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<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>K-factor multipliers are all about degree
of difficulty and we can probably agree that it can be difficult to do good
snaps every time. They can seem like a good thing from that
perspective. However, for some perspective I thought back to a similar
discussion and thought process in IMAC a few years back, where tail slides were
considered problematic (correctly so I think). That led us into a discussion
of elimination of the maneuver in sequences, restricting how it was used
(upwind only vs. downwind) and so forth. They were genuinely hard to fly
consistently and also somewhat hard to judge properly when presented certain
ways, such as when heading downwind and far away. That led to the idea of
reducing the K-factor when the tail slide was part of a figure, which also led
to us dreaming up other K-factor adjustments (rollers went higher if I remember
correctly). </span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'> </span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>Anyway the point is that we ended up tampering
with things that caused us to stray from compliance with the FAI catalogue,
which was a problem in the case of IMAC. Ultimately the k-factors got corrected
back and tail slides stopped appearing in sequences. Problem
solved! Should we eliminate snaps in Pattern? I don’t much
care for them, but I can live with them. I would like to at least keep their
use to an absolute minimum due to the inherent mismatch with precision flying
and performing and judging a true snap roll correctly. It’s based
entirely too much on the opinions of the observer. Because we’ve
just got little models whistling about and momentarily turning into a blur, I’m
afraid that it will always be thus. It’s very different than
watching a full scale airplane do a snap, where there is little doubt of
whether one was done for real or not. I don’t know if it would be
wrong to minimize the K-factor with snaps or not, but it leaves me wondering if
we’re solving the right problem?</span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'> </span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>Ed</span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'> </span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:.5in'><font size=2 face=Tahoma><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Tahoma'>-----Original Message-----<br>
<b><span style='font-weight:bold'>From:</span></b>
nsrca-discussion-bounces@lists.nsrca.org
[mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces@lists.nsrca.org] <b><span style='font-weight:
bold'>On Behalf Of </span></b>Lance Van Nostrand<br>
<b><span style='font-weight:bold'>Sent:</span></b> Sunday, October 21, 2007
8:51 AM<br>
<b><span style='font-weight:bold'>To:</span></b> NSRCA Mailing List<br>
<b><span style='font-weight:bold'>Subject:</span></b> Re: [NSRCA-discussion]
Judging-snap & spin</span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:.5in'><font size=3 face="Times New Roman"><span
style='font-size:12.0pt'> </span></font></p>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:.5in'><font size=2 color=black
face=Arial><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:black'>Ron,</span></font></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:.5in'><font size=2 color=black
face=Arial><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:black'>Your
idea caused me to stop and think. I'm wondering if it would really help,
however. If a pilot "in the hunt" screws the landing (K=1) he's
now "out of the hunt" on that round. Scores are often very
compressed at local contests so even if we reduce the KF, a bad score on any
manuver is usually enough to do mortal damage.</span></font></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:.5in'><font size=2 color=black
face=Arial><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:black'>--Lance</span></font></p>
</div>
<blockquote style='border:none;border-left:solid black 1.5pt;padding:0in 0in 0in 4.0pt;
margin-left:3.75pt;margin-top:5.0pt;margin-right:0in;margin-bottom:5.0pt'>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:.5in'><font size=2 color=black
face=Arial><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:black'>-----
Original Message ----- </span></font></p>
</div>
<div style='font-color:black'>
<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:.5in;background:#E4E4E4'><b><font size=2
color=black face=Arial><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;
color:black;font-weight:bold'>From:</span></font></b><font size=2 color=black
face=Arial><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:black'> <a
href="mailto:ronlock@comcast.net" title="ronlock@comcast.net">Ron Lockhart</a> </span></font></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:.5in'><b><font size=2 color=black
face=Arial><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:black;
font-weight:bold'>To:</span></font></b><font size=2 color=black face=Arial><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:black'> <a
href="mailto:nsrca-discussion@lists.nsrca.org"
title="nsrca-discussion@lists.nsrca.org">NSRCA Mailing List</a> </span></font></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:.5in'><b><font size=2 color=black
face=Arial><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:black;
font-weight:bold'>Sent:</span></font></b><font size=2 color=black face=Arial><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:black'> Saturday, October 20,
2007 11:34 AM</span></font></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:.5in'><b><font size=2 color=black
face=Arial><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:black;
font-weight:bold'>Subject:</span></font></b><font size=2 color=black
face=Arial><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:black'> Re:
[NSRCA-discussion] Judging-snap & spin</span></font></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:.5in'><font size=2 color=black
face=Arial><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:black'> </span></font></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:.5in'><font size=2 color=black
face=Arial><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:black'>Eliminating
is one solution - a price that comes with that solution is lack of practice
doing and judging snaps-</span></font></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:.5in'><font size=2 color=black
face=Arial><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:black'>which
is desirable for some in AMA classes, and for sure for those looking ahead to
F3A.</span></font></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:.5in'><font size=2 color=black
face=Arial><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:black'> </span></font></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:.5in'><font size=2 color=black
face=Arial><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:black'>An in
between thought - reduce the K factor considerable for snap and spin maneuvers.</span></font></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:.5in'><font size=2 color=black
face=Arial><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:black'>That
leaves them in the schedules, provides flying and judging practice on them, but
reduces the</span></font></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:.5in'><font size=2 color=black
face=Arial><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:black'>impact
of the imperfect judging of them on round scores.</span></font></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:.5in'><font size=2 color=black
face=Arial><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:black'> </span></font></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:.5in'><font size=2 color=black
face=Arial><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:black'>Ron
Lockhart</span></font></p>
</div>
<blockquote style='border:none;border-left:solid black 1.5pt;padding:0in 0in 0in 4.0pt;
margin-left:3.75pt;margin-top:5.0pt;margin-right:0in;margin-bottom:5.0pt'>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:.5in'><font size=2 color=black
face=Arial><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:black'>-----
Original Message ----- </span></font></p>
</div>
<div style='font-color:black'>
<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:.5in;background:#E4E4E4'><b><font size=2
color=black face=Arial><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;
color:black;font-weight:bold'>From:</span></font></b><font size=2 color=black
face=Arial><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:black'> <a
href="mailto:BUDDYonRC@aol.com" title="BUDDYonRC@aol.com">BUDDYonRC@aol.com</a>
</span></font></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:.5in'><b><font size=2 color=black
face=Arial><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:black;
font-weight:bold'>To:</span></font></b><font size=2 color=black face=Arial><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:black'> <a
href="mailto:nsrca-discussion@lists.nsrca.org"
title="nsrca-discussion@lists.nsrca.org">nsrca-discussion@lists.nsrca.org</a> </span></font></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:.5in'><b><font size=2 color=black
face=Arial><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:black;
font-weight:bold'>Sent:</span></font></b><font size=2 color=black face=Arial><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:black'> Saturday, October 20,
2007 11:44 AM</span></font></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:.5in'><b><font size=2 color=black
face=Arial><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:black;
font-weight:bold'>Subject:</span></font></b><font size=2 color=black
face=Arial><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:black'> Re:
[NSRCA-discussion] Judging</span></font></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:.5in'><font size=2 color=black
face=Arial><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:black'> </span></font></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:.5in'><font size=2 color=black
face=Arial id="role_document"><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;
color:black'>My cents worth on the subject.</span></font></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:.5in'><font size=2 color=black
face=Arial><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:black'>Snaps
and Spin entry seem to cause much of the problem.</span></font></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:.5in'><font size=2 color=black
face=Arial><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:black'>Why do
we continue to repeat trying to solve a problem that most agree is
controversial at best and impossible to judge consistently on an equal
basis?</span></font></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:.5in'><font size=2 color=black
face=Arial><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:black'>Seems
that the best solution is to eliminate these from the schedules and pick
maneuvers that more suit Precision Aerobatics and their ability to be
judged correctly by everyone not just those who have advanced to the top
of the super judge platform.</span></font></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:.5in'><font size=2 color=black
face=Arial><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:black'><br>
Buddy</span></font></p>
</div>
<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-right:0in;margin-bottom:12.0pt;margin-left:
5in'><font size=2 color=black face=Arial><span style='font-size:10.0pt;
font-family:Arial;color:black'><br>
<br>
</span></font></p>
<div>
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margin-left:.5in;margin-bottom:.0001pt;text-align:center'><font size=2
color=black face=Arial><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;
color:black'>
<hr size=2 width="100%" align=center>
</span></font></div>
<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-right:0in;margin-bottom:0in;margin-left:.5in;
margin-bottom:.0001pt'><font size=2 color=black face=Arial><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:black'>See what's new at <a
href="http://www.aol.com?NCID=AOLCMP00300000001170" target="_blank"
title="http://www.aol.com?NCID=AOLCMP00300000001170">AOL.com</a> and <a
href="http://www.aol.com/mksplash.adp?NCID=AOLCMP00300000001169" target="_blank"
title="http://www.aol.com/mksplash.adp?NCID=AOLCMP00300000001169">Make AOL Your
Homepage</a>.</span></font></p>
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size=2 color=black face=Arial><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;
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</span></font></div>
<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:.5in'><font size=2 color=black
face=Arial><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:black'>_______________________________________________<br>
NSRCA-discussion mailing list<br>
NSRCA-discussion@lists.nsrca.org<br>
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion</span></font></p>
</blockquote>
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</span></font></div>
<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:.5in'><font size=2 color=black
face=Arial><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:black'>_______________________________________________<br>
NSRCA-discussion mailing list<br>
NSRCA-discussion@lists.nsrca.org<br>
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