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<DIV><SPAN class=190122400-17062008><FONT face=Arial color=#0000ff>and a really
fast one at that</FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<P><FONT
size=2>Regards,<BR>Jason<BR>www.jasonshulman.com<BR>www.shulmanaviation.com<BR>www.composite-arf.com</FONT>
</P>
<BLOCKQUOTE>
<DIV class=OutlookMessageHeader dir=ltr align=left><FONT face=Tahoma
size=2>-----Original Message-----<BR><B>From:</B>
nsrca-discussion-bounces@lists.nsrca.org
[mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces@lists.nsrca.org]<B>On Behalf Of </B>Mike
Hester<BR><B>Sent:</B> Monday, June 16, 2008 8:20 PM<BR><B>To:</B> General
pattern discussion<BR><B>Subject:</B> Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Snap entry in
FAI<BR><BR></FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>Yep....there's a 1 1/2 snap from KE in
F-09.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>Really cool looking manuever too.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>-Mike</FONT></DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE
style="PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px">
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial">----- Original Message ----- </DIV>
<DIV
style="BACKGROUND: #e4e4e4; FONT: 10pt arial; font-color: black"><B>From:</B>
<A title=vicenterc@comcast.net
href="mailto:vicenterc@comcast.net">vicenterc@comcast.net</A> </DIV>
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>To:</B> <A
title=nsrca-discussion@lists.nsrca.org
href="mailto:nsrca-discussion@lists.nsrca.org">General pattern
discussion</A> </DIV>
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Sent:</B> Monday, June 16, 2008 7:55
PM</DIV>
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Subject:</B> Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Snap
entry in FAI</DIV>
<DIV><BR></DIV>
<DIV>Do we have KE snaps in the catalog? I never seen it.</DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV class=signature id=signature>--<BR>Vicente "Vince" Bortone</DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE
style="PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; BORDER-LEFT: #1010ff 2px solid">--------------
Original message -------------- <BR>From: "george w. kennie" <<A
href="mailto:geobet@gis.net">geobet@gis.net</A>> <BR>
<META content="MSHTML 6.00.6000.16674" name=GENERATOR>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>John,</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>We often think that the wing is producing
zero effect when we go K.E., but the AOA of the wing is still positive to
the datum line and as long as we have forward movement of the airframe a
force will be generated away from the gear. That's why you have down
elevator mixed to rudder in order to nullify this effect. I hear many
people state that in K.E. the wing is not producing any lift, but it sure
is reacting to the airflow and decalage.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>For the K.E. Snap the airframe still needs to
be in a stalled condition and it's still elevator that's necessary to
produce the effect of the stall. Due to the visual perspective the
increased AOA required to stall the wing will be undectable to the pilot
as well as the judges because in K.E. the pitch-up will take place
horizontally instead of vertically.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>But then this is just my understanding and
I'm sure there are others who will straighten me out.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>G.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2> </FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT> </DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE
style="PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px">
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial">----- Original Message ----- </DIV>
<DIV
style="BACKGROUND: #e4e4e4; FONT: 10pt arial; font-color: black"><B>From:</B>
<A title=jpavlick@idseng.com href="mailto:jpavlick@idseng.com">John
Pavlick</A> </DIV>
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>To:</B> <A
title=nsrca-discussion@lists.nsrca.org
href="mailto:nsrca-discussion@lists.nsrca.org">General pattern
discussion</A> </DIV>
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Sent:</B> Monday, June 16, 2008 4:57
PM</DIV>
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Subject:</B> Re: [NSRCA-discussion]
Snap entry in FAI</DIV>
<DIV><BR></DIV>
<DIV>Which axis do you need to show a "break" in for a knife edge snap?
The wing isn't really "lifting", the fuse is.</DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV>John Pavlick<BR><BR><B><I>"george w. kennie" <<A
href="mailto:geobet@gis.net">geobet@gis.net</A>></I></B> wrote:</DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE class=replbq
style="PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; BORDER-LEFT: #1010ff 2px solid">
<META content="MSHTML 6.00.6000.16674" name=GENERATOR>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>My lip is becoming too painful from
biting it, so I think I'm going to stick my nose in here
somewhere.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>I think I'm with Jon on this
one.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>My logic, however flawed, tells me that
if I am flying my plane straight and level and I input rudder, no
matter how much, there is no way that this input will induce a stall
to the airframe. Therefore, it seems to me, that the necessary force
required to stall the main lifting surface must come from the
elevator. It would further seem to me that this input must, by it's
very nature produce a pitching attitude to the fuselage whether
positive or negative. So I would have to conclude that the attitude
"break" referenced by the rule can only refer to a "pitch" break and
would be impossible to confuse with an attitude change induced by the
rudder seeing that the required result is to stall the main
wing.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>And yes Jon, I agree that it would be
necessary to lead with the elevator in order to bring about this
attitude change before rotation is started, however miniscule the
interval might be.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>Of course I'm still open to hearing other
interpretations and their validations as these observations are
strictly opinions.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>G.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT> </DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE
style="PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px">
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial">----- Original Message ----- </DIV>
<DIV
style="BACKGROUND: #e4e4e4; FONT: 10pt arial; font-color: black"><B>From:</B>
<A title=jonlowe@aol.com href="mailto:jonlowe@aol.com">Jon Lowe</A>
</DIV>
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>To:</B> <A
title=nsrca-discussion@lists.nsrca.org
href="mailto:nsrca-discussion@lists.nsrca.org">nsrca-discussion@lists.nsrca.org</A>
</DIV>
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Sent:</B> Monday, June 16, 2008
2:10 PM</DIV>
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Subject:</B> Re: [NSRCA-discussion]
Snap entry in FAI</DIV>
<DIV><BR></DIV>Jim,<BR><BR>I have no clue how you think all three
axes can be initiated at the same time.
You keep forgetting the part of the RULE, quoted
verbatim below, that says the "fuselage break and
separation from the flight path" must happen "BEFORE THE ROTATION IS
STARTED". I'm NOT equating fueselage break to pitch break, it
could break in pitch and/or yaw, if it doesn't start rotation
at the same time. If you initiate all three axis at the same
time, rotation WILL start at the same instant, and that is
specifically NOT permitted. READ THE RULE! The
judge MUST determine if the fuselage broke and separated from the
flight path first, BEFORE the rotation started. If it
didn't, he MUST severely downgrade.<BR><BR><BR>
<DIV style="CLEAR: both">Jon Lowe</DIV><BR><BR>-----Original
Message-----<BR>From: Woodward, Jim (US SSA)
<jim.woodward@baesystems.com><BR>To: General pattern
discussion <nsrca-discussion@lists.nsrca.org><BR>Sent: Mon, 16
Jun 2008 12:37 pm<BR>Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Snap entry in
FAI<BR><BR>
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<DIV class=Section1>
<DIV class=MsoNormal><FONT face=Arial color=navy size=2><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: navy; FONT-FAMILY: Arial">Jon,</SPAN></FONT></DIV>
<DIV class=MsoNormal><FONT face=Arial color=navy size=2><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: navy; FONT-FAMILY: Arial"></SPAN></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV class=MsoNormal><FONT face=Arial color=navy size=2><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: navy; FONT-FAMILY: Arial">I’m
shocked - you are totally wrong here. Do not equate
“fuselage” to “pitch” in the reading of this
definition. As a judge you should NOT apply a
“pitch-assessment” pass/fail criteria to judging FAI snap
rolls. It is completely rejected. The plane and
therefore “fuselage” must autorotate about the flight axis,
which means that the nose and tail of the plane will move in a
conical fashion. The pilot can initiate with all 3 axis at one
time. </SPAN></FONT></DIV>
<DIV class=MsoNormal><FONT face=Arial color=navy size=2><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: navy; FONT-FAMILY: Arial"></SPAN></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV class=MsoNormal><FONT face=Arial color=navy size=2><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: navy; FONT-FAMILY: Arial">It is the
responsibility of the judge to determine if autorotation occurred,
and not determine how or in what order the pilot did it.
</SPAN></FONT></DIV>
<DIV class=MsoNormal><FONT face=Arial color=navy size=2><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: navy; FONT-FAMILY: Arial"></SPAN></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV>
<DIV class=MsoNormal><FONT face=Arial color=navy size=2><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: navy; FONT-FAMILY: Arial">Thanks,</SPAN></FONT><FONT
color=navy><SPAN style="COLOR: navy"></SPAN></FONT></DIV>
<DIV class=MsoNormal><FONT face=Arial color=navy size=2><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: navy; FONT-FAMILY: Arial">Jim</SPAN></FONT><FONT
color=navy><SPAN style="COLOR: navy"></SPAN></FONT></DIV></DIV>
<DIV>
<DIV class=MsoNormal style="TEXT-ALIGN: center" align=center><FONT
face="Times New Roman" size=3><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt">
<HR align=center width="100%" SIZE=2>
</SPAN></FONT></DIV>
<DIV class=MsoNormal><B><FONT face=Tahoma size=2><SPAN
style="FONT-WEIGHT: bold; FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Tahoma">From:</SPAN></FONT></B><FONT
face=Tahoma size=2><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Tahoma"> <A
href="mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces@lists.nsrca.org">nsrca-discussion-bounces@lists.nsrca.org</A>
[<A
href="mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces@lists.nsrca.org?">mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces@lists.nsrca.org</A>]
<B><SPAN style="FONT-WEIGHT: bold">On Behalf Of </SPAN></B>Jon
Lowe<BR><B><SPAN style="FONT-WEIGHT: bold">Sent:</SPAN></B> Monday,
June 16, 2008 1:21 PM<BR><B><SPAN
style="FONT-WEIGHT: bold">To:</SPAN></B> <A
href="mailto:nsrca-discussion@lists.nsrca.org">nsrca-discussion@lists.nsrca.org</A><BR><B><SPAN
style="FONT-WEIGHT: bold">Subject:</SPAN></B> Re: [NSRCA-discussion]
Snap entry in FAI</SPAN></FONT></DIV></DIV>
<DIV class=MsoNormal><FONT face="Times New Roman" size=3><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt"></SPAN></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV class=MsoNormal style="MARGIN-BOTTOM: 12pt"><FONT
face="Times New Roman" size=3><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt">You are
correct, as long as there is no roll induced at the same
instant. I overlooked that possibility. Not sure how
rudder alone will induce the "supposed to be in a stalled condition"
though!! There are many attitudes (e.g. 45 down on
center) where a judge could not likely see a rudder
departure alone first, and thus conclude that departure
did not occur before the roll departure started. And a
judge might also not see a pitch departure first on a end
box upline snap, but he could see rudder first. It is VERY
clear that simultaneous roll with either or both of the
other axes departures is NOT allowed as others have
tried to state here. I did say that pitch and yaw
departure could happen simutaneously, in my original post, as long
as roll doesn't occur at the same t ime.</SPAN></FONT></DIV>
<DIV>
<DIV class=MsoNormal><FONT face="Times New Roman" size=3><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt">Jon Lowe</SPAN></FONT></DIV></DIV>
<DIV class=MsoNormal style="MARGIN-BOTTOM: 12pt"><FONT
face="Times New Roman" size=3><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt"><BR><BR>-----Original Message-----<BR>From:
JShulman <<A
href="mailto:jshulman@cfl.rr.com">jshulman@cfl.rr.com</A>><BR>To:
General pattern discussion <<A
href="mailto:nsrca-discussion@lists.nsrca.org">nsrca-discussion@lists.nsrca.org</A>><BR>Sent:
Mon, 16 Jun 2008 11:22 am<BR>Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Snap
entry in FAI</SPAN></FONT></DIV>
<DIV id=AOLMsgPart_3_02b65284-83ea-4950-beb7-d8726e751af5>
<DIV>
<DIV class=MsoNormal><FONT face=Arial color=blue size=3><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt; COLOR: blue; FONT-FAMILY: Arial">Jon,</SPAN></FONT></DIV></DIV>
<DIV>
<DIV class=MsoNormal><FONT face="Times New Roman" size=3><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt"></SPAN></FONT> </DIV></DIV>
<DIV>
<DIV class=MsoNormal><FONT face=Arial color=blue size=3><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt; COLOR: blue; FONT-FAMILY: Arial">I don't see
where it says pitch break? Rudder first will show attitude break and
separation from the flight path. So if one uses rudder and elevator
first this is also correct.</SPAN></FONT></DIV></DIV>
<DIV>
<DIV class=MsoNormal><FONT face="Times New Roman" size=3><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt"></SPAN></FONT> </DIV></DIV>
<DIV>
<DIV class=MsoNormal><FONT face="Times New Roman" size=2><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt">Regards,<BR>Jason<BR><A
href="http://www.jasonshulman.com/"
target=_blank>www.jasonshulman.com</A><BR><A
href="http://www.shulmanaviation.com/"
target=_blank>www.shulmanaviation.com</A><BR><A
href="http://www.composite-arf.com/"
target=_blank>www.composite-arf.com</A></SPAN></FONT> </DIV></DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE
style="MARGIN-TOP: 5pt; MARGIN-BOTTOM: 5pt; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0in">
<DIV class=MsoNormal style="MARGIN-BOTTOM: 12pt"><FONT face=Tahoma
size=2><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Tahoma">-----Original
Message-----<BR><B><SPAN
style="FONT-WEIGHT: bold">From:</SPAN></B> <A
href="mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces@lists.nsrca.org">nsrca-discussion-bounces@lists.nsrca.org</A>
[<A
href="mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces@lists.nsrca.org?">mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces@lists.nsrca.org</A>]<B><SPAN
style="FONT-WEIGHT: bold">On Behalf Of </SPAN></B>Jon
Lowe<BR><B><SPAN style="FONT-WEIGHT: bold">Sent:</SPAN></B>
Monday, June 16, 2008 12:11 PM<BR><B><SPAN
style="FONT-WEIGHT: bold">To:</SPAN></B> <A
href="mailto:nsrca-discussion@lists.nsrca.org">nsrca-discussion@lists.nsrca.org</A><BR><B><SPAN
style="FONT-WEIGHT: bold">Subject:</SPAN></B> Re:
[NSRCA-discussion] Snap entry in FAI</SPAN></FONT></DIV>
<DIV class=MsoNormal style="MARGIN-BOTTOM: 12pt"><FONT
face="Times New Roman" size=3><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt">I
suggest people re-read the definition ofsnap-rolls from the
FAI sporting code. I did a few minutes ago. Here it
is:</SPAN></FONT><FONT face=Arial size=2><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Arial"></SPAN></FONT></DIV>
<DIV class=MsoNormal><FONT face=Arial size=2><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Arial">"5B.7.5. <B><SPAN
style="FONT-WEIGHT: bold">SNAP-ROLLS</SPAN></B></SPAN></FONT></DIV>
<DIV class=MsoNormal><FONT face=Arial size=2><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Arial">A snap-roll (or flick
roll/rudder roll) is a rapid autorotative roll where the model
aircraft is in a stalled</SPAN></FONT></DIV>
<DIV class=MsoNormal><FONT face=Arial size=2><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Arial">attitude, with a
continuous high angle of attack</SPAN></FONT></DIV>
<DIV class=MsoNormal><FONT face=Arial size=2><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Arial">Snap-rolls have the
same judging criteria as axial rolls as far as start and stop of
the rotation, and</SPAN></FONT></DIV>
<DIV class=MsoNormal><FONT face=Arial size=2><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Arial">constant flight path
through the manoeuvre is concerned.</SPAN></FONT></DIV>
<DIV class=MsoNormal><FONT face=Arial size=2><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Arial">At the start of a
snap-roll, the fuselage attitude must show a definite break and
separation from the</SPAN></FONT></DIV>
<DIV class=MsoNormal><FONT face=Arial size=2><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Arial">flight path, before
the rotation is started, since the model aircraft is supposed to
be in a stalled</SPAN></FONT></DIV>
<DIV class=MsoNormal><FONT face=Arial size=2><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Arial">condition throughout
the manoeuvre, If the stall/break does not occur and the model
aircraft barrelrolls</SPAN></FONT></DIV>
<DIV class=MsoNormal><FONT face=Arial size=2><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Arial">around, the manoeuvre
must be severely downgraded (more than 5 points). Similarly,
axial</SPAN></FONT></DIV>
<DIV class=MsoNormal><FONT face=Arial size=2><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Arial">rolls disguised as
snap-rolls must be severely downgraded (more than 5
points).</SPAN></FONT></DIV>
<DIV class=MsoNormal><FONT face=Arial size=2><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Arial">Snap-rolls can be
flown both positive and negative, and the same criteria apply. The
attitude</SPAN></FONT></DIV>
<DIV class=MsoNormal><FONT face=Arial size=2><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Arial">(positive or negative)
is at the competitor’s discretion. If the model aircraft returns
to an unstalled</SPAN></FONT></DIV>
<DIV class=MsoNormal><FONT face=Arial size=2><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Arial">condition during the
snap-roll, the manoeuvre is severely downgraded using the 1
point/15 degree</SPAN></FONT></DIV>
<DIV class=MsoNormal><FONT face=Arial size=2><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Arial">rule."</SPAN></FONT></DIV>
<DIV class=MsoNormal style="MARGIN-BOTTOM: 12pt"><FONT
face="Times New Roman" size=3><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt"><BR>Note that "the fuselage attitude must
show a definite break and separation from the flight path, before
the rotation is started..." That means that
simultaneous pitch and rotation is specifically NOT
permitted. I would interpret it as meaning that pitch and
yaw could theoretically happen simultaneously, as long as no roll
is involved. Sorry Matt, the rules as written do NOT allow
actuation in all three axes simultaneously. The rule also
states that a constant flight path has to be
maintained.<BR><BR>Let's face it, the only way to prevent severe
downgrading from EVERY judge, not just some judges, is to have a
pitch break first. Takes any question
away.</SPAN></FONT></DIV>
<DIV>
<DIV class=MsoNormal><FONT face="Times New Roman" size=3><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt">Jon Lowe</SPAN></FONT></DIV></DIV>
<DIV class=MsoNormal style="MARGIN-BOTTOM: 12pt"><FONT
face="Times New Roman" size=3><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt"><BR><BR>-----Original
Message-----<BR>From: <A
href="mailto:rcmaster199@aol.com">rcmaster199@aol.com</A><BR>To:
<A
href="mailto:nsrca-discussion@lists.nsrca.org">nsrca-discussion@lists.nsrca.org</A><BR>Sent:
Mon, 16 Jun 2008 10:46 am<BR>Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Snap
entry in FAI</SPAN></FONT></DIV>
<DIV id=AOLMsgPart_0_f4e18038-9d63-45d9-87c7-a93410402f63>
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"Flick" and a "Snap" roll are the same roll in full scale
aerobatics parlance and reference material. <BR> <BR>Do
these mean the same thing in model aerobatics? In my view, they
do <BR> <BR>The latest FAI regs allow actuation of the
three main axes simultaneously...that is, the regs don't
specifically differentiate "Pitch Break" from other deviations. I
don't think they specifically require that the model must rotate
about it's flight path either, I don't believe (.....plane must
rotate in a conical fashion about the fight axis....). The model
would probably present the best if that's done, so pilots may want
to consider that when executing the
maneuver. <BR> <BR>In my take, a rapid Pitch is desired
to preload the wing. Contrary to popular belief, both panels dot
not have to stall for a snap to occu r. Qui te the opposite. Upon
rudder deflection, the port panel will practically stall (lift
much much less than the other panel) but the starboard panel must
be lifting to create the autorotation. If both panels stall, the
model will fall out of the sky for a distance and a snap would not
occur at the correct moment in
time <BR> <BR>MattK <BR> <BR>-----Original
Message----- <BR>From: Woodward, Jim (US SSA) <<A
href="mailto:jim.woodward@baesystems.com">jim.woodward@baesystems.com</A>> <BR>To:
General pattern discussion <<A
href="mailto:nsrca-discussion@lists.nsrca.org">nsrca-discussion@lists.nsrca.org</A>> <BR>Sent:
Mon, 16 Jun 2008 8:47 am <BR>Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion]
Snap entry in FAI <BR> <BR>Guys, <BR> <BR>I
thought the FAI changes explicitly allowed flick rolls? The
rule <BR>reads, "... fuselage attitude must show a definite
break and separation <BR>from the flight
path." <BR> <BR>It doe s not say, "MUST SHOW PITCH
BREAK." Please DO NOT ERROUNIOUSLY <BR>APPLY A PASS/FAIL
MAJOR DEDUCTION initial assessment to the snap
roll. <BR>Watch the whole maneuver then render your
score. <BR> <BR>A break and separation from the flight
path simply means that the nose <BR>and tail of the plane
must rotate in a conical fashion about the fight <BR>axis.
Yaw, roll, and pitch can all break at the same moment if that
is <BR>how the pilot does it. <BR> <BR>Hey :) some
really handsome smart guy wrote some stuff at this
link <BR>below about snap rolls to help clarify how they are
done in IMAC. <BR> <BR><A
href="http://www.mini-iac.com/DesktopDefault.aspx?tabid=77"
target=_blank>http://www.mini-iac.com/DesktopDefault.aspx?tabid=77</A> <BR> <BR>thanks, <BR>Jim <BR> <BR> <BR>_______________________________________________ <BR>NSRCA-discussion
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