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<DIV><FONT face=Arial color=#0000ff size=2>I still find it amazing after all
these years it is people with full scale experience that rarely have a
problem with the concept Bill just mentioned.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial color=#0000ff size=2> </FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial color=#0000ff size=2> Del </FONT></DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE
style="PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px">
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial">----- Original Message ----- </DIV>
<DIV
style="BACKGROUND: #e4e4e4; FONT: 10pt arial; font-color: black"><B>From:</B>
<A title=billglaze@bellsouth.net
href="mailto:billglaze@bellsouth.net">billglaze</A> </DIV>
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>To:</B> <A
title=nsrca-discussion@lists.nsrca.org
href="mailto:nsrca-discussion@lists.nsrca.org">NSRCA Mailing List</A> </DIV>
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Sent:</B> Tuesday, October 09, 2007 3:28
PM</DIV>
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Subject:</B> Re: [NSRCA-discussion]
Rudder</DIV>
<DIV><BR></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial>Correct. The airplane does NOT know the wind is
blowing. If we were moving in the same direction/velocity the wind is
moving, (thus matching the airplane direction/velocity), the airplane would
have no vector.</FONT></DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE
style="PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px">
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial">----- Original Message ----- </DIV>
<DIV
style="BACKGROUND: #e4e4e4; FONT: 10pt arial; font-color: black"><B>From:</B>
<A title=terryb@beachlers.com href="mailto:terryb@beachlers.com">Terry
Beachler</A> </DIV>
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>To:</B> <A
title=nsrca-discussion@lists.nsrca.org
href="mailto:nsrca-discussion@lists.nsrca.org">NSRCA Mailing List</A> </DIV>
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Sent:</B> Tuesday, October 09, 2007 2:59
PM</DIV>
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Subject:</B> Re: [NSRCA-discussion]
Rudder</DIV>
<DIV><BR></DIV><BR>J & B<BR>Weather vane implies the wind blowing the
tail away from and the nose into the wind which would be desirable for
(self)correcting for crosswind. This would imply that an airplane on a cross
country flight would self correct into a crosswind, no crab necessary. Or
the reverse, pilot would have to hold rudder for a couple of hours on a
cross country flight. Talk about a way to induce asymmetrical leg
muscles...wow!<BR><BR>Rudder is used to point the noise into the wind i.e.
to induce crab. Full scale pilots make a small coordinated turn into the
wind to create crab angle and the desired ground track. I think I read in
some pattern stuff that pattern pilots can induce crab and it either
presents better to a judge or they can sneak the crab in a way not so easily
detected by the judge. Weathervaning would only happen on the ground
with a taildragger, usually the beginning of a ground loop. Or with the
airplane on a pylon on the vertical axis, just like a
weathervane.<BR><BR>Crab angle and track apply here. Crosswind acts upon the
whole airplane in flight, not just the tail surface. If we turn this whole
situation 90 degrees and fly into a headwind and pull up, the airplane would
flop over on its back because of the greater exposed surface of the wing
area. The wing would have a greater weathervane effect. But it does not work
thataway.<BR><BR>Bob and I have been having fun with this one for a
while.<BR><BR>Terry Beachler<BR><BR>At 13:01 10/9/2007, you wrote:<BR><BR>
<BLOCKQUOTE class=cite cite="" type="cite"><FONT face="Arial, Helvetica"
color=#0000ff>weathervane by cause of wind. If you straighten the plane
out to look vertical, the track (actual line drawn) will move with the
wind and not be vertical and be cause for a downgrade. Someone has a clip
from the rule book covering all parts of
this.<BR></FONT> <BR><BR><FONT size=2>Regards,<BR>Jason<BR><A
href="http://www.jasonshulman.com/"
eudora="autourl">www.jasonshulman.com</A><BR><A
href="http://www.shulmanaviation.com/"
eudora="autourl">www.shulmanaviation.com</A><BR><A
href="http://www.composite-arf.com/"
eudora="autourl">www.composite-arf.com</A></FONT> <BR>
<DL>
<DD><FONT face=Tahoma size=2>-----Original Message-----<BR>
<DD>From:</B> nsrca-discussion-bounces@lists.nsrca.org [<A
href="mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces@lists.nsrca.org" eudora="autourl">
mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces@lists.nsrca.org</A>]On Behalf Of
</B>Terry Beachler<BR>
<DD>Sent:</B> Tuesday, October 09, 2007 12:53 PM<BR>
<DD>To:</B> NSRCA Mailing List<BR>
<DD>Subject:</B> Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Rudder<BR><BR></FONT>
<DD>Do you mean crab (induce by rudder) or weathervane as if the wind is
applying a force upon the tail and causing a turn toward the wind about
the vertical axis.<BR><BR>
<DD>Terryb<BR><BR>
<DD>At 12:10 10/9/2007, you wrote:<BR><BR>
<BLOCKQUOTE class=cite cite="" type="cite">
<DD><FONT face="Arial, Helvetica" color=#0000ff>Hi Bob,<BR></FONT>
<DD><BR>
<DD><FONT face="Arial, Helvetica" color=#0000ff>The airplane should
weathervane into the wind, as long as the track of the plane is
straight (track- actual line/path of the plane). <BR></FONT>
<DD><BR><BR>
<DD><FONT size=2>Regards,<BR>
<DD>Jason<BR>
<DD><A href="http://www.jasonshulman.com/"
eudora="autourl">www.jasonshulman.com</A><BR>
<DD><A href="http://www.shulmanaviation.com/"
eudora="autourl">www.shulmanaviation.com</A><BR>
<DD><A href="http://www.composite-arf.com/"
eudora="autourl">www.composite-arf.com</A></FONT>
<DL>
<DD><FONT face=Tahoma size=2>-----Original Message-----
<DD>From: nsrca-discussion-bounces@lists.nsrca.org [ <A
href="mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces@lists.nsrca.org%5DOn"
eudora="autourl">mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces@lists.nsrca.org]On</A>
Behalf Of Bob Wilson
<DD>Sent: Tuesday, October 09, 2007 8:53 AM
<DD>To: nsrca-discussion@lists.nsrca.org
<DD>Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Rudder<BR><BR></FONT>
<DD>Some great ideas.
<DD>I'm going to give the 60-70% rudder expo a shot and see how it
works.<BR>
<DD>
<DD>I'd like to do the stall turns on low rate, as Jason
reccommends, but when stall turning into the wind my practice
airplane will not go vertical (on the downline) unless I have high
rates (it weathervanes slightly towards the wind). <BR>
<DD>
<DD>I also liked John Pavlick's recommendation on the two
consecutive rolls. I'm probably being too anal in coordinating
rudder, aileron and elevator because I always seem to run out of
room.<BR>
<DD>
<DD>So much to learn and the damn winter is coming!<BR>
<DD>
<DD>Thanks guys,<BR>
<DD>
<DD>Bob Wilson<BR><BR></DD></DL>
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