<!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.0 Transitional//EN">
<HTML><HEAD>
<META http-equiv=Content-Type content="text/html; charset=iso-8859-1">
<META content="MSHTML 6.00.6001.18099" name=GENERATOR></HEAD>
<BODY bgColor=#ffffff>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>What I've done is have two batteries and two
regulators, one regulator at 5.7 volts and one at 5.3 volts (or any voltage
lower). On the higher voltage regulator I connect my primary battery, say a 2000
mah five cell or Lithium. On the lower voltage regulator I connect the
smallest battery I can buy, say a 750 Lipo that weighs less than
an ounce. </FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>Since the larger battery is hooked to a
regulator that outputs a higher voltage all drain comes from the primary
battery and nothing is sucked from the smaller battery unless the
main battery drops below 5.3 volts (or fails). </FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>This works great and when recharging the smaller
battery seldom needs any recharge at all.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>I spoke to Jim Oddino before doing this and
confirmed that the lower voltage battery would not suck voltage from the larger
battery since it was going through his regulator (Jaccio
regulator).</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>This setup has worked great for me and even saved a
plane when my primary battery came loose and disconnected once!</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>Keith Black</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT> </DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE
style="PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px">
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial">----- Original Message ----- </DIV>
<DIV
style="BACKGROUND: #e4e4e4; FONT: 10pt arial; font-color: black"><B>From:</B>
<A title=vicenterc@comcast.net
href="mailto:vicenterc@comcast.net">vicenterc@comcast.net</A> </DIV>
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>To:</B> <A
title=nsrca-discussion@lists.nsrca.org
href="mailto:nsrca-discussion@lists.nsrca.org">General pattern discussion</A>
; <A title=nsrca-discussion@lists.nsrca.org
href="mailto:nsrca-discussion@lists.nsrca.org">'General pattern
discussion'</A> </DIV>
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Sent:</B> Wednesday, September 03, 2008 11:23
AM</DIV>
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Subject:</B> Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Part
2-Its a miracle!!!</DIV>
<DIV><BR></DIV>
<DIV>Correct, I still use separate regulators for each battery.
This system is smart that isolates the bad battery if something goes
wrong. In this way, the bad battery won't drain the good
one. The LED in the receiver tells you if the battery has been
isolated. </DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV class=signature id=signature>--<BR>Vicente "Vince" Bortone</DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE
style="PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; BORDER-LEFT: #1010ff 2px solid">--------------
Original message -------------- <BR>From: "Jay Marshall" <<A
href="mailto:lightfoot@sc.rr.com">lightfoot@sc.rr.com</A>> <BR>
<META content="Microsoft Word 10 (filtered)" name=Generator>
<STYLE>@font-face {
font-family: Tahoma;
}
@font-face {
font-family: Brush Script MT;
}
@font-face {
font-family: sans-serif;
}
@page Section1 {size: 8.5in 11.0in; margin: .2in .25in 33.1pt .25in; }
P.MsoNormal {
FONT-SIZE: 12pt; MARGIN: 0in 0in 0pt; FONT-FAMILY: "Times New Roman"
}
LI.MsoNormal {
FONT-SIZE: 12pt; MARGIN: 0in 0in 0pt; FONT-FAMILY: "Times New Roman"
}
DIV.MsoNormal {
FONT-SIZE: 12pt; MARGIN: 0in 0in 0pt; FONT-FAMILY: "Times New Roman"
}
A:link {
COLOR: blue; TEXT-DECORATION: underline
}
SPAN.MsoHyperlink {
COLOR: blue; TEXT-DECORATION: underline
}
A:visited {
COLOR: blue; TEXT-DECORATION: underline
}
SPAN.MsoHyperlinkFollowed {
COLOR: blue; TEXT-DECORATION: underline
}
P {
FONT-SIZE: 12pt; MARGIN-LEFT: 0in; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0in; FONT-FAMILY: "Times New Roman"
}
TT {
FONT-FAMILY: "Courier New"
}
SPAN.EmailStyle19 {
COLOR: navy; FONT-FAMILY: Arial
}
DIV.Section1 {
page: Section1
}
</STYLE>
<DIV class=Section1>
<P class=MsoNormal><FONT face=Arial color=navy size=2><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: navy; FONT-FAMILY: Arial">As I read the
literature, the dual battery setup is designed to provide a heavier buss for
more current. It does not solve the problem of a failed battery(s). This
could effectively add even more drain. The ideal setup still seems to be
dual battery packs with dual regulators, or some other means to isolate a
failed pack.</SPAN></FONT></P>
<P class=MsoNormal><FONT face=Arial color=navy size=2><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: navy; FONT-FAMILY: Arial"></SPAN></FONT> </P>
<DIV>
<P><B><I><FONT face="Brush Script MT" color=navy size=4><SPAN
style="FONT-WEIGHT: bold; FONT-SIZE: 13.5pt; COLOR: navy; FONT-STYLE: italic; FONT-FAMILY: 'Brush Script MT'">Jay
</SPAN></FONT></I></B><B><I><FONT face="Brush Script MT" color=navy
size=4><SPAN
style="FONT-WEIGHT: bold; FONT-SIZE: 13.5pt; COLOR: navy; FONT-STYLE: italic; FONT-FAMILY: 'Brush Script MT'">Marshall</SPAN></FONT></I></B><FONT
color=navy><SPAN style="COLOR: navy"> </SPAN></FONT></P></DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal style="MARGIN-LEFT: 0.5in"><FONT face=Tahoma size=2><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Tahoma">-----Original
Message-----<BR><B><SPAN style="FONT-WEIGHT: bold">From:</SPAN></B>
</SPAN></FONT><FONT face=Tahoma size=2><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Tahoma">nsrca-discussion-bounces@lists.nsrca.org</SPAN></FONT><FONT
face=Tahoma size=2><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Tahoma">
[mailto:</SPAN></FONT><FONT face=Tahoma size=2><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Tahoma">nsrca-discussion-bounces@lists.nsrca.org</SPAN></FONT><FONT
face=Tahoma size=2><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Tahoma">]
<B><SPAN style="FONT-WEIGHT: bold">On Behalf Of
</SPAN></B>vicenterc@comcast.net<BR><B><SPAN
style="FONT-WEIGHT: bold">Sent:</SPAN></B> Wednesday, September 03, 2008
11:44 AM<BR><B><SPAN style="FONT-WEIGHT: bold">To:</SPAN></B>
</SPAN></FONT><FONT face=Tahoma size=2><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Tahoma">General pattern d iscuss
ion</SPAN></FONT><FONT face=Tahoma size=2><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Tahoma"><BR><B><SPAN
style="FONT-WEIGHT: bold">Subject:</SPAN></B> Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Part
2-Its a miracle!!!</SPAN></FONT></P>
<P class=MsoNormal style="MARGIN-LEFT: 0.5in"><FONT face="Times New Roman"
size=3><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt"></SPAN></FONT> </P>
<DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal style="MARGIN-LEFT: 0.5in"><FONT face="Times New Roman"
size=3><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt">Gray,</SPAN></FONT></P></DIV>
<DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal style="MARGIN-LEFT: 0.5in"><FONT face="Times New Roman"
size=3><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt"></SPAN></FONT> </P></DIV>
<DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal style="MARGIN-LEFT: 0.5in"><FONT face="Times New Roman"
size=3><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt">Yes, high drain could have been the
problem. Since the plane is in good condition probably you can
check. I think you should consider using two batteries of your
preference. I starting to use the 9100 receiver that already has two
power inputs. Check details here:</SPAN></FONT></P></DIV>
<DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal style="MARGIN-LEFT: 0.5in"><FONT face="Times New Roman"
size=3><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt"></SPAN></FONT> </P></DIV>
<DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal style="MARGIN-LEFT: 0.5in"><FONT face="Times New Roman"
size=3><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt"><A
href="http://www.horizonhobby.com/Products/Default.aspx?ProdID=SPMAR9100">http://www.horizonhobby.com/Products/Default.aspx?ProdID=SPMAR9100</A></SPAN></FONT></P></DIV>
<DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal style="MARGIN-LEFT: 0.5in"><FONT face="Times New Roman"
size=3><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt"></SPAN></FONT> </P></DIV>
<DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal style="MARGIN-LEFT: 0.5in"><FONT face="Times New Roman"
size=3><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt"></SPAN></FONT> </P></DIV>
<DIV id=signature>
<P class=MsoNormal style="MARGIN-LEFT: 0.5in"><FONT face="Times New Roman"
size=3><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt">--<BR>Vicente "Vince"
Bortone</SPAN></FONT></P></DIV>
<DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal style="MARGIN-LEFT: 0.5in"><FONT face="Times New Roman"
size=3><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt"></SPAN></FONT> </P></DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE
style="BORDER-RIGHT: medium none; PADDING-RIGHT: 0in; BORDER-TOP: medium none; MARGIN-TOP: 5pt; PADDING-LEFT: 3pt; MARGIN-BOTTOM: 5pt; PADDING-BOTTOM: 0in; MARGIN-LEFT: 3pt; BORDER-LEFT: #1010ff 1.5pt solid; PADDING-TOP: 0in; BORDER-BOTTOM: medium none">
<P class=MsoNormal
style="MARGIN-BOTTOM: 12pt; MARGIN-LEFT: 0.5in; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0in"><FONT
face="Times New Roman" size=3><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt">--------------
Original message -------------- <BR>From: Gray E Fowler
<gfowler@raytheon.com> <BR><BR></SPAN></FONT><FONT face=sans-serif
size=2><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: sans-serif">Vicente</SPAN></FONT>
<BR><BR><FONT face=sans-serif size=2><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: sans-serif">The Robbe charger has a
setting for soft peak, which is to be used for NiMH. This is what I had. I
cycled twice before using this new battery..what I remember was getting
about 1300 Mah from this 1450 mah pack. I think there may be a "high
drain" problem on the plane in addition.</SPAN></FONT> <BR><FONT
face=sans-serif size=2><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: sans-serif"><BR><BR><BR>Gray
Fowler<BR>Senior Principal Chemical Engineer<BR>Radomes and Specialty
Apertures<BR>Technical Staff Composites Engineer
ing<BR>Raytheon</SPAN></FONT> <BR><BR></P>
<TABLE class=MsoNormalTable style="MARGIN-LEFT: 0.5in; WIDTH: 100%"
cellPadding=0 width="100%" border=0>
<TBODY>
<TR>
<TD
style="PADDING-RIGHT: 0.75pt; PADDING-LEFT: 0.75pt; PADDING-BOTTOM: 0.75pt; WIDTH: 40.08%; PADDING-TOP: 0.75pt"
vAlign=top width="40%">
<P class=MsoNormal><B><FONT face=sans-serif size=1><SPAN
style="FONT-WEIGHT: bold; FONT-SIZE: 7.5pt; FONT-FAMILY: sans-serif">vicenterc@comcast.net</SPAN></FONT></B><FONT
face=sans-serif size=1><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 7.5pt; FONT-FAMILY: sans-serif">
</SPAN></FONT><BR><FONT face=sans-serif size=1><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 7.5pt; FONT-FAMILY: sans-serif">Sent by:
nsrca-discussion-bounces@lists.nsrca.org</SPAN></FONT> </P>
<P><FONT face=sans-serif size=1><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 7.5pt; FONT-FAMILY: sans-serif">09/03/2008 09:42
AM</SPAN></FONT> </P>
<TABLE class=MsoNormalTable cellPadding=0 border=1>
<TBODY>
<TR>
<TD
style="PADDING-RIGHT: 0.75pt; PADDING-LEFT: 0.75pt; BACKGROUND: white; PADDING-BOTTOM: 0.75pt; PADDING-TOP: 0.75pt"
vAlign=top bgColor=white>
<P class=MsoNormal style="TEXT-ALIGN: center"
align=center><FONT face=sans-serif size=1><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 7.5pt; FONT-FAMILY: sans-serif">Please
respond to<BR>General pattern discussion
<nsrca-discussion@lists.nsrca.org></SPAN></FONT></P></TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE>
<P></P></TD>
<TD
style="PADDING-RIGHT: 0.75pt; PADDING-LEFT: 0.75pt; PADDING-BOTTOM: 0.75pt; WIDTH: 59.14%; PADDING-TOP: 0.75pt"
vAlign=top width="59%">
<TABLE class=MsoNormalTable style="WIDTH: 100%" cellPadding=0
width="100%" border=0>
<TBODY>
<TR>
<TD
style="PADDING-RIGHT: 0.75pt; PADDING-LEFT: 0.75pt; PADDING-BOTTOM: 0.75pt; PADDING-TOP: 0.75pt"
vAlign=top>
<P class=MsoNormal style="TEXT-ALIGN: right" align=right><FONT
face=sans-serif size=1><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 7.5pt; FONT-FAMILY: sans-serif">To</SPAN></FONT></P></TD>
<TD
style="PADDING-RIGHT: 0.75pt; PADDING-LEFT: 0.75pt; PADDING-BOTTOM: 0.75pt; PADDING-TOP: 0.75pt"
vAlign=top>
<P class=MsoNormal><FONT face=sans-serif size=1><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 7.5pt; FONT-FAMILY: sans-serif">General
pattern discussion
<nsrca-discussion@lists.nsrca.org></SPAN></FONT>
</P></TD></TR>
<TR>
<TD
style="PADDING-RIGHT: 0.75pt; PADDING-LEFT: 0.75pt; PADDING-BOTTOM: 0.75pt; PADDING-TOP: 0.75pt"
vAlign=top>
<P class=MsoNormal style="TEXT-ALIGN: right" align=right><FONT
face=sans-serif size=1><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 7.5pt; FONT-FAMILY: sans-serif">cc</SPAN></FONT></P></TD>
<TD
style="PADDING-RIGHT: 0.75pt; PADDING-LEFT: 0.75pt; PADDING-BOTTOM: 0.75pt; PADDING-TOP: 0.75pt"
vAlign=top>
<P class=MsoNormal><FONT face="Times New Roman" size=3><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt"></SPAN></FONT> </P></TD></TR>
<TR>
<TD
style="PADDING-RIGHT: 0.75pt; PADDING-LEFT: 0.75pt; PADDING-BOTTOM: 0.75pt; PADDING-TOP: 0.75pt"
vAlign=top>
<P class=MsoNormal style="TEXT-ALIGN: right" align=right><FONT
face=sans-serif size=1><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 7.5pt; FONT-FAMILY: sans-serif">Subject</SPAN></FONT></P></TD>
<TD
style="PADDING-RIGHT: 0.75pt; PADDING-LEFT: 0.75pt; PADDING-BOTTOM: 0.75pt; PADDING-TOP: 0.75pt"
vAlign=top>
<P class=MsoNormal><FONT face=sans-serif size=1><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 7.5pt; FONT-FAMILY: sans-serif">Re:
[NSRCA-discussion] Part 2-Its a
miracle!!!</SPAN></FONT></P></TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE>
<P class=MsoNormal><FONT face="Times New Roman" size=3><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt"></SPAN></FONT> </P>
<TABLE class=MsoNormalTable cellPadding=0 border=0>
<TBODY>
<TR>
<TD
style="PADDING-RIGHT: 0.75pt; PADDING-LEFT: 0.75pt; PADDING-BOTTOM: 0.75pt; PADDING-TOP: 0.75pt"
vAlign=top>
<P class=MsoNormal><FONT face="Times New Roman" size=3><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt"></SPAN></FONT> </P></TD>
<TD
style="PADDING-RIGHT: 0.75pt; PADDING-LEFT: 0.75pt; PADDING-BOTTOM: 0.75pt; PADDING-TOP: 0.75pt"
vAlign=top>
<P class=MsoNormal><FONT face="Times New Roman" size=3><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt"></SPAN></FONT> </P></TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE>
<P class=MsoNormal></P></TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE>
<P class=MsoNormal
style="MARGIN-BOTTOM: 12pt; MARGIN-LEFT: 0.5in; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0in"><FONT
face="Times New Roman" size=3><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt"><BR><BR><BR>Gray, <BR> <BR>Yes, that is good
news. Clearly the battery was the problem. I had heard that
some chargers get a "false peak" and stop charging when the battery is not
really fully charged. I wonder if this was the problem. <BR>
<BR>--<BR>Vicente "Vince" Bortone <BR> <BR>-------------- Original
message -------------- <BR>From: Gray E Fowler
<gfowler@raytheon.com> <BR></SPAN></FONT><FONT face=sans-serif
size=2><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: sans-serif"><BR>Lance
and I went out and found the plane right where it was supposed to be. Do
not know how I missed it the first day, so I am going to say that someone
went into the woods Monday night and moved it .</SPAN></FONT> <BR><FONT
face=sans-serif size=2><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: sans-serif"><BR>What is
amazing in the minimal damage the plane has considering it went straig ht
in from 200 feet, albeit at a slow speed. The horrible reverbed cracking
sound Keith and I heard was the carbon fiber wing tube breaking. Both
wings have limited leading edge damage, the stab has a golfball size divot
on the R LE, an easy to repair crack in the fuse (buckle failure) behind
one wing and a little nose ring area damage. That is all.</SPAN></FONT>
<BR><FONT face=sans-serif size=2><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: sans-serif"><BR>The battery pack had
broken the 3/8 bals a stic ks on impact that were bonded into place (my
battery packs are not "removeable" per say) and the battey pack was on the
ground at the nose of the plane. The plane was standing vertical on
the undamage spinner being held up by the tree branches. Once we got
home we hooked eveything up and of course it all worked fine. Knowing that
the battery pack essentially had the same charge as when the plane went
in, Lance took the battery pack home for diagnostics. Using the
Robbe charger he cycled the1450 mah &nbs p;pack down....it read 80
mah. He then charged it and it read 1000 mah. Anthony described a NiMH
"brown out" and that is starting to make alot of sense. 6 volt
packNiMH , drained does not just die like a 4.8 volt NiCad. Also an
important note is I now think the plane was going in and out of PCM lock.
When I tested PCM lock the throttle did cut, but not to low idle. It cut
to about 20% throttle (programming error), hence the pulsing of the
throttle that I exper ienced. If this diagnosis is correct then it is a
testament to using PCM as I was able to fly the plane for 45 seconds
before impact...had I been closer when the problem started I may have even
been able to score a "10" FAI landing (not really-I would have gone for
the grass instead of the runway).</SPAN></FONT> <BR><FONT face=sans-serif
size=2><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: sans-serif"><B R>Anyw ay
I am sending the entire radio off for examination, try to see why the
battery was so low, and fix the plane for spring.</SPAN></FONT>
<BR><BR><FO size="2" NT fac e="sans-serif">Thanks for the ideas <BR><FONT
face=sans-serif size=2><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: sans-serif"><BR></SPAN></FONT><BR><FONT
face=sans-serif size=2><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: sans-serif"><BR><BR><BR><BR>Gray
Fowler<BR>Senior Principal Chemical Engineer<BR>Radomes and Specialty
Apertures<BR>Technical Staff Composites
Engineering<BR>Raytheon</SPAN></FONT> <TT><FONT face="Courier New"
size=2><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt">_______________________________________________</SPAN></FONT></TT><FONT
face="Courier New" size=2><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Courier New'"><BR><TT><FONT
face="Courier New">NSRCA-discussion mailing list</FONT></TT><BR><TT><FONT
face="Courier New">NSRCA-discussion@lists.nsrca.org</FONT></TT><BR><TT><FONT
face="Courier New">http://lists.nsrca.o rg/mai
lman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion</FONT></TT></SPAN></FONT>
<BR><BR></P></BLOCKQUOTE></DIV></BLOCKQUOTE>
<P>
<HR>
<P></P>_______________________________________________<BR>NSRCA-discussion
mailing
list<BR>NSRCA-discussion@lists.nsrca.org<BR>http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion</B></BLOCKQUOTE></BODY></HTML>