<!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.0 Transitional//EN">
<HTML><HEAD>
<META http-equiv=Content-Type content="text/html; charset=iso-8859-1">
<META content="MSHTML 6.00.6000.16608" name=GENERATOR>
<STYLE></STYLE>
</HEAD>
<BODY bgColor=#ffffff>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>John</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>Don't tell - I intended for that message to
be off line ! Using the snap button is an approach to determine what
is needed. After you can be a real hero <G> if you have the
need. Timing of the throws is a psycological need, not aerodynamic.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>I believe the full scale rules say you initiate all
axis simaltaneously. Now see, you've already made me misspell a word ( or
two
).
Nat</FONT></DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE
style="PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px">
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial">----- Original Message ----- </DIV>
<DIV
style="BACKGROUND: #e4e4e4; FONT: 10pt arial; font-color: black"><B>From:</B>
<A title=jpavlick@idseng.com href="mailto:jpavlick@idseng.com">John
Pavlick</A> </DIV>
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>To:</B> <A
title=nsrca-discussion@lists.f3a.us
href="mailto:nsrca-discussion@lists.f3a.us">NSRCA Mailing List</A> </DIV>
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Sent:</B> Saturday, March 22, 2008 5:34
PM</DIV>
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Subject:</B> Re: [NSRCA-discussion]
triangulation trimming</DIV>
<DIV><BR></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>Nat,</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2> You use the snap buttons? I'm shocked.
:)</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>John Pavlick<BR><A
href="http://www.idseng.com">http://www.idseng.com</A></FONT></DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE
style="PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px">
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial">----- Original Message ----- </DIV>
<DIV
style="BACKGROUND: #e4e4e4; FONT: 10pt arial; font-color: black"><B>From:</B>
<A title=natpenton@centurytel.net href="mailto:natpenton@centurytel.net">Nat
Penton</A> </DIV>
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>To:</B> <A
title=nsrca-discussion@lists.f3a.us
href="mailto:nsrca-discussion@lists.f3a.us">NSRCA Mailing List</A> </DIV>
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Sent:</B> Saturday, March 22, 2008 4:01
PM</DIV>
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Subject:</B> Re: [NSRCA-discussion]
triangulation trimming</DIV>
<DIV><BR></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>Cris</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>1. If there was a way I could get planform
dimensions ( wing and stab only), I could tell you where to put
the CG - and, we could eliminate that variable</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>2. Use the snap button until you determine how
to trim the snaps. THEN you can fly them. This CRAP about timing
controll inputs is BS, unnessary, and one of your problems</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>I say go back to 3/4 positive on the wing and
1/2 positive on the T/L. This should eliminate most of the KE pitch mix
and all of the downline
mix. </FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>Is the stab adjustable
?
Nat</FONT></DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE
style="PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px">
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial">----- Original Message ----- </DIV>
<DIV
style="BACKGROUND: #e4e4e4; FONT: 10pt arial; font-color: black"><B>From:</B>
<A title=homeremodeling2003@yahoo.com
href="mailto:homeremodeling2003@yahoo.com">krishlan fitzsimmons</A> </DIV>
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>To:</B> <A
title=nsrca-discussion@lists.f3a.us
href="mailto:nsrca-discussion@lists.f3a.us">nsrca-discussion@lists.f3a.us</A>
</DIV>
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Sent:</B> Friday, March 21, 2008 11:22
PM</DIV>
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Subject:</B> Re: [NSRCA-discussion]
triangulation trimming</DIV>
<DIV><BR></DIV>
<DIV>Ok, </DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV>Well, I did feel I was a little tail heavy after thinking, so I moved
my batteries to the forward position and went back to 1/2 degree
positive.. What a huge difference that made.. Line's are better than they
have ever been. I've always fought this plane in the wind, even on
horizontal straight flights.. Today, horizontal lines were hands off.. And
it was pretty windy.. Up lines were much easier to fly. Not sure if it
pulls to the canopy up or down as it was windy. But it held the track
better all the way around. The wind was straight down the runway, and the
plane held it's distance almost by itself. Very little heading corrections
were needed. Before, I've always seemed to be on the rudder.. Even without
wind. I actually left the field and said, dang, that's the best this plane
has ever flown.. Even told the wife!!<IMG
src="http://us.i1.yimg.com/us.yimg.com/i/mesg/tsmileys2/04.gif"></DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV>Snaps, well that's still the strange thing. Inverted snaps seem very
sluggish, like I break it with down ele, then throw in the aileron and
rudder, and you can see the break, then it starts to barrel, then it
speeds up and can over rotate a little ( I added more aileron throw, and
took out some elevator and rudder, seemed to help a little. Regular snaps
are lightning fast, but they stop when I let go of the sticks. They'd be
great if they weren't so fast. I usually use one dual rate switch which is
for low and high rate. Never needed anything different. I think I may need
to try an inverted snap dual rate and a regular snap dual rate on
different switches. That'll be a fun one to remember.. lol</DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV>Oh, it carries a little up trim in the ele's now. My knife
up elevator mix of 15% on both sides is still there, but the roll
coupling changed a little.</DIV>
<DIV>I kinda liked how the cg felt, I gave myself 5 percent more
down ele so my stick felt the same inverted. Still I think I'd like to try
it a little further forward, but I feel it would be a mistake. I didn't
change motor thrust yet as I wanted to see the difference of the cg and
incidence change first. I did feel I had too much positive in the wings
and that I was a little tailheavy.. That's why I said the honest setup of
the plane last time.</DIV>
<DIV>So now I am, 0 downthrust, 1/2 pos wings, 0 stab. But it needs a
little up trim. I liked the way it flew, and presented today (especially
in the wind). Just didn't care for the snaps. </DIV>
<DIV>More tomorrow night if I can get out after the easter egg hunt, or
Sunday after the race..</DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV>Any suggestions?</DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV>Thanks, </DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV>Chris<BR><BR><B><I>shinden1@cox.net</I></B> wrote:</DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE class=replbq
style="PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; BORDER-LEFT: #1010ff 2px solid">Chris
sorry I have not got back to you<BR>I see you have 3/4 deg pos in the
wings ,,thats too much! <BR>too much pos inc, will have the same feeling
and response as too much tail weight the rudder will make the nose pitch
down in both normal flying or knife ,,,and even vertical lines because
of the down elevator needed to trim the model<BR>go to 1/2 pos. on the
wings 1/2 deg down thrust ,,<BR>and then move the c/g around till the
left knife has no mix or very little is needed ,,and the inverted
elevator and rolls feel good <BR>every thing else will fall in place
<BR>any time you need up trim with left and right rudder input your tail
heavy ,,or you have too much pos. inc in the wing <BR>Bryan <BR><BR>----
krishlan fitzsimmons <HOMEREMODELING2003@YAHOO.COM>wrote: <BR>>
Bryan, <BR>> I was hopeful to hear back from you on this before I
made a change. No worries though, I know you are busy, and you've been a
great help with all of us.. <BR>> So if I go cg forward, I will need
less positive in the wings as I wil need up trim in the ele's, correct?
Or should I add 1/2 degree of down thrust? After seeing my uplines and
my horizontal lines, I don't think I need it. But, what do I know?
lol<BR>> I think the cg forward could help my snaps and my downlines.
I love the way it flys inverted and rolling right now, but I need to
change.. I'll try the cg forward and less positive. <BR>> <BR>>
C<BR>> <BR>> vicenterc@comcast.net wrote:<BR>> Chris,<BR>>
<BR>> Very good information. How much right thrust? I think you are
correct, move the CG a little more forward. It could help the snaps
also.<BR>> <BR>> --<BR>> Vicente "Vince" Bortone<BR>>
<BR>> -------------- Original message ----------------------<BR>>
From: krishlan fitzsimmons <BR>> > Ok Bryan, <BR>> >
<BR>> > Here's how I went out today and man was I suprised, 0
degree down thrust, 0 <BR>> > stab, 3/4 positive in the wing.. Cg
forward where Budd recommends. What a <BR>> > difference.. I had a
neutral elevator for the first time since I owned the plane <BR>>
> without adjusting things.. Uplines were good, downlines pulled to
the canopy <BR>> > still. Horizontal lines, the plane DID feel
more locked into the line.. It's <BR>> > never felt like that..
Mixing, well it still needed about 15% up mix in knifes, <BR>> >
down from 30% though. Inverted nearly hands off. 45 roll to inverted
slowly <BR>> > drops the nose. 45 downs are locked in. Snaps, well
they suck for some reason. w<BR>> > Not from this, but when I did
cg, and other changes before, I changed throws cuz <BR>> > the
snaps sucked. It took alot more down ele, and aileron for inverted
snaps.. <BR>> > And still, when I start the snap, it breaks, then
slowly gets into the snap, <BR>> > then speeds up too fast causing
an overrotation. Regular snaps are now too fast <BR>> > (easy to
cure though with a different dual rate<BR>> > setting). <BR>>
> I think my cg could go forward to help with the up ele needed in
knife, and <BR>> > also the pull to canopy on downlines maybe?? Or
should I play with the wing <BR>> > adjusters more?<BR>> >
<BR>> > Thanks, <BR>> > <BR>> > Chris<BR>> >
<BR>> > <BR>> > Nat Penton wrote:<BR>> > Wayne<BR>>
> You missed the seminar - that was the rest room .<BR>> >
----- Original Message ----- <BR>> > From: Wayne Galligan <BR>>
> To: NSRCA Mailing List <BR>> > Sent: Tuesday, March 18, 2008
10:21 AM<BR>> > Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] triangulation
trimming<BR>> > <BR>> > <BR>> > John Crapper was not
the original inventor of the toilet. However Thomas <BR>> >
Crapper was one of the people that was responsible for it popularity.
Not to <BR>> > sure where John L Crapper came from but the
original inventor was John <BR>> > Harington. So maybe that's how
the "John" and the "Crapper" have been come to <BR>> > be known
as.<BR>> > ----- Original Message ----- <BR>> > From: Wayne
Galligan <BR>> > To: NSRCA Mailing List <BR>> > Sent:
Tuesday, March 18, 2008 10:11 AM<BR>> > Subject: Re:
[NSRCA-discussion] triangulation trimming<BR>> > <BR>> >
<BR>> > Water Closet (WC) is a toilet that disposes of the waste
by using water to <BR>> > flush it through a drainpipe to another
location. Modern toilets incorporate an <BR>> > 'S' bend; this
'trap' creates a water seal which remains filled the 'S' bend <BR>>
> also provides siphon action which helps accelerate the flushing
process. Water <BR>> > filling up the bowl creates a high pressure
area which forces the water past the <BR>> > S bend. At the S bend
when water starts to move it creates a vacuum that pulls <BR>> >
the water and waste out of the toilet. When no more water is left then
the air <BR>> > stops the siphon or vacuum process. At that point
the water that is going into <BR>> > the bowl continues to fill up
the bowl to equalize the bowl and the S bend. This <BR>> > ends
the cycle of one flush. Since there were no rooms designated for toilets
<BR>> > or crappers as they were called (named after John L
Crapper, inventor of the <BR>> > flush toilet) the term Water
Closet was coined as homes that had the out houses <BR>> > moved
indoors were usually located in<BR>> > closets in the
home.<BR>> > <BR>> > Flush away............<BR>> >
----- Original Message ----- <BR>> > From: Karl G. Mueller
<BR>> > To: NSRCA Mailing List <BR>> > Sent: Tuesday, March
18, 2008 10:45 AM<BR>> > Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion]
triangulation trimming<BR>> > <BR>> > <BR>> >
Vicente,<BR>> > <BR>> > "WC" actually is the short form of
"Water Closet".<BR>> > That's what the early Toilets were
called.<BR>> > <BR>> > Karl G. Mueller<BR>> >
kgamueller@rogers.com<BR>> > <BR>> > ----- Original Message
----- <BR>> > From: vicenterc@comcast.net <BR>> > To:
adriancwong@earthlink.net ; NSRCA Mailing List <BR>> > Sent:
Monday, March 17, 2008 10:04 PM<BR>> > Subject: Re:
[NSRCA-discussion] triangulation trimming<BR>> > <BR>> >
<BR>> > WC = toilet. I wonder how many went and check. <BR>>
> <BR>> > --<BR>> > Vicente "Vince" Bortone<BR>> >
<BR>> > -------------- Original message -------------- <BR>>
> From: adriancwong@earthlink.net <BR>> > BODY { FONT-SIZE:
9pt; COLOR: black; FONT-FAMILY: <BR>> >
Geneva,Arial,Helvetica,sans-serif; BACKGROUND-COLOR: #ffffff } <BR>>
> body{font-family: <BR>> >
Geneva,Arial,Helvetica,sans-serif;font-size:9pt;background-color:
#ffffff;color: <BR>> > black;} "WC", huh? I haven't heard that
word since I've moved back from Hong <BR>> > Kong in the early
90's. <BR>> > <BR>> > May be I should try the knife edge on
a vertical down line, instead of doing it <BR>> > horizontally?
<BR>> > <BR>> > <BR>> > -----Original Message-----
<BR>> > From: vicenterc@comcast.net <BR>> > Sent: Mar 17,
2008 7:00 PM <BR>> > To: adriancwong@earthlink.net, NSRCA Mailing
List <BR>> > Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] triangulation
trimming <BR>> > <BR>> > That is called Coriolis
accerelation. That is why the water closets flush to <BR>> > the
right in the North hemisphere and to the left in the South hemisphere
<BR>> > (looking the water closet from above). If going down
straight you are close to <BR>> > the ecuator. If this do not
happens as described the water closet needs to be <BR>> > trimmed.
<BR>> > <BR>> > --<BR>> > Vicente "Vince"
Bortone<BR>> > <BR>> > -------------- Original message
-------------- <BR>> > From: adriancwong@earthlink.net <BR>>
> I think Bryan is hiding in his wind tunnel trying to duplicate the
same <BR>> > condition.<BR>> > <BR>> > I don't think
it was my digits. It's probably between the earth's gravitational
<BR>> > pull and soething in the northern hemisphere. I bet the
plane will do the exact <BR>> > opposite if I fly it in Australia
... .-)<BR>> > <BR>> > <BR>> > -----Original
Message----- <BR>> > From: Derek Koopowitz <BR>> > Sent: Mar
17, 2008 3:36 PM <BR>> > To: NSRCA Mailing List <BR>> >
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] triangulation trimming <BR>> >
<BR>> > I think he wishes it was his thumbs... :)<BR>> >
<BR>> > The push to the belly was more than the pull to the
canopy... the pull was <BR>> > very slight.<BR>> > <BR>>
> <BR>> > On Mon, Mar 17, 2008 at 3:24 PM, krishlan fitzsimmons
<BR>> > wrote:<BR>> > I was going to tell Adrian his thumbs
cause this.. <BR>> > Just kidding of course Adrian..<BR>> >
<BR>> > C <BR>> > <BR>> > Nat Penton wrote:<BR>>
> <BR>> > Where is Bryan when you need him <BR>> >
<BR>> > ----- Original Message ----- <BR>> > From: <BR>>
> To: "NSRCA Mailing List" <BR>> > Sent: Sunday, March 16, 2008
10:17 PM<BR>> > Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] triangulation
trimming<BR>> > <BR>> > <BR>> > > Bryan,<BR>>
> ><BR>> > > What cause the plane to pull to the belly on
one rudder, and to the canopy <BR>> > > on the other rudder
during knife edge.<BR>> > ><BR>> > > Thx,<BR>> >
><BR>> > > Adrian<BR>> > ><BR>> > >
-----Original Message-----<BR>> > >>From:
shinden1@cox.net<BR>> > >>Sent: Mar 16, 2008 7:17 PM<BR>>
> >>To: NSRCA Mailing List <BR>> > <BR>> >
>>Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] triangulation trimming<BR>>
> >><BR>> > >>Lance you need to find out exactly
where the wing inc . is.<BR>> > >>I think if you move your
c/g back a little it will help take some of the <BR>> > >>up
trim out But you prob need more pos inc, in the wing so we need to know
<BR>> > >>where you are at right now to determine exactly
where to go<BR>> > >>Bryan<BR>> > <BR>> >
<BR>> > >>---- Lance Van Nostrand wrote:<BR>> >
>>> Bryan,<BR>> > >>><BR>> > >>>
The discussion list moves faster than I can try this stuff out. Too bad
<BR>> > >>> I<BR>> > >>> have to
work...<BR>> > >>><BR>> > >>> I first only
moved my CG forward significantly and have improved overall<BR>> >
>>> tracking. It was windy Saturday and wind penetration were
good. <BR>> > >>> Bryan's<BR>> > >>>
suggestion was correct on CG movement to make this improvement.
However<BR>> > >>> with the forward CG (and resultant
uptrim) it pulls to the canopy <BR>> > >>>
slightly<BR>> > >>> on downlines. At this point I noticed
that during inverted flight, <BR>> > >>> rudder<BR>>
> >>> input caused a pull to the belly (plane rose). This
was weird. I then<BR>> > >>> raised the incidence 2 turns
and it fixed the inverted flight problem <BR>> > >>> but
it<BR>> > >>> seemed to make the canopy pul! l worse .
Interestingly, KE flight was not<BR>> > >>> noticeably
affected.<BR>> > >>><BR>> > >>> The other
affect is that inverted 45 downlines drop toward earth faster <BR>>
> >>> than<BR>> > >>> upright 45s (which
track nicely). Before this change, both 45s were <BR>> >
>>> fine.<BR>> > >>><BR>> > >>>
Is this the expectation?<BR>> > >>><BR>> >
>>> --Lance<BR>> > >>><BR>> > >>>
_______________________________________________<BR>> >
>>> NSRCA-discussion mailing list<BR>> > >>>
NSRCA-discussion@lists.nsrca.org<BR>> > >>>
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion<BR>> >
>>_______________________________________________<BR>> >
>>NSRCA-discussion mailing list<BR>> > >>NSRCA-disc!
ussion@ l ists.nsrca.org<BR>> >
>>http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion<BR>>
> ><BR>> > >
_______________________________________________<BR>> > >
NSRCA-discussion mailing list<BR>> > >
NSRCA-discussion@lists.nsrca.org<BR>> > >
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion<BR>> >
> <BR>> > <BR>> >
_______________________________________________<BR>> >
NSRCA-discussion mailing list<BR>> >
NSRCA-discussion@lists.nsrca.org<BR>> >
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion<BR>> >
<BR>> > <BR>> > <BR>> > <BR>> > <BR>> >
Chris <BR>> > <BR>> > <BR>> > <BR>> > <BR>>
> <BR>> > ---------------------------------<BR>> > Be a
better friend, newshound, and know-it-all with Yahoo! Mobile. Try it
now. <BR>> > <BR>> > <BR>> > <BR>> >
_______________________________________________<BR>> >
NSRCA-discussion mailing list<BR>> >
NSRCA-discussion@lists.nsrca.org<BR>> >
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion<BR>> >
<BR>> > <BR>> > <BR>> >
---------------------------------<BR>> > <BR>> >
_______________________________________________<BR>> >
NSRCA-discussion mailing list<BR>> >
NSRCA-discussion@lists.nsrca.org<BR>> >
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion<BR>> >
<BR>> > ---------------------------------<BR>> > <BR>>
> _______________________________________________<BR>> >
NSRCA-discussion mailing list<BR>> >
NSRCA-discussion@lists.nsrca.org<BR>> >
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion<BR>> >
<BR>> > ---------------------------------<BR>> > <BR>>
> _______________________________________________<BR>> >
NSRCA-discussion mailing list<BR>> >
NSRCA-discussion@lists.nsrca.org<BR>> >
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion<BR>> >
<BR>> > ---------------------------------<BR>> > <BR>>
> _______________________________________________<BR>> >
NSRCA-discussion mailing list<BR>> >
NSRCA-discussion@lists.nsrca.org<BR>> >
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion<BR>> >
_______________________________________________<BR>> >
NSRCA-discussion mailing list<BR>> >
NSRCA-discussion@lists.nsrca.org<BR>> >
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion<BR>> >
<BR>> > <BR>> > Chris <BR>> > <BR>> > <BR>>
> <BR>> > <BR>> > <BR>> >
---------------------------------<BR>> Looking for last minute
shopping deals? Find them fast with Yahoo! Search.<BR>> <BR>>
From: krishlan fitzsimmons <HOMEREMODELING2003@YAHOO.COM><BR>> To:
NSRCA Mailing List <NSRCA-DISCUSSION@LISTS.NSRCA.ORG><BR>> Subject:
Re: [NSRCA-discussion] triangulation trimming<BR>> Date: Tue, 18 Mar
2008 23:24:07 +0000<BR>> <BR>> Ok Bryan, <BR>> <BR>> Here's
how I went out today and man was I suprised, 0 degree down thrust, 0
stab, 3/4 positive in the wing.. Cg forward where Budd recommends. What
a difference.. I had a neutral elevator for the first time since I owned
the plane without adjusting things.. Uplines were good, downlines pulled
to the canopy still. Horizontal lines, the plane DID feel more locked
into the line.. It's never felt like that.. Mixing, well it still needed
about 15% up mix in knifes, down from 30% though. Inverted nearly hands
off. 45 roll to inverted slowly drops the nose. 45 downs are locked in.
Snaps, well they suck for some reason. Not from this, but when I did cg,
and other changes before, I changed throws cuz the snaps sucked. It took
alot more down ele, and aileron for inverted snaps.. And still, when I
start the snap, it breaks, then slowly gets into the snap, then speeds
up too fast causing an overrotation. Regular snaps are now too fast
(easy to cure though with a different dual rate<BR>> setting).
<BR>> I think my cg could go forward to help with the up ele needed
in knife, and also the pull to canopy on downlines maybe?? Or should I
play with the wing adjusters more?<BR>> <BR>> Thanks, <BR>>
<BR>> Chris<BR>> <BR>> <BR>> Nat Penton
<NATPENTON@CENTURYTEL.NET>wrote:<BR>> Wayne<BR>> You missed the
seminar - that was the rest room <G>.<BR>> ----- Original Message
----- <BR>> From: Wayne Galligan <BR>> To: NSRCA Mailing List
<BR>> Sent: Tuesday, March 18, 2008 10:21 AM<BR>> Subject: Re:
[NSRCA-discussion] triangulation trimming<BR>> <BR>> <BR>> John
Crapper was not the original inventor of the toilet. However Thomas
Crapper was one of the people that was responsible for it popularity.
Not to sure where John L Crapper came from but the original inventor was
John Harington. So maybe that's how the "John" and the "Crapper" have
been come to be known as.<BR>> ----- Original Message ----- <BR>>
From: Wayne Galligan <BR>> To: NSRCA Mailing List <BR>> Sent:
Tuesday, March 18, 2008 10:11 AM<BR>> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion]
triangulation trimming<BR>> <BR>> <BR>> Water Closet (WC) is a
toilet that disposes of the waste by using water to flush it through a
drainpipe to another location. Modern toilets incorporate an 'S' bend;
this 'trap' creates a water seal which remains filled the 'S' bend also
provides siphon action which helps accelerate the flushing process.
Water filling up the bowl creates a high pressure area which forces the
water past the S bend. At the S bend when water starts to move it
creates a vacuum that pulls the water and waste out of the toilet. When
no more water is left then the air stops the siphon or vacuum process.
At that point the water that is going into the bowl continues to fill up
the bowl to equalize the bowl and the S bend. This ends the cycle of one
flush. Since there were no rooms designated for toilets or crappers as
they were called (named after John L Crapper, inventor of the flush
toilet) the term Water Closet was coined as homes that had the out
houses moved indoors were usually located in<BR>> closets in the
home.<BR>> <BR>> Flush away............<BR>> ----- Original
Message ----- <BR>> From: Karl G. Mueller <BR>> To: NSRCA Mailing
List <BR>> Sent: Tuesday, March 18, 2008 10:45 AM<BR>> Subject:
Re: [NSRCA-discussion] triangulation trimming<BR>> <BR>> <BR>>
Vicente,<BR>> <BR>> "WC" actually is the short form of "Water
Closet".<BR>> That's what the early Toilets were called.<BR>>
<BR>> Karl G. Mueller<BR>> kgamueller@rogers.com<BR>> <BR>>
----- Original Message ----- <BR>> From: vicenterc@comcast.net
<BR>> To: adriancwong@earthlink.net ; NSRCA Mailing List <BR>>
Sent: Monday, March 17, 2008 10:04 PM<BR>> Subject: Re:
[NSRCA-discussion] triangulation trimming<BR>> <BR>> <BR>> WC =
toilet. I wonder how many went and check. <BR>> <BR>> --<BR>>
Vicente "Vince" Bortone<BR>> <BR>> -------------- Original message
-------------- <BR>> From: adriancwong@earthlink.net <BR>> BODY {
FONT-SIZE: 9pt; COLOR: black; FONT-FAMILY:
Geneva,Arial,Helvetica,sans-serif; BACKGROUND-COLOR: #ffffff }
body{font-family:
Geneva,Arial,Helvetica,sans-serif;font-size:9pt;background-color:
#ffffff;color: black;} "WC", huh? I haven't heard that word since I've
moved back from Hong Kong in the early 90's. <BR>> <BR>> May be I
should try the knife edge on a vertical down line, instead of doing it
horizontally? <BR>> <BR>> <BR>> -----Original Message-----
<BR>> From: vicenterc@comcast.net <BR>> Sent: Mar 17, 2008 7:00 PM
<BR>> To: adriancwong@earthlink.net, NSRCA Mailing List <BR>>
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] triangulation trimming <BR>> <BR>>
That is called Coriolis accerelation. That is why the water closets
flush to the right in the North hemisphere and to the left in the South
hemisphere (looking the water closet from above). If going down straight
you are close to the ecuator. If this do not happens as described the
water closet needs to be trimmed. <BR>> <BR>> --<BR>> Vicente
"Vince" Bortone<BR>> <BR>> -------------- Original message
-------------- <BR>> From: adriancwong@earthlink.net <BR>> I think
Bryan is hiding in his wind tunnel trying to duplicate the same
condition.<BR>> <BR>> I don't think it was my digits. It's
probably between the earth's gravitational pull and soething in the
northern hemisphere. I bet the plane will do the exact opposite if I fly
it in Australia ... .-)<BR>> <BR>> <BR>> -----Original
Message----- <BR>> From: Derek Koopowitz <BR>> Sent: Mar 17, 2008
3:36 PM <BR>> To: NSRCA Mailing List <BR>> Subject: Re:
[NSRCA-discussion] triangulation trimming <BR>> <BR>> I think he
wishes it was his thumbs... :)<BR>> <BR>> The push to the belly
was more than the pull to the canopy... the pull was very
slight.<BR>> <BR>> <BR>> On Mon, Mar 17, 2008 at 3:24 PM,
krishlan fitzsimmons <HOMEREMODELING2003@YAHOO.COM>wrote:<BR>> I was
going to tell Adrian his thumbs cause this.. <BR>> Just kidding of
course Adrian..<BR>> <BR>> C <BR>> <BR>> Nat Penton
<NATPENTON@CENTURYTEL.NET>wrote:<BR>> <BR>> Where is Bryan when
you need him <BR>> <BR>> ----- Original Message ----- <BR>>
From: <BR>> To: "NSRCA Mailing List" <BR>> Sent: Sunday, March 16,
2008 10:17 PM<BR>> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] triangulation
trimming<BR>> <BR>> <BR>> > Bryan,<BR>> ><BR>> >
What cause the plane to pull to the belly on one rudder, and to the
canopy <BR>> > on the other rudder during knife edge.<BR>>
><BR>> > Thx,<BR>> ><BR>> > Adrian<BR>>
><BR>> > -----Original Message-----<BR>> >>From:
shinden1@cox.net<BR>> >>Sent: Mar 16, 2008 7:17 PM<BR>>
>>To: NSRCA Mailing List <BR>> <BR>> >>Subject: Re:
[NSRCA-discussion] triangulation trimming<BR>> >><BR>>
>>Lance you need to find out exactly where the wing inc .
is.<BR>> >>I think if you move your c/g back a little it will
help take some of the <BR>> >>up trim out But you prob need
more pos inc, in the wing so we need to know <BR>> >>where you
are at right now to determine exactly where to go<BR>>
>>Bryan<BR>> <BR>> <BR>> >>---- Lance Van Nostrand
wrote:<BR>> >>> Bryan,<BR>> >>><BR>>
>>> The discussion list moves faster than I can try this stuff
out. Too bad <BR>> >>> I<BR>> >>> have to
work...<BR>> >>><BR>> >>> I first only moved my
CG forward significantly and have improved overall<BR>> >>>
tracking. It was windy Saturday and wind penetration were good. <BR>>
>>> Bryan's<BR>> >>> suggestion was correct on CG
movement to make this improvement. However<BR>> >>> with the
forward CG (and resultant uptrim) it pulls to the canopy <BR>>
>>> slightly<BR>> >>> on downlines. At this point I
noticed that during inverted flight, <BR>> >>>
rudder<BR>> >>> input caused a pull to the belly (plane
rose). This was weird. I then<BR>> >>> raised the incidence
2 turns and it fixed the inverted flight problem <BR>> >>>
but it<BR>> >>> seemed to make the canopy pul! l worse .
Interestingly, KE flight was not<BR>> >>> noticeably
affected.<BR>> >>><BR>> >>> The other affect is
that inverted 45 downlines drop toward earth faster <BR>>
>>> than<BR>> >>> upright 45s (which track nicely).
Before this change, both 45s were <BR><BR>=== message truncated
===</BLOCKQUOTE><BR><BR><BR>
<DIV><STRONG><EM><FONT face="comic sans ms" color=#0000bf size=3>Chris
</FONT></EM></STRONG></DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<P>
<HR SIZE=1>
Be a better friend, newshound, and know-it-all with Yahoo! Mobile. <A
href="http://us.rd.yahoo.com/evt=51733/*http://mobile.yahoo.com/;_ylt=Ahu06i62sR8HDtDypao8Wcj9tAcJ ">Try
it now.</A>
<P>
<HR>
<P></P>_______________________________________________<BR>NSRCA-discussion
mailing
list<BR>NSRCA-discussion@lists.nsrca.org<BR>http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion</BLOCKQUOTE>
<P>
<HR>
<P></P>_______________________________________________<BR>NSRCA-discussion
mailing
list<BR>NSRCA-discussion@lists.nsrca.org<BR>http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion</BLOCKQUOTE>
<P>
<HR>
<P></P>_______________________________________________<BR>NSRCA-discussion
mailing
list<BR>NSRCA-discussion@lists.nsrca.org<BR>http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion</BLOCKQUOTE></BODY></HTML>