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<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2><FONT color=#0000ff>These are all great but, I see
nothing changing to stop driving away the casual competitor. If the organization
and sport wants to truly grow that area is long overdue. We need their
numbers and help at fielding contests.</FONT> </FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2> </FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2> <EM><FONT
color=#800000>Del</FONT></EM></FONT><EM><FONT
color=#800000> </FONT></EM></DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE
style="PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px">
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial">----- Original Message ----- </DIV>
<DIV
style="BACKGROUND: #e4e4e4; FONT: 10pt arial; font-color: black"><B>From:</B>
<A title=rob@koolsoft.com href="mailto:rob@koolsoft.com">Robert L.
Beaubien</A> </DIV>
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>To:</B> <A
title=nsrca-discussion@lists.nsrca.org
href="mailto:nsrca-discussion@lists.nsrca.org">NSRCA Mailing List</A> </DIV>
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Sent:</B> Thursday, August 23, 2007 8:42
AM</DIV>
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Subject:</B> Re: [NSRCA-discussion] [Fwd:
Proposal]</DIV>
<DIV><BR></DIV>
<DIV class=Section1>
<P class=MsoPlainText>Richard / John, See my comments inline.<o:p></o:p></P>
<P class=MsoPlainText><o:p> </o:p></P>
<P class=MsoPlainText>-----Original Message-----<BR>From: <A
href="mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces@lists.nsrca.org">nsrca-discussion-bounces@lists.nsrca.org</A>
[mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces@lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of richard
wallace<BR>Sent: Wednesday, August 22, 2007 7:28 PM<BR>To: NSRCA Mailing
List<BR>Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] [Fwd: Proposal]<o:p></o:p></P>
<P class=MsoPlainText><SPAN style="COLOR: black"><o:p> </o:p></SPAN></P>
<P class=MsoPlainText>> Gotta say though, I'm just not a fan of a national
database for<o:p></o:p></P>
<P class=MsoPlainText>> recording Pattern results. I don't really
understand what problem this<o:p></o:p></P>
<P class=MsoPlainText>> is intended to fix.<o:p></o:p></P>
<P class=MsoPlainText><SPAN style="COLOR: black"><o:p> </o:p></SPAN></P>
<P class=MsoPlainText><B><SPAN style="COLOR: black">If I read what John
proposed correctly, this is to give additional value and incentive to being a
NSRCA member. Being able to participate in a nationwide ranking system
is appealing to me.<o:p></o:p></SPAN></B></P>
<P class=MsoPlainText><o:p> </o:p></P>
<P class=MsoPlainText>> Of course, I'm in the apparent minority that
believes that our current<o:p></o:p></P>
<P class=MsoPlainText>> self-policing system of advancement points is fine,
ESPECIALLY now<o:p></o:p></P>
<P class=MsoPlainText>> that points only count for four years.
...<o:p></o:p></P>
<P class=MsoPlainText><SPAN style="COLOR: black"><o:p> </o:p></SPAN></P>
<P class=MsoPlainText><B><SPAN style="COLOR: black">I agree with you. I
think peer pressure to keep people from Sandbagging is the best medicine and
forced promotions is not needed. <o:p></o:p></SPAN></B></P>
<P class=MsoPlainText><o:p> </o:p></P>
<P class=MsoPlainText>> 2. I don't know that I'd be really interested in
seeing my 'national<o:p></o:p></P>
<P class=MsoPlainText>> ranking' -- I've found out enough at
the Nats the past several<o:p></o:p></P>
<P class=MsoPlainText>> years... and 37/44 in Masters tells me enough about
where I stand... !<o:p></o:p></P>
<P class=MsoPlainText><o:p> </o:p></P>
<P class=MsoPlainText><B><SPAN style="COLOR: black">I know I would be
interested in my "national" rank as I try to progress through the
classes.<o:p></o:p></SPAN></B></P>
<P class=MsoPlainText><o:p> </o:p></P>
<P class=MsoPlainText>> and one more thing - do we have any volunteers for
setting up and<o:p></o:p></P>
<P class=MsoPlainText>> adminstering this national system? That's not a
trivial question or<o:p></o:p></P>
<P class=MsoPlainText>> issue, especially in a world where (at least some)
NSRCA officers are<o:p></o:p></P>
<P class=MsoPlainText>> in their positions not because they sought the job
in order to be in<o:p></o:p></P>
<P class=MsoPlainText>> charge of stuff, but because there was a necessary
job to be done, and<o:p></o:p></P>
<P class=MsoPlainText>> no one else was willing to step up to do it... I do
the Champs<o:p></o:p></P>
<P class=MsoPlainText>> standings for my District and mostly enjoy it, but
it IS a manual<o:p></o:p></P>
<P class=MsoPlainText>> process. Understand about hooks to automated
scoring systems like<o:p></o:p></P>
<P class=MsoPlainText>> PACSS, but it'll still take initial work and
sustainment and then<o:p></o:p></P>
<P class=MsoPlainText>> fixes to keep it going at the national level... and
there are still<o:p></o:p></P>
<P class=MsoPlainText>> places around the country that still do contest
scoring manually...<o:p></o:p></P>
<P class=MsoPlainText><o:p> </o:p></P>
<P class=MsoPlainText><B>I would be interested in volunteering my services
towards this endeavor. What would be needed would be a standardized
scoring program used by all CD's that has upload capabilities to a server, and
a website to present the information to the members. As a software
developer, it is a project I would like to participate in if it were to see
the light of day. I would also be willing to donate the bandwidth and
servers necessary to make this happen.<o:p></o:p></B></P>
<P class=MsoPlainText><SPAN style="COLOR: black"><o:p> </o:p></SPAN></P>
<P class=MsoPlainText>> Agree about helping Sportsman and maybe
Intermediates be mentored at<o:p></o:p></P>
<P class=MsoPlainText>> contests- we usually don't have a formal system for
that, and more<o:p></o:p></P>
<P class=MsoPlainText>> would certainly be better.<o:p></o:p></P>
<P class=MsoPlainText><o:p> </o:p></P>
<P class=MsoPlainText><B>This already happens to a great extent in D7.
When I showed up at a pattern contest, Troy Newman took it upon himself
to mentor me and I feel very lucky to have his experience to guide me. A
formal rule/suggestion/whatever towards this end is certainly not a bad
thing.<o:p></o:p></B></P>
<P class=MsoPlainText><SPAN style="COLOR: black"><o:p> </o:p></SPAN></P>
<P class=MsoPlainText>Also am in violent agreement about the need to grow
Pattern at the<o:p></o:p></P>
<P class=MsoPlainText>grass-roots level one new guy at a time - and most of us
need to plow<o:p></o:p></P>
<P class=MsoPlainText>that field more thoroughly too.<o:p></o:p></P>
<P class=MsoPlainText><o:p> </o:p></P>
<P class=MsoPlainText>Good stuff - keep it coming!<o:p></o:p></P>
<P class=MsoPlainText><o:p> </o:p></P>
<P class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></P>
<P class=MsoNormal>- Robert Beaubien<o:p></o:p></P>
<P class=MsoNormal>- AMA #618061<o:p></o:p></P>
<P class=MsoNormal>- NSRCA #4121<o:p></o:p></P>
<P class=MsoNormal>-<o:p></o:p></P>
<P class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></P>
<P class=MsoPlainText><SPAN style="COLOR: black"><o:p> </o:p></SPAN></P>
<P class=MsoPlainText><SPAN style="COLOR: black"><o:p> </o:p></SPAN></P>
<P class=MsoPlainText>> ----- Original Message -----<o:p></o:p></P>
<P class=MsoPlainText>> From: John Gayer<o:p></o:p></P>
<P class=MsoPlainText>> To: NSRCA Mailing List<o:p></o:p></P>
<P class=MsoPlainText>> Sent: Wednesday, August 22, 2007 7:12
PM<o:p></o:p></P>
<P class=MsoPlainText>> Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] [Fwd:
Proposal]<o:p></o:p></P>
<P class=MsoPlainText>><o:p> </o:p></P>
<P class=MsoPlainText>><o:p> </o:p></P>
<P class=MsoPlainText>> I'd like to present three proposals that might
appeal to a few if not the<o:p></o:p></P>
<P class=MsoPlainText>> many....<o:p></o:p></P>
<P class=MsoPlainText>> Modified from the original proposal . Apparently
not many saw it. The first<o:p></o:p></P>
<P class=MsoPlainText>> one has been added<o:p></o:p></P>
<P class=MsoPlainText>> Comments?<o:p></o:p></P>
<P class=MsoPlainText>> John<o:p></o:p></P>
<P class=MsoPlainText>> NSRCA 632<o:p></o:p></P>
<P class=MsoPlainText>><o:p> </o:p></P>
<P class=MsoPlainText>> Revive the practice of assigning mentors to
Sportsman and Intermediate<o:p></o:p></P>
<P class=MsoPlainText>> flyers<o:p></o:p></P>
<P class=MsoPlainText>><o:p> </o:p></P>
<P class=MsoPlainText>> At contests, assign an experienced competitor to
mentor, call and advise the<o:p></o:p></P>
<P class=MsoPlainText>> Sportsman/ Intermediate flyers. This is nothing
new, but should be a part of<o:p></o:p></P>
<P class=MsoPlainText>> every contest. We should try to provide a
connection that will last past the<o:p></o:p></P>
<P class=MsoPlainText>> contest.<o:p></o:p></P>
<P class=MsoPlainText>> As I see it, there are four issues that drasticaly
affect the ability of<o:p></o:p></P>
<P class=MsoPlainText>> these flyers to compete effectively: aircraft
trimming, execessive throws,<o:p></o:p></P>
<P class=MsoPlainText>> wings level and centering(also known as flying the
airplane, not letting the<o:p></o:p></P>
<P class=MsoPlainText>> airplane fly you).<o:p></o:p></P>
<P class=MsoPlainText>> These flyers have shown the initiative to come out
and compete. We owe them<o:p></o:p></P>
<P class=MsoPlainText>> (and ourselves) all the help we can throw at
them.<o:p></o:p></P>
<P class=MsoPlainText>><o:p> </o:p></P>
<P class=MsoPlainText>><o:p> </o:p></P>
<P class=MsoPlainText>> Create a National Database for
Pattern<o:p></o:p></P>
<P class=MsoPlainText>><o:p> </o:p></P>
<P class=MsoPlainText>> The database must contain the raw scores of all
flights for all competitors<o:p></o:p></P>
<P class=MsoPlainText>> by class. The only thing normalized scores are good
for is finding the right<o:p></o:p></P>
<P class=MsoPlainText>> finish order for each class at a contest. Raw
scores are much better for<o:p></o:p></P>
<P class=MsoPlainText>> comparing results even at a contest. For example I
finish round one with a<o:p></o:p></P>
<P class=MsoPlainText>> 930 and round two with a 985, both to competitor A.
Now did I fly a lot<o:p></o:p></P>
<P class=MsoPlainText>> better in round two(I thought I did) or did
competitor A flop a stall turn<o:p></o:p></P>
<P class=MsoPlainText>> in the figure M in round 2.<o:p></o:p></P>
<P class=MsoPlainText>> Anyway once you have the raw scores by competitor
and class, you can do the<o:p></o:p></P>
<P class=MsoPlainText>> following:<o:p></o:p></P>
<P class=MsoPlainText>><o:p> </o:p></P>
<P class=MsoPlainText>> Create a National Ranking for each class based on
average points per<o:p></o:p></P>
<P class=MsoPlainText>> maneuver. Once this is in place and on line, we
will have a reason for<o:p></o:p></P>
<P class=MsoPlainText>> pattern competitors to join NSRCA. you can't tell
me that there wouldn't be<o:p></o:p></P>
<P class=MsoPlainText>> a lot of interest in seeing who is hot around the
country and how you stack<o:p></o:p></P>
<P class=MsoPlainText>> up against the competition. I know, the judging
isn't always equal but<o:p></o:p></P>
<P class=MsoPlainText>> that's always been true and we have to live with
it.<o:p></o:p></P>
<P class=MsoPlainText>> The data available on each competitor would include
contests entered,<o:p></o:p></P>
<P class=MsoPlainText>> placing, advance points earned. The districts could
extract whatever data is<o:p></o:p></P>
<P class=MsoPlainText>> required to ascertain the district champions. We
could archive previous<o:p></o:p></P>
<P class=MsoPlainText>> years as well.<o:p></o:p></P>
<P class=MsoPlainText>> Other ways to specify advancement in class become
available, percentage of<o:p></o:p></P>
<P class=MsoPlainText>> average FAI score, even eventually moving the 10
top-rated pilots up a<o:p></o:p></P>
<P class=MsoPlainText>> class. Possibilities are endless when you have the
data.<o:p></o:p></P>
<P class=MsoPlainText>> Since the database would only be open to NSRCA
members, if you want to track<o:p></o:p></P>
<P class=MsoPlainText>> your National standing, joining NSRCA would be a
must. If you want to see<o:p></o:p></P>
<P class=MsoPlainText>> what the guy nobody heard of that just rolled in
from out of district has<o:p></o:p></P>
<P class=MsoPlainText>> accomplished, look him up. We've been looking for
reasons to join NSRCA, I<o:p></o:p></P>
<P class=MsoPlainText>> feel this is one that could be big and would be
worth some investment in<o:p></o:p></P>
<P class=MsoPlainText>> time and money. I would be willing to help with
such a project although I<o:p></o:p></P>
<P class=MsoPlainText>> don't feel like I could take it on by
myself.<o:p></o:p></P>
<P class=MsoPlainText>><o:p> </o:p></P>
<P class=MsoPlainText>> Redirect the focus to our international team
competition through<o:p></o:p></P>
<P class=MsoPlainText>> modification of the advancement
system<o:p></o:p></P>
<P class=MsoPlainText>><o:p> </o:p></P>
<P class=MsoPlainText>><o:p> </o:p></P>
<P class=MsoPlainText>> Modify the advancement process to be consistent
through all classes from<o:p></o:p></P>
<P class=MsoPlainText>> Sportsman through to F3A. See section two for
possible advancement criteria<o:p></o:p></P>
<P class=MsoPlainText>> Advancement can be forced by the advancement
criteria(see section 2) or<o:p></o:p></P>
<P class=MsoPlainText>> voluntary.<o:p></o:p></P>
<P class=MsoPlainText>> The first year in a new and higher class is an
option year. At the end of<o:p></o:p></P>
<P class=MsoPlainText>> the option year you can downselect one class for
any reason. This has the<o:p></o:p></P>
<P class=MsoPlainText>> advantage of being able to try out the higher class
for a year without<o:p></o:p></P>
<P class=MsoPlainText>> committing your entire pattern career. If you
discover that the next class<o:p></o:p></P>
<P class=MsoPlainText>> is beyond your means( time, money or talent) then
you option down the<o:p></o:p></P>
<P class=MsoPlainText>> following year. If you absolutely refuse to fly
your new class, then perhaps<o:p></o:p></P>
<P class=MsoPlainText>> you could use the time and money to reintroduce
your self to your wife,<o:p></o:p></P>
<P class=MsoPlainText>> girlfriend, etc. If you need a goal for the year,
focus on making your<o:p></o:p></P>
<P class=MsoPlainText>> rudder commands instinctive, learn to fly a
helicopter, learn to fly rolling<o:p></o:p></P>
<P class=MsoPlainText>> circles. You would probably come back a better
pattern flyer than when you<o:p></o:p></P>
<P class=MsoPlainText>> left.<o:p></o:p></P>
<P class=MsoPlainText>><o:p> </o:p></P>
<P class=MsoPlainText>><o:p> </o:p></P>
<P class=MsoPlainText>><o:p> </o:p></P>
<P class=MsoPlainText>><o:p> </o:p></P>
<P class=MsoPlainText>><o:p> </o:p></P>
<P class=MsoPlainText>>
_______________________________________________<o:p></o:p></P>
<P class=MsoPlainText>> NSRCA-discussion mailing list<o:p></o:p></P>
<P class=MsoPlainText>> NSRCA-discussion@lists.nsrca.org<o:p></o:p></P>
<P class=MsoPlainText>>
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion________________________________<o:p></o:p></P>
<P class=MsoPlainText>><o:p> </o:p></P>
<P
class=MsoPlainText>_______________________________________________<o:p></o:p></P>
<P class=MsoPlainText>NSRCA-discussion<o:p></o:p></P>
<P class=MsoPlainText>> mailing<o:p></o:p></P>
<P class=MsoPlainText>> list<o:p></o:p></P>
<P class=MsoPlainText>NSRCA-discussion@lists.nsrca.org<o:p></o:p></P>
<P
class=MsoPlainText>http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion<o:p></o:p></P>
<P class=MsoPlainText>><o:p> </o:p></P>
<P class=MsoPlainText>>
_______________________________________________<o:p></o:p></P>
<P class=MsoPlainText>> NSRCA-discussion mailing list<o:p></o:p></P>
<P class=MsoPlainText>> NSRCA-discussion@lists.nsrca.org<o:p></o:p></P>
<P class=MsoPlainText>>
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion<o:p></o:p></P>
<P class=MsoPlainText>><o:p> </o:p></P>
<P
class=MsoPlainText>_______________________________________________<o:p></o:p></P>
<P class=MsoPlainText>NSRCA-discussion mailing list<o:p></o:p></P>
<P class=MsoPlainText>NSRCA-discussion@lists.nsrca.org<o:p></o:p></P>
<P
class=MsoPlainText>http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion<o:p></o:p></P></DIV>
<P>
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