To:</B> 'General pattern discussion'<BR><B>Subject:</B> Re:
[NSRCA-discussion] WRAP UP - Advancement</SPAN><o:p></o:p></P></DIV></DIV>
<P style="mso-margin-top-alt: auto; mso-margin-bottom-alt: auto"
class=MsoNormal> <o:p></o:p></P>
<P style="mso-margin-top-alt: auto; mso-margin-bottom-alt: auto"
class=MsoNormal><SPAN
style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Calibri','sans-serif'; COLOR: #1f497d; FONT-SIZE: 11pt">One
thing that might be beneficial for number 2 is the use of Aresti for
sequences. I HATED it when I first started playing with it in IMAC,
but now that I understand it, it does make life pretty easy. There
are also a couple of websites that really break it down and make it easy
to understand. </SPAN><o:p></o:p></P>
<P style="mso-margin-top-alt: auto; mso-margin-bottom-alt: auto"
class=MsoNormal><SPAN
style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Calibri','sans-serif'; COLOR: #1f497d; FONT-SIZE: 11pt"> </SPAN><o:p></o:p></P>
<P style="mso-margin-top-alt: auto; mso-margin-bottom-alt: auto"
class=MsoNormal><SPAN
style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Calibri','sans-serif'; COLOR: #1f497d; FONT-SIZE: 11pt">Arch</SPAN><o:p></o:p></P>
<P style="mso-margin-top-alt: auto; mso-margin-bottom-alt: auto"
class=MsoNormal><SPAN
style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Calibri','sans-serif'; COLOR: #1f497d; FONT-SIZE: 11pt"> </SPAN><o:p></o:p></P>
<DIV>
<DIV
style="BORDER-BOTTOM: medium none; BORDER-LEFT: medium none; PADDING-BOTTOM: 0in; PADDING-LEFT: 0in; PADDING-RIGHT: 0in; BORDER-TOP: #b5c4df 1pt solid; BORDER-RIGHT: medium none; PADDING-TOP: 3pt">
<P style="mso-margin-top-alt: auto; mso-margin-bottom-alt: auto"
class=MsoNormal><B><SPAN
style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Tahoma','sans-serif'; FONT-SIZE: 10pt">From:</SPAN></B><SPAN
style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Tahoma','sans-serif'; FONT-SIZE: 10pt">
nsrca-discussion-bounces@lists.nsrca.org
[mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces@lists.nsrca.org] <B>On Behalf Of </B>Mark
Hunt<BR><B>Sent:</B> Monday, May 11, 2009 9:43 AM<BR><B>To:</B> General
pattern discussion<BR><B>Subject:</B> Re: [NSRCA-discussion] WRAP UP -
Advancement</SPAN><o:p></o:p></P></DIV></DIV>
<P style="mso-margin-top-alt: auto; mso-margin-bottom-alt: auto"
class=MsoNormal> <o:p></o:p></P>
<DIV>
<DIV>
<P style="mso-margin-top-alt: auto; mso-margin-bottom-alt: auto"
class=MsoNormal>I would support 1 and 2.<o:p></o:p></P></DIV></DIV>
<DIV>
<P style="mso-margin-top-alt: auto; mso-margin-bottom-alt: auto"
class=MsoNormal> <o:p></o:p></P></DIV>
<DIV>
<P style="mso-margin-top-alt: auto; mso-margin-bottom-alt: auto"
class=MsoNormal>2 will require a good bit of effort in writing
downgrade descriptions that cover all basic manuever concepts that could
be put into NSRCA written sequences. The IMAC rules are written and
illustrated very well in this regard. Might be easier if a few
people worked together on this to split up some of the
work.<o:p></o:p></P></DIV>
<DIV>
<P style="mso-margin-top-alt: auto; mso-margin-bottom-alt: auto"
class=MsoNormal> <o:p></o:p></P></DIV>
<DIV>
<P style="mso-margin-top-alt: auto; mso-margin-bottom-alt: auto"
class=MsoNormal>-mark<o:p></o:p></P></DIV>
<DIV>
<P style="mso-margin-top-alt: auto; mso-margin-bottom-alt: auto"
class=MsoNormal> <o:p></o:p></P></DIV>
<DIV>
<DIV style="TEXT-ALIGN: center" class=MsoNormal align=center><SPAN
style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Tahoma','sans-serif'; FONT-SIZE: 10pt">
<HR align=center SIZE=1 width="100%">
</SPAN></DIV>
<P style="mso-margin-top-alt: auto; mso-margin-bottom-alt: auto"
class=MsoNormal><B><SPAN
style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Tahoma','sans-serif'; FONT-SIZE: 10pt">From:</SPAN></B><SPAN
style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Tahoma','sans-serif'; FONT-SIZE: 10pt"> J N Hiller
<jnhiller@earthlink.net><BR><B>To:</B> General pattern discussion
<nsrca-discussion@lists.nsrca.org><BR><B>Sent:</B> Monday, May 11,
2009 9:08:49 AM<BR><B>Subject:</B> Re: [NSRCA-discussion] WRAP UP -
Advancement<BR></SPAN><SPAN
style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Arial','sans-serif'; FONT-SIZE: 10pt"><BR>OK Mark I
will hold.<BR>I agree with and would support both 1&2.<BR>Jim
Hiller<BR><BR>-----Original Message-----<BR>From: <A
href="mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces@lists.nsrca.org"
target=_blank><U><SPAN
style="COLOR: blue">nsrca-discussion-bounces@lists.nsrca.org</SPAN></U></A><BR>[mailto:<A
href="mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces@lists.nsrca.org"
target=_blank><U><SPAN
style="COLOR: blue">nsrca-discussion-bounces@lists.nsrca.org</SPAN></U></A>]On
Behalf Of Atwood, Mark<BR>Sent: Monday, May 11, 2009 6:36 AM<BR>To:
General pattern discussion<BR>Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] WRAP UP -
Advancement<BR><BR>Not that the debate on 2 vs 3 rolls isn't fascinating,
but....<BR><BR>Can we wrap up the original discussion regarding
advancement?<BR><BR>I heard a semi consensus on 2 things that I think we
should aggressively<BR>pursue<BR><BR>1) Removing any forced advancement
rules (possibly changing to a guideline,<BR>or possibly eliminating the
language altogether)<BR> Reason: Forced
advancement simply harms more people than it helps.<BR>Very few if any
abuse the system, while many have been compelled to fly in a<BR>class
inappropriate to their skills or comfort, discouraging some,
causing<BR>others to quit, and overall reducing the level of enjoyment
contrary to what<BR>the rule was intended for. A guideline would
still be valuable to help<BR>those who are trying to make the advancement
decision, however that may be<BR>better placed outside of the Rule Book
(such as the NSRCA web site)<BR><BR>2) Removal of the pattern schedules
from the rule book, in an effort to<BR>simplify the change
procedure.<BR> Reason: In conjunction with the
change above, virtually every class<BR>is a "destination" class for some,
and as such, some variety is desirable at<BR>every level.
De-coupling the sequences from the rule book would allow<BR>greater ease
in changing the schedules, and greater ease of change also<BR>reduces the
critical nature of "getting it right" the first time, which<BR>would allow
for more creativity and
experiementation.<BR><BR><BR><BR>Thoughts??<BR><BR>How do we get this
done...<BR><BR>-Mark<BR>_______________________________________________<BR>NSRCA-discussion
mailing list<BR><A href="mailto:NSRCA-discussion@lists.nsrca.org"
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style="COLOR: blue">http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion</SPAN></U></A></SPAN><o:p></o:p></P></DIV><PRE>_______________________________________________<o:p></o:p></PRE><PRE>NSRCA-discussion mailing list<o:p></o:p></PRE><PRE>NSRCA-discussion@lists.nsrca.org<o:p></o:p></PRE><PRE>http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion<o:p></o:p></PRE></TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE>
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